Wanderlei Silva v. Chuck Liddell..your thoughts

[Quil]

MMA and Pride are well established in Japan...MMA is still coming up here in the states. Dana is obviously concerned about losing fans to Pride once people find out how good the quality of fighters are there. But I agree, I think the UFC should show the same respect to Pride and their fighters as the do to the UFC in Japan.

[rar1015]

Alright alright.....sorry if i pissed any of you guys off about this whole thing buy everyone has there opinions on this fight. You never know what will happen until they step in the ring and fight. Some of you like pride more than the ufc and some like the ufc more than pride. We are just gonna have to wait and see what happens if they fight (which i really hope they do).

[Panzerfaust]

Alright alright.....sorry if i pissed any of you guys off about this whole thing buy everyone has there opinions on this fight. You never know what will happen until they step in the ring and fight. Some of you like pride more than the ufc and some like the ufc more than pride. We are just gonna have to wait and see what happens if they fight (which i really hope they do).

You know what it is with me, i love MMA. But i'll be damned if they (UFC) try to sell me a shit sandwhich and call it a angus steak burger. **** that, UFC has done alot of good for MMA in the States but don't seem to care about the long run and that is why we have a shitty HW division, ****ing rematches constantly, bums fighting Champions (happens everywhere but the UFC is awful for it) and trying to make people believe that the bum fighter is "world class" etc...

Most of the UFC roster is American, it's like they are scared to have a foreign champion. There is a huge reason why som many Pride fighters have fought in the UFC in the past but don't any longer.

Pride and it's fans treat the fighters like god's and warriors win or lose, Americans are dumb as shit and boo and curse during fights and are just loud, ignoarant and obnoxious.

Why would anyone wanna fight there is beyond me, but some people will do anything just to fight and that leads e to fighter salaries..just how in the flying **** can you expect a fighter to live off and train properly for $2k to show $2k to win?

That is the biggest ****ing problem with UFC, they pay the fighters shit and that is beyond disrespectful IMO, someone is pocketing the ****ing cash because it is'nt going to the fighters.

Pride pays alot better and in return the fighters are better..i know i would fight alot harder for $50k to fight than if i were gonna get paid $2k


UFC sent Chuck, Vitor, Ricco over to Pride and they all lost, Chuck did beat a green Overeem though, Pride then tried to send Kharitonov, Ninja, CroCop to the UFC and they turned them down. wtf?

Fact is, Zuffa would be paying Pride fighter's salary just as Pride paid Chuck, Vitor's, Ricco's UFC salary when they came to Pride.

It is good to see the sport grown here in the states but at the same time makes me wanna ****ing puke with all these TUF fighters fighting on cards and being caled "world class" etc...when Ray Charles can tell they are awful.

People actually thought Leben would kill Anderson Silva...and why should'nt they have thought that...the UFC did a piss poor ****ing job of promoting their latest signing. They had to know what was gonna happen, fact is they want everyone to believe Leben is a killer etc...well he just got blasted and made to look like a complete tool..what now?

I could go on and on but my fingers are getting tired...

[juiceboxxx]

You know what it is with me, i love MMA. But i'll be damned if they (UFC) try to sell me a shit sandwhich and call it a angus steak burger. **** that, UFC has done alot of good for MMA in the States but don't seem to care about the long run and that is why we have a shitty HW division, ****ing rematches constantly, bums fighting Champions (happens everywhere but the UFC is awful for it) and trying to make people believe that the bum fighter is "world class" etc...

Most of the UFC roster is American, it's like they are scared to have a foreign champion. There is a huge reason why som many Pride fighters have fought in the UFC in the past but don't any longer.

Pride and it's fans treat the fighters like god's and warriors win or lose, Americans are dumb as shit and boo and curse during fights and are just loud, ignoarant and obnoxious.

Why would anyone wanna fight there is beyond me, but some people will do anything just to fight and that leads e to fighter salaries..just how in the flying **** can you expect a fighter to live off and train properly for $2k to show $2k to win?

That is the biggest ****ing problem with UFC, they pay the fighters shit and that is beyond disrespectful IMO, someone is pocketing the ****ing cash because it is'nt going to the fighters.

Pride pays alot better and in return the fighters are better..i know i would fight alot harder for $50k to fight than if i were gonna get paid $2k


UFC sent Chuck, Vitor, Ricco over to Pride and they all lost, Chuck did beat a green Overeem though, Pride then tried to send Kharitonov, Ninja, CroCop to the UFC and they turned them down. wtf?

Fact is, Zuffa would be paying Pride fighter's salary just as Pride paid Chuck, Vitor's, Ricco's UFC salary when they came to Pride.

It is good to see the sport grown here in the states but at the same time makes me wanna ****ing puke with all these TUF fighters fighting on cards and being caled "world class" etc...when Ray Charles can tell they are awful.

People actually thought Leben would kill Anderson Silva...and why should'nt they have thought that...the UFC did a piss poor ****ing job of promoting their latest signing. They had to know what was gonna happen, fact is they want everyone to believe Leben is a killer etc...well he just got blasted and made to look like a complete tool..what now?

I could go on and on but my fingers are getting tired...

Amazing post. The reason why they pay the fighters so low is cuz Dana White is one greedy sob. He keeps most of the profit to himself obviously!

He is just finally starting to make a couple big signing money wise after re signing Tito then getting Spider anderson silvia and vanderlia silva.

If he wants ufc to become big time and world wide like he says then he has to spend more money and be less greedy.

[Panzerfaust]

Dana does'nt have Wanderlei under a UFC contract, Wanderlei is on loan from Pride just as Chuck etc were on loan from the UFC. It is most likely some type of agreement contract, you send your fighter here bla bla bla

Exact same siutation as Royce, Royce is under contract with K-1 and it was K-1 and Zuffa who negotiated his fight in the UFC, technically he was fighting in the UFC as a K-1 rep

[juiceboxxx]

Dana does'nt have Wanderlei under a UFC contract, Wanderlei is on loan from Pride just as Chuck etc were on loan from the UFC. It is most likely some type of agreement contract, you send your fighter here bla bla bla

but still Dana doesn't like to spend much money by signing the big boyz

[USfighterFC]

You know what it is with me, i love MMA. But i'll be damned if they (UFC) try to sell me a shit sandwhich and call it a angus steak burger. **** that, UFC has done alot of good for MMA in the States but don't seem to care about the long run and that is why we have a shitty HW division, ****ing rematches constantly, bums fighting Champions (happens everywhere but the UFC is awful for it) and trying to make people believe that the bum fighter is "world class" etc...

Most of the UFC roster is American, it's like they are scared to have a foreign champion. There is a huge reason why som many Pride fighters have fought in the UFC in the past but don't any longer.

Pride and it's fans treat the fighters like god's and warriors win or lose, Americans are dumb as shit and boo and curse during fights and are just loud, ignoarant and obnoxious.

Why would anyone wanna fight there is beyond me, but some people will do anything just to fight and that leads e to fighter salaries..just how in the flying **** can you expect a fighter to live off and train properly for $2k to show $2k to win?

That is the biggest ****ing problem with UFC, they pay the fighters shit and that is beyond disrespectful IMO, someone is pocketing the ****ing cash because it is'nt going to the fighters.

Pride pays alot better and in return the fighters are better..i know i would fight alot harder for $50k to fight than if i were gonna get paid $2k


UFC sent Chuck, Vitor, Ricco over to Pride and they all lost, Chuck did beat a green Overeem though, Pride then tried to send Kharitonov, Ninja, CroCop to the UFC and they turned them down. wtf?

Fact is, Zuffa would be paying Pride fighter's salary just as Pride paid Chuck, Vitor's, Ricco's UFC salary when they came to Pride.

It is good to see the sport grown here in the states but at the same time makes me wanna ****ing puke with all these TUF fighters fighting on cards and being caled "world class" etc...when Ray Charles can tell they are awful.

People actually thought Leben would kill Anderson Silva...and why should'nt they have thought that...the UFC did a piss poor ****ing job of promoting their latest signing. They had to know what was gonna happen, fact is they want everyone to believe Leben is a killer etc...well he just got blasted and made to look like a complete tool..what now?

I could go on and on but my fingers are getting tired...

Cro-cops salary is close to around 750k per fight. He is the highest paid foreigner to fight in Pride and Kharitonov is close to 150k per fight. Ninjas pay is pretty high as well. The problem is that Zuffa doesnt have the money to pay those salaries. UFC 60 made around $30 million and thats not all profit. I think the highest total that the UFC has ever had was $500,000. Thats everyones pay in the whole event. Cro-cops salary alone is higher than that. Kharitonov would have to be paid as much as Randy Coutures and Tito Oritz. I think to many people in the UFC that's just ludicrous someone from another organization can come in fight one fight and leave with a higher pay than their top man or the entire squad fighting that night. The Ferttita brothers only made a few million from the UFC last year. Yes they did pull in 25 million but they do own casinos and resorts around Vegas.

I think the UFC needs to remarket the whole concept of MMA. They should no longer call it Ultimate Fighting or cage fighting. Ultimate fighting is a way to describe the sport for people who have no clue what it is and it's a label that was used when the UFC was nothing but a bunch of bar brawlers. You guys ever watch a Pride commercial??....the shit is actually pretty moving. They have Andrea Bocelli singing "Con Te Partido" which is an opera song while showing clips of fights. Even when during the show when they have the fighters stats before they fight they have some sort of cult chant/music in the backround which is HORRID and has been carried over since the early UFC days. Instead of promoting it as an WWE event with more blood and that stupid deep throaty voiced guy saying "TITO ORTIZ KEN SHAMROCK BAAAD BLOOOOOD WHO WILL BE LEFT STANDING" promote it better. So many more people like Pride because of the FANS and their PROMOTION and not even because of the fighters. Try something different.

[Logan13]

It may be fun to revisit this thread after the Liddell/Silva fight. Liddell is a MUCH better fighter than he was 3 years ago guys and Silva is a badass. I can guarantee you that Silva is not better at the take down than Couture though, and Liddell fought him off pretty easily. I prefer a good ground and pound, but Silva must first get Chuck to the ground. My question: What will you guys say if Liddell wins? "Oh, he just got a lucky punch in"? I will totally agree on one point: The UFC heavyweight division is a ****ing joke.
Either way, this will be a good fight.
-Logan13

[Icon]

Cro-cops salary is close to around 750k per fight. He is the highest paid foreigner to fight in Pride

The NY Times article last month quoted Fedor making a million per fight.

I'll stay out of the UFC vs. Pride debate though.

[skinnyhb]

ya, ive gotta agree with the need to change the promotion style of the UFC. just as many people who i was watching the fight with who didn't know who wandy was were also calling it "that brutal no rules fighting". it can't expand to larger audiences while it is still widely regarded as that.

[Panzerfaust]

It may be fun to revisit this thread after the Liddell/Silva fight. Liddell is a MUCH better fighter than he was 3 years ago guys and Silva is a badass. I can guarantee you that Silva is not better at the take down than Couture though, and Liddell fought him off pretty easily. I prefer a good ground and pound, but Silva must first get Chuck to the ground. My question: What will you guys say if Liddell wins? "Oh, he just got a lucky punch in"? I will totally agree on one point: The UFC heavyweight division is a ****ing joke.
Either way, this will be a good fight.
-Logan13

Why would Wanderlei take it to the ground? Mark my words, Chuck gets clocked by Wanderlei he will shoot, it's a natural defense he has. Overeem popped him and he shot in on Overeem.

Silva is alot better than 41 year old Couture (not a striker) chasing Chuck down.

IMO, i give it 60/40 in Wanderlei's favor..he has more tools than Chuck and having faced K-1 strikers in Hunt & CroCop and not gotten KTFO, speaks for itself. Chuck has been fighting 185lb Horn (not even a striker), Vernon White (the name say's it all).

This fight will not happen...mark my words..to much going on right now for both fighters to be able to come into a fight in November healthy, especially Wanderlei, he WILL be facing 1 top 5 HW come September, possibly two and the chances of him walking out unscathed are not that great. He will be outweighed by 25-30lbs no matter who he fights.

[Smart-tony]

Dana does'nt have Wanderlei under a UFC contract, Wanderlei is on loan from Pride just as Chuck etc were on loan from the UFC. It is most likely some type of agreement contract, you send your fighter here bla bla bla

Exact same siutation as Royce, Royce is under contract with K-1 and it was K-1 and Zuffa who negotiated his fight in the UFC, technically he was fighting in the UFC as a K-1 rep

You have lots of great posts,and you know there isn't nothing wrong with fighters with some type of agreement and fighting as a rep.I can't wait to see this fight but i would like to see a few matches out of both of them.

[USfighterFC]

It may be fun to revisit this thread after the Liddell/Silva fight. Liddell is a MUCH better fighter than he was 3 years ago guys and Silva is a badass. I can guarantee you that Silva is not better at the take down than Couture though, and Liddell fought him off pretty easily. I prefer a good ground and pound, but Silva must first get Chuck to the ground. My question: What will you guys say if Liddell wins? "Oh, he just got a lucky punch in"? I will totally agree on one point: The UFC heavyweight division is a ****ing joke.
Either way, this will be a good fight.
-Logan13

Silva isnt gonna try to take him to the ground he's not a big ground and pounder. He will knock him out standing.

[Box This*]

Wandy all the way total manaic.

[pepperoni]

I'm putting my money on Chuck, but I think anyone is stupid to say that this will be an easy fight either way. They are both obviously skilled, and it will be a good fight, but in the end Chuck will take it.

[Quil]

If it's going to be a talent exchange type fight, then how is it that Dana said it will be for the title? If Wand wins, he'll be under contract with the UFC to defend his title (if memory serves correctly).

[HeavyHitter]

I for Liddel all the way baby! Been a fan of the Iceman for a while. Gonna be a SICK fight, as long as Chuck stays on his feet, which im confident he will. Plus UFC needs some redemption against Pride.

[QuieTSToRM33]

Pride over UFC ........ Wandy over Chuck here

[sooners04]

It's ok, he has'nt been around long enough to realise that MMA math does'nt work, never has, never will.

In that case, Rampage beat the living hell out of Chuck and Wanderlei KO'd Rampage so bad it made him find Jesus.

If you look at the posts above mine you would realize I was going with that logic. Not that I agree with it because it doesn't work in ANY sport. Chuck still wins!!

[westcoastbadboy]

very true

[sonar1234]

Is the fight gonna be in UFC ground of PRide ground?

[sonar1234]

Wandy if he comes in like when he fought rampage he is gonna pound Liddell like hell.

Wandy got serious sick knees strikes and if the fight happens in UFC which i dounbt he will be able to do some standing elbow stikes.

UFC needs this fight.

[rar1015]

Is the fight gonna be in UFC ground of PRide ground?

UFC ground.

[rar1015]

Silva is only 30 years old huh? I thought he was a lot older that.

[Ridla]

I believe it will be a nice fight to watch as long as both of them stay on their feet. Still I think Silva will take chuck. If it goes to the ground Silva will hand chuck his ass. We cant for get that silva gained more weight too and has same speed and endurance but now more power. Actually if U think about it Silva will maul Chuck..
hahahah

[Natty99]

85% of the UFC "fans" are completely ignorant when it comes to MMA and that the world does not revolve around America and the brand name UFC. The crowds at the UFC are typical ****ing morons that don't know their ass from a hole in the ground.

You got people on here saying Wanderlei will not be as effective without stomps and knees to a downed opponent, little do they realise that Wanderlei has more options as a fighter than Chuck.

Chuck has:

1. Strikes (and eye pokes)
2. Take down defense

Wanderlei has:

1. Strikes
2. Knee attacks in the clinch (would'nt normally need to mention this, as it is obvious but people don't seem to know who or what Wanderlei is/can do)
3. BJJ Black Belt (awesome defense)
4. Takedown defense (improved since the 2nd Arona fight)
5. Knees, Stomps & Soccer kicks ***Pride rules***
6. Psycho Aggression
7. Cardio Machine

Need i say more?

Chick also has the following.

3. Sledgehammers for fists
4. Beer gut strength
5. Some pretty wicked kicks (hasn't had to use them laterly as everyone just drops like a hooker on a $20 Bill)

[HeavyHitter]

Chick also has the following.

3. Sledgehammers for fists
4. Beer gut strength
5. Some pretty wicked kicks (hasn't had to use them laterly as everyone just drops like a hooker on a $20 Bill)

so very true!!!

[groundandpoundpwr21]

Silva by knock out.

[sooners04]

Chuck has:

1. Strikes (and eye pokes)
2. Take down defense

Wanderlei has:

1. Strikes
2. Knee attacks in the clinch (would'nt normally need to mention this, as it is obvious but people don't seem to know who or what Wanderlei is/can do)
3. BJJ Black Belt (awesome defense)
4. Takedown defense (improved since the 2nd Arona fight)
5. Knees, Stomps & Soccer kicks ***Pride rules***
6. Psycho Aggression
7. Cardio Machine

Need i say more?

So you can pretty much eliminate #3 since Chuck has such a great takedown defense it negates the BJJ portion. #4-since Chuck will most likely keep it standing as long as he is in control. #5-since this is UFC not Pride those don't apply to this fight. #6-I believe Chuck is just as aggressive. #7 Chuck can be gassed. Looks pretty even. Mark my words, Chuck will win and everyone that said Silva would win will come up with an excuse.

[Coop77]

Nevada drug tests all fighters, I believe. We may see a considerably less aggressive Silva fighting in the US.

[Logan13]

So you can pretty much eliminate #3 since Chuck has such a great takedown defense it negates the BJJ portion. #4-since Chuck will most likely keep it standing as long as he is in control. #5-since this is UFC not Pride those don't apply to this fight. #6-I believe Chuck is just as aggressive. #7 Chuck can be gassed. Looks pretty even. Mark my words, Chuck will win and everyone that said Silva would win will come up with an excuse.

agreed, posted a similar thought ealier on. They will call it a "striker's chance".

[rar1015]

So you can pretty much eliminate #3 since Chuck has such a great takedown defense it negates the BJJ portion. #4-since Chuck will most likely keep it standing as long as he is in control. #5-since this is UFC not Pride those don't apply to this fight. #6-I believe Chuck is just as aggressive. #7 Chuck can be gassed. Looks pretty even. Mark my words, Chuck will win and everyone that said Silva would win will come up with an excuse.

Agreed!!!

[PROUD TO BE DUTCH!]

If the fight wil happen,(which i doubt) wandy wil kick ass, Don't get me wrong Chuck is a very good fighter with some serious knock out power but I think wandy will win. With respect for Chuck of course. I think at this moment wandy is the better man.


I kow one thing for SURE and that it will be a fight that both UFC an PRIDE fans will never forget!

Grtz

[xpijeonx]

I think this fight will happen if not it will be a huge dissapointment, they both have big fights coming up which to me makes it seem real risky for pride/UFC to even announce this.

I think Silva will take the fight but as anyone who has watched MMA knows ANYTHING can happen. ( A friend of mine just put the lights out on Alex Steibling via guilotene in a grappling tourney here, the kid has less then two years of any real fighting wrestling experience/training. which was absolutely a freak thing but it just goes to show anything can happen.)

Sliva may have more seen tools but I really think Chuck has alot more tools than anyone has even seen. I think one of the biggest things that people dont realize, thats just not where he wants the fight. This style makes him very marketable in America cause every bar room brawler uses the same looping hook although much uglier and they dont realize they are throwing a hook.

I think it will be much harder for chuck to control the pace of the fight with Silva though, he is very aggresive and I think that will be hard for chuck to slow down.

I would really like to see the UFC stray away from the WWF type of marketing. I dont think it will happen though. America is full of rednecks and small towns etc. This type of advertising will always work with the majority of America. I dont know how Japan is or the rest of the world. From what I have seen though it has very developed maybe over-developed communities which is primarily city dwelling(they have access to good entertainment, country folk are entertained by killing rabbits and racing lawn mowers, hehe). I really believe that on top of being better educated they probably do not relate to this type of marketing but we do. Any sport I have ever been involved in that isnt totally mainstreem has been full of rednecks or lower class people, love budlight, missing teeth etc have no idea what champagne or a tooth brush is. SIMPLE people who will understand hate, rivalry and jealousy. So if the UFC markets a fight as "BAD BLOOD" or the like it becomes very simple that this will be a war. If they advertise it as a sport and two world class atheletes fighting to see who is more skilled people might not get it as easily. America doesnt want to think, they want to be entertained primarily(why do these two dudes want to fight if they dont hate each other?). It could be that this has devolped from WWF etc since it has become a staple in so many homes. So it relates very easily.

[USfighterFC]

So you can pretty much eliminate #3 since Chuck has such a great takedown defense it negates the BJJ portion. #4-since Chuck will most likely keep it standing as long as he is in control. #5-since this is UFC not Pride those don't apply to this fight. #6-I believe Chuck is just as aggressive. #7 Chuck can be gassed. Looks pretty even. Mark my words, Chuck will win and everyone that said Silva would win will come up with an excuse.

Chuck is hardly aggressive. Silva makes chuck look like stephan hawking in terms of aggression. He throws big looping punches while silva throws like a friggin wild man. For every punch chuck throws silva will throw 5. I'll def mark those words. The only thing Silva cannot do is soccer kicks but now silva can use elbows which if you ever watched any of his Vale Tudo fights, which I know you have not, he can throw elbows hard. If Cro-cop can't knock him out and Mark Hunt (who makes Chucks punches look like slaps) can't knock him out then I don't think Liddell will either.

[USfighterFC]

What most people hardly realize is chuck has hardly faced a good standing striker. His best fight against a striker was Alistair Overeem and overeem was winning until he gassed, such as overeem does. The only other fighter he fought that was a decent striker was Guy Mezger who gassed as well.

[scriptfactory]

What most people hardly realize is chuck has hardly faced a good standing striker. His best fight against a striker was Alistair Overeem and overeem was winning until he gassed, such as overeem does. The only other fighter he fought that was a decent striker was Guy Mezger who gassed as well.

Yeah, what's up with that? Overeem knows cardio is his Achilles Heel and yet he does nothing to fix it. Doesn't make any sense to me because he would be a very, very good fighter if he improved his cardio.

[kimura9]

I think a huge problem with chuck liddell is his shorts. someone send him some new ones.

[Coop77]

I really think Chuck is overrated. UFC always hypes the hell out of their current champ. He didn't look that good against Quinton.

[gymnutt]

I think this will be a great fight. Both of these guys are great strikers and have a lot of heart. Regardless of what you think of these guys, neither are the type to turn down a fight..and that is rare when you're holding onto a belt. I really hope this fight happens and am looking forward to it. One thing I have always respected immensely of Pride is their propensity to give vets shots at the title, the Grand Prix is proof of this. From what I've seen and heard, the UFC does not often afford this opportunity as freely to those who have proved themselves. I don't see these two going to the ground unless one of them is dropped.