penny for your thoughts

[adamjames]

That analogy doesn't really make sense. You really shouldn't advise anyone on anything.

No what your trying to say is that your mind cannot understand that analogy

[adamjames]

i think he means you cant maintain muscle without fuel ( food or natural testosterone ) analogy is sound i think, but yet you will end up with as much muscle as you could have naturally maintained if you were running at the same natural level of testosterone (maybe slightly more if diet is on point) - aas is just a short term sythetic performance spurt- when you come off you body will balance out and you should end up bigger for sure. If natty levels are 150 before aas, you can kiss your gains goodbye when you come off. Thats why its always good to get bw done before you embark and good pct protocol- good
luck

thankyou

someone has arrived and dissected the meaning behind the very simple analogy and facts i layed out

[gixxerboy1]

i know you can not keep over your genetic limit with out being on. That you will revert to that.
Thats what you back tracked and stated. And i agree with that,
At first you said everyone looses after a cycle and reverts back to where they started. And i stand by that. That is not true.
They are 2 completely different things.

[adamjames]

Come on man stop playing and changing what i said please, my exact words were "when you stop cycling you will lose most of your gains and go back to what you could have achieved naturally"

let me guess, i didnt say that

[MuscleInk]

Come on man stop playing and changing what i said please, my exact words were "when you stop cycling you will lose most of your gains and go back to what you could have achieved naturally"

let me guess, i didnt say that

Bro, what's up with the insults? Everyone is hopefully here for the same reason(s): education and frank discussion of topics we are passionate about. Opinions will vary but that's the nature of discourse and communication. There wouldn't be much of a discussion or forum if we all acquiesced now would there? You come across as knowledgable and can offer something to this forum, but let's not digress into a tirade of insults and defamation of character.

Now, to your earlier point, I must disagree. I appreciate the analogies as they can be useful in illustrating or simplifying an argument, however, your use of a car without petrol as an analogy to the body in the absence of steroids , is inaccurate. True, a car without fuel isn't going to travel very far, but a user of a steroid cycle isn't the same. The human body is never depleted of all hormones. In fact, we would be in a life threatening condition if all hormonal activity was completed arrested - loss of muscle gains would in fact be the least of our concerns. While it is true, exogenous steroids will suppress endogenous productions, there is always a physiological response, weak or otherwise. Moreover, the knowledgable user would (should) observe a proper protocol in which aromatase activity would would be kept in check and a PCT including hcg to restart natural testosterone production would be followed at the end of a cycle. Thus, the body at the end of a cycle is never "a car without fuel".

Now, I don't disagree that some gains are lost. Anyone who argues that they have retained 100% of all gains is overstating reality. A loss of gains however depends on many factors and the degree of loss will vary. Sure, the guy/girl who thinks they can run a cycle of AAs and then at the end of the cycle return to a sedentary lifestyle of beer and pizza, is in for a tremendous letdown! This is why we preach the hell out of diet and exercise and tell the "new users" to spend several years developing a diet and exercise curriculum that they will stay committed to and will support their gains between cycles. In the absence of these things, gains will be hard to maintain. Another reason some gains are lost is that some anabolics promote water retention. With these compounds, naturally there will be observable losses when the compounds are stopped, but not all steroids are alike. Some promote far less water retention (e.g. Primo, winni, anavar ) and lead to sustainable lean muscle gains. The key to success, as we have said all along is a LONG TERM commitment to diet and exercise. Anyone looking to steroids for a quick fix, ought to look elsewhere.

[Capebuffalo]

^^^ Waited all day for that post. Well said

[MuscleInk]

^^^ Waited all day for that post. Well said

Lol....thanks brother. I hope it was worth the suspense! I have my moments.....but they are rare. Lol

[Judah]

once your hormones go back to normal so will your physique, end of story

if your planning on doing 1 short cycle then coming of steroids forever you may aswell stay natural in the first place IMO

End of story lol???

This is 100% not true. Where are you getting your information dude?

[Judah]

i guess ignorance is bliss but the fact of the matter is that you cant run a car without petrol im afraid

That's the worst analogy I have ever heard lol.

[Judah]

lol i love this forum, like i said ignorance is bliss : ) i guess the truth hurts sorry for saying it

please dont take offence to what i say people i said you will lose most of your gains not all, my analogy of popping a balloon was slightly exaggerated i admit lol but what you keep will be within the limit of what you could have achieved naturally after many years of training, steroids are just a fast track to that potential so yes you may be very impressed with what you keep but the more cycles you do the less you will keep, yes there is a limit to what you can keep when you stop taking the steroids i thought that was quite obvious especially to all you post whores out there

gixxerboy your assumptions are ridiculous , i wasent aware we were friends and you knew all of my friends, i guess its a small world

27,300 posts what an achievement congratulations maybe the queen will give you a knighthood for being such a loser, joke

Dude, now your completely changing your story lol. I think maybe you got used to your friends or girlfriends believing your bullshit. What your doing is very transparent and nobody is buying your shit sandwiches bro.

[adamjames]

Bro, what's up with the insults? Everyone is hopefully here for the same reason(s): education and frank discussion of topics we are passionate about. Opinions will vary but that's the nature of discourse and communication. There wouldn't be much of a discussion or forum if we all acquiesced now would there? You come across as knowledgable and can offer something to this forum, but let's not digress into a tirade of insults and defamation of character.

Now, to your earlier point, I must disagree. I appreciate the analogies as they can be useful in illustrating or simplifying an argument, however, your use of a car without petrol as an analogy to the body in the absence of steroids , is inaccurate. True, a car without fuel isn't going to travel very far, but a user of a steroid cycle isn't the same. The human body is never depleted of all hormones. In fact, we would be in a life threatening condition if all hormonal activity was completed arrested - loss of muscle gains would in fact be the least of our concerns. While it is true, exogenous steroids will suppress endogenous productions, there is always a physiological response, weak or otherwise. Moreover, the knowledgable user would (should) observe a proper protocol in which aromatase activity would would be kept in check and a PCT including hcg to restart natural testosterone production would be followed at the end of a cycle. Thus, the body at the end of a cycle is never "a car without fuel".

Now, I don't disagree that some gains are lost. Anyone who argues that they have retained 100% of all gains is overstating reality. A loss of gains however depends on many factors and the degree of loss will vary. Sure, the guy/girl who thinks they can run a cycle of AAs and then at the end of the cycle return to a sedentary lifestyle of beer and pizza, is in for a tremendous letdown! This is why we preach the hell out of diet and exercise and tell the "new users" to spend several years developing a diet and exercise curriculum that they will stay committed to and will support their gains between cycles. In the absence of these things, gains will be hard to maintain. Another reason some gains are lost is that some anabolics promote water retention. With these compounds, naturally there will be observable losses when the compounds are stopped, but not all steroids are alike. Some promote far less water retention (e.g. Primo, winni, anavar) and lead to sustainable lean muscle gains. The key to success, as we have said all along is a LONG TERM commitment to diet and exercise. Anyone looking to steroids for a quick fix, ought to look elsewhere.

You make some good points, you also make some bad points, im not going to go into a detailed counter argument to the points i disagree with because no offence but your post is too long winded and i cant be bothered atm im just watching a film(kill the irishman) and while i agree that a world with no insults would be a nice world it would also be a tremendous bore because its simply in our nature as humans to be mean sometimes, so lets celebrate our wickedness and raise a glass to Hitler

Nice tatts btw and the abbs arent to bad either bro

[adamjames]

That's the worst analogy I have ever heard lol.

thanks it took me all of 1 second to concoct but at second glance i would have to agree with your keen insight its one of the worst quotes ever to grace this forum

[MuscleInk]

You make some good points, you also make some bad points, im not going to go into a detailed counter argument to the points i disagree with because no offence but your post is too long winded and i cant be bothered atm im just watching a film(kill the irishman) and while i agree that a world with no insults would be a nice world it would also be a tremendous bore because its simply in our nature as humans to be mean sometimes, so lets celebrate our wickedness and raise a glass to Hitler

Nice tatts btw and the abbs arent to bad either bro

Lol....thanks. I'm much more a pragmatist, occasionally an antagonist, but rarely a utopian who views the world in harmony, peace, or blissfulness. Diversity is what makes us unique and interesting as a species so a world that is in agreement would be bland vanilla IMO.

I'm not ready to raise a glass to someone espousing ethnic cleansing, but to each his own.

Thanks, I can't recall which took longer, the abs or the tats or which was more painful to achieve. Perhaps the same. I cover them both well in the hospitals and clinics but it drives the nurses wild when they find out what's underneath.

[adamjames]

Lol....thanks. I'm much more a pragmatist, occasionally an antagonist, but rarely a utopian who views the world in harmony, peace, or blissfulness. Diversity is what makes us unique and interesting as a species so a world that is in agreement would be bland vanilla IMO.

I'm not ready to raise a glass to someone espousing ethnic cleansing, but to each his own.

Thanks, I can't recall which took longer, the abs or the tats or which was more painful to achieve. Perhaps the same. I cover them both well in the hospitals and clinics but it drives the nurses wild when they find out what's underneath.

Thats right, no 2 blades of grass are the same and thats why earth is so awesome : ) and also why it sucks sometimes : (
and can i say my friend you are by far the most interesting person ive had the pleasure of conversing with on here

[adamjames]

Dude, now your completely changing your story lol. I think maybe you got used to your friends or girlfriends believing your bullshit. What your doing is very transparent and nobody is buying your shit sandwiches bro.

I try not to bullshit to friends to often but i bullshit to my GF all the time, as far as the poo sandwiches go i cant say ive ever tried one myself but youl have to post your recipe in the diet section

[Judah]

I try not to bullshit to friends to often but i bullshit to my GF all the time, as far as the poo sandwiches go i cant say ive ever tried one myself but youl have to post your recipe in the diet section

I don't make shit sandwiches. If you read the progression of your responses, its obvious your the one with the recipe. Your all over the place dude.

[Capebuffalo]

I myself would like some closure on the issue. From the post the consensus seems to be you can keep your gains from your cycle. Not all your gains but your not going to deflate like a ballon.AJ seems to be the only one disagreeing with this. And no longer wishes to debate his point. Because some statements are too long winded. Fair enough. Op I hope you can draw your own conclusion from the post and the people who have posted. Being your first cycle you don't know. But I would guess there are an abundance of total cycles between all the posters and the majority my all be delusional but we do believe gains can be kept.

[MuscleInk]

I myself would like some closure on the issue. From the post the consensus seems to be you can keep your gains from your cycle. Not all your gains but your not going to deflate like a ballon.AJ seems to be the only one disagreeing with this. And no longer wishes to debate his point. Because some statements are too long winded. Fair enough. Op I hope you can draw your own conclusion from the post and the people who have posted. Being your first cycle you don't know. But I would guess there are an abundance of total cycles between all the posters and the majority my all be delusional but we do believe gains can be kept.

Lmao.....couldn't resist it could you?

How's that for brevity??

[Capebuffalo]

Lmao.....couldn't resist it could you?

How's that for brevity??

Asshole. Who me?