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Thread: New protocol and ED

  1. #1
    roxer's Avatar
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    New protocol and ED

    Since I have started my new protocol of 100mg weekly (50mg x2 a week), I have begun to experience mild ED. The same happened before when I was on Axiron and my levels dropped below 600 (was 540). The doctor increased my application to four swipes instead of two. My levels eventually increased to around 700 and my ED went away.

    My labs came back last week with my test level after 6 weeks on shots and I am now back down to 556 ng/ml (300-1000). My blood was drawn again yesterday because they left out my sensitive E test and something called an H&H test. SGOT was 42 (0-40) and SGPT was 29 (0-44). Not much more information than that. PSA was 0.56 ng/ml (0.00-4.00).

    He has since increased my prescription to 100mg every five days (from 2ml per month to 3ml). I think I will go with his protocol just to see if that helps my levels increase. How should I take my HCG now? I am the guinea pig on HCG for my doctor as he has never prescribed it before me. Would MWF work with this schedule?

    Should I stay with two times a week for my test shots (75mg x2)? I like my doc as he is open to suggestions (thus the HCG), but he is not really working to find my magic "level". He's not exceptionally moveable on extra items included in blood work either (like DHT, etc) or frequency. Next visit is scheduled 3 months out.

    MikeT, you are on my list to visit later this year bro.
    Last edited by roxer; 06-05-2013 at 01:26 PM.

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    Got my sensitive "E2" test in and H&H. So the levels he would test are:

    Test: 556 ng/ml (300-1000)
    Sensitive E2: 24 (3-70)
    Hematocrit: 52 (34-46)
    Hemoglobin: 17 (11-15)
    PSA: 0.56 (0.00-4.00)
    SGOT: 42 (0-40)
    SGPT: 29 (0-44)

    As I said in another post, I am getting ED now (getting worse actually). Anything noticeably wrong with these numbers? I was upper 700s previously when on Axiron. Might it take the injections a little longer to build up in my system? I basically came off of Axiron and immediately went to injections.

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    ZenFitness is offline Associate Member
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    I'm sure someone with more expertise will chime in, but the ED may actually be high hematocrit/hemoglobin. The way to get these down is to give blood.

    I too struggle with ED intermittently. hCG helped (knock on wood, no pun intended) but it's not perfect. I do 250 IUs 3X a week, like so:

    Monday AM: hCG
    Tuesday AM: 50mg test cyp
    Wednesday AM: hCG
    Thursday: Off
    Friday AM: hCG
    Friday PM: 50 mg test cyp
    Saturday PM: 0.25mg adex (although this may change to either 2X a week or none at all... bloodwork coming up Friday to find out)
    Sunday: Off

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    xcraider37 is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenFitness View Post
    I'm sure someone with more expertise will chime in, but the ED may actually be high hematocrit/hemoglobin. The way to get these down is to give blood.

    I too struggle with ED intermittently. hCG helped (knock on wood, no pun intended) but it's not perfect. I do 250 IUs 3X a week, like so:

    Monday AM: hCG
    Tuesday AM: 50mg test cyp
    Wednesday AM: hCG
    Thursday: Off
    Friday AM: hCG
    Friday PM: 50 mg test cyp
    Saturday PM: 0.25mg adex (although this may change to either 2X a week or none at all... bloodwork coming up Friday to find out)
    Sunday: Off
    Not sure that high hemoglobin/hematocrit will cause ED, but I guess if the blood gets too thick it could. 52% is not extremely bad, but of course needs to get better with donations.

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    ZenFitness is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by xcraider37 View Post
    Not sure that high hemoglobin/hematocrit will cause ED, but I guess if the blood gets too thick it could. 52% is not extremely bad, but of course needs to get better with donations.
    You could very well be right. I've heard higher counts can cause ED. Wish I knew what caused mine so I could stamp it out 100%!!

  6. #6
    bass's Avatar
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    was there a free T test done? you can have enough total T but if your free T is bound then you could have these problems. since your e2 is in good range that leaves one thing to test for, SHBG!
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  7. #7
    roxer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bass
    was there a free T test done? you can have enough total T but if your free T is bound then you could have these problems. since your e2 is in good range that leaves one thing to test for, SHBG!
    Just curious as to what's out there to treat excess SHBG? I have seen some use Nettle as a blocker. Is that a viable alternative to prescribed meds?

  8. #8
    Trific's Avatar
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    6,000 - 10,000iu of vitamin d per day should help lower shbg too....

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    Thank you. I currently take 4500 IU daily. I'll give that a shot and see what happens starting on the low end of course.

  10. #10
    LowT Mike is offline HRT Specialist, P.A. - LowTestosterone.com
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    Quote Originally Posted by roxer View Post
    Since I have started my new protocol of 100mg weekly (50mg x2 a week), I have begun to experience mild ED. The same happened before when I was on Axiron and my levels dropped below 600 (was 540). The doctor increased my application to four swipes instead of two. My levels eventually increased to around 700 and my ED went away.

    My labs came back last week with my test level after 6 weeks on shots and I am now back down to 556 ng/ml (300-1000). My blood was drawn again yesterday because they left out my sensitive E test and something called an H&H test. SGOT was 42 (0-40) and SGPT was 29 (0-44). Not much more information than that. PSA was 0.56 ng/ml (0.00-4.00).

    He has since increased my prescription to 100mg every five days (from 2ml per month to 3ml). I think I will go with his protocol just to see if that helps my levels increase. How should I take my HCG now? I am the guinea pig on HCG for my doctor as he has never prescribed it before me. Would MWF work with this schedule?

    Should I stay with two times a week for my test shots (75mg x2)? I like my doc as he is open to suggestions (thus the HCG), but he is not really working to find my magic "level". He's not exceptionally moveable on extra items included in blood work either (like DHT, etc) or frequency. Next visit is scheduled 3 months out.

    MikeT, you are on my list to visit later this year bro.

    Seems to me your Doc in on the right page here. Not much different than how I would stage the patient. "Start low... go slow" keep staging with labs titrating dose up if patient is still symptomatic. Generally speaking the "sweet spot" for most men is 800+ with a free T 20+. Elevated estradiol can hinder libedo and is the usual culprit. Another issue would be injections spread out too far and the roller coaster feeling as serum test levels go up and down. HCG can greatly help libedo as well. As far as timing of HCG goes if your doing every 5 days injection remember one of the great attributes of HCG is to keep endogenous T production alive and give a boost mid way between injections. Many men doing the 1x per week protocol can feel great for the first 3-4 days then a lag finishing out the week. The use of HCG on day 4 and 5 back to back with majority of these men following this protocol get a nice natural boost in serum T to levels up in the top 1/3 throughout week and is enough generally to keep spermogenesis and endogenous T production going. Something for you to bring up with your doc about implementing mid way inbetween injections. Remember 250-500IU of HCG 2-3x per week is enough. More would be just waste. You only have so many receptors. Just find what works for you by staging symptoms and size of testes. My 2 cents.
    Last edited by LowT Mike; 06-12-2013 at 08:50 AM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by roxer View Post
    Just curious as to what's out there to treat excess SHBG? I have seen some use Nettle as a blocker. Is that a viable alternative to prescribed meds?
    when I was under the care of a clinic they prescribed Anavar to lower SHBG and it did, unfortunately too much! but I don't think an endo or any doc will prescribe anavar.

  12. #12
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    I popped 6000iu of D3 this morning and will continue with that dose for a while. I am presently taking 50mg SQ Monday/Thursday, but I think I will up that to 60mg to see if that makes a difference. My T level is currently 556 ng/ml at 50mg. Doing 60mg still falls in the 100mg every five days protocol my doc wanted (I can go up to 75mg and not run out until my next prescription pickup date). Trying to find that "less is more" spot.

    From my observation, when I first started with the 200mg x 2 week shot, my libido was great for a whole week, then slowly started edging down. Focus and energy did the same. And when I transitioned to 100mg x 1 week - first two/three days were decent. Now that I am on 50 x 2 weekly, ED has kicked in, I do touch'n go's more often and my focus isn't that great. I think I read sometime ago that some guys metabolize T at a quicker or different level, is that true? Do some people "burn" through it quicker needing higher levels or doses?

    My schedule is lifting Mon, Wed, Fri and 3.5 mile run Tues, Thurs and Saturday. 5 mile run Sunday.

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    Do some people "burn" through it quicker needing higher levels or doses?
    Yes, definitely....I know a guy that needs 250mg per week....
    Last edited by Trific; 06-13-2013 at 11:36 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trific View Post
    Yes, definitely....I know a guy that needs 250mg per week....
    250mg a week just for normal ranges? Seriously? Holy bejesus.

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