21 year old low test

[dchavex]

hey whats up, i was going to start a steroid cycle next week but my bloodwork didnt come up good.
here are the results, they are in spanish but if you know the name of the hormone then youll know what they mean...

I must say that i have never used steroids or prohormones in the past, and i have had symptoms of low test probably since i was a teenager... but i never realized that i actually had low test until yesterday...
Im obviously going to the endochrinologist as soon as i can, but since the treatment for low test are the test shots, i figured out that i had nothing to lose if i start my cycle as planned, what do you think?


ESTUDIOS RESULTADOS UNIDADES VALORES DE REFERENCIA

CORTISOL 17.00 mcg/dl (5-25) |---*---|
+------------------------------------------+
¦ 5.0- 25.0 ¦ µg/dl ¦ A.M. ¦
¦ 2.5- 12.5 ¦ µg/dl ¦ P.M. ¦
+------------------------------------------+
(METODO: )

HORMONA DE CRECIMIENTO
HORMONA DE CRECIMIENTO 0.05 ng/ml (0-7.50) |*------|
+-----------------------------+
¦ 0.0- 7.5 ¦ ng/ml ¦ Adulto ¦
¦ 0.0-10.0 ¦ ng/ml ¦ Niños ¦
+-----------------------------+
(METODO: QUIMIOLUMINISCENCIA)
HORMONA FOLICULO ESTIMULANTE: 1.70 mUI/ml
+----------------------------------+
¦ 2.5-15.0 ¦ mUl/ml ¦ Hombres ¦
¦ 2.5-12.0 ¦ mUl/ml ¦ Prepúberes ¦
+----------------------------------+
LH, HORMONA LUTEINIZANTE. 3.2 mUI/ml
+----------------------------------+
¦ 2.5-12.0 ¦ mUl/ml ¦ Prepúberes ¦
¦ 2.5-16.0 ¦ mUl/ml ¦ Adultos ¦
+----------------------------------+
(METODO: )

HORMONA TIROIDEO ESTIMULANTE (TSH)
Hormona Tiroideoestimulante 1.953 mcU/mL (0.35-4.94) |-*-----|
+--------------------------------------+
¦ 1.-39.0 ¦ mcU/mL ¦ 1 a 4 dias ¦
¦ 6.0- 8.0 ¦ mcU/mL ¦ 5 a 6 días ¦
¦ 1.7 -9.1 : mcU/mL : 2 - 20 semanas :
: 0.3-5.0 ¦ mcU/mL ¦ Adulto :
¦ 0.4 - 9 : mcU/mL : Mayores de 80 a:
+--------------------------------------+
(METODO: QLM)

INDICE DE TIROXINA LIBRE (ITL)
T4 Total 6.50 µg/dl (4.87-11.72) |-*-----|
T-3 Captación 30.20 % (25-37) |--*----|
ITL 1.96 (1.12-4.44) |-*-----|
PROLACTINA (QUIMIOL ) 12.8 ng/ml

Hombres: 0-16 ng/ml.
Mujeres:
fase folicular: 0-23 ng/ml.
Fase Lutea....: 5-40 ng/ml.
Embarazo:
1er. trimestre : 0-80 ng/ml.
2do. trimestre : 0-160 ng/ml.
3er. trimestre : 0-400 ng/ml.
T3 CAPTACION (QUIMIOL ) 30.2 % (25-37) |--*----|
T3 TRIYODOTIRONINA TOTAL 1.24 ng/ml (0.58-1.59) |----*--|
+---------------------------------------------+
¦ 90-200 ¦ ng/dl ¦ Adultos ¦
¦ 100-260 ¦ ng/dl ¦ 1 a 5 Años ¦
¦ 90-240 ¦ ng/dl ¦ 5 a 10 Años ¦
¦ 80-210 ¦ ng/dl ¦ 10 a 15 Años ¦
¦ 116-247 ¦ ng/dl ¦ Embarazo últimos 5 meses ¦
+---------------------------------------------+
T4 TOTAL (TIROXINA) 6.50 µg/dl (4.87-11.72) |-*-----|
+--------------------------------------------+
¦ 7.3-15.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ Cordón umbilical ¦
¦ 11.0-21.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ 1 a 3 días ¦
¦ 8.2-16.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ 1 a 4 semanas ¦
¦ 7.2-15.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ 1 a 12 meses ¦
¦ 5.6-13.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ 1 a 2 años ¦
¦ 6.4-13.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ 5 a 10 años ¦
¦ 5.4-12.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ Adultos ¦
¦ 6.1-18.0 ¦ µg/dL ¦ Embarazo últimos días ¦
+--------------------------------------------+
(METODO: )
TESTOSTERONA TOTAL 3.58 ng/ml
+--------------------------------------+
¦ Hombres: :
: 0.1 - 0.5 ¦ ng/ml ¦ Recien nacidos ¦
¦ 0.03- 0.1 ¦ ng/ml ¦ Hasta 10 años ¦
¦ 0.1 - 0.3 ¦ ng/ml ¦ 10 a 12 años ¦
¦ 0.7 - 4.0 ¦ ng/ml ¦ 12 a 14 años ¦
¦ 2.5 - 9.0 ¦ ng/ml ¦ 14 a 17 años ¦
¦ 3.0 -10.0 ¦ ng/ml ¦ Adultos :
----------------------------------------
: 0.0 - 1.0 : ng/mL : Mujeres :
+--------------------------------------+
(METODO: QUIMIOLUMINISCENCIA)

[BigBadWolf]

I would hold off with the cycle. Go to the endo apt and get checked out and find out what's up. Hold off with the cycle.

[kelkel]

^^exactly. See your doctor and be honest with him. You expect to trust him, shouldn't he expect to trust you? See him as soon as you can and get started with a good diagnosis. If my spanish is correct you may be secondary and an MRI should be in your future.....TRT is for life. Your too young. Avoid it at all costs...

[dchavex]

yeah i think its better to hold off the cycle, i just noticed that my HGH(Hormona de Crecimiento) levels are also SUPER low... damn this is worse than i thought =/
Do you know any other hormones that my doc would want to check??? I want to visit him having all the info hed want at hand...

[kelkel]

Yes. Go to the top of our forum and read and re-read all the stickies related to TRT. Valuable information there including proper blood work. The stickies go over the main topics of TRT and will be very helpful to you.

Welcome to the forum chavex. Good people here who will steer you in the right direction. You can learn a lot here if you so choose. Get to the doctor and keep us posted here with the results.

[dchavex]

thanks a lot, i will start reading all that stuff right away¡
I will get the bloodwork done and ill post the results here as soon as i get them.

[dchavex]

hey whats up, i showed the test results to my dad (hes a doctor, not an endo, but a gine) and im afraid hes way too "old school" =/ he says that my test levels are in the "normal range", and that theres nothing wrong with the results, i tell him that im too young to have testosterone levels that low... but he wont listen...
hes going to show the results to a specialist, but what if he says that theres nothing wrong with the results? honestly guys i felel like crap, no libido, bitch tits, etc... i want to adress this as soon as i can, can you guys give me some advice?

[kelkel]

Read the stickies. Matter of fact, encourage your dad to read them. You have symtoms that need a good diagnosis and proper treatment. I'm surprised your father would dismiss it without delving deeper for the cause of why you feel the way you do. The scale on a BW chart is not the end all to beat all. It's just a guide based on societal norms. You are an individual and deserve to be treated as such. Go elsewhere for help if you need to. You are in charge of your health! Most doc's don't know trt. Find one that does.

[dchavex]

ive already read all the stickies, very good info, thanks¡ If the doc doesnt want to treat me, ill find someone who will...
Ill post everything here regarding my situation =)

[dchavex]

hey whats up, today i went to an endo and it was terrible, i told him my symptoms (usual low t symptoms) and i also gave him the test results... he said that my hormones were in range, and that it was nothing wrong with me.
obviously i told him that i didnt agree with him because my symptoms were clear evidence of low t, and that evidence is supported by the test results.
He sent to do a sperm test, wich im planning to do, but seriously i want to find another doc because i dont want to be treated by an old man who thinnks that 356 Total test WITH low t symptoms is all right...
Do you guys think i need to find another endo or perhaps an urologist???

[TED66]

yes i think u do. your only 21 and feel rundown and 356 for your age is not good enough. just keep searching for a doc that will pay attention.

[Black]

Speaking of sperm test, who do you go through to get one done and how much does it cost?

[Vettester]

Your LH is on the lower end of normal; suggesting slight suppression, causing the test score to also be a little low. Free and bio available testosterone would truly tell us how low things are for you, but I don't see that on the labs. Since there's a concern with GH as well, my suggestion would be to get an MRI in the pituitary region, and rule out there isn't some cyst/tumor or other condition tampering with you. The pituitary is responsible for producing the hormones at question here, so take a look there first.

[Vettester]

Speaking of sperm test, who do you go through to get one done and how much does it cost?

Well, it was only $10 for me, but that's Kaiser. Here's what I went through to get one done ... For me it was a hot porno with Lucie Theodorova, and they had a container that I had to place my specimen into, which Lucie was instrumental with. Now the trick was that I had to get it over to the lab within 30 minutes of everything happening, or the contents would not be viable for evaluation.

[kelkel]

^^^TMI!. Googling Lucie Theodorova as we speak.....

[dchavex]

thanks a lot guys, i have a question for you:
Should i look for endocrinologists or urologists? Wich of them have more probability to know TRT???

[dchavex]

thanks a lot guys, i have a question for you:
Should i look for endocrinologists or urologists? Wich of them have more probability to know TRT???

[kelkel]

One would think the endo would have more knowledge, but it's really an individual doctor issue. Just because they have the term Euro or Endo does not mean they know TRT. Hunt for a doc that knows TRT, their title does not really matter. My last endo was literally clueless. He could not answer my questions. I'm now with a euro who's great. You have to be comfortable with who your with as your going to develope a long term relationship.

[Black]

Well, it was only $10 for me, but that's Kaiser. Here's what I went through to get one done ... For me it was a hot porno with Lucie Theodorova, and they had a container that I had to place my specimen into, which Lucie was instrumental with. Now the trick was that I had to get it over to the lab within 30 minutes of everything happening, or the contents would not be viable for evaluation.

Is Kaiser a lab or university local to you?

[Vettester]

^^^TMI!. Googling Lucie Theodorova as we speak.....

And did she give you the urge to perform a sperm test?

OP, look up Lucie when you're ready to donate.

[dchavex]

haha thanks guys i went to the lab today and left my specimen there... they said i could pick up the results tomorrow by 12 pm, and ill post them here as soon as i get them... by the way Lucie iss HOT¡¡¡ xD

[TRT2010]

wow personally i was at 404 at 25 years old and i qualifed for TRT treatment at a AAC but the endo i saw said for me to stop and that there was no need for treatment. I would just make as many apts as possible and you will find the right one. I would hate to be a guy your age walking around at 356 im sorry for you dude.

[dchavex]

thanks mates you all give me the courage to keep looking for the right doc, hopefully i would convince any of them with my sperm test wich ill pick up tomorrow...

[Vettester]

Is Kaiser a lab or university local to you?

Dante, sorry man, I didn't see this when I posted last night. Anyways, Kaiser = Kaiser Permanente, which is a big health service provider in CA, and in several other states. Just like any place, they have their pros and cons.

[Vettester]

thanks mates you all give me the courage to keep looking for the right doc, hopefully i would convince any of them with my sperm test wich ill pick up tomorrow...

Excellent!! Good luck with the test, and say hello to Lucie for me

[Black]

Dante, sorry man, I didn't see this when I posted last night. Anyways, Kaiser = Kaiser Permanente, which is a big health service provider in CA, and in several other states. Just like any place, they have their pros and cons.

No worries. Gotcha thanks. Just trying to find the cheapest route to having this test done without insurance.

[dchavex]

ok guys, i went to an urologist today and it was worse than with the endocrinologist... ill buy the testosterone by myself and make some bloodwork regularly to keep everything in check... but dont worry ill continue to search for a good TRT doc but here in Mexico it really seems impossible...

[kelkel]

Sorry to hear Chavex! Keep us posted on the path you take as well as the results achieved.

[dchavex]

ok guys ill need your help here, im not giving up yet but as i told u yesterday, it seems its extremely difficult to find a TRT doc here in Guadalajara, so i decided to start my steroid cycle... i cant go on with this low t symptoms... while on cycle ill continue searching for a TRT doc, i already have the bloodwork so i dont think it will be much of a problem.
My question is: ill do a 12 week cycle, but since we already know that i cant produce enough testosterone by my own, should i do PCT as planned or should i continue injecting myself but only with testosterone (TRT) ?? If so, what dosage do you reccomend for a 21 year old?
I know most of you will not agree with me and youll tell me to wait till i find a good doc... but guys please im 21 i should be enjoying my life at its max right now, and not only that but i have been in this freaking low t state probably since 14 who knows...
I would really appreciate if you help me with this guys... but hey, remember that this is ONLY if i dont find a TRT doc. thanks a lot

[dchavex]

ohhh i forgot to mention that my Sperm test also came out like crap, 23 millions per ml, thats all right you tell me? well, take a look at this:
50% of them are DEAD
of the remaining sperms, 55 % are inmovile, and the rest have slow movements, only 11% have fast movement, and 15 % moderate movement
Its also to mention that only 20% of my sperms are considered normal (aspect)

that really reinforces the idea that my pituitary dos not work at 100%, since my FSH was at 1.7 (2.5-15) and my LH 3.2 (2.5-16) , please correct me if im wrong

[dchavex]

anybody?

[kelkel]

Are you able to arrange an MRI somewhere on your own?

[dchavex]

i dont thnik so, to get an MRI you need a dr who is asking for it... but what i did get was an appointment in an Anti-aging clinic.. i found it today... my appointment is scheduled next wednesday... should i stay with this doc or should i continue searching an endocrinologist since my problem appears to be in the pituitary??

[dchavex]

anyone??

[kelkel]

You need to keep searching for a doc who will find the root cause and then treat accordingly.

[dchavex]

hey guys, it seems like ill have to take anti-estrogens or aromatase inhibitors, along with the testosterone shots, do you know if you can take that stuff forever? or does it have t be discontinued??? Im asking you this because the TRT doc dindt even mention it, but ive been reading a lot and it seems that almost everyone on TRT uses AIs, my doc only prescribed 150 mgs of test e/week, but noHCG or AIs, can you help me? I need to know how much HCG to take and if i need the AI or the tamoxifen ... thanks

[kelkel]

Good info in the stickies on it dc. It all depends on BW, sensitive E2 assay, etc. HCG should be initiated and you will probably need an ai. Just add them in one at a time in conjunction with bw so you can get a handle on how your body is responding to them, IMO. Tamox is a serm, not an AI. It doesn't limit the amount of estrogen in your system just re-directs it from the receptors in the breast.

[dchavex]

Oook, just one More question, if im already Taking some test shots, do i really need to stop them before i do the e2 test?

[kelkel]

No. But you need to find out where your at and monitor and adjust accordingly via an AI if levels are elevated. If you use an AI use the smallest possible amount to start and then adjust as needed. Remember there are private labs out there that are relatively inexpensive.

[dchavex]

thanks a lot for you help kelkel¡¡ ill go to the lab and ask for e2 sensitive test, as well as some other stuff that my doc reccomended... Im currently taking 20 mg of taxus (tamoxifen ) every night, should i stop taking that stuff? i am taking them cuz i have some sort of pseudogynecomastia, and i dont want to end up with real gyno...