***Dieting 101: Carb Cycling***

[gbrice75]

Does drinking the whites give you the trots? I did it for the first time in a while yesterday and basically had a completely liquid BM like an hour later.

I haven't experienced any negative effects from liquid egg whites... a lot of people report HORRIBLE farting, but I haven't had that issue (thank God).

[mark woods]

good read!

[gbrice75]

good read!

Thanks!

[Rida5d]

How the hell did I miss your thread?
I've Ben reading UD2 last few days and your approach seems more applicable/friendly as u describe it, that's for sure..
This thread will be my bible for the next couple of months..
I've lost few weeks on a keto which yield some shitty results.
Thnx a lot for posting.

[sh0plifter]

Great info, thanks, OP.

[gbrice75]

How the hell did I miss your thread?
I've Ben reading UD2 last few days and your approach seems more applicable/friendly as u describe it, that's for sure..
This thread will be my bible for the next couple of months..
I've lost few weeks on a keto which yield some shitty results.
Thnx a lot for posting.

Thanks! How's it going - any update?

Great info, thanks, OP.

Thx!

[athletic.guy]

So you don't use any Vitargo or waxy maize Intra workout or PWO at all during this diet?

[Granovich]

what do you think of doing cardio on the morning of the first low carb day ( or all low carb days) for an hour on empty stomach to deplete your glycogen and start burning fat faster ? or wont be significant and would be same as if you do it post workout ?? ( purpose is cutting)
what about cardio on moderate days ?

[RewardingLabor]

I keep reading the conversation between you and sub zero and I still don't know what the conclusion is.
Should I be upping my fats as I drop my carbs or am i just dropping carbs if my goal is lean body mass first and bf loss/ maintenance second?

Also, how does carb cycling factor in to testosterone cycling?
If I'm bulking and injecting test every 3.5 days would it make sense to time the high carb days with the test or the low carb days with the test?

[uhit]

I keep reading the conversation between you and sub zero and I still don't know what the conclusion is.
Should I be upping my fats as I drop my carbs or am i just dropping carbs if my goal is lean body mass first and bf loss/ maintenance second?

Also, how does carb cycling factor in to testosterone cycling?
If I'm bulking and injecting test every 3.5 days would it make sense to time the high carb days with the test or the low carb days with the test?

Fats will be static, the only dynamic portion of your macronutrients will be carbs which will fluctuate from high to low throughout the week

[gbrice75]

So you don't use any Vitargo or waxy maize Intra workout or PWO at all during this diet?

Me personally? No ... I don't see the need to buy a PWO 'fast acting' carb source when I can eat food.

what do you think of doing cardio on the morning of the first low carb day ( or all low carb days) for an hour on empty stomach to deplete your glycogen and start burning fat faster ? or wont be significant and would be same as if you do it post workout ?? ( purpose is cutting)
what about cardio on moderate days ?

The age-old cardio debate ... it's enough to drive anybody crazy. You have people telling you it doesn't matter when you do cardio, and in what state (i.e. fed vs. fasted), etc. and on the opposite end of the spectrum, those who swear by it.

I'll say this - most competitive bodybuilders I know do am fasted cardio during contest prep, so take that for what it's worth.

Personally, my approach has always been low-moderate intensity steady-state cardio in the morning, and higher intensity (HIIT or the like) PWO in the fed state. It's a well-rounded plan of attack. The main point is that you DO cardio and are consistent with it, if that's your thing.

I keep reading the conversation between you and sub zero and I still don't know what the conclusion is.
Should I be upping my fats as I drop my carbs or am i just dropping carbs if my goal is lean body mass first and bf loss/ maintenance second?

Also, how does carb cycling factor in to testosterone cycling?
If I'm bulking and injecting test every 3.5 days would it make sense to time the high carb days with the test or the low carb days with the test?

Not sure which conversation you're referring to ... it's been a while, sorry. On the particular example outlined in this thread, the only variance is with carbs; fats/proteins stay consistent.

If I were bulking and running a cycle, I probably wouldn't cycle my carbs at all. Just my personal opinion.

Fats will be static, the only dynamic portion of your macronutrients will be carbs which will fluctuate from high to low throughout the week

^^ this.

[CanadaStrong88]

Great read. Just a question... Isn't a tdee of a 5'11 male 200lb 12percent bf higher than 2600? I punched it into a few different calculators and got about 3100. I'm 5'11 early 20s about 200lb but probably 15 to 16bf. Current macros are 59f 230p and about 300c(cutting on 2600cal). How should I adjust for carb cycling? Would really appreciate a reply thanks.

[gbrice75]

Great read. Just a question... Isn't a tdee of a 5'11 male 200lb 12percent bf higher than 2600?

Not necessarily. TDEE will differ for everyone. It's just that - Total Daily Energy Expenditure. A 200lb 5'11 12% BF male who has a desk job will have a MUCH lower TDEE than say somebody who works construction ... all else being equal.

I punched it into a few different calculators and got about 3100. I'm 5'11 early 20s about 200lb but probably 15 to 16bf. Current macros are 59f 230p and about 300c(cutting on 2600cal). How should I adjust for carb cycling? Would really appreciate a reply thanks.

I've never been a big fan of the TDEE formulas, especially the online calculators. They always seem to calculate too far on the high end. Also, I find that beginners/novices in general think they need way more calories than they actually need. This is especially important for cutting, since the threshold between losing, maintaining, and God forbid gaining weight is usually a few hundred calories or so.

At the end of the day, all you can really do is stick with what you're doing, be 100% consistent (this is KEY, I can't stress it enough), and watch how your body responds over the course of a few weeks. Then you adjust accordingly, if needed. If you're not consistent, you'll never really know what's going on with your body, because you will have 'tarnished' the 'formula'.

[Panzerfaust]

I have really enjoyed reading this thread, excellent work gb

[gbrice75]

I have really enjoyed reading this thread, excellent work gb

Thanks Panzer! Good to see you still around!

[CanadaStrong88]

Alright guys so my carb cycle is Sunday high Monday Tues wed medium and Thurs Fri sat none. Today's sat and my buddies brought me my favourite dinner fajitas to my place. I estimate 150 to 200g carbs. What do you guys recommend doing tomorrow, Sunday to make up for it? Please reply ASAP.

[gbrice75]

Alright guys so my carb cycle is Sunday high Monday Tues wed medium and Thurs Fri sat none. Today's sat and my buddies brought me my favourite dinner fajitas to my place. I estimate 150 to 200g carbs. What do you guys recommend doing tomorrow, Sunday to make up for it? Please reply ASAP.

It's a little late now ... but this is one of those times where you have to decide how important your goal is, and what that goal is. Are you wanting to compete? You'd better get used to denying yourself during contest prep ... because the other guy that just placed ahead of you said no to the fajitas.

I'm being extreme to make a point. If you're doing this casually, then I wouldn't really worry, although I also wouldn't make a habit of 'cheating', or you'll just be spinning your wheels. I'm assuing you've already eaten them, so just drop your estimated carbs from Sunday and be done with it. Or, eat your usual Sunday and get in an extra cardio session or two.

[CanadaStrong88]

It's a little late now ... but this is one of those times where you have to decide how important your goal is, and what that goal is. Are you wanting to compete? You'd better get used to denying yourself during contest prep ... because the other guy that just placed ahead of you said no to the fajitas.

I'm being extreme to make a point. If you're doing this casually, then I wouldn't really worry, although I also wouldn't make a habit of 'cheating', or you'll just be spinning your wheels. I'm assuing you've already eaten them, so just drop your estimated carbs from Sunday and be done with it. Or, eat your usual Sunday and get in an extra cardio session or two.

Cool. Yes just doing it casual for the next couple of years at least. I just dropped my Sunday carbs and will be throwing in an extra cardio this week. Thanks for the reply though

[nes]

Readjusted my first diet I tried to make by my own, Thanks for this article it was helpfull !!
Tired of paying 60$ every month so the coach readjusts it !

[LEO78]

Thanks for the article. Hope I will get rid of some fat.

[ZeroSumGainz]

Excellent guide, it's something that would be very easy to stick to. I've read UD2 and Lyle spends a lot of time on the idea of perfecting glycogen depletion with the end goal of achieving supercompensation on the carb reload. Is there any value to this or simply not worth the effort?

[N00bie329]

Hey, can you help me on what my macros should be M-W and Sunday's? I'm at 175, about 18-20% BF. I was thinking:

M-W - Protein 225, Fats 55, Carbs 150
Sunday - Carbs 300

What are your thoughts? Thanks

[N00bie329]

Also, Corn Pops cereal is high in carbs and no fat. 3 cups of that with 3 cups of 1% fat milk gives me 114g of carbs alone. Is this a bad source of carbs? I just want to be able to satisfy my sweet tooth and help keep me sane. What are your thoughts

[CanadaStrong88]

Also, Corn Pops cereal is high in carbs and no fat. 3 cups of that with 3 cups of 1% fat milk gives me 114g of carbs alone. Is this a bad source of carbs? I just want to be able to satisfy my sweet tooth and help keep me sane. What are your thoughts

I actually like corn pops but only Sunday on my refeed. Would definitely not use during week as a primary carb source especially like 70 percent of carbs from corn pops

[gbrice75]

Thanks for the article. Hope I will get rid of some fat.

So, how's it going?

Excellent guide, it's something that would be very easy to stick to. I've read UD2 and Lyle spends a lot of time on the idea of perfecting glycogen depletion with the end goal of achieving supercompensation on the carb reload. Is there any value to this or simply not worth the effort?

I think there's definitely some merit, however I wouldn't bother with UD2 or the like unless you're really lean already and wanting to take it to the next level, planning to compete, etc. It's a very, VERY hard diet (I've run it) and not fun at all. So, whether it's worth the effort or not is something you'll have to gauge based on your goals, however it certainly 'works'.

[javajim]

Quantity Calories Total Calories Fat Protein Carbs
Eggs 3 17 51 0.3 10.8 0.6
Bee pollen 2 tbl 64 64 0.48 2.4 4.34
Tuna 8 oz 220 220 5.1 40.6 0
Broccoli 1 cup 20 20 0.2 2.1 3.7
Green Beans 1 cup 44 44 0.4 2.4 9.9
Turkey 8 oz 150 300 1.6 75 0
Beans 1/2 cup 100 100 0.5 6.5 17.5 xxxxxxxx
Oatmeal 2 cups 166 332 1.4 11.8 56.2 xxxxxxxx
Raisins 1/4 cup 108 108 0.1 1.1 26 xxxxxxxx
Almonds 20 164 164 14.4 6 5.6 xxxxxxxx
Wild rice or Quinoa av ca 1/2 cup 83 83 0.75 3.6 18.5 xxxxxxxx
Protein Shake 1 110 110 1 11 4
Olive Oil 2 tbl 240 240 28 0 0
Lentils 1/2 cup 130 130 0.04 8.5 20 xxxxxxxx
peanut butter 2 tbl 188 188 16 8 6.8 xxxxxxxx











Carbs total 2154 70.27 189.8 173.14 On low carb day 1633 cal



















Carbs Cycle by Day



Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday Saturday Sunday
Med Carb Medlum Carb Low Carb Low Carb Low Carb High Carb Meduim Carb

















On hight Carb day potatoes pasta bread rice beans fruit any good Carbs




Sorry I dont why it wont line up The x is what I dont have on low carb day I think I am ok on high carb day but not sure about the rest
56 years old,5-10,216 17-18 bf I think. Thanks for looking

[gbrice75]

Your


diet


Layout


Hurts


My



EYES.

Quantity Calories Total Calories Fat Protein Carbs
Eggs 3 17 51 0.3 10.8 0.6
Bee pollen 2 tbl 64 64 0.48 2.4 4.34
Tuna 8 oz 220 220 5.1 40.6 0
Broccoli 1 cup 20 20 0.2 2.1 3.7
Green Beans 1 cup 44 44 0.4 2.4 9.9
Turkey 8 oz 150 300 1.6 75 0
Beans 1/2 cup 100 100 0.5 6.5 17.5 xxxxxxxx
Oatmeal 2 cups 166 332 1.4 11.8 56.2 xxxxxxxx
Raisins 1/4 cup 108 108 0.1 1.1 26 xxxxxxxx
Almonds 20 164 164 14.4 6 5.6 xxxxxxxx
Wild rice or Quinoa av ca 1/2 cup 83 83 0.75 3.6 18.5 xxxxxxxx
Protein Shake 1 110 110 1 11 4
Olive Oil 2 tbl 240 240 28 0 0
Lentils 1/2 cup 130 130 0.04 8.5 20 xxxxxxxx
peanut butter 2 tbl 188 188 16 8 6.8 xxxxxxxx











Carbs total 2154 70.27 189.8 173.14 On low carb day 1633 cal



















Carbs Cycle by Day



Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday Saturday Sunday
Med Carb Medlum Carb Low Carb Low Carb Low Carb High Carb Meduim Carb

















On hight Carb day potatoes pasta bread rice beans fruit any good Carbs




Sorry I dont why it wont line up The x is what I dont have on low carb day I think I am ok on high carb day but not sure about the rest
56 years old,5-10,216 17-18 bf I think. Thanks for looking

[SpotMe87]

may give a try

[ocman]

If I were bulking and running a cycle, I probably wouldn't cycle my carbs at all. Just my personal opinion.

Can you elaborate on this?

thanks!

[Josh577]

I have a question that may be stupide but I'm 6'7" 315 pounds. I would like to get down to 280. I've been ready all the stickys abt cutting an diets I'm not on a cycle right now or plaining on it untill I can get down to that 280 mark. My question is can I do your carb cycling for cutting plain week end week out untill I hit my goal? If I want to be at 280 should I figure up my calories and protein and so on for a 280 pound man or a 315 pound man? I'm confused exactly how to get my tdee. If you can help me out I would be greatful and thank you for the knowledge I've already gained.

[Back In Black]

Bumping this. It's an awesome tool for fat loss

[ocman]

Ok, maybe you can help me understand.

I get the part where you keep your body guessing because of the different small amounts of carbs mostly...It takes a couple of weeks for your body to get use to the low carbs before it starts using the high fats for energy and that leaves you with low energy for the first couple of weeks?

What happens when you come off carb cycling?

[InternalFire]

you can suffer those few weeks slowly adopting to low carb or throw yourself in it full blast and be done switching over to FAT-BURNING ZONE in less than 5 days, usually 2-4 days and youre in KETOSIS. Thats when fun begins.

I'd say eat ~15% bellow your maintenance kcal, exercise intensivelly, include 30-60min cardio daily and make sure stay under 25g carbs, keep your protein high for this period, high meaning like ~1g per lb of your body weight to minimise muscle loss.

[Back In Black]

Ok, maybe you can help me understand.

I get the part where you keep your body guessing because of the different small amounts of carbs mostly...It takes a couple of weeks for your body to get use to the low carbs before it starts using the high fats for energy and that leaves you with low energy for the first couple of weeks?

What happens when you come off carb cycling?

You are talking about a ketogenic diet. Carb cycling is not a ketogenic diet, please read the first post of this thread.

[almostgone]

I have a question that may be stupide but I'm 6'7" 315 pounds. I would like to get down to 280. I've been ready all the stickys abt cutting an diets I'm not on a cycle right now or plaining on it untill I can get down to that 280 mark. My question is can I do your carb cycling for cutting plain week end week out untill I hit my goal? If I want to be at 280 should I figure up my calories and protein and so on for a 280 pound man or a 315 pound man? I'm confused exactly how to get my tdee. If you can help me out I would be greatful and thank you for the knowledge I've already gained.

Figure it up for the weight that you are targeting. If you continued to take in the amount of calories it takes to maintain your current weight, you wouldn't see any/very little loss unless you increased your energy needs through increased activity.
Also, if you see the weight moving too quickly, add some calories back in.

[ocman]

thanks for starting this thread!

I went back and re-read the first post.

I want to do a cut and these are my stats:

5'-9"
184
15.7% bf
2600 TDEE

I'm lifting on M-W-F (friday being leg day), cardio T-TH-Sat, let me know if I'm on track.

M-T-W - Moderate carbs

P-275
C-150
F-55

Th-F-Sat - Low carbs

P-275
C-0 (only from veggies)
F-55

Sun - high

P-275
C-400
F-55

peace!

[ocman]

Is that the right way to do carbs on a cut?

mod carbs - m-t-w
low carbs - th-fri-sat
high carbs - sun

[jGrande]

I swear it's tuff for me to think about cycling. A good diet is so hard to formulate and stick to then throw some daily changes in there and I'm confused Great post

[gbrice75]

Can you elaborate on this?

thanks!

Can't recall the PO or context in which I was replying to ... but hit me up if this is still up in the air, lol.

I have a question that may be stupide but I'm 6'7" 315 pounds. I would like to get down to 280. I've been ready all the stickys abt cutting an diets I'm not on a cycle right now or plaining on it untill I can get down to that 280 mark. My question is can I do your carb cycling for cutting plain week end week out untill I hit my goal? If I want to be at 280 should I figure up my calories and protein and so on for a 280 pound man or a 315 pound man? I'm confused exactly how to get my tdee. If you can help me out I would be greatful and thank you for the knowledge I've already gained.

Not to be overly general or simplistic, but there are many ways to achieve a fat loss goal. Carb cycling is nothing more than a tool that can be utilized with any intelligent, well thought out diet plan where dropping body fat is the goal. Conversely, it can be used to 'bulk' as well - therefore is not exclusive to cutting diets/dropping bodyfat.

All of this to say - you can use carb cycling for as long as you like, but when you hit a plateau (and you will), you'll know it's time to make a change.

Bumping this. It's an awesome tool for fat loss

Thanks brother - have always appreciated your support!

Ok, maybe you can help me understand.

I get the part where you keep your body guessing because of the different small amounts of carbs mostly...It takes a couple of weeks for your body to get use to the low carbs before it starts using the high fats for energy and that leaves you with low energy for the first couple of weeks?

What happens when you come off carb cycling?

Assuming overall caloric intake stays relatively close to what it was during your carb cycle (let's say within the range of a week) - nothing 'happens'. You may feel slightly different (tired or more energetic) depending on how you've statically adjusted your macros vs. cycling.

Is that the right way to do carbs on a cut?

mod carbs - m-t-w
low carbs - th-fri-sat
high carbs - sun

It's been years, but pretty sure that's how I did it. If I recall (I'm too lazy to check now), I posted my original plan, or something similar to it, in the OP. Check it out.

I swear it's tuff for me to think about cycling. A good diet is so hard to formulate and stick to then throw some daily changes in there and I'm confused Great post

Honestly, it's not that hard. People make it hard. People over complicate. Keyboard gurus, people wanting to sell you on the 'perfect' plan, etc. keeps our heads spinning. Not to trivialize, but it's pretty simple, really. cut = slight hypocaloric diet - caloric deficit created via limited food intake and/or increased physical output (cardio). add mass = slight hypercaloric diet - caloric surplus created by increased food intake (preferred) and/or less output (activity/cardio - not preferred IMO).

Smart food choices. 80/20 clean eating (clean being a relative term, I know). moderate-high protein with either goal, low-moderate fat with either goal, carbs being the biggest x-factor and adjuster for your given goal.

[Metalmank]

Started carb cycling this week. Been a interesting run so far.

MTuWed - Mod carb

Protein 220g, Carbs 150g, fat 60g

ThuFriSat - Low carb

Protein 200-220g, Fat 60g, Carbs 0g (I aim for less then 30g because obviously some food you get some 'small amount of carbs). Leafy green vegetables.

Sunday- Refeed/highcarb

220g pro, 60g fat (Its at 70g today), 300g Carbs

TDEE is like 2700ish.

High carb im only eating to my TDEE or very slighty over.

Lowcarb days are rough man lol