lowering Estrogen naturally!

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 08:08 AM

anyone have success lowering es levels naturally thru diet and vitamins or any other rumours or tricks they read?

Just wondering because about to get some Aromasin "over Arimidex , here its better" but damn stuff is expensive if needed for controlling levels on trt....

On 200mg of cyp every week for 8 months and need an AI in my opinion "not my dr.s" so have to pay out of pocket. Might go up to 300mg of cyp soon but need to get es in check. Test level is at 256 and es was 127.....

I read few places that zinc at 50mg to 100mg a day will lower es and a good diet of etc...leafy greans and other foods....anyone else have opinion on this or just go for the Aromasin...8 months and still looking for my sweet spot....

sides I experience currently is ACNE trying to keep it controlled with 100mg of minocyline a day "working ok" but rather try to test es levels now....

If I go up to 300mg week then add bloat to sides....

thanks in advance

only thing i have on hand is liquid tamox...and for obvious reasons dont think this is my solution

**JD250** · 09-13-2011, 08:23 AM

Post current blood work with ranges.

**kelkel** · 09-13-2011, 08:28 AM

Your on 200mg cyp and your T is only 256? Something is definitely wrong. Like JD said, post some BW.

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 08:47 AM

don't have paper from blood wor have to get a copy Wednesday.

last test was 2 weeks ago and test was 256 ng/dl
Estrogen was 129 few points below normal according to quest...

Only other things out of wack are lymphocytes. Glucose. Globulin by a point or to according to quest.

I will get a copy this week and post detailed results. Dr keeps telling me everything is normal and I keep hearing es is way high at 129....

**TJsurgRehab22** · 09-13-2011, 08:51 AM

Broccoli apparently has estrogen lowering effects, so eat up!

**steroid.com 1** · 09-13-2011, 08:53 AM

Non pharmacological methods have no real efficacy in controlling E2. You need an AI to effectively control E2.

Remember, through aromatitazion E2 follows T.

What was the range for your E2 assay by Quest?

As noted, need to see BW.

**Titleesq** · 09-13-2011, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by gdevine

Non pharmacological methods have no real efficacy in controlling E2. You need an AI to effectively control E2.

Remember, through aromatitazion E2 follows T.

What was the range for your E2 assay by Quest?

As noted, need to see BW.

Hey G, what about Calcium D-Glucarate??? Surprised you did not recommend that....

**steroid.com 1** · 09-13-2011, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by Titleesq

Hey G, what about Calcium D-Glucarate??? Surprised you did not recommend that....

Zinc, DIM, I3C, Calcium D-Glucarate (and others) all have some level of affect on E2 suppression but compared to a pharmacy grade AI they don't compare. Also, with supplements it's very difficult to control the amounts needed to get the results one would need. You will see men on here who tried high amounts of Zinc and DIM and they still had high levels of E2. Only a pharmacy grade AI will get the consistent results we all want in controlling E2.

But you're right; if the OP is looking for a good supplement to have some E2 suppression control probably the best options are DIM and Calcium D-Glucarate. I'd stay away from I3C, DIM is better and safer as far as supplements go.

But again, an AI is the best most reliable option.

BTW, I take Calcium D-Glucarate for a lot of other reasons beyond E2 control. It is a very powerful anti-cancer supplement; maybe the best apples to apples.

**bass** · 09-13-2011, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by kelkel

Your on 200mg cyp and your T is only 256? Something is definitely wrong. Like JD said, post some BW.

my thought exactly! and like the guys said AI is the only way to control E2 levels especially with that size of test dose!

**kelkel** · 09-13-2011, 12:21 PM

When was your bw done relative to your injection?

**GotNoBlueMilk** · 09-13-2011, 01:16 PM

Originally Posted by confused123

don't have paper from blood wor have to get a copy Wednesday.

last test was 2 weeks ago and test was 256 ng/dl
Estrogen was 129 few points below normal according to quest...

Only other things out of wack are lymphocytes. Glucose. Globulin by a point or to according to quest.

I will get a copy this week and post detailed results. Dr keeps telling me everything is normal and I keep hearing es is way high at 129....

A ton of your Test is being converted to E2! If your Quest labs say that 129 is a couple points below normal, you did not get the ultrasensative estradiol test. I am looking at my Quest results, and it says: ultasensative estradiol, 20 pg/mL Range < OR = 29 pg/mL.

It would appear you took the female estrogen test. So you are just a couple points below maximum for a chick. What does this tell you about your estrogen level?

No amount of DIM or any other natural method is going to reduce your E2 levels anywhere near enough. Get some AI and start taking it.

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 01:26 PM

Test was done right before injection so on day 7...
hate to say this but my dr says test does not turn to es. And my levels was normal......anyway I wills get a printout and post actual numbers. Trying to figure this out and get that sweet spot.....thanks for the help...

**bass** · 09-13-2011, 01:31 PM

o my Lord! these fvcking doctors!

**Bonaparte** · 09-13-2011, 01:37 PM

Lowering your bodyfat is the simplest natural way to reduce E2.
Get cutting!

**steroid.com 1** · 09-13-2011, 03:09 PM

O my lord is right!

Tell you "Doctor" to look up the term "Aromatase" for God's sake.

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 05:33 PM

Anything else I can bring to table to educate dr so I can get a script. Was about to purchase some liquid ai and bailed stuff is not cheap.will I have to use a maintance dose all year after i get it down to sweet spot.

**GotNoBlueMilk** · 09-13-2011, 05:35 PM

This is just depressing.

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 05:44 PM

Ok wouldn't it shoot right back up after depressing...lot to learn

**kelkel** · 09-13-2011, 06:12 PM

Start reading some of the sticky threads along with this site...http://www.allthingsmale.com/publications.html

**GotNoBlueMilk** · 09-13-2011, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by confused123

Ok wouldn't it shoot right back up after depressing...lot to learn

I meant your doc was depressing

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 06:31 PM

Lmfao don't confuse me

**confused123** · 09-13-2011, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by kelkel

Start reading some of the sticky threads along with this site...http://www.allthingsmale.com/publications.html

Jeez been reading a longtime...think dr will no this shit

**JD250** · 09-13-2011, 07:03 PM

I don't think your doc knows shit, do you have another doc to go to.....if not, print off some of Dr.Crislers protocols and take them too him.....or for a small fee Dr. Crisler will do a phone consultation with your doc. You can't let someone who is SO lacking in knowledge of HRT be in charge of your health!!

**kelkel** · 09-13-2011, 07:45 PM

JD. Word.

BTW, welcome to the forum confused123

**steroid.com 1** · 09-13-2011, 07:54 PM

[QUOTE=JD250;5748406] You can't let someone who is SO lacking in knowledge of HRT be in charge of your health!![/QUOTE]

How many times do we have to say this to men who don't know and find us through searches to learn. Imagine all the men out there who don't know what we know and how they are soooo mismanaged.

Confused, go to Barns & Nobel and pick-up a book called "Testosterone for Life" by Dr Abraham Morgentaler...you won't put it down and you'll know why the "Doctor" you have is using you as a Ginny Pig. Also, read the papers written by Dr. Crisler that were provided to you. Read how Testosterone converts to Estradiol in men and how it's managed. Print it out and email it to you Doctor and tell him he's wrong. There is nothing wrong in challenging your Doctor.

Keep us posted on THIS THREAD.

Sad really...

**KyleJumpjets** · 09-13-2011, 08:36 PM

Ever heard of white button mushrooms? There is a ton of info online about its estrogen lowering effects.... just google it.

**confused123** · 09-14-2011, 09:07 AM

[QUOTE=gdevine;5748444]

Originally Posted by JD250

You can't let someone who is SO lacking in knowledge of HRT be in charge of your health!![/QUOTE]

How many times do we have to say this to men who don't know and find us through searches to learn. Imagine all the men out there who don't know what we know and how they are soooo mismanaged.

Confused, go to Barns & Nobel and pick-up a book called "Testosterone for Life" by Dr Abraham Morgentaler...you won't put it down and you'll know why the "Doctor" you have is using you as a Ginny Pig. Also, read the papers written by Dr. Crisler that were provided to you. Read how Testosterone converts to Estradiol in men and how it's managed. Print it out and email it to you Doctor and tell him he's wrong. There is nothing wrong in challenging your Doctor.

Keep us posted on THIS THREAD.

Sad really...

reading the above suggested!

also ordered some liquid Arimidex and going to try .5ml twice a week and see how i feel. "hope i dont mess things up more"

printed some of the above references and going to show dr. and ask him about the estrogen test he gave me. I believe it was defaulted to a female test as stated above.....

thanks again for all the great advice! ill post back soon..... any more advice is definitely welcomed..

**Fred40** · 09-14-2011, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by KyleJumpjets

Ever heard of white button mushrooms? There is a ton of info online about its estrogen lowering effects.... just google it.

sure....but who in the hell wants to eat a pound of white button mushrooms everyday?

**Fred40** · 09-14-2011, 09:14 AM

[QUOTE=gdevine;5748444]

Originally Posted by JD250

Confused, go to Barns & Nobel and pick-up a book called "Testosterone for Life" by Dr Abraham Morgentaler...you won't put it down and you'll know why the "Doctor" you have is using you as a Ginny Pig.

On your suggestion I went and picked up this book.....good read, but this book says nothing about HCG or AI treatment. Pretty much straight up T replacement.

**confused123** · 09-14-2011, 02:01 PM

Ok looking at blood work and def seems estrogen was for female going to ask when I get in there with dr...
only other things I see is lipid panel and cbc and psa all in range.

Ok dr said they did a total estrogen test and estrodiol is a breakdown test one of a few....and dr still said test doesn't turn into estrogen . when I mentioned armoatase he explained something else......bottom line walked out with no ai....
also said bloat and acne is a test.side not estrogen ...

So I guess ill self medicate with liquid ai and see how I feel..

**JD250** · 09-14-2011, 03:59 PM

Good lord, go ask your mechanic to treat you, he prolly knows as much as your doc.........aggravating to hear about these docs but dont lose hope bro, keep looking for a good doc and learn everything you can. Once you start to understand it will be all that much easier to find a doc that does.

**confused123** · 09-14-2011, 04:13 PM

Ya im going to try and learn as much as I can- just hope I don't do any major damage in the process

**steroid.com 1** · 09-14-2011, 06:50 PM

Confused - Please email this Dr.Crisler paper (link below) and tell him to read the section on Estradiol (or the entire paper for that matter). You need to challenge your Doctor. You are not being managed correctly and self medicating is a big gamble if you don't have a lot of experience. If you don't have his email address get it from his office assistant and tell them you won't come back till he reads the paper and responds accordingly.

You need to find a Doctor to provide you with the correct care.

This is a wonderful read for all members if you haven't already read it:

allthingsmale.com/word_docs/TRT.doc

**confused123** · 09-14-2011, 07:04 PM

Is that same as this one that I already printed out

http://www.allthingsmale.com/word_docs/TRT.doc

Ill drop an email with a casual note like "check this out"

So u think its a bad idea to try some of the liquid ai I just ordered?

Thnx again for all the great jnfo

**steroid.com 1** · 09-14-2011, 07:27 PM

Originally Posted by confused123

Is that same as this one that I already printed out

http://www.allthingsmale.com/word_docs/TRT.doc

Ill drop an email with a casual note like "check this out"

So u think its a bad idea to try some of the liquid ai I just ordered?

Thnx again for all the great jnfo

One in the same; you should have given him your copy when you met wtih him.

Stop being casual about this situation and take control. Your Doc probably has an ego (go figure, right) but you and only you need to manage your healthcare. Tell him to read it and respond accordingly; it's okay to tell him he may be wrong and your research from top TRT Docs can prove that. If he's even a little understanding he will read it and get back to you.

If you read this paper you can see that high E2 can cause some very dangerous diseases notwithstanding Cancer.

I can't stress enough that you must manage your care Confused; we all only want the best for you...honestly.

**kelkel** · 09-14-2011, 07:41 PM

If the doc ultimately will not listen (and I've been there) don't just make appts with random doc's. Start calling some endo's / euro's and check with the staff and ask them if the doc will treat you via Crisler's protocols. If they don't know ask them to ask the doc and call you back as you don't want to waste your time or the doc's. It worked perfectly for me and I found a euro who will listen and actually is familiar with Crisler. I know I understood trt better than the endo I was with. I credit this site and voracious reading for that. Unless the doc is stellar, you will get to the point where you can talk to them basically on their level concerning your treatment. They will respect you more and bullsh*t you less. Keep us informed on this thread. Like GD said, everyone here wants the best for you as most of us have been where you are. good luck.

**confused123** · 09-14-2011, 07:46 PM

Trust me I am listening and taking all this in....its kinda overwhelming but I am going to drop a copy off to him friday. I will see what his response is to the article. I believe he would try his best to help me and has an open mind. I also believe he will reachout and do research. This dr I been using for around 6 years hopefully we can work this out......I am worried about high e as I already had my battle with cancer years ago.

Honestly should I mess with the ai I ordered to test if I feel better.ill also find out if my coverage will go for a deep hormone testing

**steroid.com 1** · 09-15-2011, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by confused123

......I am worried about high e as I already had my battle with cancer years ago.

Dear God, what type of cancer and was it hormonal dependent i.e., prostate cancer? If you had a cancer that was hormonal dependent then you absolutely don't want high E2 no matter what!

Please tell.

**confused123** · 09-15-2011, 09:40 AM

Na was a low grade cancer kidney tumor....
when it rains it pours just pulled a muscle in my forearm last night at work......shit hurt ...now have to lay off gym for awhile

**steroid.com 1** · 09-15-2011, 11:45 AM

Sorry to hear. Took a week off from lifting last week to let my shoulder heal from completing my tattoo...seemed like an eternity.

Get some rest and get your E2 down...

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