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Thread: Estrogen /AI

  1. #1
    DPSCT is online now New Member
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    Estrogen /AI

    Hey all

    First post. Been lurking for awhile & learning alot.

    My question is.. Do you guys feel an AI (such as Aromasin ) is absolutely necessary w an estradiol reading of 95 with absolutely no related AI symptoms?

    Cycle is 500 MG test cyp per week. Thank you!!

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  2. #2
    FishWhisperer1972 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by DPSCT View Post
    Hey all

    First post. Been lurking for awhile & learning alot.

    My question is.. Do you guys feel an AI (such as Aromasin ) is absolutely necessary w an estradiol reading of 95 with absolutely no related AI symptoms?

    Cycle is 500 MG test cyp per week. Thank you!!

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    Better to be safe than sorry brother.
    12.5 every 3 days is what I use even though Ive never had estrogen sides gyno etc. But I sure as hell don't want any either as from what I've seen and heard gyno once set in more than likely has to be fixed with surgery .

    Sent from my moto g power using Tapatalk

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by DPSCT View Post
    Hey all

    First post. Been lurking for awhile & learning alot.

    My question is.. Do you guys feel an AI (such as Aromasin ) is absolutely necessary w an estradiol reading of 95 with absolutely no related AI symptoms?

    Cycle is 500 MG test cyp per week. Thank you!!

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    It depends on whether that estradiol test is the sensitive or the regular. If it is the regular, your estradiol is likely not out of range. Even if it is the sensitive, and you are not having any high e sides, then why bother? Your test is likely through the roof, so it makes sense that your e would and should be. You're probably feeling good, making gains, etc so if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it.

    You could start nolvadex at 5mg per day if you have concerns about gyno, but if everything is going well, I would ride it out.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by DPSCT View Post

    My question is.. Do you guys feel an AI (such as Aromasin ) is absolutely necessary w an estradiol reading of 95 with absolutely no related AI symptoms?
    Short answer: absolutely Not, if you don't have symptoms as @cylon said already.

    Long answer: please post your full blood work reading instead (with units)
    .
    Last edited by Dgs59; 09-13-2021 at 08:20 AM.
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  5. #5
    DPSCT is online now New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cylon357 View Post
    It depends on whether that estradiol test is the sensitive or the regular. If it is the regular, your estradiol is likely not out of range. Even if it is the sensitive, and you are not having any high e sides, then why bother? Your test is likely through the roof, so it makes sense that your e would and should be. You're probably feeling good, making gains, etc so if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it.

    You could start nolvadex at 5mg per day if you have concerns about gyno, but if everything is going well, I would ride it out.
    The cycle is actually done with so I'm sort of asking after the fact and in preparation for my next cycle.

    My blood work mid (last) cycle - which has now ended - showed the following :

    Total Test: 2,320 ng/dL
    Free Test : 781 pg/mL
    Estradiol: 95 pg/ml
    It was not the Ultrasensitive estradiol test

    All else (lipids, PSA, liver etc) was normal and within the ranges established by Quest Diagnostic.

    Keep in mind this was on a cutting diet so my carbs (and body fat) where relatively low.

    I didn't add in any AI - and as I said I didn't have any related symptoms during the cycle - but in almost every post I read people just add an AI from the start of the cycle without even bothering to get blood work so that's what has been confusing me.

    I'll be doing another cycle (bulking) come October. This one will be 500 test cyp again and I'll be adding in 300 MG NPP and 25 MG Proviron per day.
    Test and NPP will be split into injections 3 times per week (M W & F)

    Can an estrodiol reading that high give me issues with prolactin when I start this next cycle? I believe the two are related in that the higher the estradiol the more potential there is for prolactin issues.... But I may be mistaken.

    I'm going to be adding in P5p to help control Prolactin.

    Bottom line is that I don't want to add in anything that is not absolutely necessary at my next cycle be it an AI or Caber.

    Thank you!!

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    Last edited by DPSCT; 09-13-2021 at 08:24 AM.
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  6. #6
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    High prolactin is one mofo of a killer. It’s worse than high estrogen.

    Anyways high estrogen + high prolactin is the defacto formula for developing gyno.

    Personally I’d run the caber from the start no questions asked. The AI id keep on hand for when it may be needed.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DPSCT View Post
    The cycle is actually done with so I'm sort of asking after the fact and in preparation for my next cycle.

    My blood work mid (last) cycle showed the following :

    Total Test: 2,320
    Free Test : 781
    Estradiol: 95
    It was not the Ultrasensitive test

    Keep in mind this was on a cutting diet so my carbs (and body fat) where relatively low.

    I didn't add in any AI - and as I said I didn't have any related symptoms during the cycle - but in almost every post I read people just add an AI from the start of the cycle without even bothering to get blood work so that's what has been confusing me.

    I'll be doing another cycle (bulking) come October. This one will be 500 test cyp again and I'll be adding in 300 MG NPP and 25 MG Proviron per day.
    Test and NPP will be split into injections 3 times per week (M W & F)

    Can an estrodiol reading that high give me issues with prolactin when I start this next cycle? I believe the two are related in that the higher the estradiol the more potential there is for prolactin issues.... But I may be mistaken.

    I'm going to be adding in P5p to help control Prolactin.

    Bottom line is that I don't want to add in anything that is not absolutely necessary at my next cycle be it an AI or Caber.

    Thank you!!

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    Man with those numbers, I bet you felt like Superman!

    A good rough estimate, and man, I can't stress 'rough' enough, is that the regular estradiol test will read roughly twice as high as the sensitive in men. But being conservative and saying it read 50% higher, your e2 was around 60, and as low as 45 if we cut the reading in half. Neither is a bad number with those t scores and especially with a low body fat. In fact, you may have felt even better if your e was a little higher.

    I think that the thinking on adding an AI in from day one is to keep things idiot proof. A lot of gym bros aren't disciplined enough to be smart about their cycles, nutrition etc so the general guidance comes from "just in case the person reading this is a donkey brain...". That is, a better safe than sorry approach.

    The rest of your questions I will have to defer to someone else more knowledgeable, and being as this is Monday, we ought to see an uptick in traffic. I do like the idea of not adding things to your cycle unnecessarily, that goes back to the idea that "every compound has a purpose and I know what it is".
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  8. #8
    Cylon357's Avatar
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    OP, as I see that these are your first posts, welcome to the posting part of the forum!
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  9. #9
    DPSCT is online now New Member
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    Good info.

    Any other options on this topic at all??

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  10. #10
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    I’ve never run an AI or caber…ever.

    I handle estrogen and prolactin sides quite well and recognize the value of elevated E2. There’s also a genetic component so it’s difficult to paint with a broad brush. I would let symptoms be your compass.

    I get some slight edema on high test (6-800 mgs) and some delayed orgasms on Tren due to elevated prolactin (4-600 mgs). I’m a believer in less is more and crashed estrogen and prolactin is a whole different can of worms.

    I’m also a believer in having mast and proviron on board…especially with any 19 nors.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiki View Post
    High prolactin is one mofo of a killer. Itís worse than high estrogen.

    Anyways high estrogen + high prolactin is the defacto formula for developing gyno.

    Personally Iíd run the caber from the start no questions asked. The AI id keep on hand for when it may be needed.
    Caber on board for 500 mgs of test? We have a very different opinion. No way in hell..

    OP, if youíre not symptomatic donít treat the lab numbers and caber for a test only cycle is bananas (no offense Kiki).

    If you have gyno flaring or a history of it, then thatís a different conversation.

    If youíre that concerned, Iíd go with Mast as an anti estrogen agent with some mild anabolic properties

  12. #12
    DPSCT is online now New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SampsonandDelilah View Post
    Iíve never run an AI or caberÖever.

    I handle estrogen and prolactin sides quite well and recognize the value of elevated E2. Thereís also a genetic component so itís difficult to paint with a broad brush. I would let symptoms be your compass.

    I get some slight edema on high test (6-800 mgs) and some delayed orgasms on Tren due to elevated prolactin (4-600 mgs). Iím a believer in less is more and crashed estrogen and prolactin is a whole different can of worms.

    Iím also a believer in having mast and proviron on boardÖespecially with any 19 nors.
    You don't know what a relief it is to read this. It seems like almost EVERY cycle post I see people are adding in at least an AI right out of the gate with no regard whatsoever as to if they even really need it. I never understood that. It's like taking Tylenol before you get a headache no?

    My last cycle (my first ever in my 50s) was 500 MG test for 16 weeks. No AI. I just didn't feel I needed it... well... because I just didn't FEEL like I needed it. I did have Aromasin on hand just didn't feel it was necessary based on my lack of high Estrogen symptoms.

    Next cycle will be 500 MG test per week, 300 MG NPP per week and 50 mg Proviron per day. Proviron will provide the DHT component. No Caber. I'll have Aromasin on hand again but I hope I won't need it. Didn't need it last cycle. I'll also have P5P on hand as a prolactin back up but unlikely I'll need that either.

    I wish people gave more thought to AI's/Caber before simply throwing them into every cycle. Why take anything more than you need... Just never made sense to me...

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DPSCT View Post
    You don't know what a relief it is to read this. It seems like almost EVERY cycle post I see people are adding in at least an AI right out of the gate with no regard whatsoever as to if they even really need it. I never understood that. It's like taking Tylenol before you get a headache no?

    My last cycle (my first ever in my 50s) was 500 MG test for 16 weeks. No AI. I just didn't feel I needed it... well... because I just didn't FEEL like I needed it. I did have Aromasin on hand just didn't feel it was necessary based on my lack of high Estrogen symptoms.

    Next cycle will be 500 MG test per week, 300 MG NPP per week and 50 mg Proviron per day. Proviron will provide the DHT component. No Caber. I'll have Aromasin on hand again but I hope I won't need it. Didn't need it last cycle. I'll also have P5P on hand as a prolactin back up but unlikely I'll need that either.

    I wish people gave more thought to AI's/Caber before simply throwing them into every cycle. Why take anything more than you need... Just never made sense to me...

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


    Couldn’t agree more.

    I would read up on masteron , it’s an awesome drug and is multifaceted. Test, 19 nor and mast is the holy trinity. HUGE fan of proviron on cycle as well

    You’re on the right track for sure imho
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