how much over maintenance?

**gettinbigger03** · 04-28-2007, 07:34 PM

How many calories over maintenance should someone eat while on test E cycle?

**audis4** · 04-28-2007, 08:13 PM

totally d e p ends on oneself (metabolism)

I'm eating about 500 over maintenance but I gain fat EXTREMELY easily. Slowly up cals until you begin gaining fat then back off a bit.

**gettinbigger03** · 04-28-2007, 08:43 PM

so how much fat gain should I consider acceptable on a cycle? I heard its inevitable! This is the first time I've ever been at around 12% and I want to gain muscle but minimal fat. Does it hurt your progress to do cardio on a test E cycle?

**audis4** · 04-29-2007, 12:53 AM

doesn't sound like you need aas right now.

keep researching and just focus on eating/training/resting

**Snrf** · 04-29-2007, 04:41 AM

I was 800-1000 over maintenance and didn't gain any noticeable fat until I got to week 8...then I dropped the cals

**gettinbigger03** · 04-30-2007, 03:39 PM

why do you say it doesn't sound like I need AS now?

**gettinbigger03** · 04-30-2007, 04:36 PM

Audis4,
I am just curious what your thoughts are on someone who should/could use AAS and why I don't sound like a canidate? You look like you have been around here for awhile so I assume you know what your talking about. If not now at 30 years old, been lifting for 5 years, 12%body fat, 180pds., 6ft tall. Then when would you say would be the right time I would like to ideally be over 200pds. and the same body fat? Thanks in advance for your time and imput!

**HomesliceYEA** · 04-30-2007, 07:22 PM

If you really want to track your calories, good for you. at 500 above, you will gain approx 1 lb per week (not counting initial water gain). I would say somewhere between 500-1000 over would be good. Remember you will have to keep increasing it as you gain weight though.

**DNoMac** · 04-30-2007, 08:41 PM

What is your goal? If you just want to gain weight, anything over maintenance will do.

**gettinbigger03** · 05-01-2007, 02:23 PM

Thanks for your help guys! my goal is to put on as much mass as possible with the least amount of fat. I guess I will try 500 over and track my body fat with calipers each week. If I'm not gaining fat I'll try 700 and so on. You say you can gain one pound a week? so does that mean the maximum amount of muscle mass you could put on in a ten week cycle is 10pds.? I really do keep track of calories everyday, I'm addicted to a free site where you put in what you eat everyday and track calories or use a meal plan that you can make. I'm at about 600cal. under maintenance now. Trying to get a little leaner before cycle! Oh! by the way do most do cardio while on test E? I did a bulking cycle with no gear over the winter with no cardio. Now I'm "cutting" and doing cardio. Would doing cardio on gear affect gains?

**Snrf** · 05-01-2007, 03:00 PM

people assume a lb of muscle = same amount of calories as a pound of fat.

it is not. ie 450g of fat = approx 4000 calories. the same amount of meat does not have anywhere near the same amount of calories.
ie 450g raw steak = approx 600 calories, obviously it would take extra calories to build the muscle so actual calorie usage would be higher than just the actual calories contained in the muscle itself.

I could be completely wrong here, someone correct me if I am, I just don't believe a lb of fat and a lb of muscle are the same, nor that it takes 3500 calories to gain a lb of muscle

I gained as much as 4-5lbs a week eating 1000 calories over. i was also getting 400g protein a day

**AandF6969** · 05-01-2007, 03:07 PM

Weight gain can also be due to water retention.

**want2bulk** · 05-01-2007, 11:26 PM

A pound of fat contains 3,500 calories while a pound of muscle contains 600 calories. Obviously a 600 calorie surplus doesn't equal a pound of muscle or I'd currently be gaining a couple pounds/week naturally... not gonna happen.

***perfectbeast2001*** · 05-02-2007, 12:18 AM

I would start at 200 and work up until you notice fat gain, find the sweet spot that suits you, there is no fixed rule on this...

**Snrf** · 05-02-2007, 03:27 AM

Originally Posted by want2bulk

A pound of fat contains 3,500 calories while a pound of muscle contains 600 calories. Obviously a 600 calorie surplus doesn't equal a pound of muscle or I'd currently be gaining a couple pounds/week naturally... not gonna happen.

Thats not true, if that was then we'd all be able to gain alot of weight naturally, steroids increase protein synthesis thats the whole point.

I still don't believe that a lb of fat and a lb of muscle take the same amount of calories to create

**audis4** · 05-02-2007, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by gettinbigger03

Audis4,
I am just curious what your thoughts are on someone who should/could use AAS and why I don't sound like a canidate? You look like you have been around here for awhile so I assume you know what your talking about. If not now at 30 years old, been lifting for 5 years, 12%body fat, 180pds., 6ft tall. Then when would you say would be the right time I would like to ideally be over 200pds. and the same body fat? Thanks in advance for your time and imput!

hey bro!
I'm definitely no pro but post a diet and lemme see what your eating. without proper diet, aas does nothing! I agree with beast, get yourself to 200lbs and then hit a cycle if your diet is good and just do a lean bulk, starting off about 500cals above maintenance. Your definitely old enough and would this be your first cycle? what does your entire cycle look like?

**naturalsux** · 05-02-2007, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by audis4

hey bro!
I'm definitely no pro but post a diet and lemme see what your eating. without proper diet, aas does nothing! I agree with beast, get yourself to 200lbs and then hit a cycle if your diet is good and just do a lean bulk, starting off about 500cals above maintenance. Your definitely old enough and would this be your first cycle? what does your entire cycle look like?

thats good advice for a 17-23 year old. hes 30 his test levels could be shit!
he wasting time!

**gettinbigger03** · 05-02-2007, 07:25 PM

right now I'm cutting fat. I'm eating about 2000-2200 calories a day about 600-800 below maintenance( I figure), at a ratio of 40-50%protein, about 15-20%fat, 30-35%carbs. I eat 6-8 times a day. Protein from lean beef, chicken, and whey protein, carbs I try to get from whole grains, fruits, and vegetables, fats if I don't get enough I supplement with olive oil. When I do the cycle I was planning on keeping diet clean at about the same ratio. I'd just up the calories to about 3300 to start and go from there? The cycle I was planning was going to be
Cycle: week 1-2 sustanon 250 500mg wk
Week 3-10 test E 500mg wk
Week 1-17 .25mg l-dex
Pct: (start two weeks after last shot weeks 14-17)
Day 1-30- .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
***the reason I started with sustanon at first is I read somewhere could kick start your gains?(long and short esters) but I also heard it wouldn't? I am getting 5ML Sustanon 250 so unless someone says its a really bad idea to do it I figured I would use it?

**audis4** · 05-02-2007, 08:54 PM

Originally Posted by naturalsux

thats good advice for a 17-23 year old. hes 30 his test levels could be shit!
he wasting time!

are you kidding...his test levels wont be shit!

**audis4** · 05-02-2007, 08:55 PM

^^looks like you can diet.
post pics but i honestly i would cut to 10% and do a lean bulk/cycle. I wouldn't cycle till i hit 200lbs but thats me.
good luck man!

**want2bulk** · 05-02-2007, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Snrfmaster

Thats not true, if that was then we'd all be able to gain alot of weight naturally, steroids increase protein synthesis thats the whole point.

I still don't believe that a lb of fat and a lb of muscle take the same amount of calories to create

What's not true? You must have misread my post. What it takes to PRODUCE a pound of muscle, who knows. But a lb of fat is 3,500 calories. A lb of muscle is 600 calories. This is why it's so easy to lose muscle. As why it's so hard to gain it, I'm guessing because the body is so good at converting other nutrients to fat instead.

**gettinbigger03** · 05-03-2007, 02:36 PM

I appreciate all your guys help. I just did a 30 week bulking cycle(natural), thats why I am cutting. I don't currently have a digital camera, but I hope to soon then I'll post a pic. I am planning on cutting till about 10% body fat and then starting my cycle. What would be the benefits of waiting till I am a "natural" 200pds. and then cycling? assuming I could get to 200pds. with my natural test levels at 30 years old?