Do you think bodybuilding will help or hurt MMA training?

**PistolPete33** · 12-09-2009, 09:50 AM

You would think the obvious answer would be of course it would. Let me start with this. I use to train in Martial Arts for many years and then trained in MMA. When my son was born I had to stop MMA training and then switched to bodybuilding. I've been hitting the gym hard and putting on weight and muscle. Now that I have more time I started my MMA training back up. It's only been a few days since being back and now that I'm 30+ lbs. heavier and twice as strong I've noticed a lot of things.

First of all I don't have any where near the flexibility that I had when I was thinner. I started stretching again but because some of my muscles are fairly large they can get in the way such as my back. This is also a benefit as it makes it harder for others to get their legs around you when you're in their guard. Now, having all this extra strength is awesome. Being able to easily outpower everyone else is awesome.

The MAJOR DRAWBACK though is that I get winded like never before. I'm sure this has a lot to do with the fact that I was on a bulking diet and didn't do any cardio for the past 4 months. However, I also think that because I have a lot more muscle I need a lot more oxygen and bloodflow so this is causing me to tire.

Just wanted to see what your thoughts were on this topic. I'm not going to stop bodybuilding either way but was just curious to see what everyone thinks of this.

**hugovsilva** · 12-09-2009, 10:12 AM

Weightlifting will help for sure. Bodybuilding not really, on the contrary. A fighter want a strong, fast, flexible muscle mass, not an hypertrofied one.

**elpropiotorvic** · 12-09-2009, 10:13 AM

you can do it in the "off season" of fighting in my op ...But U cant train for a fight in the gym doing bb training type (just my opinion).

**energizer bunny** · 12-09-2009, 10:37 AM

You can definately utilise weights for mma..but it cant be the bulk of your training..if you want to fight then you need to train mma........if you want to be a bodybuilder you have to train like a bodybuilder.

**KimboHalfSlice** · 12-09-2009, 11:52 AM

I was a Thai boxer in the past, plan on getting back into it soon after a put on some beef.

I've actually gained flexibility because I made sure to stretch after every workout, my legs in particular.

**gunslinger2** · 12-09-2009, 12:12 PM

The weights will help if done correctly. I'm the assistant grappling instructor at my MMA school and I get asked this question all the time. You did not list your hight/weight and thats a big factor. Your loss of flexibility comes from not stretching regularly not from the added muscle most likely unless you look like Ronnie Colman. As for cardio, well its a trade off to be honest. The more muscle mass you have the stronger you will be but the faster you will get winded. That does not mean that you can't have a nice balance of both.

If you want to really go after MMA you will have to start training with the weights a bit differently. Using a lighter weight, higher reps in the 12-15 range and shorter rest breaks.

**PistolPete33** · 12-09-2009, 12:52 PM

Originally Posted by gunslinger2

The weights will help if done correctly. I'm the assistant grappling instructor at my MMA school and I get asked this question all the time. You did not list your hight/weight and thats a big factor. Your loss of flexibility comes from not stretching regularly not from the added muscle most likely unless you look like Ronnie Colman. As for cardio, well its a trade off to be honest. The more muscle mass you have the stronger you will be but the faster you will get winded. That does not mean that you can't have a nice balance of both.

If you want to really go after MMA you will have to start training with the weights a bit differently. Using a lighter weight, higher reps in the 12-15 range and shorter rest breaks.

I'm currently 5'8" tall and weigh 201lbs and about 12% bodyfat. I'm not trying to make MMA a career or anything I just want to train and maybe some day do an amateur fight or 2 but nothing crazy. With my current schedule I can only train in MMA 3 days a week anyways. I'm trying to balance my MMA/Gym schedule as I will most likely have to do 2 workouts on some days.

I want to try to maintain the weight I'm at right now for a while and see if I can just work on my endurance to get it back to where it was. Then I can decide if I need to cut down some weight and muscle or change things a bit more. I def. can hit much harder now and when rolling I have way more strength so it's def. an advantage.

**gunslinger2** · 12-09-2009, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by PistolPete33

I'm currently 5'8" tall and weigh 201lbs and about 12% bodyfat. I'm not trying to make MMA a career or anything I just want to train and maybe some day do an amateur fight or 2 but nothing crazy. With my current schedule I can only train in MMA 3 days a week anyways. I'm trying to balance my MMA/Gym schedule as I will most likely have to do 2 workouts on some days.

I want to try to maintain the weight I'm at right now for a while and see if I can just work on my endurance to get it back to where it was. Then I can decide if I need to cut down some weight and muscle or change things a bit more. I def. can hit much harder now and when rolling I have way more strength so it's def. an advantage.

Your stats are almost the same as mine. I'm 5'9'' 201 with 12% BF. I think your best fighting weight will be 185 class. That means you will need to walk around at 195-200. You could make that easy. I also train MMA only three times per week, the trick is to make every session count. That don't mean push 100% all the time. That will just get you hurt. What I mean by making it count is really focusing on aspects of your game that need work during the time you have. If you have good stand up and a weak ground game, you will need to focus hard on takedown defense, getting back to standing and ground defense. You will have to work extra hard on the cardio, I know I do. You will also need to find your control/rest points. This is a point during the fight were you can take a bit of a break while your opponent expends his energy. An example would be side control.

**PistolPete33** · 12-09-2009, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by gunslinger2

Your stats are almost the same as mine. I'm 5'9'' 201 with 12% BF. I think your best fighting weight will be 185 class. That means you will need to walk around at 195-200. You could make that easy. I also train MMA only three times per week, the trick is to make every session count. That don't mean push 100% all the time. That will just get you hurt. What I mean by making it count is really focusing on aspects of your game that need work during the time you have. If you have good stand up and a weak ground game, you will need to focus hard on takedown defense, getting back to standing and ground defense. You will have to work extra hard on the cardio, I know I do. You will also need to find your control/rest points. This is a point during the fight were you can take a bit of a break while your opponent expends his energy. An example would be side control.

this is extremely helpful I appreciate the input. Because I can go to the gym at any time it's much easier for me to get there. I can easily get there 5-6 days a week. However, since the MMA classes are at night I don't have the same options. I have a 1 1/2 year old son so it makes it more difficult. I need to find time to spend with him and also fit my hobbies in. Since he goes to bed at 7:30 and class is at 7:00-9:00 I can sneak out a few nights a week just before he goes to bed.

**PistolPete33** · 12-09-2009, 06:57 PM

One other thing that I didn't mention is the fact that I'm in my 2nd week of PCT. I'm sure this has a lot to do with things as well for obvious reasons.

**gunslinger2** · 12-09-2009, 09:41 PM

Originally Posted by PistolPete33

One other thing that I didn't mention is the fact that I'm in my 2nd week of PCT. I'm sure this has a lot to do with things as well for obvious reasons.

Starting my PCT in 12 days.

**shaihulud7** · 08-04-2010, 10:53 PM

Well you are out powering people because u gained muscle and weight. So if u have 20 pounds on your old training partner that use to weight the same as u do then yes it will be easier. I think that if you wear fighting your older self without the weight just the relative strength you would lose. Just speculation though.

**burn219** · 08-05-2010, 03:24 PM

flexability can be trained in, there are massive bodybuilders who do the splits on stage.

**xxxl83** · 08-05-2010, 07:06 PM

Nope, stick to explosive movements not slow controlled bb movements, and you'll be fine. Remember train slow, become slow.

xxxl83

**goodlifting** · 08-05-2010, 08:39 PM

when it comes to training with weights, IMHO olympic style weightlifting would be most beneficial to mma fighter. It is violently explosive and requires great flexibility. if you're coached properly you will become exceptionally strong as well. As an mma fighter those are very important attributes.

my wrestlers do oly lifting along with their proper conditioning. i notice wrestlers who do this style of lifting can drop into double or single leg take downs much more quickly than ones who don't. they are also much more explosive with their takedowns.

however, i do not recommend doing CROSSFIT

. It takes away from the quality of the lifts. i have the wrestlers do oly lifting separately from conditioning.

i love training wrestlers and fighters so if i can help you on here a bit more let me know.

**deadkey** · 08-06-2010, 10:04 AM

i think you can find a happy medium between all out muscle n still being small enough so that your cardio vascular system can keep up. i know what you mean by having the ability to outpower anyone, its a good feeling XD but if you can condition your body with alittle more cardio and enough mma practices i think youll find a good medium.

**AlphaGenetics** · 08-07-2010, 10:42 AM

The biggest draw back for me is hand speed.

**MACHINE5150** · 08-07-2010, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by AlphaGenetics

The biggest draw back for me is hand speed.

who needs hand speed when you can punch through brick walls.. haha.. No seriously though.. it all depends on what type of fighter you are and what weight class you are gonna fight in..

**RonCarlston** · 08-16-2010, 07:00 PM

You need to know your own body very well. striking and grappling will take a huge told on your joints... you start adding in extra body building stuff and you are asking for some kind of chronic injury.

BUT, if you slowly build up your routine and give your body time to adjust i suppose it wouldn't be that big of a deal.

all depends on your goals

**glacierflow** · 08-16-2010, 09:51 PM

I think you need to consider what weight class are you in. If you are fighting 265, make it all muscle, power wins in the heavyweights. Most dont have the cardio to go 3X5min much less a full title fight. For the smaller guys mass will hurt your speed and cardio and speed kills in the lower weight classes. Ask BJ Penn. If you look at most of the UFC champs they tend to be long and lean, muscular but not thick. Speed, functional strength, and crazy cardio thats the ticket. I have none of these.

**1nd** · 08-30-2010, 08:24 AM

Lifting weights will help, but you don't want to look like a bodybuilder.

A trained 160lb fighter will beat a 200lb bodybuilder 9 out of 10 times. You have to know HOW to fight in order to be good at it. Strength will only give you an advantage.

**walkerls1** · 09-08-2010, 09:53 AM

gunslinger2 hit the head on the nail with the info he gave you. I've been a marital artist for over 17yrs, got BB in Karate at 14 and my 2nd Dan in TKD at 17. Been training in MMA for over 10 yrs. If you're wanting to to both bodybuilding and MMA you have to adjust your workouts for both as well. With your size you're gonna get winded fast. Just look a Bob Sapp, Mariusz Pudzianowski, and Bobby Lashley. All huge strong guys but gas in the 1st round. If you're doing the MMA training for fun, then don't adjust your workouts, but if you're gonna do a couple of fights do yourself a favor and train the right way for them. That way win lose or draw you have no excuses. Wish you the best of luck

**bigz1017** · 09-08-2010, 04:50 PM

in my opinion you should do like 6 months of power lifting and focusing on your strength, and then 6 months of mma and a maintainance workout, or maybe a different amount of months for each, depends on what you want to do

**ScotchGuard02** · 09-25-2010, 02:28 PM

I've been training MMA athletes for about 10 years. I train a guy that's an UNBELIEVABLE in bjj. I find that muscles trained to be efficient in bjj is not the same as the muscles required for speed/power work. In stand up speed/power is critical. I combine plyometric (HITT) type training and weight lifting in the workout to condition both the quick twitch and slow twitch muscles. The the original question about BB good for MMA? My answer would be "it depends" on the training. Weight lifting is definitely good for MMA. The BB physique is not the ideal body in MMA.

**mmakid** · 12-27-2010, 10:07 PM

use weights to get yourself strong but try to keep your muscle mass done and focus more on explosive endurance versus impressing the girls at the gym with your biceps..

**JDub1980** · 01-04-2011, 05:01 PM

Pistol , lifting heavy and hard is great for MMA .. I do it .. Start stretching 3 times a day for 20 minutes each session.. Being bigger it just takes a little bit longer periods of constant stretching ( Be Patient just step that part up ) .

Losing wind - of course when you just focus on lifting you are gonna lose wind especially when you gain more mass. You already know what you have to do here , Cardio in the morning , step it up . Start doing wind sprints and indian runs ( interval runs ) I do telephone poles , every pole I sprint all out until the next one then I go back to my original pace ( needs to be a good pace not jogging ). Do a 1/2 mile the first week then 1 mile the next .. do this for 3 weeks and you will get it fast . Try taking Arginine or an NO product to help with blood flow ... Helped me anyway .. Good Luck

**Bigjerdog** · 01-24-2011, 01:33 AM

2 words for you... Phil Baroni... Common for yoked up guys to not have a lot of gas. He runs out in every fight. Not all big guys but alot of them do. Takes more oxygen to pump blood into all the muscles

**Far from massive** · 01-26-2011, 04:16 PM

Body building hell no, wieght training on the other hand can be adapted to help results in almost every sport. Its just a matter of adaptation of the routines to suit the sport being trained for.

**Dog-Slime** · 01-26-2011, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by Bigjerdog

2 words for you... Phil Baroni... Common for yoked up guys to not have a lot of gas. He runs out in every fight. Not all big guys but alot of them do. Takes more oxygen to pump blood into all the muscles

Well I also heard from him himself that he cuts around 20lbs in 24hrs or less for the weigh ins. That takes gas out the tank, I dont care if you getta IV for rehydration.

But to the OP -

Seen a lot of good advice and a couple conflicting advices but I dont think many/any have been wrong. EVERYBODY is different applies here just like it applies everywhere on this forum. Some say go heavy, some say go explosive, some say go high reps. I say all three of these are right and you should try all 3 different ways and see which one you feel the best with and which one is best for the way YOU fight. Personally I still lift pretty much the same way I always did (6-8 reps x3 to failure on the 3rd only 2 main exercises per bodypart) and I am functionally the strongest guy of the regulars we have even tho half the guys are in weight classes above me. By functionally the strongest I mean I can overpower them when grappling/wrestling but might not be able to outlift them in weight. The only change from my lifting is I used to lift 4x per week (back/bi, chest/tri, shoulder/trap, legs) and now I do the same routine but workout 2x per week meaning I only hit each body part 1x every 2 weeks. This allows me to still go heavy without my forearms having tendon pain from all the bjj/striking I do at mma class (I too only go 2-3x per week). Oh and I also now do 30-90minutes of core and cardio after each workout. I do find I gas a little quicker then some the smaller guys in same weight class (my trainer says I muscle through everything straining myself even when using the proper technique) but even when Im tired as **** I can still outpower them lol! I like the idea of the olympic style lifting and I like the high rep idea too but as you just heard I currently dont do either and am doing great so its all individual man.

**TopGunn** · 05-21-2011, 02:58 PM

Fighting never has an offseason for one thing, bodybuilding will cause loss of endurance, speed, and flexibility. If you are trying to get back in dedicate your time to cardio, if youve done this before you should know this.