Estane and xtrene cycle

**Sfla80** · 11-08-2009, 08:41 AM

Whats up, i am about to start a estane/xtren cyc.e tomorrow. Im going to get bf and measurements today before i start. Then im going to keep track of the gains and everything throughout the cycle.

Right now im 5-10 168 29 yo.
Traing for 2 years hard.
One cycle before...test/400 and deca /300

Cycle looks like..

estane 20/20/20/20
xtrene 20/20/20/20
I have 2 bottles of each, not sure if i should run 3-4 wks...or 5-6 wks
Any suggestions? I was just going to see if i get affected by sides before making the choice.
Cycle cupport everyday with protein shake

Pct
Clomid 75-50-50
nolva 40-20-20
Ill do a 4th week if i run for 5+ wks.

Any other suggestions? How everything look far as doses and length?
I am picking up my liver support today. Not sure which one i want yet.

thanks for the help

**Kibble** · 11-08-2009, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

Whats up, i am about to start a estane/xtren cyc.e tomorrow. Im going to get bf and measurements today before i start. Then im going to keep track of the gains and everything throughout the cycle.

Right now im 5-10 168 29 yo.
Traing for 2 years hard.
One cycle before...test/400 and deca /300

Cycle looks like..

estane 20/20/20/20 Estane30/30/30/30
xtrene 20/20/20/20 Xtren 90/90/90/90
Xtren is most effective at 60-90mg
I have 2 bottles of each, not sure if i should run 3-4 wks...or 5-6 wks
Any suggestions? I was just going to see if i get affected by sides before making the choice.
Cycle cupport everyday with protein shake

Pct
Clomid 75-50-50 Add another week
nolva 40-20-20 Add another week
Ill do a 4th week if i run for 5+ wks.

Any other suggestions? How everything look far as doses and length?
I am picking up my liver support today. Not sure which one i want yet.

thanks for the help

Answers in bold

**Sfla80** · 11-08-2009, 05:02 PM

so only do 4 weeks of this cycle?

**TOP** · 11-08-2009, 05:44 PM

Hey hey! Okininawa power has this cycle going on also his is a bit higher dosed than yours also. What type of liver support did you get? And how is your diet coming?? TOP

Start of my S4 with DS Log

**Sfla80** · 11-08-2009, 07:29 PM

Wow, we are taking the same cycle. Sounds like its working for him. I think ill try his doses too and wait to see how i feel and how the sides get.

Diet is going good, i just basiclly need the motivation i guess.thats why i got this cycle. I lost it from the previous cycle. Maybe it was because i was going through my pct?? I still hitting the gym hard, its just taking alot more effort now lol. Plus i miss my vascularity that i had. I was addictted to that look. I know the gear was making it like that but still loved it!

Thanks for asking too top, i cant believe you can keep track of all of us that your helping!

**Sfla80** · 11-10-2009, 06:41 PM

i was going to start logging my cycle for this. Been keeping track. Taken 2 days so far. Wheres the right forum to start this log? sarms ?

**xlxBigSexyxlx** · 11-10-2009, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

i was going to start logging my cycle for this. Been keeping track. Taken 2 days so far. Wheres the right forum to start this log? sarms?

http://forums.steroid.com/members-cycle-results/

**Sfla80** · 11-10-2009, 08:39 PM

hmm, yeah i saw that. I thought that was just for pics before and after stuff like that. But thanks man....im going to start it today then.

**xlxBigSexyxlx** · 11-10-2009, 08:42 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

hmm, yeah i saw that. I thought that was just for pics before and after stuff like that. But thanks man....im going to start it today then.

cool. kick ass on your cycle!

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-11-2009, 03:44 AM

Cycle has been going great. I'm into day 7 and can't wait for the next 14 days...That is when you really feel the affects of Tren /Stane. Good Luck with your cycle and let me know how it is going!!!

**CMonkey** · 11-11-2009, 08:54 PM

Originally Posted by Okinawa_Power

Cycle has been going great. I'm into day 7 and can't wait for the next 14 days...That is when you really feel the affects of Tren/Stane. Good Luck with your cycle and let me know how it is going!!!

I am in week 3 of my Tren /Epi cycle. It is absolutely crazy the size and strength gains. I am running 30mg Epi and 90mg of Tren per day. I am shutdown pretty hard at the moment, but I expected that. I am up about 10 lbs. and still going up. Started at 188, hoping to get to 205 by the end.

**TOP** · 11-14-2009, 04:00 PM

Define this??

Originally Posted by CMonkey

I am in week 3 of my Tren /Epi cycle. It is absolutely crazy the size and strength gains. I am running 30mg Epi and 90mg of Tren per day. I am shutdown pretty hard at the moment, but I expected that. I am up about 10 lbs. and still going up. Started at 188, hoping to get to 205 by the end.

**CMonkey** · 11-14-2009, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by topherhinton

Define this??

My balls are the size of grapes and I have absolutely no interest in sex. I can still perform, but just no libido. The wife is not impressed..lol, usually I am a hornball. My first run I did Epistane only and it shut me down, so I knew it would happen this time.

This is a great stack. I think it would be a damn good kickstart to a test cycle. At least the test would counter the sexual sides.

Last time I did a Nolva and some OTC crap for PCT and it took 8 weeks for everything to come back to normal. This run I am going to be doing Nolva and Torem, hopefully will come back a little faster.

**Sfla80** · 11-14-2009, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by CMonkey

My balls are the size of grapes and I have absolutely no interest in sex. I can still perform, but just no libido. The wife is not impressed..lol, usually I am a hornball. My first run I did Epistane only and it shut me down, so I knew it would happen this time.

This is a great stack. I think it would be a damn good kickstart to a test cycle. At least the test would counter the sexual sides.

Last time I did a Nolva and some OTC crap for PCT and it took 8 weeks for everything to come back to normal. This run I am going to be doing Nolva and Torem, hopefully will come back a little faster.

How long did this happened into the cycle. Im on dday 6, no signs of it yet.

**CMonkey** · 11-14-2009, 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

How long did this happened into the cycle. Im on dday 6, no signs of it yet.

For me I was horny as a mofo for the first 14 days, then it started to go slowly downhill. Right now I'm a little over 3 weeks in.

It may not happen to you, everybody is different.

**POPS** · 11-14-2009, 06:46 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

How long did this happened into the cycle. Im on dday 6, no signs of it yet.

The libido thing probably starts around week 2 but Im sure everyone is different...

I had the same thing with my spawn cycle. You definately need nolva and clomid. It took about 3 weeks for me to get back to normal then my wife started to run away from me! lol!!

**CMonkey** · 11-14-2009, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by popsinc

The libido thing probably starts around week 2 but Im sure everyone is different...

I had the same thing with my spawn cycle. You definately need nolva and clomid. It took about 3 weeks for me to get back to normal then my wife started to run away from me! lol!!

That shouldn't have been too hard....especially when your walker snags on the carpet.....LOL

J/K

**POPS** · 11-14-2009, 06:58 PM

Originally Posted by CMonkey

That shouldn't have been too hard....especially when your walker snags on the carpet.....LOL

J/K

thats right, pick on the old guy!!! lol...

**CMonkey** · 11-14-2009, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by popsinc

thats right, pick on the old guy!!! lol...

You got a few years on me...but I'm getting there. For some reason I keep getting older every day.

**TOP** · 11-14-2009, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by CMonkey

That shouldn't have been too hard....especially when your walker snags on the carpet.....LOL

J/K

LMFAO thats was a good one!/You have to say that was funny pop!

**POPS** · 11-14-2009, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by topherhinton

LMFAO thats was a good one!/You have to say that was funny pop!

yeah, yeah, yeah!!!!! Hey, I love a good joke. Too bad my entire place has hardwood floors, lol!!!

**Sfla80** · 11-14-2009, 08:58 PM

very cool, i guess i will see what happens....i never crashed on my test/deca cycle at all. and i was even a week late on pct. But i guess the nolva clomid combo still is the best thing for it.

Not married anyways so not a big deal lol was just curious.

**POPS** · 11-14-2009, 09:45 PM

[QUOTE=goode80;4946309]very cool, i guess i will see what happens....i never crashed on my test/deca cycle at all. and i was even a week late on pct. But i guess the nolva clomid combo still is the best thing for it.

Not married anyways so not a big deal lol was just curious.BUT IF YOU HAVE A GF, SAME THING BRO![/QUOTE]

When anybody asks me for my personal exp with phs I tell them what I reccomend. Mind you that it took me 4 months of research before I decided to do a cycle of hdrol for 4 weeks and this is a mild one as we all know.

My philosophy : no pct, no support, no ph's.....plain and simple...better be safe than sorry.......jmo......

**Sfla80** · 11-14-2009, 10:04 PM

oh dude totally agree, but i was just saying rescently divorced so not really worried about my libdo right now.

Plus got 2 bottles each nolva and clomid...cycle cupport, milk thistle, vitamin c, fish oil, multi vitamin, arginine.

Im good on all that. I just dont understand why a ph would shut you down more the real gear would....but i guess it just depends on the person.

**CMonkey** · 11-14-2009, 10:14 PM

Originally Posted by goode80

oh dude totally agree, but i was just saying rescently divorced so not really worried about my libdo right now.

Plus got 2 bottles each nolva and clomid...cycle cupport, milk thistle, vitamin c, fish oil, multi vitamin, arginine.

Im good on all that. I just dont understand why a ph would shut you down more the real gear would....but i guess it just depends on the person.

It shuts you down, because most of the time test is not ran with PH/DS's. The PH/DS's activate the negative feedback loop in your body, this shuts off your natural test production. Your nuts shrink and your libido goes in the toilet. If you were to add test, your nuts would still shrink, but the exogenous test would keep the libido going strong.

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-15-2009, 05:18 AM

Sex drive is high right now...on day 11.....I will see how it goes....Cycle is pretty good right now.....Massive strength gains......Trying to eat clean and every 3 hours.......I don't think I am going to reach my 225 goal though......Gains are coming to slow.......After week 3 your gains taper off so I may hit 215....I'm at 209.5 as of this morning.........So if I can reach 215 from this four week cycle and then bridge for 2 weeks and then continue bulk for another 16 weeks using M-Drol and X-Tren /E-Stane I might reach 225......It all depends on how I feel.......

**Sfla80** · 11-15-2009, 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by Okinawa_Power

Sex drive is high right now...on day 11.....I will see how it goes....Cycle is pretty good right now.....Massive strength gains......Trying to eat clean and every 3 hours.......I don't think I am going to reach my 225 goal though......Gains are coming to slow.......After week 3 your gains taper off so I may hit 215....I'm at 209.5 as of this morning.........So if I can reach 215 from this four week cycle and then bridge for 2 weeks and then continue bulk for another 16 weeks using M-Drol and X-Tren/E-Stane I might reach 225......It all depends on how I feel.......

What does this mean? Will you still do 4 weeks of pct? If you do when will you do it? I have 2 bottles of stane/trene. What is the proper way to bridge 2 cycles with inculding pct?

**POPS** · 11-15-2009, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by goode80

What does this mean? Will you still do 4 weeks of pct? If you do when will you do it? I have 2 bottles of stane/trene. What is the proper way to bridge 2 cycles with inculding pct?

Good question. Remember something about Okinawa, hes a f*****g animal!!!

Wouldnt it be nice just to stay on spawn all the time - no mean to hijack....

Pct for 4 weeks is a must no matter how you look at it but I think Okinawa has this down to a science so I am curious as well as how this is done. I was always told to skip 60 days after pct to begin another ph cycle.

Dude keeps on going and going and going, lol!!!

**Sfla80** · 11-15-2009, 09:24 AM

lol, damn ok i guess i have to wait and see....would be interesting to know the right way to do that. I dont think i would have a problem waiting but 8-12 weeks is a long time to let it sit in my cabneit lol.

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-16-2009, 06:16 AM

Gentlemen I am glad you asked this question....And thanks Pops for the great comments that you made about me. Ok here goes.....

1. When you take a PH it has to convert in your system to become a Steroid , however a Designer Steroid (DS), SD, E-Stane, X-Tren , Spawn....is already a steroid that does not have to use your liver to convert it is ready to do it's job when you take it.

2. I have been reading about bridging for about 3 months now and I have come to the conclussion that bridging with a DS will be the same as doing a 16 week cycle of lets say Test E with Tren.....The way we can accomplish this is by doing a 4 week cycle of E-Stane/X-Tren followed by 2 weeks PCT with Clomid and Nolva followed by a 4 week cycle of M-Drol followed by 6 weeks PCT......The 2 weeks of Clomid and Nolva and Clen will allow your receptors to become unsatuated and will allow your natural test levels to raise, now bear in mind that the PCT will have to be very agressive like this Clomid 100/100 with Nolva at 60/60 this will allow the estrogen in your body to level out using Clen will allow you to keep your strength and preserve muscle during this time frame....Once you complete PCT you then start the M-Drol cycle at 10mg everyday for the first week and you then raise it to 20mg for the next 2 weeks followed by 30mg for the last 2 weeks.

As for damage to your liver.....I have medical friends that have told me that the liver is a very strong organ and can repair itself in a matter of days so as long as during PCT you take your liver support you will be good to go.....

After the 6 weeks of PCT then you will be ready to load up again on E-Stane/X-Tren and can run it for 3 weeks.....

This is what I think will give you the best gains.......Just an idea that I have, not fact, not proven.....I will do this and let everyone know how it goes and will run a log on it.....I like to do things that others have not tried....That is why I am running a SARM S4 and E-Stane/X-Tren at the same time.........

Please let me know what you think....I am not the subject matter expert on DS/PH so if you know something I don't please let me know...I am always open for advice.......

P.S. During PCT do not allow your lifts to go down....Keep lifting as heavy as possibe.

**Sfla80** · 11-16-2009, 07:06 AM

wow you have done your research!!! Im cant try this now, would had to have all that product already on hand if i wanted to do it. Maybe next time.

**Sfla80** · 11-16-2009, 11:40 AM

Ok not sure if you guys look at all the forums, but i posted a thread in question and answers.....saying i just found a good source for gear. So im going to be buying test/deca and stack it with dbol . I will be doing this cycle maybe end of janurary. Should be plenty time to recover from this cycle.

But my question is, instead of dbol could i use the trene/stane the first 4 weeks of the cycle like i would the dbol? Or is this not a good idea?

**RATTLEHEAD** · 11-16-2009, 11:45 AM

goode, yes you can I guess by why would you? go with the dbol .

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-16-2009, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by RATTLEHEAD

goode, yes you can I guess by why would you? go with the dbol.

**** the Stane/Tren use that Dbol !!!!!

**Sfla80** · 11-16-2009, 10:25 PM

Lmao, true wasnt sure though. I really wanna load on this cycle so was definately going to do one or the other but you guys definately made my mind up. I am so looking forward to that cycle. Almost 3 months away though!!!

One other question i see people adding clen to their pct? I thought that would be part of the cycle and need a pct for that too? Or is it safe taking the clen during pct?

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-17-2009, 05:42 AM

Originally Posted by goode80

Lmao, true wasnt sure though. I really wanna load on this cycle so was definately going to do one or the other but you guys definately made my mind up. I am so looking forward to that cycle. Almost 3 months away though!!!

One other question i see people adding clen to their pct? I thought that would be part of the cycle and need a pct for that too? Or is it safe taking the clen during pct?

Clen is used to get rid of water and fat that you get from bulking. It also helps maintain your strength and fights againest muscle loss during PCT. If you don't do the proper PCT you will lose everything you gained....Trust me...Trial and error.......Sucks losing everything......

**Swifto** · 11-17-2009, 06:37 AM

Originally Posted by Okinawa_Power

Gentlemen I am glad you asked this question....And thanks Pops for the great comments that you made about me. Ok here goes.....

1. When you take a PH it has to convert in your system to become a Steroid , however a Designer Steroid (DS), SD, E-Stane, X-Tren , Spawn....is already a steroid that does not have to use your liver to convert it is ready to do it's job when you take it.

2. I have been reading about bridging for about 3 months now and I have come to the conclussion that bridging with a DS will be the same as doing a 16 week cycle of lets say Test E with Tren.....The way we can accomplish this is by doing a 4 week cycle of E-Stane/X-Tren followed by 2 weeks PCT with Clomid and Nolva followed by a 4 week cycle of M-Drol followed by 6 weeks PCT......The 2 weeks of Clomid and Nolva and Clen will allow your receptors to become unsatuated and will allow your natural test levels to raise, now bear in mind that the PCT will have to be very agressive like this Clomid 100/100 with Nolva at 60/60 this will allow the estrogen in your body to level out using Clen will allow you to keep your strength and preserve muscle during this time frame....Once you complete PCT you then start the M-Drol cycle at 10mg everyday for the first week and you then raise it to 20mg for the next 2 weeks followed by 30mg for the last 2 weeks.

As for damage to your liver.....I have medical friends that have told me that the liver is a very strong organ and can repair itself in a matter of days so as long as during PCT you take your liver support you will be good to go.....

After the 6 weeks of PCT then you will be ready to load up again on E-Stane/X-Tren and can run it for 3 weeks.....

This is what I think will give you the best gains.......Just an idea that I have, not fact, not proven.....I will do this and let everyone know how it goes and will run a log on it.....I like to do things that others have not tried....That is why I am running a SARM S4 and E-Stane/X-Tren at the same time.........

Please let me know what you think....I am not the subject matter expert on DS/PH so if you know something I don't please let me know...I am always open for advice.......

P.S. During PCT do not allow your lifts to go down....Keep lifting as heavy as possibe.

What receptors?

Who's to say you can recover enough in "2 weeks"?

All your doing is yo-yo'ing with your HPTA. You should stick to the rule of time off = time on + PCT. DS's and PH's can cause HPTA shutdown, not just inhibition.

You also dont include BW at all.

I dont like this idea and dont suggest it. I stick to the rule above and get regular BW done on cycle and off.

Clen during PCT may help with preserving muscle as it has shown to be anabolic in skeletal muscle in humans. Therefore, anti-catabolic.

**Okinawa_Power** · 11-18-2009, 06:21 AM

Originally Posted by Swifto

What receptors? Adrogen Receptors

Who's to say you can recover enough in "2 weeks"? Who is to say 4 weeks is enough? Because everyone else says it is?

All your doing is yo-yo'ing with your HPTA. You should stick to the rule of time off = time on + PCT. DS's and PH's can cause HPTA shutdown, not just inhibition. HPTA should not be shut down after only a 4 week cycle

You also dont include BW at all.: Blood Work can be done before and after.....

I dont like this idea and dont suggest it. I stick to the rule above and get regular BW done on cycle and off. I am not recommending this to anyone...I am simply stating that I am going to try it....I did not recoomend this to anyone either....I am going to be the one doing this cycle.....

Clen during PCT may help with preserving muscle as it has shown to be anabolic in skeletal muscle in humans. Therefore, anti-catabolic.

: That is why I include it in PCT...

I never said it was a good cycle.....I am only stating what I am going to do......I'll let you know how it goes.....I think the use of PH/DS/AAS is all trial and error.........Just like doctors "practice" medicine........Same principle......

**theattrition** · 12-18-2009, 03:18 AM

i got shot in the liver and got 60% of it removed and the doctors told me it would take 2 weeks for it to grow back full and it did

**Okinawa_Power** · 12-18-2009, 06:05 AM

Originally Posted by theattrition

i got shot in the liver and got 60% of it removed and the doctors told me it would take 2 weeks for it to grow back full and it did

Individual liver cells can regenerate. That's not to say you can cut out your liver and a new one will grow back. Unlike other organs, in the case of certain diseases and injury, where the liver function is comprimised, through appropriate medical treatment, the cells can heal and the liver can be functional again. Of course thousands of people die every year from liver disease and liver failure, so this isn't some kind of miracle healing that's being done, this is just a good hardy organ that can take some punishment.

It's just an organ that has a greater capability to heal itself than other organs. It's probably an evolutionary mechanism that's been built in because the liver itself is the main site of metabolism in the body, where breakdown of chemicals often results in toxic metabolites which can destroy cells locally. Since it's doing that 24 hours a day, the cells have probably just adapted a greater capacity to heal and regrow. This is in contrast to say, your heart or lungs, which cannot regrow new cells and cannot heal at all.