Starting my journey...finally

[Lifted1]

ya i looked over the sticky about time frame effects on mood, mass, etc. someone in there mentioned if your starting numbers are totally out of whack from cycles, it might take longer for treatment to make a difference. its just his opinion, but it kinda makes sense. it might be wishful thinking, but i hope since im <15% bf, very active and my starting numbers werent horrible (555 total 8.6 free) it might help my body sooner.

no worries on party pooping brotha...your just trying to insure i (or anyone) have reasonable expectations from trt. ill keep this thread up to date on how my journey goes and thanks for the input!

[Lifted1]

*update*

It has been about a month of trt and as of this week I've noticed a few things...

1. I'm waking up about an hour earlier than usual and feel totally rested and ready to go.
2. I've started to feel a bit stronger as all of my compound lifts went up in weight.
3. I'm resting less between sets and still hitting or exceeding my reps.
4. I'm maintaining weight, but it appears I'm starting to burn some stubborn stomach fat I couldn't shake for the life of me.
The only thing not noticeably better is afternoon energy...it still seems to still fall off.

On a side note, I switched from subq test in the stomach to upper right glute area for ease and comfort, but still do hcg in the abdomen. I don't have a lot of bf so maybe that was my issue or I'm just a puss lol.

As of now everything seems to be going perfectly fine with my treatment. I don't have any bloating, weight gain, puffy nips, rashes, infections or lumps. Six week bw is due soon and I will post lab results here.

Will

[Metalject]

Sounds like things are going good.
As far as the afternoon energy fall off, well as good as TRT may be there is bad news....you're still human.
My point, I've been taking gear now in some capacity for 15 years, 4-5 of it TRT, the rest bodybuilding doses. Regardless of the methods, doses, combinations of drugs, etc. basic facts of life do not change, i.e., at certain points of the day you're a little more tired than others, sometimes your hornier than other times for no reason other than you are, sometimes you're a little more hungry at times despite everything being the same...that's just life.

[kelkel]

there is bad news....you're still human.

Party pooper......

[Metalject]

Party pooper......

That's why I'm here!
Of course my TRT is a little more special than most. I'm beyond human, sort of like half man, half Hercules, half master of the Universe. I realize that's three halves but my TRT gives me three halves. I regularly run through walls, people look at me and cower in fear and women beg for my seed. You know, standard TRT. And I am 100000% convinced in the back of their minds this is what many guys expect or at least close to it. Why? Because the concept of steroids and testosterone have been so distorted for so long that peoples views are pretty much science fiction.

[Lifted1]

6 Week blood work
I had my bw done at the start of the 7th week of treatment at 8:15am which is the same time as my initial bloods were done. I was due for my T injection at 8:00am day of bw.

Protocol has been 50mg T (sub q in glute area) every 3.5 days followed by 250iu Hcg (stomach) day after T injection. Figured I would need some adjustments, but I was surprised how low I still am...total is a hair lower than baseline and free is 2 points higher, but still on the low end. Lmk what you guys think!

Will

[kelkel]

Why surprised? We all respond differently and you have to learn what works for you. Free T is to low. Time to up your dose a bit, imho. Remember, sometimes a slight adjustment can make a big difference. Meaning that if 100mgs got you where you are now, adding another 50mg doesn't mean you'll get exactly another half on your total T. Make sense?

That said, maybe another 20mgs total (120) and retest TT, FT and E2 in about 4 weeks. It will be good to get your E2 elevated into the 20's or so as well. Nice to see the correct E2 test.

Take your time with this and see how you react to incremental changes. I'd say you stand a good chance of achieving a good free T and E2 level without an AI. Win-Win.

[Lifted1]

I talked to my doctor this afternoon and after looking over my lab results he revised my script to 160mg/wk T and 700iu/wk Hcg . Now I'm wondering if I can improve on my current protocol...should I pin both 3x/wk? Would that even help? I would prefer to keep 2x/wk since its already 4 days of pinning. Tia!

[kelkel]

Your doc in a hurry? Just keep an eye on your E2.
Twice a week still just fine. And why is it 4 days of pinning? Just pin your hcg in the same syringe as your test.

[Lifted1]

Why surprised? We all respond differently and you have to learn what works for you. Free T is to low. Time to up your dose a bit, imho. Remember, sometimes a slight adjustment can make a big difference. Meaning that if 100mgs got you where you are now, adding another 50mg doesn't mean you'll get exactly another half on your total T. Make sense?

That said, maybe another 20mgs total (120) and retest TT, FT and E2 in about 4 weeks. It will be good to get your E2 elevated into the 20's or so as well. Nice to see the correct E2 test.

Take your time with this and see how you react to incremental changes. I'd say you stand a good chance of achieving a good free T and E2 level without an AI. Win-Win.

ya makes sense that Xxmg doesnt equal Xxtotal/free test and it is a learning curve that I'm lucky enough to be ahead of thanks to this forum. I could just bump 20mgs and retest, but it would be at my own expense since I wont be due for scheduled bw until January (6 month). Its probably only the correct E2 test since it was requested from LowT.com lol

I would love nothing more than ending up with a healthy free t and e2 level without juggling an ai.
Thanks for your advise as usual Kel...you have been a great help in making my journey an easier one!

Cheers,
Will

[Lifted1]

Your doc in a hurry? Just keep an eye on your E2.
Twice a week still just fine. And why is it 4 days of pinning? Just pin your hcg in the same syringe as your test.

hahaha he was just being generous so I wasn't left spinning my wheels for another 4 months. Ive been doing hcg day after T, but might consider same day, same tube...just don't want to change too many things at once.

[kelkel]

As stated, you can retest in a month as it's not your first test after initiation anymore. Remember, more isn't always better and if you can do less than prescribed, have good numbers and feel good, then stock up whats left!

There's no reason to worry about HCG timing unless you're on a once per week T injection protocol. Including it in the same pin won't mess up a thing, just save you two shots per week.

[Lifted1]

*Update*

Its been about a month since increasing my dosage after my initial 6 week bw that showed my numbers were the same as where I started pre trt. I have been training harder than ever and my diet is as good as its ever been in the last three months since starting trt. I've dropped 3~4% BF (starting at 15~16% currently sitting at 12%) and gained 5lbs. In the last week 3 different people commented that I look bigger and yesterday my associate accused me of juicing lol. In my opinion it seems like my muscles are more filled out and thicker with less bf everywhere. I will be pulling bloods next week to see where I'm at with my new protocol and adjust from there.

Thanks to everyone that helped guide me into my journey and gave me very sound advise! I listened and it's apparently working.

Will

[Lifted1]

It's been a few weeks and I still haven't done blood work due to a change in my protocol. After reading a post from LT regarding Hcg and it's influence on e2 levels, I opted to lower my dose from 700iu/wk back to 500iu/wk split m/w/f. I will be pulling Total T, Free T and e2 sensitive in two weeks to see where I'm at with my current protocol.

Also, I scheduled an appointment to donate whole blood this week as I'm sure crit is nearing the 50% range by now.

[Low Testosterone]

It's been a few weeks and I still haven't done blood work due to a change in my protocol. After reading a post from LT regarding Hcg and it's influence on e2 levels, I opted to lower my dose from 700iu/wk back to 500iu/wk split m/w/f. I will be pulling Total T, Free T and e2 sensitive in two weeks to see where I'm at with my current protocol.

Also, I scheduled an appointment to donate whole blood this week as I'm sure crit is nearing the 50% range by now.

Just curious....how are you sure if you haven't had a blood test?

[Lifted1]

Just curious....how are you sure if you haven't had a blood test?

Shortly after the protocol increase I noticed around my nipple "tip" was puffy about 50% of the diameter when it was hard, it felt raw and was dry/peely on the areola. Don't know if it was a coincidence, but I've never had anything like that happen.

I read your post about Hcg potentially spiking e2 and figured I would lower Hcg first to see what happened. I also figured since less of everything injected at once would help e2, split everything M/W/F. About a week later I'm all good and taking one less injection per week than I was previously.

Honestly I'm not 100% sure as you know guessing is not an accurate way to adjust, but it seemed to help me right away.

[Lifted1]

Donated whole blood today and shit they use a HUGE needle!! Don't remember reading 16 gauge is used for the draw and when the nurse told me to "look away you're going to feel a pinch", I looked right at her tapping me and said holy shit lol. It only took 6 minutes to take the pint and I was on my way soon after.

Update
Results from my blood donation came back with 17.2g/dl Hemoglobin (about 51% Hematocrit) so donating was a good call.

[Lifted1]

Friday's Hcg /Test injection was a little different than usual lol

[Metalject]

Friday's Hcg /Test injection was a little different than usual lol

Great pic. Hope she's enjoying your TRT as much as you are

[Lifted1]

Great pic. Hope she's enjoying your TRT as much as you are

Thanks! Ya she enjoys my TRT daily

[ElSupremo]

Just wanted to say thanks for this thread, including thanks to all the contributors.
I've recently tested for low T and am seeing a Doc for more tests on Tuesday. Threads like this one help me to know what questions to ask, and what tests are needed, as well as what may lay in store for me. Thanks again!

[Lifted1]

Just wanted to say thanks for this thread, including thanks to all the contributors.
I've recently tested for low T and am seeing a Doc for more tests on Tuesday. Threads like this one help me to know what questions to ask, and what tests are needed, as well as what may lay in store for me. Thanks again!

No problem brotha! That's exactly why I posted this thread so when someone is new to TRT they will get a realistic idea of what to expect from the process. Just ask for copies of all bloodwork and post up so everyone can help.

[Lifted1]

Update
I did some blood work on my own after making a few adjustments to my protocol since my last labs in September. Blood was taken Monday morning @ 8am three days after my injection so it's my trough. I'm taking 150mg/wk Testosterone (50mg M/W/F) and 500iu Hcg /wk (200iu M, 100iu W, 200iu F). Looks like my total has slightly increased with the extra 50mg, but my free has more than doubled. My e2 has dropped slightly and is fairly low imo.
Input is appreciated!

[2Sox]

^^ It seems your Total T is in the midrange and your Free T is above the top of the range. Your E2 is on the low end. Looks good to me and you should be feeling pretty good. The main question is - how do you feel?

One more thing: How are you feeling on your present dose of hCG ? Holding the fort? Just curious.

[Lifted1]

^^ It seems your Total T is in the midrange and your Free T is above the top of the range. Your E2 is on the low end. Looks good to me and you should be feeling pretty good. The main question is - how do you feel?

One more thing: How are you feeling on your present dose of hCG? Holding the fort? Just curious.

Thanks for the input Sox those were my thoughts also. Seems like I must not be having very much aromatization from T to E. I feel pretty good for the most part...usually a bit sore form my workouts, but everything else like sleep, energy, libido, well being seems good.

Everything is functioning just fine and testy size is about the same as it used to be, maybe just slightly smaller, but no aches or pains. Depending on input I receive, I might add another 100iu on Wednesday to help bump my E up a bit.

[kelkel]

TT and FT look great. Like 2Sox said, low E2. You'd probably feel better higher. Are you taking any form or AI, prescribed or OTC?

[Lifted1]

TT and FT look great. Like 2Sox said, low E2. You'd probably feel better higher. Are you taking any form or AI, prescribed or OTC?

Thanks Kel. Ya E2 dropped 4pg/ml (from 16~12pg/ml) since my last bw and I added 50mg of Test! Not taking any AI whatsoever. Just running a TB500 cycle currently, but I don't think that would have any effect on E2.

I'm thinking of bumping Test 10mg/wk (script is 160mg/wk) and increasing Hcg 100iu/wk to help raise E2 a bit. This is my lowest point of the week so I'm not sure how much E2 fluctuates from valleys to peaks.

[Chicagotarsier]

Also reverse that.

Low Free T can cause Anemia, Hypothyroid, and T2 Diabetis. Just correcting my T level and Free T level (Primary Hypogonadal) cured my Diabetis and put all my Thyroid and Blood work back in the normal ranges. Not saying this applies to his case but many of the popular "issues" that doctors make sound like are causing your other problems are actually side effects of Testosterone deficiency. Will not find that in a text book but I am walking proof. 6 months on TrT with some diet tweeks (not a lot) took me from 13.6 A1C and 15+ blood sugar levels to in range levels. My body was just not working. Testosterone turned it back on.

So true on finding the root problem. Understanding what is causing the issue allows you to understand if the treatment is working as expected.

Thanks for the numbers on SHBG and Albumin. I learned something there.

Low free T can easily cause the symptoms you speak of.
Then again, so could anemia, hypothyroid or type 2 diabetes.

That being said, it's why all means should be exhausted to find the root cause before initiating HRT. Which you are doing.
And yes, shbg and albumin is what binds T. About 60% and app 38% respectively. The little bit left over is our free T.

You are correct, Low T cannot run all tests we would ultimately like. If they did they would not be cost effective.

[Low Testosterone]

Blood doesn't look bad. E2 is a little low. As others said you'll probably feel better with that number coming up a little bit. A lot of guys start to notice the effects of low E2 when they fall below 15 for extended periods of time. I'd be surprised if 10mg more of testosterone would make that big of a difference. I'm not saying it can't but that I'd simply be a little surprised.

[Lifted1]

Thanks for the input LT. I talked with my doc and we are going to increase my T dose from 160mg/wk to 180mg/wk. I'm also going to add 100iu of Hcg for a 600iu/wk total. Those changes should get my E up in the 20's and bump my free/total a bit.

[Flier]

Looks similar to my experience.
Had baseline like yours, which is why it took me 3 years to start, questioning if my low T symptoms actually came from low T.
Doc put me on 100mg Cyp, 1000iu HCG , 1mg Adex. / week.

After 8 weeks my BW came back at baseline numbers. So I bumped to 140mg Cyp/week. 4 weeks later my BW came back outside the top range. (Tot. and Free). Ie, the 40mg bump more than doubled my levels. So I reduced to 120mg.
Just saying, so you don´t overshoot. It may take a while before the BW come back showing the compounding result from your adjusted dosage.

[Lifted1]

Looks similar to my experience.
Had baseline like yours, which is why it took me 3 years to start, questioning if my low T symptoms actually came from low T.
Doc put me on 100mg Cyp, 1000iu HCG , 1mg Adex. / week.

After 8 weeks my BW came back at baseline numbers. So I bumped to 140mg Cyp/week. 4 weeks later my BW came back outside the top range. (Tot. and Free). Ie, the 40mg bump more than doubled my levels. So I reduced to 120mg.
Just saying, so you don´t overshoot. It may take a while before the BW come back showing the compounding result from your adjusted dosage.

Thanks for the input!

I started at 100mg/wk Test and 500iu/wk Hcg (every 3.5 days), but bloodwork came in where I was before starting trt. I went to 120mg 700iu/wk and had no progress, so I moved to 140mg 700iu/wk for a few weeks without progress. Then I tried 160mg 700iu/wk and after a few weeks my nips got puffy and peely so I went back to 150mg T 500iu Hcg, but split it MWF. I felt better and nips calmed down, but my bloodwork shows I still need some adjustments. Hopefully this newest protocol of 180mg/wk 600iu/wk split MWF should be just right. Fwiw, I feel better injecting MWF than I ever did every 3.5 days...I'm thinking I am a hyperexcreter.