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  1. #1
    marcus300's Avatar
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    Cialis increases Testosterone

    May be of interset to some that cialis increases testoterone by reducing the conversion from testosterone to estrogen, cialis may well have anti-estrogen actions or so this study indicates that long term cialis treatment showed an increase in T via blocking the T conversion to Estrogen. It didn't increase LH levels but indirectly increased T by lowering Estrogen.........

    Greco EA, Pili M, Bruzziches R, Corona G, Spera G, Aversa A. Testosterone: Estradiol ratio changes associated with long-term tadalafil administration: A pilot study. J Sex Med, 2006;3:71622.

    Journal sexual medicine, published online January 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcus300 View Post
    May be of interset to some that cialis increases testoterone by reducing the conversion from testosterone to estrogen, cialis may well have anti-estrogen actions or so this study indicates that long term cialis treatment showed an increase in T via blocking the T conversion to Estrogen. It didn't increase LH levels but indirectly increased T by lowering Estrogen.........

    Greco EA, Pili M, Bruzziches R, Corona G, Spera G, Aversa A. Testosterone: Estradiol ratio changes associated with long-term tadalafil administration: A pilot study. J Sex Med, 2006;3:716–22.

    Journal sexual medicine, published online January 2011
    Thanks Marcus quite interesting!

  3. #3
    MBMETC's Avatar
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    i could use all he good news about cialis as i can get, tough tren cycle..

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcus300 View Post
    May be of interset to some that cialis increases testoterone by reducing the conversion from testosterone to estrogen, cialis may well have anti-estrogen actions or so this study indicates that long term cialis treatment showed an increase in T via blocking the T conversion to Estrogen. It didn't increase LH levels but indirectly increased T by lowering Estrogen.........

    Greco EA, Pili M, Bruzziches R, Corona G, Spera G, Aversa A. Testosterone : Estradiol ratio changes associated with long-term tadalafil administration: A pilot study. J Sex Med, 2006;3:71622.

    Journal sexual medicine, published online January 2011
    I only saw the abstraction for this study, but it seems you're making a jump/stretch by inferring a Test increase ONLY because of an Estro decrease. The abstract indicates statisitically significant changes with regard to both an Estro decrease, and a Test:Estro ratio increase. But it specifically stated that there were no changes (regardless of its relationship to estro) in Test serum levels.

    For example, let's say you make your ideal PB & J sandwich, put everything away, then go back and remove half the peanut butter. It is admittedly debatable, as to whether you're actually making a 'sweeter sandwich' due to your changing of the PB & J ratio - argument being you didn't add more sweetner, with opposition holding, but you removed half of the sweetness retarding ingredient. But there is no debate as to whether said ratio change actually increases the amount of jelly, i.e. Test, as in your inplication.

    I think the study demonstrates that Cialis will aid cycling in a very mild AI kind of way, and that its proving of an enhanced ratio debunks past suggestions that Cialis and similar drugs might be detrimental to cycling.

    J Sex Med. 2006 Jul;3(4):716-22.
    Testosterone:estradiol ratio changes associated with long-term tadalafil administration: a pilot study.
    Greco EA, Pili M, Bruzziches R, Corona G, Spera G, Aversa A.
    SourceInternal Medicine, Department of Medical Pathophysiology, University of Roma La Sapienza, Rome, Italy.

    Abstract
    INTRODUCTION: It has been reported that lack of sexual activity due to erectile dysfunction (ED) may be associated with testosterone (T) decline.

    AIM: To investigate whether the known changes in sex hormones associated with resumption of sexual activity are sustained in the long term.

    MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: Primary endpoints were variations from baseline of steroid hormones: total T, free T (f T), and estradiol (E). Secondary endpoints were variations of erectile function domain scores at International Index of Erectile Function-5 (IIEF-5).

    METHODS: In an open-label fashion, 20 patients (mean age 54.8 +/- 8.4 years) received tadalafil 10-20 mg on demand for 12 months. Exclusion criteria were those reported for phosphodiesterase inhibitors, including hypogonadism and hyperprolactinemia.

    RESULTS: Tadalafil assumption was safe and well tolerated (overall adverse effects in 15% of patients) and none discontinued medication. A significant decrease in E levels occurred at the end of the study (from 19.9 +/- 9.6 to 16.6 +/- 8.1 ng/dL, P = 0.042 vs. baseline), with parallel increase in the T:E ratio (26.3 +/- 15.3 to 32.6 +/- 17.7, P = 0.05), whereas no changes in T and f T serum levels were observed, respectively (411.4 +/- 131.4 to 434.2 +/- 177.1 ng/dL and 47.7 +/- 15.3 to 49.9 +/- 19.1 pmol/L, not significant). Interestingly, nonparametric subgroup analysis for related samples revealed that E decrease was detectable only in lean (N = 14) but not in obese (N = 6, body mass index > 27.5 kg/m2) subjects (17.8 +/- 10.1 vs. 13.5 +/- 6.8, P < 0.05). A net increase in IIEF-5 scores was observed at the endpoint (13.7 +/- 5.9 vs. 25.7 +/- 2.9, P < 0.0001).

    CONCLUSIONS: Sustained improvement in sexual function after 12 months of tadalafil administration is associated with increased T:E ratio mainly related to reduction of E levels. We hypothesize that androgen-estrogen cross-talk and possible inhibition of aromatase activity during chronic exposure to tadalafil might have a role in the regulation of erectile function.

    PMID:16839328[PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16839328
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    The article what I read stated that there would be more test floating around because its not being converted to E. For me more Test less E is a bonus especially when your taking Cialis

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    thanks Magic now i'm hungry

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    magic32's Avatar
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    The article what I read stated that there would be more test floating around because its not being converted to E. For me more Test less E is a bonus especially when your taking Cialis
    Yeah, I hate how whack article writers inject their subjective thoughts into well performed research.

    I completely agree about the benefit of the ratio, and I also like it's role as a mini-AI. Fortunately, all systems are go, so no Cialis or Viagra for me. At least not yet!
    Master Pai Mei of the White Lotus Clan



    My motto: SAFETY & RESPECT (for drugs and others).

    I AM NOT A SOURCE, I DO NOT GIVE OUT SOURCES, OR PROVIDE SOURCE CHECKS.
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    Difference between Drugs & Poisons
    http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=317700


    Half-lives explained
    http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...inal+half+life


    DNP like Chemotherapy, can be a useful poison, but both are still POISONS
    http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=306144


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  8. #8
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    It comes to us all ^^^ lol

  9. #9
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    Another article, from MD Magazine.....


    Cialis Increases Testosterone ! Based on the research, acute dosages of Cialis do not have performance enhancing effects, but new research suggests that Cialis increases testosterone! Researchers had participants perform three 30 second “all out” sprints to exhaustion and measured testosterone and cortisol responses to exercise. They found that only after Cialis and exercise did increase testosterone however Cialis also increased cortisol levels as well. Cialis also lowered the DHEA to cortisol response. The study demonstrates that Cialis increases the “stress” response to the body but also has some testosterone enhancing effects as well. It’s interesting that a large dosage of caffeine which is a weak non-specific PDE inhibitor also caused an increase in testosterone and also an increase in cortisol21. So it seems that Cialis has both positive and negative effects on muscle. Cialis does not directly stimulate testosterone secretion per se, meaning it does not stimulate LH release or SHBG release directly. This is not the first study to find that Cialis raises testosterone:

    In a study of 74 patients whom were treated on demand with 50 mg of Viagra or 20 mg of Cialis for 3 months in patients with erectile dysfunction. Basal level of total testosterone and free testosterone were at the bottom of the normal range that was reversed after treatment in both groups. Testosterone increase in Viagra-treated cases was significantly lower than in those treated with Cialis suggested to be due to the higher frequency of full sexual intercourse in the Cialis -treated group15.

    Interesting, another study reported that the increase in testosterone from taking Cialis is mediated by a reduction in estrogen demonstration that Cialis may have anti-estrogen actions. It was found pointed out that T/estradiol ratio was changed associated with long-term Cialis treatment. There was no increase in LH levels from Cialis demonstrating that Cialis did not directly increase testosterone but indirectly increased testosterone by lowering estrogen16.

    One of the primary reasons that many older men have problems “rising to the occasion” is that they have excess estrogen levels. Furthermore, in men with hypogonadism, a low dose of clomiphene citrate (Clomid) is effective in improving Testosterone: Estrogen ratio, thus giving more long-term benefit for the management of erectile dysfunction in hypogonadal patients18. It seems that based on the current study Cialis has similar actions to Clomid by improving T: E ratios.

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    Good info

  11. #11
    marcus300's Avatar
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    I doubt it will increase it to any kind of level what we look for, but hey alittle bit more here and there always helps. Didnt like the cortisol increase along side the Test but article makes interesting reading

  12. #12
    AbusedYam is offline Junior Member
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    Interesting.. good read, thanks

  13. #13
    butters4u is offline Junior Member
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    next cycle=cialis lol

  14. #14
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    so, 10 or 12 week cycle?

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    much appreciated!

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcus300 View Post
    I doubt it will increase it to any kind of level what we look for, but hey alittle bit more here and there always helps. Didnt like the cortisol increase along side the Test but article makes interesting reading
    thanks for the article Marcus,i surely need it,i take cials everyday lol

  17. #17
    Ashop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcus300 View Post
    May be of interset to some that cialis increases testoterone by reducing the conversion from testosterone to estrogen, cialis may well have anti-estrogen actions or so this study indicates that long term cialis treatment showed an increase in T via blocking the T conversion to Estrogen. It didn't increase LH levels but indirectly increased T by lowering Estrogen.........

    Greco EA, Pili M, Bruzziches R, Corona G, Spera G, Aversa A. Testosterone: Estradiol ratio changes associated with long-term tadalafil administration: A pilot study. J Sex Med, 2006;3:71622.

    Journal sexual medicine, published online January 2011
    First I have heard of that, interesting!!!

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