Advice for first test prop cycle

[Dannyboy51577]

All i can say, is this is the same type of shit we were talking about earlier in the thread.

Obvious lack of dedication and knowledge? I guess i missed the part where you've known me for a really long time, to make assumptions about what ive done, or what i know, or how dedicated i am.

I dont think it has as much to do with new guys or vets to be honest. Look, theres a reaction that people sometimes have when they have experienced something and someone else hasnt. But theres also a line between giving advice and being condescending. Truth is , if it gets under your skin that much, you have the choice of not reading or commenting on the thread. Others also have the choice of doing their own homework, whether its up to some peoples standard or not, and making a choice on their own.

Ive said this before and ill say it again- time after time after time, i see new guys come here, ask a question, told they are stupid, or given no advice but to come back when they are this age or hqve this training, etc etc. And from what i can see, often they just leave here, dont come back, get some advice from somewhere else, and do what they are gonna do anyway.

You can tell people what you think. But its human nature to find things out for yourself. I had maybe 8 or 9 years of training and cycling until my late 20's. Im 40, and my bf is above what some people would recommend for adding aas. If anyone thinks i wasnt gonna do what i was gonna do, theyre wrong. I went right on and started my cycle and thats that. Im down bf, adding muscle, eating right, and dedicated to what im gonna do and the results ill get. So assuming you know someone and spitting out random general statements is counter productive and borders on rude.

Theres a big difference between someone starting a test cycle at a high bf, and someone pounding 8 grams of compounds in their body on their first run. Maybe its not optimal to run at a higher bf, but cmon. How many things in your daily life arent optimal but you do them anyway.

It has gotten away from being supportive and turned into, do it this way or you are an idiot. Last i checked, any or all of the stuff we are doing is very wide ranged and person specific. Not everything that works for one works for all, mentally or physically. And truthfully, if thats how it is, im sure theres alot of people who just dont need to deal with that type of dynamic.

[kelkel]

1) you don't have the right to talk to anybody like that.

2) he isn't half assing anything.

3) I'm allowed opinions just the same as you.

4) were did you get your degree?

5) got someone calling him fat beer belly double chin, when its not even the case

5.1) I hate when vets (used that term loosely) band together and parrot the same bullshit over and over again.

thanks for the insight my man.

Actually to some extent he does. You surely seem to feel that you can so why can't he? He's been here a long time and earned the respect of the membership. You sir, have not achieved that just yet. To be honest, you've been here for a whopping 48 posts, many rather argumentative to say the least. Maybe you should enlighten us to what gives you your knowledge base or post a current picture showing your level of development to at least give some credence to what you espouse.

That being said, I do agree that the op will be just fine running a cycle.


ps: there are pro's here...

[Mr.Waffles]

I don't see 20% in your pic but 5'6 at 210 is decent size for the height. I have you at 185-190ish from the pic.

Assuming you are below 20% BF, the first cycle sticky is a safe bet as you'll ever get. It's a good learning cycle as you'll be pinning 1ml Test-E@250 each twice a week at 500mg for 12 weeks. It'll get you used to pinning a virgin muscle and teach you how to manage your estrogen and allow you to get used to what AAS does to your body with little risk if you aren't dead on. It'll take you through the PCT process.

If you went with Test-Prop, you are pinning every other day, 4x one week 3 times the next or 3x a week with 1.5ml each for 450mgs. Even that gets tiring especially if you are new to this and not used to pinning.

We'll I am definitely not used to it. Not sure what to expect.

[Mr.Waffles]

This is enlightened me to say the least . I am not 1 bit discouraged. I have never been on any kind of message board . I appreciate each and everyone of you . What is a good way to get body fat checked ?

I have been lacking on cardio for quite some time and diet has been decent but not perfect . It's time to step everything up and prime myself for my first cycle.

[kelkel]

Glad you're not discouraged. Just do your due diligence, absorb opinions from all sides and make an informed decision on what course of action to take and how to implement it. You'll be fine.

Re body fat, take a look at this for a good guestimate:

[Mr.Waffles]

I'm estimating in-between 20 and 25

[Mr.Waffles]

I think that code is the current o e, at least as of a week or so ago, if not let me know and ill fi d the newest one- they float around online and a friend of mine gets an email once a month with the new code.

Waffles, if you look through the info on the tests, there are a few different ones that will give you info you need, so e are different prices. If i remember correct i think one of the female panels will do, and i think the unisex panel also. I think those 2 and the one i mentioned above are pretty close in price. I think the hormone panel i mentioned above was in the $105-110 range. So you can end up payibg maybe 90 bucks with coupon.
But look through them and check them out. Woth that test i think you should get estradiol, free and total test, the CBC, FSH, LH, metabolic panel. Then you can add tests in if you ever want to.

I am planning on going Monday if you have a code to save me $$ .

[Dannyboy51577]

You order online, code should be MAR2018, you enter it in the coupon box online. It should take off the 15% before checkout

[Mr.Waffles]

You order online, code should be MAR2018, you enter it in the coupon box online. It should take off the 15% before checkout

Sweet,

Assuming I go with prop. Let's say I have 20 ml how should I make the best of it?
Like someone said previously prop is going to hurt. I plan on hitting glutes then going to delts in a circle
. My friend said he is absolutely dreading glute injecting because his ass
hurts so bad .
Where should I get more pins for delts ?

[MACKATTACK]

1) you don't have the right to talk to anybody like that.

2) he isn't half assing anything.

3) I'm allowed opinions just the same as you.

4) were did you get your degree?

5) got someone calling him fat beer belly double chin, when its not even the case

5.1) I hate when vets (used that term loosely) band together and parrot the same bullshit over and over again.

thanks for the insight my man.

Prime example why you won't last here.........your mouth will get you booted swiftly.......no one has times for games on this forum, you are dealing with peoples health and livelihood. Giving bad advice and acting as if you know everything and arguing with senior leadership is not what is needed here.

[kelkel]

Waffles why don't you just order up some cyp from somewhere?

[Mr.Waffles]

Considering it

[Dannyboy51577]

Not a bad idea. I know you said you have the prop already, but alot less pinning etc with e or cyp. I just use prop because i prefer it, dont ask me why, just one of those things that stuck with me

[Lemonada8]

Not gonna read the 3 pages of replies lol... but i bet alot of replies are great...

but my 2 cents are answered in my blog, just under my name i believe... but I loved test prop as my first cycle... 50mg EVERY DAY for 7 weeks. Great cycle. make sure u have a good PCT and run HCG on cycle and good diet. Check out my blog and u can PM me any questions if u like. Ill try to check for ur messages good luck!!! or u can post here.

[Mr.Waffles]

Letrole or arimidex ?

2000 mg of tamoxifen
1500 mg of clomid.

Should be plenty for 1 cycle maybe 2?

I just want to make sure I understand this correctly and order plenty. I did the math , just want verification.

Anyone have a coupon for in-house ?

[Couchlockd]

Prime example why you won't last here.........your mouth will get you booted swiftly.......no one has times for games on this forum, you are dealing with peoples health and livelihood. Giving bad advice and acting as if you know everything and arguing with senior leadership is not what is needed here.

I didn't argue with Kel, I did with you, your not senior leadership at all.

you can give advice that's not quite right either, with half a cycle under your belt.

I'm in 8 or 9 over the last 10 years.

I practice safety, hence why my bloods come back better after every cycle, nothing gets out of range when on as per my mid cycle bloods show me and I cycle only once a year, or less

not here to twist tails, but I'm allowed to be just as confident in my opinions and experiences as anyone else.

after all, we are doing illegal things, for gods sake, lets not get jaded.

[kelkel]

I'm in 8 or 9 over the last 10 years.

I practice safety, hence why my bloods come back better after every cycle, nothing gets out of range when on as per my mid cycle bloods show me and I cycle only once a year, or less

not here to twist tails, but I'm allowed to be just as confident in my opinions and experiences as anyone else.

after all, we are doing illegal things, for gods sake, lets not get jaded.

Good to learn a bit of your history m.horn. And there's nothing wrong with being confident in your opinions.

[Lemonada8]

Letrole or arimidex ?

2000 mg of tamoxifen
1500 mg of clomid.

Should be plenty for 1 cycle maybe 2?

I just want to make sure I understand this correctly and order plenty. I did the math , just want verification.

Anyone have a coupon for in-house ?

Arimidex for Ai on cycle... i never used one with prop ED... didnt need it... but dont use letro for AI control, its very potent and can tank ur E2 levels.

Tamoxifen u should have enough for 40mg x 7 days for 2 weeks then 20mg x 7 days for 4 weeks
Clomid 100mg x 7 days for 2 weeks then 50mg x 7 days for 2 weeks

if u get signs of gyno then start nolva on cycle at 40mg then continue it throughout cycle. Then continue it thru pct. When u notice the gyno to decrease then decrease it down to 20mg for 4 weeks following. U want the nolva to go for 2 weeks past the clomid.

Also HCG on cycle is a MUST. 250iu 2x a week.

[Mr.Waffles]

Arimidex for Ai on cycle... i never used one with prop ED... didnt need it... but dont use letro for AI control, its very potent and can tank ur E2 levels.

Tamoxifen u should have enough for 40mg x 7 days for 2 weeks then 20mg x 7 days for 4 weeks
Clomid 100mg x 7 days for 2 weeks then 50mg x 7 days for 2 weeks

if u get signs of gyno then start nolva on cycle at 40mg then continue it throughout cycle. Then continue it thru pct. When u notice the gyno to decrease then decrease it down to 20mg for 4 weeks following. U want the nolva to go for 2 weeks past the clomid.

Also HCG on cycle is a MUST. 250iu 2x a week.

More opinions on hcg please ?

[kelkel]

More opinions on hcg please ?

There is nothing more really. HCG works. Anyone who cares about their "boys" should run it to maintain function and to help make restarting easier. It's that simple.

[Couchlockd]

Good to learn a bit of your history m.horn. And there's nothing wrong with being confident in your opinions.

since o.p started another thread that will follow his cycle. ill give info.

in all my 8 cycles (I'm on 9th now. and just really introducing other things) I always pretty much just ran test 500-750 mg weekly, I've done front loads (first week 1000mg test) I've played with prop additions on top of long esters test, I've dosed suspensions 3x daily as well.

maybe toss in a DHT like mast, or var during last 8 weeks of a 16-20 week cycle.

this one I'm currently on, I'm running 500 test e weekly. and prop 50 mg eod and test base 25mg daily.

I have found even after all my cycles I really like test and mild dht. I get growth from it why mess around with what works.

that said, I read about and understand 19nors, and I really don't care for what I read (I know they are like steroids on steroids. lol) but I'm not greedy.

I play around a bit with ai dosages, and have ran just serms for on cycle protection.

I wouldn't purposely give someone advice I myself would not try first. in fact I only speak about that which I have done before

[kelkel]

I have found even after all my cycles I really like test and mild dht. I get growth from it why mess around with what works.

I've never run super large or over-complicated cycles either. Never saw the need since I seem to do fine on moderate amounts. And I agree, you have to stick with what works. There are way to many guys who run cycles that are far more advanced than their physiques or level of knowledge justify. Instead of improving training and nutrition they look to run more compounds.

But when it comes to 19 Nor's, oh you'd like them and they're no where near the problem guys make them out to be if you have a bit of knowledge behind you. I even run low dose deca with my TRT and have done so for years. My doc will write it for me but insurance won't cover it so it's simply cheaper to get it elsewhere...

[MACKATTACK]

You are arguing with everyone and telling them they have no right to talk to you like that. You should go back and read your responses. I’m done with you, like I said you are the steotypical “juice head” who can’t control his emotions and is under educated. It’s “you’re” btw.

I didn't argue with Kel, I did with you, your not senior leadership at all.

you can give advice that's not quite right either, with half a cycle under your belt.

I'm in 8 or 9 over the last 10 years.

I practice safety, hence why my bloods come back better after every cycle, nothing gets out of range when on as per my mid cycle bloods show me and I cycle only once a year, or less

not here to twist tails, but I'm allowed to be just as confident in my opinions and experiences as anyone else.

after all, we are doing illegal things, for gods sake, lets not get jaded.

[Dannyboy51577]

Gotta agree with kel, i talk to alot of guys that are either running a cycle that is way too advanced for them, or running simply way too much gear. I guess its part of the way society is now-more is better, and everything right now.

I have never run what i wouod consider a crazy cycle. Most of my cycling was done from around 22yo to about 29 or 30yo. There wasnt the info about ancillaries, pct, etc that there is now so i i always kept the mentality that if i could gain on the minimum combo's and amounts, then i was less inclined to get whacked with sides.

I have always been a larger framed - i have been 6'3" since just after high school, and was about 220-225 lbs at 22 or 23, and stayed that way til my body started to slow down at 35. So been in the 230-245 range since then. Yet i still love me a test-deca run. I experimented more than a few times with different compounds and combos- i like to see for myself what the results are, and i like running winny on the last 4 wks of a test/deca run- although it seems counterproductive , with a guy my size, even with a caloric deficit while on deca, i usually end up putting on anywhere from 12-20lbs. If i run the winny at the end, i get rid of alot of the water and bloat, while still gettin the benefits of the deca to keep my joints from really killin me. Has worked for me to the extent i wanted

I have no problem being a guinea pig and trying different things, see how they work, learn by experience and trial and error. And I guess there must be a place for high amounts and crazy cycles, but ive never needed to.

[Couchlockd]

You are arguing with everyone and telling them they have no right to talk to you like that. You should go back and read your responses. I’m done with you, like I said you are the steotypical “juice head” who can’t control his emotions and is under educated. It’s “you’re” btw.

oh, no your done with me? please not that. I look up to you man. I aspire to be you, please don't turn your back on me, I mean you've taught me soo much about apostrophes...

Listen man that's all you got is a correction of your and you're

You realize I'm typing into a phone and don't really give two flying fucks whether or not I'm using the proper punctuation

You have 6 weeks under your belt I read your thread you can't even handle 500 mg of test without losing your temper

I will speak straight and to the point I'm not going to sugar-coat things to try to be cool and make friends if you don't like what I'm saying then don't read it I mean you have a leg in your I mean you have a leg in your avatar nice work you have the development that could only come with walking around LOL

and quote the "bad advice" I gave. what I told him with a few hundred mg test he might not need 1mg of adex a week crushing his estrogen? because I told him maybe try .25mg e3d? terrible dangerous loose cannon I am. trying to kill members. lol

or saying prop a first cycle is ok (I mean even in your scripture of 'planning and executing first cycle) its mentioned in that thread test c, test e, or test p is perfectly suitable.

it even says you may need less ai than .25mg a day.

lets try and understand, its a general guidline in that thread, when specific questions are asked it is ok to give situation specific advice.

mic drop...

[Mr.Waffles]

Mac , will you stay off my thread unless you give useful advice .your stirring the pot when it seemed to be settled.

[ghettoboyd]

Mac , will you stay off my thread unless you give useful advice .your stirring the pot when it seemed to be settled.

agreed guys maybe take this to PM if there is more to be said this thread has been hijacked bad...sorry waffles...

[almostgone]

I'll second what Ghetto posted. Let Waffles have a thread where he can get input, not harassment.

[Mr.Waffles]

P.s. waiting on blood work sucks

[Mr.Waffles]

Damn, I am really confused on AI . Is it recommended to start ai immediately or only if I see symptoms. I have been recommended several different medications and I don't have any clue what to get . This shit is going over my head by the minute .

[Dannyboy51577]

I wouldnt run an ai at all with your current planned dose and current e2 level. Your test levels will prob peak somewhere in the 1100-1500 level at the high end, give or take. Not that much outside high normal. And until your e2 increases and levels out a bit, you have nothing to combat against.

[kelkel]

Your test levels will prob peak somewhere in the 1100-1500 level at the high end, give or take.

Don't know if I missed something but I surely hope he surpasses those numbers on a cycle. Hell, my TRT dose of 120-140 mgs hits those numbers.....

[Mr.Waffles]

I have shot acouple ideas by other members and the consensus was 3-400 a week won't get me much in terms of performance.

[kelkel]

I would not go less than 400, imho.

[Dannyboy51577]

I can understand the hesitation to change plans when you have it in your head how you want to do it. Nothing wrong with that. Its much easier for guys that have done certain compounds at certain levels to say its no big deal. But you also have to be comfortable with what you are doing, and have that sense of security in your own mind. And if starting out low helps you feel better and get your feet under you, then so be it. Once you get your feet wet and get comfortable, it will be easier to increase or make adjustments. Do you, be comfortable with it, amd the rest will follow

[Mr.Waffles]

I figured it was time for a update . I am about halfway through my cycle . I've been injecting 100mg EOD . Started .25 mg of adex last week . I feel great ! Looking leaner and way more defined . 222 lbs as of acouple days ago . I am going next week for mid blood work .
Hcg is on the way.
P.s. prop isn't near as bad as what people tried to say . I rotate between 6 injection sites .

I'm curious to see how much I will change over the next few weeks . There is a huge noticable differences then before . I have been eating pretty clean minus a cheat meal on the weekend . I've upped cardio and started hitting abs hard.

On a side note my wife was ok with me running a cycle in the beginning but now she is all for it .
Thank you all for your help and answering my messages.

[Dannyboy51577]

Yeah, im with ya on the wife front. My wife and i were dating when i cycled earlier in my years, but she didnt know much about it. Was very skeptical when i decided to go back on. But once she saw i felt better, more energy, better mood, better libido, and no negatives, she was pleasantly surprised.

Great to hear its going good man, keep at it and you will be happy with the outcome

[GearHeaded]

Once your wife comes over to the dark side with you it gets even better.. nothing better then having a "lets inject each other with gear" date