bOnDs !!!

[Butch]

The Niners suck as well!!!! Pretty bascially any team from the "Treat Area" suck.

[$uperman]

Originally posted by KeyMastur


as an old coach of mine used to say "there are 3 things that win games - pitching, defense, and timely hitting"

my coach says the same thing. must be a coach thing.... anywayz , i luv how everyone can call bonds an asshole , and say how much of a jerk he is just because shit they read. its like... i heard bonds did this , and i heard bonds said that. well.... im seeing what is swing is doing and that is what i was talking bout in the first place. just the other day i heard micheal vick can throw a football 175 yds when he drinks gatorade , but ill bet my left nut he cant. so what im saying is if he hasnt been an asshole to you then why call him that and not respect his talent

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 9natural9
It sure was convenient it was broadcasted NATIONALLY on Sportscenter the next day. Now what would that accomplish, besides negative feedback?

But it could have been a chance for him to show the media a different side for a change but he only reinforced the negatives about him.

9Natural9 do you really believe that Bonds is a good guy or are you arguing just for arguments sake?

[KeyMastur]

Originally posted by 9natural9
It is a very demanding profession...only a select few are talented enough to make this their profession, and I am sure each player said that early on Neo, but playing a plethora of games becomes demanding and the last thing you want is a microphone in your face while your trying to wash your nuts, so you can see your family you havent seen in weeks, after a double header, in which you just lost a heartbreaker...believe me it is demanding, but you are right they are rewarded monetarily, but sometimes thats not enough....personal freedom is a much precious item!!!

THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!

[KeyMastur]

Originally posted by Vegas Kid
9 They may play 162 compared to only 80 something but skating for an hour (clock stops frequently) hardly compares to swinging a bat a couple of times every 40 minutes or standing out in the middle of the grass waiting for somebody to hit the ball your way. It's more of a skill sport (baseball) than a physical one. It requires some strength but come on do you really think these guys are up there with football, hockey, even basketball players?

so you think all that running around for 162 games doesn't take a toll on your body? you think you don't have to run or workout during the off-season?

As for Pete Rose, he got screwed. You might as well kick out all the others in every sport who have commited crimes from the hall of fame. ie, OJ, Jim Brown, etc...

how did he get screwed ? he disobeyed the rules. who cares how good he played, he broke the major law of baseball - gambling on it. baseball players sign a little list every single year that says they won't gamble on it.

OJ - so he killed his wife or maybe he didn't - that has nothing to do with the game.

[Vegas Kid]

I didn't say it doesn't take a toll on your body but IMO nowhere compared to the other sports. As for the off season-every other sport has one as well.

In Baseball all they do is wait around for something to happen (hit/bunt) and then the player finally exerts some energy. Like I said before, swinging a bat every 40 min or standing in the outfield watching balls go over your head is not what I call "taking a toll on your body." Pitchers actually do something, and even catchers and 1st baseman but that's really about it. Well the shortstop too. But that's about it.

[9natural9]

Damn, I leave for the evening and I miss all the action.....O.K. let me play catch up...

1)CANES, I'm not saying Bonds is a "great guy", nor am I saying he isn't. I don't know the man, therefore I can't base a hatred on him just because Sportcenter reported he is an asshole to the fans. Furthermore, I will say again, personally I DO NOT agree with his "reported" behavior whatsoever, and if I was to so blessed as to play professional football I would like to pattern such a overall charecter such as Brett Favre. I will say again, I am not saying he is a gem of a person, nor am I saying he isn't. CANES I don't know the guy except for what the media reports, which is obviously most every time a negative slant. My final point is Bonds is responsible for his playing performance, no more, no less. What he does with his "own" time is his right, and should be respected.

2)KEYMASTUR, show me any "LEGAL" documentation that Pete Rose was tried and convicted in a court of law of gambling on baseball games, sorry pal, you can't. Again, Pete Rose was a prick to many people, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with his on-field performance. Many fans can't decypher the difference between what the player is responsible for on the field and off, and it clouds the game and pollutes it in my opinion. Athletes, as well as all people in the spotlight, deserve their personal "space", the fans have got to deal with that and move on. I will not be gullible enough to say that Rose was not a gambler, but nowhere, I mean fucking nowhere does MLB or the HOF have a lawful right to keep him from his just do. The MLB, in conjuction with the HOF, sugarcoated a blackballing plan to banish Rose from baseball and all his on the field honors. It is an injustice even a blind man can see, my friends. Why do you think over 99% of the ball players in the present day, boycotted that pencil neck Jim Grey after his unprofessional media shark feeding attempt on Rose. Because every "real" person involved in the MLB knows that Rose deserves nothing less than an induction into the HOF. He is, and will forever be remembered as "Charlie Hustle", it is just a shame that some no talented pukes (HOF voters) have the audacity to play GOD and keep such a athlete out, because as long as Rose is out of the HOF, the sanctity of what it stands for is squalid and poisoned.

[KeyMastur]

Originally posted by 9natural9
2)KEYMASTUR, show me any "LEGAL" documentation that Pete Rose was tried and convicted in a court of law of gambling on baseball games, sorry pal, you can't. Again, Pete Rose was a prick to many people, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with his on-field performance. Many fans can't decypher the difference between what the player is responsible for on the field and off, and it clouds the game and pollutes it in my opinion. Athletes, as well as all people in the spotlight, deserve their personal "space", the fans have got to deal with that and move on. I will not be gullible enough to say that Rose was not a gambler, but nowhere, I mean fucking nowhere does MLB or the HOF have a lawful right to keep him from his just do. The MLB, in conjuction with the HOF, sugarcoated a blackballing plan to banish Rose from baseball and all his on the field honors. It is an injustice even a blind man can see, my friends. Why do you think over 99% of the ball players in the present day, boycotted that pencil neck Jim Grey after his unprofessional media shark feeding attempt on Rose. Because every "real" person involved in the MLB knows that Rose deserves nothing less than an induction into the HOF. He is, and will forever be remembered as "Charlie Hustle", it is just a shame that some no talented pukes (HOF voters) have the audacity to play GOD and keep such a athlete out, because as long as Rose is out of the HOF, the sanctity of what it stands for is squalid and poisoned.

check this site :

http://www.baseball1.com/bb-data/rose/

There's physical evidence there for ya.

Now I'm not saying he doesn't deserver to be in the HOF because of his playing ability - hell yeah he does. Definitely one of the greatest and he should have been there the first time. But, since you aren't allowed to gamble on baseball - Major League Rule 21 - then that's the thing that keeps him out.

[9natural9]

Thank you KEYMASTUR, but that physical evidence is irrelevant for the simple fact that it was NEVER defended against in a courtroom. It doesn't work that way, you don't just present one side. O.J. had a plethora of damning evidence, and it was certain he was guilty, but what was the final outcome. Guilty or not, in the populations eyes, he got the right to state his side. Pete Rose also had that right, but MLB confronted him with the sugarcoated deal. How come we never heard what was said behind close doors...I'll tell you why, there was reliable sources that state MLB told Rose "your Pete Rose, who's gonna keep you out of the game more than a year" I would call that misleading and sugarcoating. Also, I have also used this site in the past years to do research on the book I am writing about this subject...but more importantly read the below agreement that was signed......it solidifies my point.....please pay especially close attention to subject B) and and subject C). It clearly states that nothing in that Agreement shall deprive Peter Edward Rose of
the rights under Major League Rule 15(c) to apply for reinstatement.
Peter Edward Rose agrees not to challenge, appeal or otherwise
contest the decision of, or the procedure employed by, the
Commissioner or any future Commissioner in the evaluation of any
application for reinstatement.

This simply means that he has a right to be reinstated, after the agreement was signed by a smiling and sugarcoated MLB executive, MLB made it known that he will NEVER have that chance. That my friend is an injustice and should be recognized by the simplistic of minds.

Also, to prove my final point that he was NEVER, NEVER, NEVER tried and convicted for BETTING ON BASEBALL GAMES read C). It clearly states that the MLB is neither accusing/not accusing Rose, therefore making him neither gulity, or NOT FUCKING GUILTY which indicates to an intelligent person that he got banned for being neither. That is an injustice, believe it, accept it, and swallow it folks. It is an underlying stinch to the sanctity of the game, and I plan on making it more of a noticeable eyesore for the MLB. The executives of the game are no better than terrorist to me. They infiltrate, and destroy what is known to many to be Americas pastime, not for the love of the game, but sadly so more for the money and power.




THEREFORE, the Commissioner, recognizing the benefits to
Baseball from a resolution of this matter, orders and directs
that Peter Edward Rose be subject to the following disciplinary
sanctions, and Peter Edward Rose, recognizing the sole and exclusive
authority of the Commissioner and that it is in his interest to
resolve this matter without further proceedings, agrees to accept
the following disciplinary sanctions imposed by the Commissioner.

a. Peter Edward Rose is hereby declared permanently ineligible
in accordance with Major League Rule 21 and placed on the Ineligible
List.

b. Nothing in this Agreement shall deprive Peter Edward Rose of
the rights under Major League Rule 15(c) to apply for reinstatement.
Peter Edward Rose agrees not to challenge, appeal or otherwise
contest the decision of, or the procedure employed by, the
Commissioner or any future Commissioner in the evaluation of any
application for reinstatement.

c. Nothing in this agreement shall be deemed either an
admission or a denial by Peter Edward Rose of the allegation
that he bet on any Major League Baseball game.

Neither the Commissioner nor Peter Edward Rose shall be
prevented by this agreement from making any public statement
relating to this matter so long as no such public statement
contradicts the terms of this agreement and resolution.

This document contains the entire agreement of the
parties and represents the entire resolution of the matter of
Peter Edward Rose before the Commissioner.


Agreed to and resolved this 23rd day of August 1989,

(signed) (signed)
Peter Edward Rose A. Bartlett Giamatti
Commissioner of Baseball

Witnessed by: Witnessed by:
(signed) (signed)
Reuven K. Katz, Esquire (Fay Vincent Jr.)
Katz, Teller, Brant & Hild


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[9natural9]

see above post

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 9natural9
Damn, I leave for the evening and I miss all the action.....O.K. let me play catch up...

1)CANES, I'm not saying Bonds is a "great guy", nor am I saying he isn't. I don't know the man, therefore I can't base a hatred on him just because Sportcenter reported he is an asshole to the fans. Furthermore, I will say again, personally I DO NOT agree with his "reported" behavior whatsoever, and if I was to so blessed as to play professional football I would like to pattern such a overall charecter such as Brett Favre. I will say again, I am not saying he is a gem of a person, nor am I saying he isn't. CANES I don't know the guy except for what the media reports, which is obviously most every time a negative slant. My final point is Bonds is responsible for his playing performance, no more, no less. What he does with his "own" time is his right, and should be respected.

2)KEYMASTUR, show me any "LEGAL" documentation that Pete Rose was tried and convicted in a court of law of gambling on baseball games, sorry pal, you can't. Again, Pete Rose was a prick to many people, but that has absolutely NOTHING to do with his on-field performance. Many fans can't decypher the difference between what the player is responsible for on the field and off, and it clouds the game and pollutes it in my opinion. Athletes, as well as all people in the spotlight, deserve their personal "space", the fans have got to deal with that and move on. I will not be gullible enough to say that Rose was not a gambler, but nowhere, I mean fucking nowhere does MLB or the HOF have a lawful right to keep him from his just do. The MLB, in conjuction with the HOF, sugarcoated a blackballing plan to banish Rose from baseball and all his on the field honors. It is an injustice even a blind man can see, my friends. Why do you think over 99% of the ball players in the present day, boycotted that pencil neck Jim Grey after his unprofessional media shark feeding attempt on Rose. Because every "real" person involved in the MLB knows that Rose deserves nothing less than an induction into the HOF. He is, and will forever be remembered as "Charlie Hustle", it is just a shame that some no talented pukes (HOF voters) have the audacity to play GOD and keep such a athlete out, because as long as Rose is out of the HOF, the sanctity of what it stands for is squalid and poisoned.

Well I am not basing my views on Bonds on what I saw on SportsCenter, I witnessed it IN PERSON, then saw a FACTUAL report on SportsCenter. Lets not assume that EVERY report you hear from the media is all hype and a crock of shit. I too didn't believe what the media was saying about him and maybe don't still believe all the bad pub, but I don't dismiss it either as an anti-media pias against him anymore either. I think if someone has had as many ROUGH reports as he has had, many of them have a lot of validity.

As for your crying foul about Rose, why aren't you crying about Shoeless Joe Jackson, maybe a man even MORE screwed by MLB ?

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 9natural9
Also, I have also used this site in the past years to do research on the book I am writing about this subject...It is an underlying stinch to the sanctity of the game, and I plan on making it more of a noticeable eyesore for the MLB. The executives of the game are no better than terrorist to me. They infiltrate, and destroy what is known to many to be Americas pastime, not for the love of the game, but sadly so more for the money and power.

And here all along I had you pegged wrong 9Natural9 and that is my mistake. I thought you were just a football jock, and that was my bad.

You are a very intelligent and passionate baseball fan, and a very bright young man in general.

Kudos to you my friend, big kudos to you

[9natural9]

CANES, once again I will say...Bonds has obviously not been the angel that people would like him to be...granted, but he should have that right to be a prick, it sucks, but I enjoy personal freedoms, why can'y he.

As far as Shoeless Joe is concerned, that is exactly the point I am trying to make with the MLB executives. They make these GOD DAMN - LIKE rulings that have no legal basis. It is bullshit. I will cry just as foul about Shoeless Joe, but the sad part is Joe is dead and will never know his HOF outcome, and I don't want it to happen to another great one before his life expires. MLB will forever be cursed until they eradicate this hidden shame on the game.

[9natural9]

Excellent reply, BigGunz, I like the professionalism in which you presented your opinion...just to explain more in depth my stance...

To be honest, I am a Pete Rose fan, I believe the passion in which he played the game has faded out, in general, of the present day player. Many might say that this is the driving force behind my comments, not really. I would be uphauled if this injustice happened to any ball player.

The ever-so repetitive point I have been trying to present is....MLB absolutely loathed Pete Rose, even before the allegations. Let's just say he was that generations Ty Cobb, or possibly this generations Barry Bonds, in comparison to media hatred, and executive thumbing of the nose. As you, and many other critics stated, if he was innocent why did he sign the agreement? That is a valid possible "proof of guilt" question. My rebuttle is just as valid. Why did MLB sign it. They wanted Rose OUT of baseball completely. If the MLB had so much damning evidence, then why did they settle on a shady agreement in which it WILL sooner or later be torn apart, God willing, allowing Rose back into the game? I'll tell you why, because the majority of the evidence was "he said/she said" bullshit, and that WILL NOT hold up in court against such a harsh penalty against a beloved player. For example, Shoeless Joe Jackson was in almost the exact predicament, but the MLB took him to court, twice. Both cases were found in Shoeless Joe's favor, INNOCENT by jury on all charges. MLB executives went against court proceedings and banished Joe. It almost ruined baseball, and in my opinion, it did in a way.

Now the reason MLB signed this agreement was not to go easy on Rose, and keep his name from being dragged in the mud. That had already been done. The MLB signed this agreement knowing damn well that they could never beat Rose in the coutroom against a jury. Impossible, just like in the Shoeless Joe case, the outstanding jury looked past charecter and judged the facts, concluding innocence.

MLB spun a web around the word loophole and concocted this bullshit agreement, sugar-coated it for Rose from which one reliable source was told that the prior to the signing told Rose that there is in "NO CHANCE IN HELL the fans would allow you (Rose) to be banished a lifetime from baseball, maybe a few years, but not a lifetime." To be blunt, the bastards lied to side-step the courtroom....

I am yet to rest my case, until the MLB executives own up to what Rose, Shoeless Joe, and the fans deserve.

[9natural9]

strike one, strike two, bump three

[BIG_JDAWG]

barry bonds is awesome. just because he doesn't feel like he has to make the media a priority in his life, doesn't mean he is a dick. just imagine all the pressure that pro athletes are put under. they dont need the stress of handling the media while trying to perform and do their job. some guys can do it, some can't. and bonds just doesnt want to have any part of it. and i look up to him in that way, because he doesn't do what everyone else wants him to do. he is his own man. i will always have respect for him



Big J