25 year old male sick of being tired. Trying to find an empathetic specialist.

[addwater]

25 year old Aussie here who could really do with some advice from anyone willing to offer wisdom.

I recently underwent a full blood test due to my persistent fatigue, exhaustion, depression, anxiety, lack of overall motivation and libido. I'm utterly sick of feeling exhausted and useless on a daily basis.

It turns out I'm not suffering from any known diseases or illnesses. My Total Testosterone Levels came in at 400ng/dl which I'm told are within normal ranges. I also understand I will probably need to undergo multiple tests to depict a more accurate result.

Further research suggests that at my age my levels should be soaring and that 400ng/dl is only really considered okay if you're an average 80 year old man.

I'm booked in to speak with my doctor tomorrow, from where I'm going to push to speak to a (hopefully understanding) and qualified endocrinologist whom I'll ask for further testing which may lead to TRT injections. I want nothing more than to achieve optimal Testosterone levels.

What I'm really wanting to know is if any of you out there in a similar situation and location can recommend an ideal specialist to speak with.

I live around an hour north of Brisbane, though I'm willing to travel in order to make this happen and change my life.

Any feedback in general pertaining to my situation that I may benefit from I will also be extremely grateful for.

Thank you, guys.

[Kenny357]

Have you tried any other methods of raising your levels? There's a lot you can do with just your diet to raise levels. There's also some supplements out there claiming to have great results. I'm in the US and was taking a stack that was prescribed by a nutritionist that did a lot of good a couple of years ago but it was made illegal by the time I needed more. I'll try to look it up and post it. Maybe it's legal there.

[kelkel]

Are you able to post up your full BW? Many things can suppress endogenous T levels and you need to find out what it is and correct it. Highly doubtful it's idiopathic at your age. In the Finding A Doc sticky thread at the top of this forum is a list of BW that would help you. Fill in the blanks with what you just had pulled if possible.

And welcome to the forum.

[addwater]

Have you tried any other methods of raising your levels? There's a lot you can do with just your diet to raise levels. There's also some supplements out there claiming to have great results. I'm in the US and was taking a stack that was prescribed by a nutritionist that did a lot of good a couple of years ago but it was made illegal by the time I needed more. I'll try to look it up and post it. Maybe it's legal there.

I suppose you could say I haven't tried everything.

But let's say this, I've been working out seriously and implementing heavy compound lifts for at least six months now in conjunction with 7-8 hours sleep, plenty of water and a well balanced diet full of protein. I've even added supplements and vitamins such as vitamin B, D, Zinc into my diet.

Thanks for your input.

[addwater]

Are you able to post up your full BW? Many things can suppress endogenous T levels and you need to find out what it is and correct it. Highly doubtful it's idiopathic at your age. In the Finding A Doc sticky thread at the top of this forum is a list of BW that would help you. Fill in the blanks with what you just had pulled if possible.

And welcome to the forum.

Thank you for the information, mate.

I'm going to be honest, I don't believe the blood results I received were overly comprehensive when it comes to the levels you just mentioned in your thread. I really couldn't find many levels among my blood work at all besides my total testosterone levels . As you said, obviously there are a huge number of variables and hormone levels that need to be looked into before I can conclude anything for sure.

I did take high quality photos of the blood work I received back ( imgur(dot)com/a/zgocc ). I don't expect you to go sifting through this, although I thought you may be curious.

As per an incredibly comprehensive guide on T Nation, and at the risk of sounding crazy, I'm going to ask my GP to have my blood levels tested for the following:

- Testosterone , total
- Testosterone, bioavailable
- Testosterone, free
- Estradiol (sensitive assay)
- Steroid Hormone Binding Globulin
- Follicle Stimulating Hormone (FSH)
- Luteinizing Hormone (LH)
- Dihydrotestosterone (DHT)
- Complete Blood Count (CBC)
- Prostate Specific Antigen (PSA)
- Blood Chemistry Panel
- Metabolic Panel

If you feel like I've missed anything here, or anything you'd like to add, I welcome it.

Thanks again.

[kelkel]

Get these as well as they all can contribute to the suppression of endogenous T.


Full thyroid panel to include TSH, FT3, FT4, RT3 and Antibodies
Prolactin
Cortisol

[addwater]

Get these as well as they all can contribute to the suppression of endogenous T.


Full thyroid panel to include TSH, FT3, FT4, RT3 and Antibodies
Prolactin
Cortisol

Thank you. That I shall.

I'll report back when I have a more well rounded series of test results.

I'll also update on how I went with the specialist.

[shady1991]

Mate. I am in the EXACT same position as you. 25 M from Australia also. I was ****ed around for so long, no Dr wanted to help me. Found one endo who did a trial of Testogel, but it was too inconvienient for me. So ATM, i know its not the right thing, but im self medicating, and sourcing my own UG gear to do TRT doseages myslef. Keep me posted man, i feel ya!

[CobraMustangSVT]

What's your height? What's your weight? Do you snore? Have you had a sleep study done? Do you drink to an excess? Any street drugs? Have you had your thyroid checked?

Exhaust all avenues before committing to the needles for the rest of your life. You might want to have children in the future. If you go the route of UG TRT, what if your supply dries up ? Are you sure you're getting good gear? I had a friend who decided to go underground when no one wanted to put him on TRT. When his supply dried up, no doctor wanted to touch him and he had to come off his self prescribed TRT with no PCT. The only good thing was then he recovered so poorly that after some time, he had to go on real TRT.

[Mr.BB]

What's your height? What's your weight? Do you snore? Have you had a sleep study done? Do you drink to an excess? Any street drugs? Have you had your thyroid checked?

Exhaust all avenues before committing to the needles for the rest of your life.

This^^^

It appears that you have your mind set for low testosterone . Plenty other situations may lead to the tiredness described.
Low testosterone is not a diagnostic, it is a symptom of other conditions.

[addwater]

Mate. I am in the EXACT same position as you. 25 M from Australia also. I was ****ed around for so long, no Dr wanted to help me. Found one endo who did a trial of Testogel, but it was too inconvienient for me. So ATM, i know its not the right thing, but im self medicating, and sourcing my own UG gear to do TRT doseages myslef. Keep me posted man, i feel ya!

Sorry to hear, man. It's very discouraging to read so many stories on doctors who simply won't consider treatment or at least some form a trial on men who experience such severe side effects just because they're testosterone levels aren't "clinically low".

I'd love to get in contact with you to see how you're tracking and whether or not you're deriving benefits from the treatment. I don't know that I can PM you, but it would be great to speak to someone who's in such a strikingly similar situation. Best of luck.

[addwater]

This^^^

It appears that you have your mind set for low testosterone . Plenty other situations may lead to the tiredness described.
Low testosterone is not a diagnostic, it is a symptom of other conditions.

It's extremely hard not to draw this conclusion when my lifestyle and environmental factors are at their beneficial peak. (Lifting, sleep, diet, low stress).

You're right when you say I have my mindset on low testosterone being the cause of the majority of my problems. The amount of research I've done has left me ticking every single box for low testosterone side effects, including extremely low sex drive and libido - this isn't just about exhaustion.

I'm going to wait for further and more comprehensive blood testing before I'm unconvinced.

Thanks for your input.

[addwater]

What's your height? What's your weight? Do you snore? Have you had a sleep study done? Do you drink to an excess? Any street *****? Have you had your thyroid checked?

Exhaust all avenues before committing to the needles for the rest of your life. You might want to have children in the future. If you go the route of UG TRT, what if your supply dries up ? Are you sure you're getting good gear? I had a friend who decided to go underground when no one wanted to put him on TRT. When his supply dried up, no doctor wanted to touch him and he had to come off his self prescribed TRT with no PCT. The only good thing was then he recovered so poorly that after some time, he had to go on real TRT.

Height: 185cm

Weight: 85kg

Snoring: Girlfriend says no.

Sleep study: No

Drinking: Twice a year

Narcotics: MDMA once, Cannabis maybe three times, benzodiazepines on occasions for anxiety and sleep

Thyroid check: No (I'll be asking my GP)

Thanks for raising some good points to consider.

I also don't blame your friend though, presuming he was truly suffering clinical symptoms. Most wouldn't gamble with self treatment unless they're quality of life was truly poor.

[Mr.BB]

I'm going to wait for further and more comprehensive blood testing before I'm unconvinced.

Thanks for your input.

This is what you should do^^^^

All I'm trying to say is that, at your age, low testosterone is a result of some other disease or condition. If its primary (testis not being able to produce) it can be from trauma, varicoles, testicular cancer, etc, but very local to that area.
If its secundary, it is harder to diagnose, as there are several hormones, hormonal pathways and conditions that need to be checked. Hypothyroidism is probably the most common, being Hashimoto's disease the most common reason for being hypo, which will for sure lead to low testosterone production. Cronic fatigue is the most significant symptom.

Think that your mindset to low test comes from internet information, internet is full of advertising, and yes, clinics are advertising low testosterone as a condition because the money is not in the cure but in the treatment, charging several hundred dollars monthly to ppl that sometimes have other conditions, masking the root problem. Yes, older folks will for sure get lower testosterone, and should do TRT if thats what they want, all in favour of that, the problem is that this advertising is channeling young guys like you to think they have low T when they probably have another condition.

[addwater]

This is what you should do^^^^

All I'm trying to say is that, at your age, low testosterone is a result of some other disease or condition. If its primary (testis not being able to produce) it can be from trauma, varicoles, testicular cancer, etc, but very local to that area.
If its secundary, it is harder to diagnose, as there are several hormones, hormonal pathways and conditions that need to be checked. Hypothyroidism is probably the most common, being Hashimoto's disease the most common reason for being hypo, which will for sure lead to low testosterone production. Cronic fatigue is the most significant symptom.

Think that your mindset to low test comes from internet information, internet is full of advertising, and yes, clinics are advertising low testosterone as a condition because the money is not in the cure but in the treatment, charging several hundred dollars monthly to ppl that sometimes have other conditions, masking the root problem. Yes, older folks will for sure get lower testosterone, and should do TRT if thats what they want, all in favour of that, the problem is that this advertising is channeling young guys like you to think they have low T when they probably have another condition.

This is great advice. Thanks for offering some genuinely constructive and insightful input, my friend.

I'll wait and see and even report back for those interested or just lurking.

[kelkel]

problem is that this advertising is channeling young guys like you to think they have low T when they probably have another condition.

A very serious issue. Great marketing but at the expense of finding the actual problem. Couple that with doc's that don't understand hormones and you have the perfect scenario for big pharma to make ton's of money.

[InternalFire]

when seeing your GP/doc, insist to find the exact cause/reason for being borderline low but still "within the normal" range of your T for your age, complain about lack of quality of life and loss of well being and leave no stone unturned as Arnold said, you will have to go trough various tests and examinations, and dont take quick-fix as a band-aid for a problem that can likely be fixed some way once pursued correctly. When all options and routes of finding out the reason are exhausted, you will be sure what was what and what exactly are your options, so you will not be robbing yourself of a chance being in a great permanent condition regarding your T levels, rather than long-term temporary patches of solution, and most likely for life

[addwater]

when seeing your GP/doc, insist to find the exact cause/reason for being borderline low but still "within the normal" range of your T for your age, complain about lack of quality of life and loss of well being and leave no stone unturned as Arnold said, you will have to go trough various tests and examinations, and dont take quick-fix as a band-aid for a problem that can likely be fixed some way once pursued correctly. When all options and routes of finding out the reason are exhausted, you will be sure what was what and what exactly are your options, so you will not be robbing yourself of a chance being in a great permanent condition regarding your T levels, rather than long-term temporary patches of solution, and most likely for life

This is really the quality of advice I was looking for.

Thanks to all you guys for the support.