Beginners Oral Cycle - Dianobol?

[sunblock]

Hi all!

I'm new to the forum and to steroids ! I've been training for 10 years and have been successful naturally; but now due to work and family need a boost.

I'm particularly interested in oral steroids and want to know which is the best option for quality gains and which offer the least bloated look and healthiest kidneys/liver.

I'm after some detailed clear advice.
1.What's the best oral steroid ?(don't like needles) ...
2...and in what quantities?
3.How long should I take it for?
4. Is liver protection required?
5. What PCT is best + dosage + duration?

Hope you can help...

[Razor]

Doing your first cycle right is critical and can impact on future gains and your endocrine system an oral only cycle is not the proper way to start out. That said a proper cyxle would be you want to run test, with an ai and proper pct afterwards
Head to the educational forum and do some reading in the thread beginner cycless.

[JohnnnyBlazzze]

Have you done any research at all? If you have researched all these questions would have been answered already.

What are your stats?

You say you need a boost because of work and family? AAS arn't going to make work and family go away!

[Shadowmaker]

AAS arn't going to make work and family go away!

[Shadowmaker]

id do stanazolol... 20-40mg a day...6-8 weeks imo...

dont know nothing about pct have never done one.

p.s - oral cycle is not the best thing to do, and it will never produce as much quality gains than a propper cycle would.

[austinite]

id do stanazolol... 20-40mg a day...6-8 weeks imo...

dont know nothing about pct have never done one.

p.s - oral cycle is not the best thing to do, and it will never produce as much quality gains than a propper cycle would.

Seriously?

[Shadowmaker]

Seriously?

seriously - what?

[austinite]

seriously - what?

You throw an oral only cycle at the kid without knowing anything about him. You should refrain from giving anyone advice.

[Shadowmaker]

You throw an oral only cycle at the kid without knowing anything about him. You should refrain from giving anyone advice.

80% of bodybuilders i know start with oral only cycle cause its cheap and it doesnt contain needles which are hard to get so young guys end up stabbing themselves with 1 needle for the whole cycle.

i will never refrain from giving advice just because some people think differently and you should never say something like that to anyone
bodybuilding is an individual sport - our bodys are different, our diet, training and our methods are different and so is our experience...
we cant limit opinions on this forum just because we dont agree with them or because we have different experience

[Capebuffalo]

You throw an oral only cycle at the kid without knowing anything about him. You should refrain from giving anyone advice.

Doesnt know about pct wow. Keep up the good work. Got to be kidding.

[Capebuffalo]

K

Seriously?

He's 22 and doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground. Op do not listen to this inexperienced thing.

[Shadowmaker]

do not listen to this inexperienced thing.

experience is measured in the years of active progress... just because you're older doesnt mean that you actually lift and cycle for longer period of time... the dude in your avatar looks like i looked when i was 17... so where exatcly is you huge experience? at home sitting on a chair, writing coments? how about some bodybuilding experience for a change?

P.S - you could just tell me that you dont ever care about anything else then your one opinion that is spamed in every topic and ill just never write something like that again...
you dont have to say stupid stuff about the age just to look smarter - if you want to ban a difference of opinion, its allright with me - just dont hide your censorship behing some dumb age factor like you would really belive that 30 years of working as a pluber gives you any experience in bodybuilding.

[Capebuffalo]

experience is measured in the years of active progress... just because you're older doesnt mean that you actually lift and cycle for longer period of time... the dude in your avatar looks like i looked when i was 17... so where exatcly is you huge experience? at home sitting on a chair, writing coments? how about some bodybuilding experience for a change?

P.S - you could just tell me that you dont ever care about anything else then your one opinion that is spamed in every topic and ill just never write something like that again...
you dont have to say stupid stuff about the age just to look smarter - if you want to ban a difference of opinion, its allright with me - just dont hide your censorship behing some dumb age factor like you would really belive that 30 years of working as a pluber gives you any experience in bodybuilding.

Thank you so much for the compliment. I was actually 35 then doing my first show. Wow you really think I look 17. Thanks. As for sitting in a chair and being a plumber. No that's not my profession. I am how ever suprised you know what a plumber is. Is there someone in your village with indoor plumbing? And as for the gyno clearing itself up in a month it must be something in your water. See we have purification processes and floride and such in ours. When you bring the bucket up from the stream is it clear or smell like cow shit? As for censorship here in the states we call it good health. Thanks for the compliment again. Now go milk your goat son

[Capebuffalo]

experience is measured in the years of active progress... just because you're older doesnt mean that you actually lift and cycle for longer period of time... the dude in your avatar looks like i looked when i was 17... so where exatcly is you huge experience? at home sitting on a chair, writing coments? how about some bodybuilding experience for a change?

P.S - you could just tell me that you dont ever care about anything else then your one opinion that is spamed in every topic and ill just never write something like that again...
you dont have to say stupid stuff about the age just to look smarter - if you want to ban a difference of opinion, its allright with me - just dont hide your censorship behing some dumb age factor like you would really belive that 30 years of working as a pluber gives you any experience in bodybuilding.

Thank you so much for the compliment. I was actually 35 then doing my first show. Wow you really think I lo

[sunblock]

My stats are 14% bf and I weigh 251lbs and am 34 yrs old.
I have been 273lbs and 8.5% bf at my natural best after 4yrs of never missing a session or meal (24yrs old).

I know work and family won't go away and maybe that's the best advice I'll get. I have also researched my questions but I want to see what answers I get (without any priming from me). If they stack up with what I've found it will settle my nervousness about embarking down this path.

There is clearly a lot to learn on this subject and for me to simply research and trust my findings without having a conversation like this would be foolish.

[Razor]

My stats are 14% bf and I weigh 251lbs and am 34 yrs old.
I have been 273lbs and 8.5% bf at my natural best after 4yrs of never missing a session or meal (24yrs old).

I know work and family won't go away and maybe that's the best advice I'll get. I have also researched my questions but I want to see what answers I get (without any priming from me). If they stack up with what I've found it will settle my nervousness about embarking down this path.

There is clearly a lot to learn on this subject and for me to simply research and trust my findings without having a conversation like this would be foolish.

Ok if your stats are accurate then your in good shape man. Just do some reading in here and the educational forums.
I think you will be good to go once you do some reading your stats are very impressive so far so great job. You might want to post some pics so we can see your build and were your are sitting at....picture says 1000 words.

[austinite]

Ok if your stats are accurate theb your in good shape man. Just do some reading in here and the educational forums I think you will be good to go once you do some reading your stats are very impressive so far so great job. Uou might want to post some pics so we can see your build and were your are sitting at....picture says 1000 words.

Agree. Good stats.

[Razor]

Agree. Good stats.

Yea I'm jealous!! I feel so small

[austinite]

Yea I'm jealous!! I feel so small

You're a monster.

[Razor]

head smacking table

[Readeck11]

This guy is super big

[sunblock]

Thanks for the direction to the beginners cycles.

[sunblock]

Me at 17st2lbs (from my wife's phone in my 20's).

Trying to find a decent shot at 19st mark. I have some at 18.5st when I was in Australia 2000. Will scan in when I find them and post.

[Misery13]

Me at 17st2lbs (from my wife's phone in my 20's).

Trying to find a decent shot at 19st mark. I have some at 18.5st when I was in Australia 2000. Will scan in when I find them and post.

That's not you.

[sunblock]

That's not you.

It is me. Why would you say it is not?

[Razor]

I bet you guys dont believe in running AI's either or do you believe in those? People suggest PCT to help them, not that its mandatory or that your going to die a horrible death if you don't, but frowned upon if you don't do it. If you and your friends in the Eastern Block dont wanna do it or have to do it then dont, and good for you. However this forum is a place to educate people into a higher lvl or thinking and we all have proven factual results. I doubt anyone would frown upon us trying to help people the best way possible. Moreover if you do your own research into drugs like AI's Aromasin, Letro, Adex, or PCT's such as Torem (Fareston), Nolvadex, Clomid, HCG, Evista (Raloxifene), you will learn that they not only help recover from cycles but they help with libido issues after, gyno and numerous other benefits of using them. Whats wrong with taking something that will not only help you after a cycle to keep your gains and cement further ones and run heather cycles in the future. To do anything but inform people of there options would be not only be irrational but irresponsible. You must be able to reason with this.

[Shadowmaker]

Razor - that stuff you use for PCT and that AI thing doesnt exist in most of the world. you have those products on sale, but i know people from lots of countries and i have talked to lots of bodybuilders out there to see what they have to say - no one does that.
when i joined this forum i read about pct and then go ask other people about it - they didnt know what is that and they dont understand why do you need that...

we dont have libido issues, gyno goes away in a month by itself... these risks also exist in this forum... you will never see people talking about this stuff somewhere else because it doesn't really happen or its not that noticable(if im horny 1 time less than i was on cycle - i wouldnt even notice).

it just kinda lame to think that everyone is the same... i have seen people paste the same starter cycle to anyone - so do you really belive that you have found the one and the only true way to first cycle? that is really arrogant claim imo...
you just cant think that everyone is the same... for example - you ppl eat yams and brown rice... did you know that there are lots of countries that doesnt have those foods? but they are still able to bodybuild.
for example, we have a thing that is made out of milk, has 0,5% fat, 0% carbs and 20g of protein... i have done my research and i know that you dont have that kind of food so i would never suggest it to anyone just because i have some experience in knowing different stuff...

there are older guys who laugh at me because im 22, but they have crappy results, most of them are smaller than a average 16yr old bodybuilders i know, and yet they seem to know everything... they dont wanna know nothing thats not their own opinion..

i just think its stupid... you guys belive that if you're 35 you know stuff - how lame is that? since when age=experience?
you can be 18 years old and have 5 years of training and 3 years of cycling under your belt and yet still, some guy in the forums half the size of this 18year old would feel more competent(spelling?!) about this sport just because hes older?

i belive that you give good advice and i have never said that you are wrong... i just dont like the little Stalins in here that think that im wrong because i do stuff different way.
i cant really belive that most of these people are americans - its a country in which there should be MORE than one opinion... it's me who comes from country in which few years back you could be shot because you have different opinion or where ellections had only 1 list to vote for with army behind your back so that you really do vote for that 1 list and yet it seems that im the only one who can accept something different while most of the guys here have only 1 idea of right and everything else is wrong? not to mention that there are some guys that come in and say some stupid stuff like "im older i know better" which is the most dumbest thing that someone could ever say.

[Razor]

Razor - that stuff you use for PCT and that AI thing doesnt exist in most of the world. you have those products on sale, but i know people from lots of countries and i have talked to lots of bodybuilders out there to see what they have to say - no one does that.
when i joined this forum i read about pct and then go ask other people about it - they didnt know what is that and they dont understand why do you need that...

we dont have libido issues, gyno goes away in a month by itself... these risks also exist in this forum... you will never see people talking about this stuff somewhere else because it doesn't really happen or its not that noticable(if im horny 1 time less than i was on cycle - i wouldnt even notice).

it just kinda lame to think that everyone is the same... i have seen people paste the same starter cycle to anyone - so do you really belive that you have found the one and the only true way to first cycle? that is really arrogant claim imo...
you just cant think that everyone is the same... for example - you ppl eat yams and brown rice... did you know that there are lots of countries that doesnt have those foods? but they are still able to bodybuild.
for example, we have a thing that is made out of milk, has 0,5% fat, 0% carbs and 20g of protein... i have done my research and i know that you dont have that kind of food so i would never suggest it to anyone just because i have some experience in knowing different stuff...

there are older guys who laugh at me because im 22, but they have crappy results, most of them are smaller than a average 16yr old bodybuilders i know, and yet they seem to know everything... they dont wanna know nothing thats not their own opinion..

i just think its stupid... you guys belive that if you're 35 you know stuff - how lame is that? since when age=experience?
you can be 18 years old and have 5 years of training and 3 years of cycling under your belt and yet still, some guy in the forums half the size of this 18year old would feel more competent(spelling?!) about this sport just because hes older?

i belive that you give good advice and i have never said that you are wrong... i just dont like the little Stalins in here that think that im wrong because i do stuff different way.
i cant really belive that most of these people are americans - its a country in which there should be MORE than one opinion... it's me who comes from country in which few years back you could be shot because you have different opinion or where ellections had only 1 list to vote for with army behind your back so that you really do vote for that 1 list and yet it seems that im the only one who can accept something different while most of the guys here have only 1 idea of right and everything else is wrong? not to mention that there are some guys that come in and say some stupid stuff like "im older i know better" which is the most dumbest thing that someone could ever say.

It's because we are America that we can and do voice our opinions without fear of death. I completely understand what you are saying and respect your opinion. I'm only 30 years old as of two weeks ago so still breaking into the whole 30's thing definitely not 35 yet and i don't know it all for sure.. Question..what is this thing made out of milk with pure protein no carbs or fat and how do I get some of that! What's it called and how does it taste?

I think the problem you are having with the guys here is that even though you think our opinion is incorrect, it goes against the better judgement of the powers that be here and group think of the boards collective on these matters. I hope you and them could come to sort of understanding with on another or at the very least agree to disagree. In the end, it's the end using who's sticking himself and taking pills who has to decide there own fate, we just do the best we can to lay out all the options and make sure they are as informed as possible.

Cheers

[Shadowmaker]

the thing is that i have never started to discuss any opinions unless someone starts to insult my age or experience.
all i do is - i write what i would do or what i would suggest if this was a regular guy in some supplement shop(its where the bodybuilders hang out mostly) and ask something like that... and im sure that most of the big guys there would give the same advice...
its just so different - you say to ppl that they have to start with test while in here - we almost never advice to start with injecting because its scary and done wrong can really screw you up.
the dude can pin a ml of oil into his vein(or whatever its called - the thigy in which the blood flow) and die in the matter of seconds. i dont really see how its the safest way...
we belive that staring with orals is safer - yeah, its toxic but its fast acting so if you hurt yourself you will suffer for a few days, maybe a week... by injecting a god knows what(who knows where ppl get stuff) into your body is not the safest thing in my mind.
all im saying is what i would suggest... everyone can suggest what they belive in and the author will choose anyway.

just because i do things differently it doesnt mean that im wrong...it just means that i would do stuff the different way and because i have gained some mass(more than some of the "smarts" in here) i belive that i have not totally failed.


as for the "milk-food" goes, i dont know how its called but the dictionary says that its "curds"...
this is how its made : http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_HW5gcMyH7e...s+and+Whey.jpg
and this is how its looks like : http://www.slowtrav.com/blog/nancyhol/Curds%202-3.JPG
when i tought how to explain how it tastes like i understand that you dont have the thing that it tastes like also
the closest thing i can imagine that you have could be some joghurt(the one with almost no taste) its just grainy like wet over-boiled rice

[Simon1972]

shadowmaker- all due respect to you and your people, but for people in countries that do have access to pct and ai, it is reccomended as an insurance policy against side effects and to aid in recovery of the Hpta. Your way of cycling is old school, at least 20 years in the past and alot of the knowledgeable BB's are well aware of the benefits and the clinical studies justifying the investment in a proper pct. im sorry you cant get pct or even needles in your country. but if a man has access to them...he should be encouraged to do it using the latest proven pharmaceuticals to maintain optimal health limiting any ill effects...im sure you understand what we are saying?

[Shadowmaker]

shadowmaker- all due respect to you and your people, but for people in countries that do have access to pct and ai, it is reccomended as an insurance policy against side effects and to aid in recovery of the Hpta. Your way of cycling is old school, at least 20 years in the past and alot of the knowledgeable BB's are well aware of the benefits and the clinical studies justifying the investment in a proper pct. im sorry you cant get pct or even needles in your country. but if a man has access to them...he should be encouraged to do it using the latest proven pharmaceuticals to maintain optimal health limiting any ill effects...im sure you understand what we are saying?

i never said he shouldnt do what you say... i just told him what i would do as far as oral cycle goes and said that i dont know nothing about pct because i have never done one... i never said that he shouldnt listen to you - the other guys said that he shouldnt listen to me...
i just gave my advice, you can give yours and then he can either choose one or combinde them both... i wasnt the one who started insulting people.

this has happened twice in 1 month already... some guys say what they have to say and then i say something different cause thats how i would do that... then 1 skinny 40yr old shows up thats half my size and tells me that i dont have experience because im 22, althou the only thing that the guy has to show for his experience is an experience of failing.

we all have different methods and different traditions and thats why i like this forum - i can read all kinds of interesting and also stupid stuff and thats what this should be...

in here there are some guys that see different method and they start to insult me because of age... you will never see it the other way around - i have never entered a topic where one dude gives advice and said : "look at you, you are twice my age, you should be Mr.Olympia by now but you have less muscle than my girlfriend does, you should never give any advice cause listening to you is the same thing as listening to a fat persons advice on how to lose weight".

why cant we just share our toughts and let the reader choose?

[Capebuffalo]

Ohne Ihre Ziege

[Shadowmaker]

Ohne Ihre Ziege

uuuu, sprechen du ein ander Sprache bis auf englische? das ist ein Uberraschung.

[Capebuffalo]

uuuu, sprechen du ein ander Sprache bis auf englische? das ist ein Uberraschung.

Ich bin voller Überraschungen Was Sie sehen ist was Sie erhalten nicht immer darauf achten, wo sie gehen von hier

[Shadowmaker]

it doesn't change the fact that you use insults in the discussion just because someone thinks different... and it doesnt change the fact that you think you are smarter and/or better as a human being because you are older or have more money.

german language sure suits this kind of thinking.

[Capebuffalo]

it doesn't change the fact that you use insults in the discussion just because someone thinks different... and it doesnt change the fact that you think you are smarter and/or better as a human being because you are older or have more money.

german language sure suits this kind of thinking.

Ich zitiere sie "Razor - verwenden Sie das Zeug für PCT und, dass AI was ist nicht vorhanden in vielen Teilen der Welt. Sie haben die Produkte im Verkauf, aber ich kenne Leute aus vielen Ländern und ich habe mit vielen Bodybuilder, um zu sehen, was sie zu sagen haben - niemand kann das.

These items are sold and available throughout Europe don't pull that. This is about health. You need an al and a pct period proven end of discussion

[Capebuffalo]

it doesn't change the fact that you use insults in the discussion just because someone thinks different... and it doesnt change the fact that you think you are smarter and/or better as a human being because you are older or have more money.

german language sure suits this kind of thinking.

Никто не сказал, что они лучше, чем вы. Просто больше знаний с РСТ есть эффекты, которые не будут рассматриваться в течение многих лет является все пытаются предотвратить. Никто не может быть лучше. Мы были более открыты с научно-исследовательскими и эффекты в государствах мы нужнее.

[1john]

Please read the board rules before posting again..

[panntastic]

Edit your post please we don't discuss sources

[austinite]

What country are you from Shadowmaker? I'm curious to know what country has never heard of PCT or AI's.