How could AS be bad for a fighter?

**J-Dogg** · 12-20-2008, 10:35 AM

I think a lot of us think about AS and automatically think of Body Building or power lifting.

I’ve read a few topics on the board, and people think AS would hinder your ability to fight. I just don’t see it though, how could it possibly hinder your ability to anything physical?

Simple athletic ability can win fights. GSP would not be the fighter he was if he was not so athletic. Rampage is extremely strong and athletic also, he has almost no BJJ training at all, yet he is almost never subbed. He is strong and athletic enough to rely on that for his sub defense.

Adding muscle and strength IMO just can’t hurt you in MMA. You don’t have to become less flexible, or slower simply because you are stronger, because your skeletal muscles have grown in strength as well as your bones. You will be more confident, you will feel better, you will have more energy.

Unless you are taking 100mgs of tren EOD then I don’t think it’s going to result in too much of a loss of cardio. Fighting is exhausting, but you are training for 3, 5 minute rounds. You are not doing an Iron Man.

I think people assume they will hinder you because “certain” fighters try to carry the appearance of a body builder and they suck. If Michael Jordan was bigger, faster and stronger, would have have been any worse? IN a game like basket ball he was graceful, and skilled. But imagine if he was the size of Lebron.

I think it would come down to the training. Most fighters train by sparing and what strength training they do, is mixed in with cardio/circuit training. Most movements are not to isolate muscle, but to improve explosive power, similar to a foot ball player. They don’t even have to weight train to feel the strength difference. How could any fighter be worse with a 20% strength increase, a mental edge, boost in confidence and with more aggressive workouts?

**oc pitbull** · 12-20-2008, 11:49 AM

hmmmm sounds like you have never boxed or done standup before. Try boxing three 5 min rounds with a buddy on anavar . Your ****ign arms will explode.

**rockinred** · 12-20-2008, 12:58 PM

Not sure where you are implying that everyone said AS are bad for fighters?? It is too difficult to either agree or disagree with your post. Part of it is right and part is wrong...

AS can be used for an advantage in many ways and also disadvantage to a person depending on their goals.... It is a pretty well known fact that many athletes that compete in fighting take or have used steroids .... I think Holyfield is a prime example of the pros and cons... I have seen him jacked up pretty good and it pushed him pretty far in the HW division. You can also see where it affected his gas tank too.

Anyhow, where you can be wrong is assuming that with the increase in size you won't slow down... if you put on enough size you will slow down, but your stregnth comes up though... so this can be both an advantage for some and others a huge disadvantage.....

Of course there are many other pros and cons to using... what i will say is to anyone who is not a scrapper or trained fighter thinking about taking steroids to get tougher? welll.............

**J-Dogg** · 12-20-2008, 01:23 PM

Well obviously it’s harder to fuel more muscle, but steroids don’t have to equal 20lbs of muscle gain in a cycle either. That’s a farfetched idea IMO for most people, depending on your genetics.

Holyfield for example, he would not even be a HW without them probably.

My last cycle was tren and winny, and I felt no difference in my cardio. I still ran 9 miles 3 times a week. I only put on 10lbs and I was eating a lot. I my strength on the other hand went through the roof.

If you have a fighter that cuts to 205, and he can use AS and stay at 205, I don’t feel he’ll be hurt by the effects. I honestly feel in my personal experience, that AS has almost no affect on my cardio level, I just keep at it. If you eat for size, and are putting down 7,000 calories a day, you are going to gain a lot of muscle. If you train and just get proper nutrient to maintain your size, you will just get stronger.

IMO if you train like a fighter, eat like a fighter and use AS, when it comes time for the match, you’ll be in a better position to win, you will be a better fighter.

If Michael Jordan took AS, and trained like a body builder, trained like a power lifter, would it hurt his cardio? Lower his vertical leap? Would it affect his game in a negative way? Hell yes it would.
If he trained like a basketball player, kept his cardio on par, he would post up better, be stronger, he would increase his vertical leap, on top of that he would also gain the mental advantage of using test.

I mean, guys are failing drug test in MMA for a reason. They are testing guys for a reason. How could it possibly hurt your physical ability to fight? And why would they take them if it did?

Baroni is a awful example, and that’s the most common thought. The guy is not a good fighter, fact of the matter is without AS in his life, we would not even know him and he would be an even worse fighter.

**oc pitbull** · 12-20-2008, 01:29 PM

hahaha baroni

**yannick35** · 12-20-2008, 03:38 PM

I used masteron at one point this steroid is just sick and gets you hard has a rock, has soon has you do some jabs or throw some punches your muscle contract behond crazy.

Testosteron makes your heart pump even faster and i felt winded out real fast when using it.

For the rest i cant really tell because i did not try it

**oc pitbull** · 12-20-2008, 04:01 PM

did you run anything else while you were takign that mast? what were your results like?

**J-Dogg** · 12-20-2008, 04:10 PM

Testoterone also helps increase red blood cells. Like I said higher, I've not had anything really hurt my cardio levels too much.

I'll get more of a pump with some AS, but with EQ or Winstrol I don't think it would be to the point that I sacrifice flexability because of the amount of a pump in a muscle.

It would probably depend a lot on your style of fighting too.

**QuieTSToRM33** · 12-20-2008, 04:20 PM

HGH gentlemen ... HGH.

**godkilla** · 12-20-2008, 04:43 PM

my cardio goes south while i am on for some reason. especially while using tren , deca or dbol . going to kickboxing or boxing class during a bulker doesnt sound like fun to me, maybe low dose test or like Quiet said HGH.

**oc pitbull** · 12-20-2008, 04:54 PM

hgh is a beautiful thing

**stuuyh** · 12-21-2008, 01:38 PM

IO used to kickbox for nearkly 5 years,then i decided to use some AS i didnt do nearly any cardio on that time jus big heavy weights..i put on 6st in weight....Now when i decided to get back into boxing and start doing MMA i can tell you it absolutley killed me..i couldnt box more than 2 rounds without my hands just dropping from unbelievable muscle ache in my delts....my calf muscles would cramp up from constantly on my toes and shins felt like i had major shin splints......since then i continiued AS and also my MMA...things have got a lot better with my cardio but im no were near as flexible as i was....mu deltss till hurt liek hell but im becoming more tolerable to that but i still have problems with my shins when im on my toes (star jumps/burpees etc)the upside is im a lot more stronger and powerful in my game.....still there is pro`s and cons to AS with MMA......i personally now feel pretty good with myself and the way i have adapted to my situation but i can tell you it was not easy at all!My oppinion would be to anyone that is seriously into MMA not use AS but that is just my oppinion...

**oc pitbull** · 12-21-2008, 01:42 PM

ya i noticed the same things when boxing, but when i was submission/grappling i am a ****en beast when i am on anything.

**BTM0085** · 12-21-2008, 03:21 PM

certainly a bulker isnt going to help your hand speed,flexibility,side to side movements etc . i wouldnt know about a cutting cycle. I havent lifted in 2 months got off cycle 4 months ago @ 220 and i felt like a stiff now 208. Ive been just hitting the heavy bag 20 mins a day and i hit a lot harder now than at 220 end of last cycle, then again if i didnt take that cycle i might not be hitting as hard. my bench has probably went down a good 20-30 lbs though but if a mugger attacks your bench isnt going to help. punching power=more important than silly stats. i wonder how much lennox, holyfield, tyson could put up though. id guess about 300 for holy, 400+ tyson (stocky,short arms). lennox mabye 350?

**xlxBigSexyxlx** · 12-21-2008, 05:56 PM

cheque drops

**oc pitbull** · 12-21-2008, 06:03 PM

ew la la

***RAGE*** · 12-22-2008, 05:02 PM

i noticed the same thing but you need more water when you are on the gear....its all in how you use it and you need to train on your speed while you are on the gear....

**Brown Ninja** · 12-22-2008, 10:26 PM

Baroni, Sherk, Sylvia, Franca, Belfort were all busted for juice and it's hard to make a case for any of them being that much better for taking them outside of maybe Sylvia. Belfort was obviously on them back in the day but after Randy beat him he has never been the same. I'm not saying the elite level fighters aren't on them but until one gets busted it's hard to say that the guys taking them have that much of an advantage. The. Again maybe we never would have heard of the a I've mentioned fighters without them juicing

**Hiphopharry** · 12-28-2008, 11:08 PM

winny will kill your joints and injure you!
stick with test, or maybe var!!

**MuscleScience** · 12-28-2008, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by Brown Ninja

Baroni, Sherk, Sylvia, Franca, Belfort were all busted for juice and it's hard to make a case for any of them being that much better for taking them outside of maybe Sylvia. Belfort was obviously on them back in the day but after Randy beat him he has never been the same. I'm not saying the elite level fighters aren't on them but until one gets busted it's hard to say that the guys taking them have that much of an advantage. The. Again maybe we never would have heard of the a I've mentioned fighters without them juicing

The top level guys can afford better things. A good exercise physiologist should never let one of his athletes test positive. Look at cycling them guys have round the clock monitoring when their in competition. Nearly everyone at the top levels are on something, very few get caught. If you have money, you can very easily beat current testing.

**Brown Ninja** · 12-29-2008, 12:55 AM

^^^^I agree that most probably are but until they test positive I am not big fan of accusing them. Some of those guys are just genetic freaks

**Brown Ninja** · 12-29-2008, 12:57 AM

on a related note I aM fairly certain we can agree that Brock was on the gas back in his WWE days but do any of you have a prblem with that? Do you see him reAping any benefits from cycles in the past?

**graeme87** · 12-29-2008, 06:36 AM

Evader Holyfied was cough with gear (deca amongst others he claimed he was using it to heal a shoulder injury)

This was late on in his career but look at when he moved from cruiser weight to heavy weight, he was a little 205lbs heavy weight then the next minute he’s 217lbs.

It’s damn good for anyone to gain 12lbs of lean muscle especially a boxer doing all that cardio.

**MMArmour** · 12-29-2008, 04:46 PM

explosive power and endurance can be trained while lifting, not just hitting mits/pads, working the bag or any other speed drills you might be working in the gym. I did a cycle of test and dbol and put on 20 lbs in 8 weeks. took from 190 to 213. I will say without a doubt my cardio was effected but my punches were by far more explosive and snappy. and some of the water retention was great for the joints, esp. on heavy jits days. had WAY more power on the ground, better takedown def, and thats not all. But to be honest id still rather fight at 185 then to try and fight at 205. Im not nearly tall enough to mess with it. Better for me personally to hang out around 200 and cut to 185.

**amcon** · 12-29-2008, 04:53 PM

i understand your post however...
mike tyson - strong and very fast, athletic? prob not

Uriah Faber - big for his weight class, very musclar, prob one of the fastest right hands in mma, strong and athletic

strenght doesnt mean slow or non flexable... but if you try to body build(look good) and be a fighter then your goals are off

look at chuck liddel - the guy looks like crap! yet he has had a very good run, until fighters found out he has a weak chin when hit with a haymaker(whouldnt we all if we were hit like he was... suger & rampage dropped him)

**Brown Ninja** · 12-29-2008, 09:47 PM

Chuck never had issues with that chin when he was younger. I think in Chucks case its a matter of age catching up. yes he does look like crap though

**amcon** · 12-29-2008, 10:25 PM

ya shame i love the guys attitude and fight style - age seems to be holding him back a little... but once the compitition knows you achilies heal ... thats y every fighter will swing for the hills on him over and over lookin to just connect one time... shame cause mma across the board needs some studs to hold tight to their belts and not loose to secure the sport with sponsership money ... uriah had tons of endorcement money pre knockout then after not one commercial on him... that says to endorceres' it is to volitile(sp) to chance... shame - any ways chucky should do a few anabol cycles bulk up and join k1

**Brown Ninja** · 12-30-2008, 12:46 AM

Chuckles needs to go on a cutting cycle. Faber will be back. He just got sloppy and over committed with that elbow. Brown and Garcia are both impressive but I think Faber gets the best of both them....assuming he beats Pulver again

**amcon** · 12-30-2008, 12:55 AM

i agree i would like to see both get back and pove them selves again chuck who knows if he can or even if they will give him a shot... faber seem like it a def he will be back and with a vengance

**Brown Ninja** · 12-30-2008, 02:06 AM

Faber has not even hit his prime yet where as Chuck is on the back side of his. I would love to see him do well but I am not sure he can hang with the big boys anymore

**amcon** · 12-30-2008, 02:17 AM

agreed

**Ajinra** · 01-28-2009, 03:14 PM

my 2 cents... aas will help immensely with grappling. groundwork has so much to do with strength, and having more of it always helps. take a look at sean sherk and matt hughes. yes, they are superb wrestlers, but they overwhelm opponents and keep them on the mat through strength. besides, we know at least sherk has turned to the juice.

but i doubt aas will help with the striking aspect of the game. well, maybe just a bit. i agree it will help mentally, but strength is not as great a factor on the feet. technique develops much more power than muscle ever will.

as far as using steroids for healing... everyone can benefit from that.

**Brown Ninja** · 01-29-2009, 12:58 AM

Brock Lesnar seems to think they play a vital role....

**Brown Ninja** · 01-29-2009, 12:59 AM

I think we all know a couple of Chute Boxe fighters that will vouch for the efficiency of AAS

**Geordi LaForge** · 02-04-2009, 01:09 PM

Deca helped my endurance immensely for both standup and ground. Not my cardio so much as my anaerobic endurance. The deca made it possible to do constant power moves that normally I could only pull off once in a match.

On a lighter note, I've never had a 300 lbs~ sparring partner say it felt like he was being raped by a gorilla when I was off-cycle...just sayin.

I'm thinking of adding EQ next time...good idea?