Adding Deca to TRT

[Brett N]

Been on TRT for a little over 2 years now. Feeling good. Blood work has been good last 2 times and I'm dues for new bloods in a couple weeks. I have constant joint pain in shoulders and knees. I have been diagnosed with arthritis and I have received scripts for it. They really don't work any better that Aleve so just take Aleve. Would low dose Deca added to my TRT help eliminate the joint pain? If so, how much should I take and how often? I really only want it to relieve discomfort.

[jasondd1]

I started on decca but switched to NPP when i "thought" i had erectile sides but i think it was in my head. Anyway npp is just a faster acting version of decca but needs to be pinned at least every 2-3 days. But it has no sides like ed. I pin 40 mg test cyp and 40 mg nap 3 times a week in the same syringe. BTW both decca and npp works like a champ. Decca is a longer ester and takes longer to kick in but you can get by pinning once a week if you only pin test once a week.

Been on TRT for a little over 2 years now. Feeling good. Blood work has been good last 2 times and I'm dues for new bloods in a couple weeks. I have constant joint pain in shoulders and knees. I have been diagnosed with arthritis and I have received scripts for it. They really don't work any better that Aleve so just take Aleve. Would low dose Deca added to my TRT help eliminate the joint pain? If so, how much should I take and how often? I really only want it to relieve discomfort.

[Brett N]

I pin test every Monday and Thursday. Long ester may be the better route to take for me. I pin 75mg 2x a week. Are you saying decca at 40mg 2x a week would be a big/small enough dose to help symptoms?

[kelkel]

Well said by Jason. Keep in mind that it can throw off your E2 a bit. I normally run it with my TRT but recently took a break from it. Be starting back soon though low dose.

[Brett N]

Kelkel, you think 80mg decca would be a good starting dose? Did it raise e2 or crash it? I plan on starting after my next bloods so I have a current baseline to go off of.

[kelkel]

I'd start with 100 or so. I normally run around 120 ish. Like Jason referenced, once or twice per week injections are fine.
It can raise E2. It will not effect any T readings, etc.

[jasondd1]

The bro science rule of thumb on decca is half of test dose but most say you need at least 100-120 mg to see the effect. The bro science comes from running cycles and few people pin 200-240 mg test a week on try so most on try match the decca dose to test dose or slightly less.

[Joco71]

I'd start with 100 or so. I normally run around 120 ish. Like Jason referenced, once or twice per week injections are fine.
It can raise E2. It will not effect any T readings, etc.

Kel how long will you run decca before you go back to just normal test protocol if you don't mind sharing. Thank you!

[Brett N]

Good question. I actually just planned on it becoming part of my TRT. I didn't plan to cycle off of it. I figured low dose would be ok with that.

[jasondd1]

I run 120 mg test cyp and 120 mg decca/npp a week split into 2-3 doses depending if it's decca or npp and plan on running it as a normal part of hrt.

[kelkel]

Good question. I actually just planned on it becoming part of my TRT. I didn't plan to cycle off of it. I figured low dose would be ok with that.

Totally your call. As with anything keep an eye on your BW but you should see minimal impact other than possibly E2 at such a low dose. This is my first break in a year or so, which is only due to running "other" items at the moment. But I'm adding it back in shortly.

[SEOINAGE]

I'd start with 100mg. Anyone have a script? What is the best way to ask for one? I've ran low dose NPP, upped dose to 350 mg and noticed a lot of size increase. I've heard of people using nandrolone at 100mg in lots of cycles even, just as support.

[Joco71]

Totally your call. As with anything keep an eye on your BW but you should see minimal impact other than possibly E2 at such a low dose. This is my first break in a year or so, which is only due to running "other" items at the moment. But I'm adding it back in shortly.

Thanks Kel its very reassuring hearing that from you as I know you do things correctly and follow your blood work.

[kelkel]

I'd start with 100mg. Anyone have a script? What is the best way to ask for one? I've ran low dose NPP, upped dose to 350 mg and noticed a lot of size increase. I've heard of people using nandrolone at 100mg in lots of cycles even, just as support.

I had one for a while and had to use a compounding pharmacy to get it. After a while my insurance gave me crap about reimbursing me for it so I just get it myself now. Most doc's will not write it though. 100 mgs in cycles, sure. Same theory as with TRT.

Thanks Kel its very reassuring hearing that from you as I know you do things correctly and follow your blood work.

Thanks. And there's nothing that will show up on your BW where your doc will be suddenly alerted. I'm fortunate to have a doc who lets me totally control my protocol. I can pull BW anytime for anything without issue. He will give me extra scripts every visit, either blank or with just E2 on it so I can fill the rest out myself. He trusts me, I trust him. We learn from each other.

[Brett N]

Thanks for advice guys. After next blood work I am going to add it to my protocol.

[j2048b]

Totally your call. As with anything keep an eye on your BW but you should see minimal impact other than possibly E2 at such a low dose. This is my first break in a year or so, which is only due to running "other" items at the moment. But I'm adding it back in shortly.

Kel,
Wont deca also mess with h&h? I thought it could make ur h&h go up?

[kelkel]

Sure it can but at such low doses impact is normally minimal, if any. It's why BW is so relevant when you change a protocol.

[Lifted1]

I'm always having shoulder/joint issues...tightness, achy, popping, etc. would deca help with this? It acts like a lubricant for joints, correct?

[kelkel]

I'm always having shoulder/joint issues...tightness, achy, popping, etc. would deca help with this? It acts like a lubricant for joints, correct?

For most, yes. Keep an eye on your E2 for joint issues as well.

[NACH3]

I had one for a while and had to use a compounding pharmacy to get it. After a while my insurance gave me crap about reimbursing me for it so I just get it myself now. Most doc's will not write it though. 100 mgs in cycles, sure. Same theory as with TRT.





Thanks. And there's nothing that will show up on your BW where your doc will be suddenly alerted. I'm fortunate to have a doc who lets me totally control my protocol. I can pull BW anytime for anything without issue. He will give me extra scripts every visit, either blank or with just E2 on it so I can fill the rest out myself. He trusts me, I trust him. We learn from each other.

Kel, do you have a preference of NPP or deca ? I'm assuming deca due to its longer hlf life etc and probably much cheaper?!

That's a great relationship between you and your doc(very cool)!

[kelkel]

Long ester all the way.
Yes, it is a great relationship. We catch dinner and drinks now and then as well. Good guy.

[Lifted1]

Thanks kel! E2 is in check so it's not that

[rplante7]

I recently added a ten week trial of 100 mg per week Deca to my 100 mg T per week protocol. Wanted to see if it would help arthritis like joint pain. I experienced no significant relief. Maybe ten weeks was not long enough, maybe it was just me, maybe Deca does nothing to help joint pain??

[kelkel]

I recently added a ten week trial of 100 mg per week Deca to my 100 mg T per week protocol. Wanted to see if it would help arthritis like joint pain. I experienced no significant relief. Maybe ten weeks was not long enough, maybe it was just me, maybe Deca does nothing to help joint pain??

Takes time to work, especially at lower doses. That said, it's not a miracle drug but it will help cushion joints.

[jasondd1]

I recently added a ten week trial of 100 mg per week Deca to my 100 mg T per week protocol. Wanted to see if it would help arthritis like joint pain. I experienced no significant relief. Maybe ten weeks was not long enough, maybe it was just me, maybe Deca does nothing to help joint pain??

I was at same dose and noticed a major diffidence after 4-6 weeks. Maybe try NPP and see if it works any better. It has fewer sides but has to be pinned 3 rimes a week.

[bobtail]

My TRT runs 300mg every other week of cyp. I usually add 300mg on the in between weeks for 6-8 weeks at the time as my "cycle". What would you think about adding 200mg of deca every week as well? I'm kind of a firm believe in using the lowest dose possible to get the job done.

[kelkel]

My TRT runs 300mg every other week of cyp. I usually add 300mg on the in between weeks for 6-8 weeks at the time as my "cycle". What would you think about adding 200mg of deca every week as well? I'm kind of a firm believe in using the lowest dose possible to get the job done.

But you're not using the lowest possible dose bob. 300 mgs every other week is a horrible protocol based more on the terminal life of cyp, not it's half life. Whatever doc prescribed that needs to crack open a book now and then. You need to cut that dose in half and inject weekly. Guarantee you'll feel much better.

Re Deca , I don't think you need to start at 200 mgs deca. Start lower, give it time and adjust if necessary.

[jasondd1]

My TRT runs 300mg every other week of cyp. I usually add 300mg on the in between weeks for 6-8 weeks at the time as my "cycle". What would you think about adding 200mg of deca every week as well? I'm kind of a firm believe in using the lowest dose possible to get the job done.

I don't mean to bust balls but come on man you've been on her since 2012 and have 145 posts what have you been doing posting recipes? That's just an awful protocol, you should really know better. Listen to Kelkel.

[bobtail]

http://www.center4menshealth.com/PDFs/Myth_2.pdf

[The Deadlifting Dog]

http://www.center4menshealth.com/PDFs/Myth_2.pdf

Please never show that thing again.
It is the stupidest piece of info I have ever seen.

If you don't understand what is wrong with it then I will give you a clue...
Why are they comparing day 8 of one protocol with day 7 of the other protocol?

[bobtail]

LOL
Just seeing what you guys think. That's the clinic I go to so maybe I better find a better doc.
The other one local is owned by Dr. Crisler which as was going to try but it was more expensive. May be worth the extra cash, though.
I guess I can't mention the name here.

[Joco71]

Why not just change your protocol like suggested. 300mgs every other week must cause peaks and valleys. 150mgs a week or even 75 mgs twice per week would be a big step up on how you feel like kel said. Nice even and stable level that's always the end game. Good luck Bob!!

[kelkel]

LOL
Just seeing what you guys think. That's the clinic I go to so maybe I better find a better doc.
The other one local is owned by Dr. Crisler which as was going to try but it was more expensive. May be worth the extra cash, though.
I guess I can't mention the name here.

Show that link to John and tell me what he says when he's done laughing. Test will peak in a day or so, metabolism dependent and then begin a slow decline. The last thing you want is to be on a downhill roller coaster ride until your next shot. It's why the twice weekly protocol Joco mentions is so popular. It also helps control estrogen conversion better as well.

[APIs]

Have added Deca in the past, but I experienced a lot of PIP. Am going to try again soon with a new vial and combine it with my Test Cyp shots...

[bobtail]

So if your pinning twice per week, what days do you prefer? How much skip between pins?

[jasondd1]

Most pin every 3-4 days. I pin Tues morning and friday night and I always get blood work done Friday morning.

[Hydrolex]

What about Tren ? I use 75mg and i love it

[kelkel]

What about Tren? I use 75mg and i love it

Tren 's great stuff but isn't meant for long term use - yet...... That said, there are studies out there regarding very low dose Tren for TRT. Glad to see you're using a low dose. Far to many people go overboard with Tren when it's completely unnecessary as quality gains can be made with minimal dosing, which incurs minimal sides.

[Brett N]

Started deca yesterday, just received it in the mail. 60mg 2x a week. Will keep posted. Also increased ai to .25mg anastrozole x2 a week based on most recent bloods and e2 being a little high and now adding deca. Looking forward to some joint relief. Been eating Aleve like tic tacs.

[kelkel]

Once per week injections are fine. Doesn't need to be twice.