Sides are killing me !!

**Kale** · 09-01-2006, 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by SMAN12B

sorry to hear all this kale. I am on 6iu's ED and so far only slight joint stiffness in my hands but nothing as bad as you are describing. Hope it clears up quick for you bro!!

Thanks dude. Weird thing is it has taken three months to start happening. It is classic Carpal Tunnel from the research I have done. I stareted 200mg B^ Ed today so lets see what that does. I am still off HGH and I am staying off untill this subsides.

**Ufa** · 09-02-2006, 07:35 AM

Originally Posted by Kale

Thanks dude. Weird thing is it has taken three months to start happening. It is classic Carpal Tunnel from the research I have done. I stareted 200mg B^ Ed today so lets see what that does. I am still off HGH and I am staying off untill this subsides.

Smart move. Stay off until you are 100%. If you decide to go back on
start very low. You are gonna be fine. Just don't stress. I know it's
easier said than done. We are all pulling for you. Take care and keep
us posted.

**Kale** · 09-02-2006, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by Ufa

Smart move. Stay off until you are 100%. If you decide to go back on
start very low. You are gonna be fine. Just don't stress. I know it's
easier said than done. We are all pulling for you. Take care and keep
us posted.

Thanks mate, I appreciate the support.

**Ufa** · 09-04-2006, 08:31 AM

Kale--- How are ya? Hope things are getting better. I stopped taking
GH about 5 days ago. Still have some sides. Used to wake up in the
middle of the night with bones hurting. OK in day. Some numbness
on foot. Much better but not out of the woods.

**vermin** · 09-04-2006, 10:35 AM

Wow, that sucks. At 8IUED (took 4 months to get there) my sides are bad enough that I can barely operate a fork & knife, but I have been sucking it up and slogging through it - based on the assumption that when I drop/switch it'll go away.

I had been thinking of a month at 24IU ED, now not so sure...

**Standard01** · 09-04-2006, 12:38 PM

I think 24IU ED would cripple you, unless you took 3 years to build up to that dose. I'd be interested in hearing your results.

**vermin** · 09-04-2006, 12:48 PM

That's the dose (0.67mg/Kg ED) that Healy et. al. used for athletes in their 2003 paper and based on their performance gains, they were hardly crippled.

As to the results, I'm interested too...!

**Maldorf** · 09-06-2006, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by vermin

That's the dose (0.67mg/Kg ED) that Healy et. al. used for athletes in their 2003 paper and based on their performance gains, they were hardly crippled.

As to the results, I'm interested too...!

I was taking 7 IU/ED after working up to it over about 4 months and had to drop down last week due to the pain. I dropped down to 5 IU/day last week and now my tendons arent as sore but my carpal tunnel pain is getting worse. This week I dropped it down to 4 IU/day and it is still getting worse. Going to try 3 IU/day next week. I hope this goes away soon.
24IU/day is truly insane, from what ive seen it would take many years to build up to that if you ever could manage the pain. The cost would be crazy too. I cannot imagine the returns you would get would justify spending that kind of cash.

**Kale** · 09-07-2006, 03:53 AM

Guys I am now 12 days off. The pain is gone thank God but the numbness and tingling in my hands is slowly going away but I mean slowly. I will probably start again on Sunday at 2IU EOD and see how that goes for a while. I go into hopital on Monday to have my Sleep Apnia fixed, tonsils out Epiglotis removed back of my thraot lazered and my nostrils drilled out. I am going to be fvcked for at least five days apparently so I want to get the HGH happeining to help the recovery. I cant belive how long it takes for these sides to receed.

**SMAN12b** · 09-07-2006, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by Kale

Guys I am now 12 days off. The pain is gone thank God but the numbness and tingling in my hands is slowly going away but I mean slowly. I will probably start again on Sunday at 2IU EOD and see how that goes for a while. I go into hopital on Monday to have my Sleep Apnia fixed, tonsils out Epiglotis removed back of my thraot lazered and my nostrils drilled out. I am going to be fvcked for at least five days apparently so I want to get the HGH happeining to help the recovery. I cant belive how long it takes for these sides to receed.

Damn Kale, I feel for you. I had that same thing done. They told me I would never be able to snore again..... they were wrong....lolol

We be here for you, so have your laptop around with you for recover!! Good luck with the surgery, I am sure your Thai nurse will take good care of you long time....lolol

**vermin** · 09-07-2006, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Maldorf

24IU/day is truly insane, from what ive seen it would take many years to build up to that if you ever could manage the pain. The cost would be crazy too. I cannot imagine the returns you would get would justify spending that kind of cash.

Well, they gave it to the subjects from day 1, and got 10% LBM boost in 30 days. 23+ pounds of muscle in 30 days, anyone? On the one hand, it seems impossible, on the other hand it was published in a peer reviewed journal, and what if it works....?

**Maldorf** · 09-07-2006, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by vermin

Well, they gave it to the subjects from day 1, and got 10% LBM boost in 30 days. 23+ pounds of muscle in 30 days, anyone? On the one hand, it seems impossible, on the other hand it was published in a peer reviewed journal, and what if it works....?

You mentioned .67mg/kg dose per day. ANyone know the conversion of mg to IUs? I had it once but misplaced it. One thing I would wonder about that study is how trained were these subjects? Had they been weight training for many years and reached near their genetic potential, or were they just getting started? Studies like this are only truly scientific if there is a control group, a group of similar trained subjects not on HGH, and if it is double blind. Too many factors could enter into their results. It really wouldnt be hard to believe such results if the subjects were all beginning weight lifters.

**vermin** · 09-07-2006, 04:40 PM

They were endurance athletes - all marathoners. The usual conversion is 2.6IU/mg, though some folks use 3. Of course there was a control group...this is a widely known study from J Endoc & Metab.

As to how it will work in BB/lifters? That is why we are interested. 10% LBM is not unknown for cycles of AAS, nor for long term HGH, but high-dose short term HGH is entering new, and potentially interesting territory.

270 pound = 122kg * 0.067 = 8.2mg X 2.6 = 21.4IU ED - that's for Eli Lily rHGH.

**Maldorf** · 09-08-2006, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by vermin

They were endurance athletes - all marathoners. The usual conversion is 2.6IU/mg, though some folks use 3. Of course there was a control group...this is a widely known study from J Endoc & Metab.

As to how it will work in BB/lifters? That is why we are interested. 10% LBM is not unknown for cycles of AAS, nor for long term HGH, but high-dose short term HGH is entering new, and potentially interesting territory.

270 pound = 122kg * 0.067 = 8.2mg X 2.6 = 21.4IU ED - that's for Eli Lily rHGH.

Well, I do know that AIDS patients take similar doses, so they must not experience too many side effects. I just cant understand though how this could be, considering how the 7IU/day I was taking took quite a toll on me. Im now still trying 4IU/day and still having sides. I know there is noway I could tolerate those kinds of doses.

**Ufa** · 09-08-2006, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by Kale

Guys I am now 12 days off. The pain is gone thank God but the numbness and tingling in my hands is slowly going away but I mean slowly. I will probably start again on Sunday at 2IU EOD and see how that goes for a while. I go into hopital on Monday to have my Sleep Apnia fixed, tonsils out Epiglotis removed back of my thraot lazered and my nostrils drilled out. I am going to be fvcked for at least five days apparently so I want to get the HGH happeining to help the recovery. I cant belive how long it takes for these sides to receed.

I think the GH will help you heal. I've been off Gh for about 9 days. I
was on for about a year and a half. I feel so much better, I guess you
just get used to the sides. I still get a little numbness here and there.
Mainly when I wake up in night. It used to be horrible. I think it's
good to take a break from everything. I thought I'd be depressed or
low energy after 175 mg test weekly, plus, Deca , Anver and GH and AI.

Now, it's just the AI. I know you must be stressed about surgery,
when you get to be 50 or so, it's one thing or annother. I've had
stents put in heart, even a stent put into a broken stent. A tumor
in neck. I'm feeling great. The most dangerous thing about surgery are
the infections that dirty hospitals promote. I always ask for an antibiotic
drip. Until, the Doc tells me Hey! I've never had any infections. So on.

When I had my brown reculse spider bite, I swear it was the GH that
made it go away. Take care and I'll be wishing you a speedy recovery.

**vermin** · 09-08-2006, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by Maldorf

Well, I do know that AIDS patients take similar doses, so they must not experience too many side effects. I just cant understand though how this could be, considering how the 7IU/day I was taking took quite a toll on me. Im now still trying 4IU/day and still having sides. I know there is noway I could tolerate those kinds of doses.

I think the thing is that it is high-dose, short term. Sides get to be bad in 3-4 months, typically.

**almostgone** · 09-08-2006, 05:27 PM

Kale, GH can bring on some weird sides. Everytime I run GH, it affects my left hand, arm, and shoulder only. Right now I'm stuck at 2iu 2x 5on/2off.

AG

Originally Posted by Kale

Thanks dude. Weird thing is it has taken three months to start happening. It is classic Carpal Tunnel from the research I have done. I stareted 200mg B^ Ed today so lets see what that does. I am still off HGH and I am staying off untill this subsides.

**doublefister** · 09-09-2006, 01:10 PM

I was on Jin's at 3.5IU's 5/2 and only side I got was being very sluggish. I am back on it again but at 6IU's eod and adding T4 ed and I haven't had any sides whatsoever. Maybe try eod and see how that works for you. I have tried 5/2 and everyday and eod seems to work better for me and I am still on Gensci Jintropin.

**Kale** · 09-09-2006, 10:34 PM

OK I started back again yesterday. I am doin 2IU 5on 2 off and see what happens. Still odd numbness is my hands and pins and needles but not getting worse yet.

**Standard01** · 09-09-2006, 11:20 PM

Thanks for the thread Kale, it's making me feel better about my HGH sides. Good luck.

**vermin** · 09-09-2006, 11:21 PM

Good luck Kale - I am starting to wonder if HGH can make apnea worse. Here you are getting cut, my wife has been going crazy with my snoring in the last couple months, seems like many others are getting treatment.

HGH making tonsils etc. larger?

**Kale** · 09-10-2006, 01:20 AM

Originally Posted by vermin

Good luck Kale - I am starting to wonder if HGH can make apnea worse. Here you are getting cut, my wife has been going crazy with my snoring in the last couple months, seems like many others are getting treatment.

HGH making tonsils etc. larger?

Maybe, but I have been snoring for a long time before HGH but it is getting worse now. Hopefully the surgery will fix it. As he types with a numb finger

**vermin** · 09-10-2006, 02:50 AM

Hope so buddy - still you'd think with BF dropping and all we'd be reducing the symptoms....

**comradebillyboy** · 09-10-2006, 07:54 AM

Good luck with all the fix ups. You will feel better and your wife and/or girlfriend(s) will love you even more. I get the impression that Singapore has a real good public health system.

***perfectbeast2001*** · 09-14-2006, 04:17 PM

Thought you might be interested Kale. I have just found out that my Valerian supp was making my numb/painful hands much worse. I was waking during the night in pain even at low dose of gh. I forgot my valerian supp the other night and no pain. Then i took it next night and pain again. Last night no valerian again = no pain just slight numbness and tingles which i can tolerate. Might be worth dropping some of your supps one by one to see if it helps.

**Kale** · 09-15-2006, 06:03 AM

Originally Posted by perfectbeast2001

Thought you might be interested Kale. I have just found out that my Valerian supp was making my numb/painful hands much worse. I was waking during the night in pain even at low dose of gh. I forgot my valerian supp the other night and no pain. Then i took it next night and pain again. Last night no valerian again = no pain just slight numbness and tingles which i can tolerate. Might be worth dropping some of your supps one by one to see if it helps.

Thanks dude. I am basically off all supps at the moment. I have just done HGH again for seven days and am about to have two off then go to 2IU 5 on 2 off again. The sides are very gradually going away. I still have some numbness/pins and needles in the hands but it comes and goes now and no pain at all. My throat on the other hand is totally fvcked.

**Ufa** · 09-15-2006, 09:00 AM

Kale- Does your Gh come with sterile water or BW?

**Kale** · 09-15-2006, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by Ufa

Kale- Does your Gh come with sterile water or BW?

Sterile

**Ufa** · 09-15-2006, 09:28 PM

Kyle- can you substitute BW for sterile water?

**Kale** · 09-15-2006, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by Ufa

Kyle- can you substitute BW for sterile water?

You sure can. It will last longer as well

**mick-g** · 10-25-2006, 04:12 PM

I know this thread is old but if you take about 3 ibuprofen during the nite when you wake up and it hurts it will relieve the pain, also take some glucosimine and condroitin (sp) to help the joints. Ive had joint pain for 3 wks after use, so a few days with some ppl will not relieve the pain.

**dream warrior** · 11-08-2006, 10:24 AM

i'm on jin to bro...4iu 5on 2 off for the past 2 months now and the sides are indeed a pain in the ass,for me especially in the shoulders(****s up my shoulder and chest workouts)and the hands in the morning but the last week it's going better and better

**ecivon** · 11-08-2006, 06:40 PM

Sorry to hear this guys. The problem isn't with just GenSci/Jintropin, but a side associative with hgh inflamming tendons and ligaments. It is affecting the hands because of upstream tendons and ligaments in the wrist and forearms which controls the ligs/tens in the hands. Lower the dose until it starts to clear up and then moderately raise, don't jump back up to high levels.