Bouncer killed by rear naked choke....

[Lift_Heavy_NY]

In a local bar out here by me a bouncer went to get a guy off of a table, when he turned away to get help the guy jumped on his back and killed him. Turned out the killer was a marine and actually had his wrist on the bouncers adams apple and crushed his throat. I heard the guy was shaking him back and forth when he was already unconscious . Un fuc'n believable, I cant believe anybody near by didnt do anything, where was the other bouncers? Most fuc'd up thing was his brother was working there also. Give some people alcohol and you have instant assholes. Only positive thing is, they sent his ass straight to Rikers. The sad part the bouncer had a family, making $100 a nite trying to make ends meet. If you see some bullshit like this going, grow some balls and do something, you never know it might be you or a family member one day.

["Maximus"]

Damn... that's a pretty sad ending for that bouncer and a tragic loss for his family! Hopefully, the guy who did this gets served in prison!

[gixxerboy1]

In a local bar out here by me a bouncer went to get a guy off of a table, when he turned away to get help the guy jumped on his back and killed him. Turned out the killer was a marine and actually had his wrist on the bouncers adams apple and crushed his throat. I heard the guy was shaking him back and forth when he was already unconscious . Un fuc'n believable, I cant believe anybody near by didnt do anything, where was the other bouncers? Most fuc'd up thing was his brother was working there also. Give some people alcohol and you have instant assholes. Only positive thing is, they sent his ass straight to Rikers. The sad part the bouncer had a family, making $100 a nite trying to make ends meet. If you see some bullshit like this going, grow some balls and do something, you never know it might be you or a family member one day.

I agre thats really ****ed up what happened. And im curious where the other bouncers were. But i worked in clubs for years. last thing most want is other customers trying to help out

[warchild]

usually you hear stories of the bouncer killing the customer. very sad though

[scibble]

interesting, if google "bouncer killed" you find such a long list of stories over the past several years: reasons given are:

(1) patron upset that he missed last call for drinks
(2) bouncer trying to enforce smoking ban
(3) patrons did not want to check their coats
(4) bouncer was trying to stop someone smoking pot
(5) bouncer refused to let patrons enter the estab.
(6) strangled after asking patron to stop dancing on a table
etc, etc,

not to mention the random sh1t

might want to rethink that as a career option

[gixxerboy1]

thats why i dont do it anymore. Its not worth it. It was fun while i was young or when i worked at a place everyone knew not to mess with

[Lift_Heavy_NY]

I agre thats really ****ed up what happened. And im curious where the other bouncers were. But i worked in clubs for years. last thing most want is other customers trying to help out

I hear about the customers but when the guys arms are dangling you hope anybody will do something. Rumor is there was only 3 bouncers and 300 patrons, but still, how many people sat there and watched. I also hear that someone punced him 3 times ( the killer ) then when he finally dropped him, he started kicking him while he lied there lifeless.

thats why i dont do it anymore. Its not worth it. It was fun while i was young or when i worked at a place everyone knew not to mess with

Very true, I spoke to my friend who worked there for a long time and he said they fired him and hired...and I use this term loosley with all do respect "pussies" because they were affraid of lawsuits.....well they got a big one coming real soon....bad choice.

[Lift_Heavy_NY]

might want to rethink that as a career option

I agree, but this was a bar/restaurant in Southampton village no less. Times are tough, guy was trying to make a little extra money to support his family.

[godkilla]

i was a "bouncer" as a second job for a couple yrs and unless your head of security at a decent size club it will never be worth it money wise. it can be a very fun job though, and has its perks that is for sure.

[MuscleSportMag]

The papers said that the other bouncers were trying to get this guy off the bouncer, but he held on to the choke hold tightly, even after the bouncer was unconscious. You can't 'Monday Morning QB,' but there comes a time when you have to use more effective methods, such as braining this piece of shit with a chair, if necessary.

It seems as if most people on this thread agree that more force was necessary in this case, but a few other recent posts were condemning cops for what has been deemed 'excessive force.'

I would love to throw a hypothetical situation out there - if the cops were called and walked in while this was going on, would they have been raked over the coals if they punched this guy in the face 13 times?

[peachfuzz]

Touche MuscleSportMag

[CSAR]

Touche MuscleSportMag

Touche indeed. Nice call.

[JDawg1536]

The papers said that the other bouncers were trying to get this guy off the bouncer, but he held on to the choke hold tightly, even after the bouncer was unconscious. You can't 'Monday Morning QB,' but there comes a time when you have to use more effective methods, such as braining this piece of shit with a chair, if necessary.

It seems as if most people on this thread agree that more force was necessary in this case, but a few other recent posts were condemning cops for what has been deemed 'excessive force.'

I would love to throw a hypothetical situation out there - if the cops were called and walked in while this was going on, would they have been raked over the coals if they punched this guy in the face 13 times?

The officer was not in danger when he was punching the guy in the face, nor when the other cop delivered a Ronnie Lott to the guy on the bicycle. Valid points but in all three cases, the appropriate use of force was not used.

[Amorphic]

The papers said that the other bouncers were trying to get this guy off the bouncer, but he held on to the choke hold tightly, even after the bouncer was unconscious. You can't 'Monday Morning QB,' but there comes a time when you have to use more effective methods, such as braining this piece of shit with a chair, if necessary.

It seems as if most people on this thread agree that more force was necessary in this case, but a few other recent posts were condemning cops for what has been deemed 'excessive force.'

I would love to throw a hypothetical situation out there - if the cops were called and walked in while this was going on, would they have been raked over the coals if they punched this guy in the face 13 times?

damn rights.

[zimmy]

not that it matters here...but just because you are on some guy's back with your arm on there throat does not make it a rear naked choke.

[VeraDeMilo]

I would love to throw a hypothetical situation out there - if the cops were called and walked in while this was going on, would they have been raked over the coals if they punched this guy in the face 13 times?

Not where I am from. A lot of the clubs and bars I have worked in actually hire 2-3 cops to stay at the clubs the whole night and basically arrest anyone we bouncers throw out if they continue to be out of hand. I have fought many times side by side with the cops we hire. I have seen them punch kids in the face, stomp on them when they are down, mase, choke out with their clubs, etc. And none of it, in my opinion was excessive. You have to treat a brawl like a riot situation. And sometimes, the best defense is a strong offense. And if a kid takes a swing or pushes a cop, the cop has every right to respond with as much force as HE deems necessary in that situation.

If him cracking a guy in the face and breaking his nose means the difference between he himself being seriously hurt or going home safely to his wife and kids..... I will never tell him how much force is too much. Its at his discretion, in my opinion. (I know a lot of you think differently)

[JDawg1536]

not that it matters here...but just because you are on some guy's back with your arm on there throat does not make it a rear naked choke.

He failed to mention the marine didnt have any pants on.

[J-Dogg]

I feel for the guy, and his family. Honestly, he would be better washing dishes at a local restaraunt and would probably get paid more and be safe.

Bouncers are stepping into situations like this, it's fun, but it's like being a fireman, you are taking risk. YOu are dealing with mad drunks, spitting on you, stabbing you, you are not doing it for the money. So I hope getting a few girls phone numbers is worth that risk.

[Mike Dura]

I feel your pain bro. I'm also from LI and this story is troubling. How absurd that a guy is murdered for asking some knucklehead to get off a table. And to keep choking once the guy is unconscious - just incomprehensible. It's depressing. I hope this idiot is getting what's coming to him. Throw him to the sodomites. Incidentally, he was a correction officer by day moonlighting as a bouncer.

In a local bar out here by me a bouncer went to get a guy off of a table, when he turned away to get help the guy jumped on his back and killed him. Turned out the killer was a marine and actually had his wrist on the bouncers adams apple and crushed his throat. I heard the guy was shaking him back and forth when he was already unconscious . Un fuc'n believable, I cant believe anybody near by didnt do anything, where was the other bouncers? Most fuc'd up thing was his brother was working there also. Give some people alcohol and you have instant assholes. Only positive thing is, they sent his ass straight to Rikers. The sad part the bouncer had a family, making $100 a nite trying to make ends meet. If you see some bullshit like this going, grow some balls and do something, you never know it might be you or a family member one day.

[Lift_Heavy_NY]

not that it matters here...but just because you are on some guy's back with your arm on there throat does not make it a rear naked choke.

Talk about 2 cents, I was quoting a headline, thats why I added " he actually had his wrist on the bouncers adams apple and crushed his throat."

I feel your pain bro. I'm also from LI and this story is troubling. How absurd that a guy is murdered for asking some knucklehead to get off a table. And to keep choking once the guy is unconscious - just incomprehensible. It's depressing. I hope this idiot is getting what's coming to him. Throw him to the sodomites. Incidentally, he was a correction officer by day moonlighting as a bouncer.

Holy shit, I didnt know that about being a corrections officer, I wonder if he worked in Riverhead and thats why the sent the killer straight to Rikers....he wouldnt make it to trial in the bouncers own facility. Amagine working with inmates in jail all day and get killed bouncing at a resteraunt/bar, crazy shit.

[wilson9d]

i was a "bouncer" as a second job for a couple yrs and unless your head of security at a decent size club it will never be worth it money wise. it can be a very fun job though, and has its perks that is for sure.

i was head of security at some hot spots for allot of years. had allot of fun. money was good, had its ups and downs like everything else. no better way to hook up. i got out because iwas looking arround at some of the people i had worked with over the years and asked myself if i really wanted to be in my 30's and 40's doing this?

[MuscleSportMag]

The officer was not in danger when he was punching the guy in the face, nor when the other cop delivered a Ronnie Lott to the guy on the bicycle. Valid points but in all three cases, the appropriate use of force was not used.

Maybe he wasn't, but we weren't there and don't know what lead up to that. Either way, that cop did get jammed up for what he did - for right or wrong.

It is hard to say what is "appropriate" force. Everyone has a different threshold for fighting and resisting. What may seem like a brutal beating to someone may be just enough to stop some bad guy from getting the best of you.

Did you ever run into a situation when you had to kick the crap out of someone? I'm sure we all have, and while some may have been quick, others may have taken longer and the other guy may have gotten the best of you. If a bad guy gets away from a cop because he got the best of him, it could mean the cop's life. If the criminal merely runs away, now that cop has to answer for it. I'd want to make sure that I got him under control, too.

[JDawg1536]

Maybe he wasn't, but we weren't there and don't know what lead up to that. Either way, that cop did get jammed up for what he did - for right or wrong.

It is hard to say what is "appropriate" force. Everyone has a different threshold for fighting and resisting. What may seem like a brutal beating to someone may be just enough to stop some bad guy from getting the best of you.

Did you ever run into a situation when you had to kick the crap out of someone? I'm sure we all have, and while some may have been quick, others may have taken longer and the other guy may have gotten the best of you. If a bad guy gets away from a cop because he got the best of him, it could mean the cop's life. If the criminal merely runs away, now that cop has to answer for it. I'd want to make sure that I got him under control, too.

You make sense, but what Im referring to when I say appropriate force is what's called a "Use of Force Model". It's what all law enforcement follows, and it sets guidelines for the appropriate response and amount of force an officer can use based on the actions of the subject. For example, the guy in cuffs resisting arrest was actively resisting which would be level 2 in the use of force model, and the officer striking him with his fists was a level 3 response = too much force. Whether the guy just murdered 5 people or not has nothing to do with how much force the officer is allowed to use. You can always use less force than allowed, but you are NEVER supposed to use more. So its pretty cut and dry if an officer uses excessive force or not, all you do is line up column A to column B.

[powerliftmike]

Im a bouncer part-time. I think it requires good training, you have to know where the other guys are at all times in case one gets in trouble. Sad that no one helped this guy out.

[Narkissos]

Helping a bouncer fight off a customer is like helping a policeman fight off a criminal.

Step in and do something?

Ridiculous.

So because the random stranger has a family, you're supposed to step in and risk your own death... to subdue another random, and violent, stranger who you have no argument with?

Ridiculous.

-CNS

[anaBROLIC]

alot of bars have alot of regulars who become good friends with employees. (security) i am surprised he wasnt helped out at all.

[BITTAPART2]

I agree w/ Nark, in a way, who is going to take care of a guy that just killed a bouncer w. his bare hands? Id be grabbing full bottles of liquir and smashing and slicing at that point, but then Im in jail for manslaughter because it was technically not self defense and possibly in this case, something like a sliced juggular may have been the only option out

[Mike Dura]

In that particular situation, I would have stepped in. I couldn't bare to just watch as someone was getting choked - esp., laying limp, passed out.

[Lift_Heavy_NY]

Helping a bouncer fight off a customer is like helping a policeman fight off a criminal.

Step in and do something?

Ridiculous.

So because the random stranger has a family, you're supposed to step in and risk your own death... to subdue another random, and violent, stranger who you have no argument with?

Ridiculous.

-CNS

Your a p u s s y if you sit there and watch someone kill another person with their bare hands, glad your not from my parts of the woods. Be a different story if it were your family member, just think you may get roughed up a little, but his kids would be able to see there father again. Go checkk and see if your cock hasnt fallen offf after that post.


BG

[MuscleSportMag]

Helping a bouncer fight off a customer is like helping a policeman fight off a criminal.

Step in and do something?

Ridiculous.

So because the random stranger has a family, you're supposed to step in and risk your own death... to subdue another random, and violent, stranger who you have no argument with?

Ridiculous.

-CNS

So I gather by your post that you would walk by a cop getting beat up by a legit bad guy. If that's the case, then I also have to assume that you would continue your stroll when you may stumble upon a "random stranger" getting raped or a "random stranger" kid being abducted by the sex offender in the white van.

I'm no hero, but if I saw a cop having a hard time with some scumbag, I would definitely get involved. Same goes for any incident - bouncer/drunk, rapist/victim, pedophile/kid: It's all the same to me. And I agree with the other poster on someone being a ***** if they stand by and watch.

If you can be a good samaritan, get rid of some pent up frustration, and dish out a little street justice on some piece of shit, then you're killing three birds w/ one stone. And maybe even getting your picture in the morning paper with a congratulatory headline.

[BG]

Helping a bouncer fight off a customer is like helping a policeman fight off a criminal.

Step in and do something?

Ridiculous.

So because the random stranger has a family, you're supposed to step in and risk your own death... to subdue another random, and violent, stranger who you have no argument with?

Ridiculous.

-CNS

If I hadnt seen pictures of you in posing trunks I would have thought you screen name should have been in pink after reading this post. This was probably one of those post you should have typed up.....but waited a day to post after sleeping on it.

[Jfew44]

I'm a bouncer. I got the job and had no training. They saw that I was bigger than the average guy and gave me the job. I make 6 bucks an hour plus tips, which is about $50 on a weekend. I work from 10-4. Not great money.

We had several fights at my bar the other night, which is rare. One of our barbacks got jumped by 3 guys. Now this is a big bar and I was not in that section or I would have done some serious damage. A bar that has over 300 people needs at least 8-9 security guys. If there were really only a few I think management is to blame. If one of our guys gets hit, like the other night, every security guy there is running over to help.

The bottom line of security at a bar is that we are supposed to avoid conflict. The main job of a bouncer is to get troublemakers out without a fight. But if one of my co-workers was being choked out, you can be damn sure that at least 2 of us would see it and smoke the guy who was doing it. Ok, he was trained to kill or what not, he would not be able to take on the whole security team if it was properly staffed.

I know it seems like Im going on a rant here but it really gets to me that someone was killed for doing their job. It makes me very sad and I wish the best for his family.

[DMCat]

Here's a perspetive I did not see while I read through this. The perpetrator was a US MARINE...a trained killer. Who's to know how much post-tramatic stress he may be suffering and trying to anesthetize when he finally flipped out in a public place (non-war zone). These men and women go through their own version of hell and are then released into the streets expected to act 'normal'. Go back and look at all the anti-social/sociopathic and often violent incidents that happened after the Vietnam war, then consider what we have to look forward to.
Factor that into your thinking when you deduce to a conclusion.

[J.S.N.]

So I gather by your post that you would walk by a cop getting beat up by a legit bad guy. .

how would you know he's a legit bad guy? would be be wearing prison stripes and a robber mask?

[JDawg1536]

how would you know he's a legit bad guy? would be be wearing prison stripes and a robber mask?

A prison jump suit.

[firmechicano831]

sad story, but again as a bouncer you know you're always running into problems with people. You just need someone checking ur back all the time and be cautious and careful when approching people.

[Mike Dura]

I didn't here that. If it's true, the question would be whether he had PTSD. His lawyer will factor that in come trial time.

Here's a perspetive I did not see while I read through this. The perpetrator was a US MARINE...a trained killer. Who's to know how much post-tramatic stress he may be suffering and trying to anesthetize when he finally flipped out in a public place (non-war zone). These men and women go through their own version of hell and are then released into the streets expected to act 'normal'. Go back and look at all the anti-social/sociopathic and often violent incidents that happened after the Vietnam war, then consider what we have to look forward to.
Factor that into your thinking when you deduce to a conclusion.

[Narkissos]

Personally I don't give a rat's ass who thinks i'm a *****.

I've worked as a bouncer.. I've run my own bar for 5 years.. I've worked in security, among other things.

I grew up in the ghetto, fighting for everything that I've ever had.

*shrugs*

I stick by my statements.

A random stranger isn't 'family'.

I've seen so many people get fucked up, stepping in to fights where they thought one person had instigated, when it was really the other.

I've seen patrons do total shit to bouncers.. as well seeing it happen the other way around.

I lost one of my best friends who was stabbed to death for accidentally stepping on the shoes of a guy who was having an altercation.

I've been in a party standing behind a guy only to watch him crumple at my feet after being shot to death.

I've been in the middle of altercations... and I still say, if you have no place in one... don't step into the fray.

People like to say what they think others should do.

Many of those people are frozen to the spot when shit starts.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

Bouncer killed by rear naked choke....

Nice multiple account posting... Brownie points for you.

I agree w/ Nark, in a way, who is going to take care of a guy that just killed a bouncer w. his bare hands? Id be grabbing full bottles of liquir and smashing and slicing at that point, but then Im in jail for manslaughter because it was technically not self defense and possibly in this case, something like a sliced juggular may have been the only option out

Bingo.

In my country 'self-defense' does not exist.

It's even worse if you were personally threatened.

Both parties get charged.

Isn't the same as chasing off a criminal.

Two guys apparently brawling in a bar is a whole different ballgame.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

how would you know he's a legit bad guy? would be be wearing prison stripes and a robber mask?

Apparently.

'Legit criminals' look different to 'normal guy experiencing police brutality, who just happened to get pissed off enough to kick the cop's ass'.



-CNS