not to ruffle feathers but it seems most people on trt just want free steroids

[powerlifterty16]

I hope this thread can remain open for intelligent discussion, as i think it would be enjoyable to debate on this amturely of course. I see tons of people who have either
1-self induced hypogonadism by abusing steroids
2-claim they want to ''blast''
3-only care about building more muscle
4-want hgh
5-think that there is no such thing as too much testosterone and dont really how ahrmful too much is(neurotoxic)
6-talk about adding tren , deca , winny

the biggest thing that bothers me, is that people are doing blasts. Im not trying to ruffle feathers, but trt is supposed to be replacement therapy to live a healthy life, it isnt supposed to be free steroids. 100mg/wk as it is is more than most 20 yr olds produce..and 200 is much more..why blast?

This stuff makes it hard for guys like me, who havent even done steroids and are hypogonadal at a young age to get proper care. I dont even want to blast..i just want a t level of 800-900 with low normal estrogen, so ican improve my lifts(yes i care about muscle too), and feel better.

I still have to work on my cortisol though.

side question-do you think there is any merit t the ''test causes cancer'' claims

[BallSak]

I hope this thread can remain open for intelligent discussion, as i think it would be enjoyable to debate on this amturely of course. I see tons of people who have either
1-self induced hypogonadism by abusing steroids
2-claim they want to ''blast''
3-only care about building more muscle
4-want hgh
5-think that there is no such thing as too much testosterone and dont really how ahrmful too much is(neurotoxic)
6-talk about adding tren , deca , winny

the biggest thing that bothers me, is that people are doing blasts. Im not trying to ruffle feathers, but trt is supposed to be replacement therapy to live a healthy life, it isnt supposed to be free steroids. 100mg/wk as it is is more than most 20 yr olds produce..and 200 is much more..why blast?

This stuff makes it hard for guys like me, who havent even done steroids and are hypogonadal at a young age to get proper care. I dont even want to blast..i just want a t level of 800-900 with low normal estrogen, so ican improve my lifts(yes i care about muscle too), and feel better.

I still have to work on my cortisol though.

side question-do you think there is any merit t the ''test causes cancer'' claims

What is the intention behind this thread?

Making sweeping generalizations is never a good idea.

[chi]

seems you are starting a thread with a chip on your shoulder and I wouldn't necessarily blame others because you feel that you aren't getting the proper care for your condition. Test results and a knowledgeable physician would cure your woes don't you think?

[jasondd1]

I think everyone comes into this with this exact idea. I know I did, I told my doc get me to 600 and I will be fine, I just don't want to feel like shit anymore. Once achieved it can quickly tun into more, I think that's quite normal.

[asiandudexxx]

I can see your point, but if people really wanted to do steroid cycles, getting on an optimal trt regimen is much more difficult than just buying it illegally (which people probably have to do anyway if they are trying to add other compounds to their blast). Also, artificially balancing hormones is much more difficult than utilizing a perfectly functioning HPTA. If someone was not hypogonadic, then TRT might even be a step backwards.

Nandrolone , oxandrolone, and stanozolol are legitimate prescription medications for people with clinically indicated conditions (although not commonly prescribed at the dosages necessary for large mass gains)

I think the problem is it turns the whole steroid cycle thing into a grey area. If you aren't on TRT, either you are taking AAS or not. If on TRT, you are taking AAS anyway but just at lower doses. It's easy to rationalize, "I'll just do 500 mg a week instead of 200 mg."

[steroid.com 1]

The OP makes a somewhat relevant argument albeit somewhat of a generalization at the same time.

More like "some men on TRT abuse it..." would be better choice of words.

Just keep it civil fellows and have at it

[PeteyP]

Tell me where the free stuff is last month all my prescription's cost me $200. Could I be going to the wrong Doctor?

[Joseph956]

The only sting for me was the "want hgh" part.. and I think it has partly to do with positive experiences that I read about on different forums..

Just wanted to clear that up..

[asiandudexxx]

The only sting for me was the "want hgh" part.. and I think it has partly to do with positive experiences that I read about on different forums..

Just wanted to clear that up..

In fairness, most people want HGH because of the anti-aging benefits, nothing wrong with that. My mom was disappointed when I told her the pills she was taking weren't real GH, and that it is extremely difficult to get a prescription for it.

[Metalject]

The problem and the solution are both very simple, although most people rarely want to listen.

The strictness of TRT care is due to in part steroid abuse . However, steroid abuse as defined by those who often hate all steroids including when used therapeutically.

The solution, let people do what they want as long as they're not hurting anyone else. If I want to take 100mg/wk or 1,000mg/wk I should be free to do so and there is no single argument on earth that can legitimately say I shouldn't be free to do so.

[dreadnok89]

i thought the same thing. when your only problem is build more muscle you dont need hrt. there is soooo many more probelms

[powerlifterty16]

ill admit i want a t level in the 800s-900s if im going to be shutting myself down, but i dont want any higher than that. 900 would triple my test and make me a normal 23 y/o. My cortisol is killing me though

I think everyone comes into this with this exact idea. I know I did, I told my doc get me to 600 and I will be fine, I just don't want to feel like shit anymore. Once achieved it can quickly tun into more, I think that's quite normal.

[powerlifterty16]

thank you...i figured some people would be upset, but others would want to talk about it..as it is something that may have bothered others. I would like to point out I did say most not all but i guess most is a generalization so some is better.

The OP makes a somewhat relevant argument albeit somewhat of a generalization at the same time.

More like "some men on TRT abuse it..." would be better choice of words.

Just keep it civil fellows and have at it

[powerlifterty16]

i think this is why a lot of pl feds dont like trt users competing. It sucks bc i consider trt users natural as long as their test is under 1200. I think it's more fair for me to compete with 900 tt on trt, than 339 without it.

I can see your point, but if people really wanted to do steroid cycles, getting on an optimal trt regimen is much more difficult than just buying it illegally (which people probably have to do anyway if they are trying to add other compounds to their blast). Also, artificially balancing hormones is much more difficult than utilizing a perfectly functioning HPTA. If someone was not hypogonadic, then TRT might even be a step backwards.

Nandrolone , oxandrolone, and stanozolol are legitimate prescription medications for people with clinically indicated conditions (although not commonly prescribed at the dosages necessary for large mass gains)

I think the problem is it turns the whole steroid cycle thing into a grey area. If you aren't on TRT, either you are taking AAS or not. If on TRT, you are taking AAS anyway but just at lower doses. It's easy to rationalize, "I'll just do 500 mg a week instead of 200 mg."

[powerlifterty16]

lowt.com may be better

Tell me where the free stuff is last month all my prescription's cost me $200. Could I be going to the wrong Doctor?

[powerlifterty16]

yeah, ill admit i want it for the gains in the gym that other 23 y/o's get...but i also have other issues too. It is annoying seeing people who lift for a year pass you by.

i thought the same thing. when your only problem is build more muscle you dont need hrt. there is soooo many more probelms

[powerlifterty16]

But steroids are illegal. You are being given 100mg/wk for your medical condition and you should be honest. Seeing guys ons teroids hurts me, because it makes me feel inferior. I partly lift weights to stand out, to make me able to defend myself better, to be more attractive to girls.but mostly for myself. It becomes disheartening seeing guys juice up and dl 500 with a few months of training.
I do agree though, that steroids arent as dangerous as cigs or alcohol. I ahte when people smoke near me

The problem and the solution are both very simple, although most people rarely want to listen.

The strictness of TRT care is due to in part steroid abuse . However, steroid abuse as defined by those who often hate all steroids including when used therapeutically.

The solution, let people do what they want as long as they're not hurting anyone else. If I want to take 100mg/wk or 1,000mg/wk I should be free to do so and there is no single argument on earth that can legitimately say I shouldn't be free to do so.

[Lunk1]

I like free shyt....but I bet I will never get free steroids . Either cycling or TRT, you always pay somehow.

[HRTstudent]

Well, I will agree with you OP. I've started to see more and more abuse of hormones in this forum.

I totally understand that the push for "steroid .com" to get into the TRT business has something to do with it.

[kelkel]

It's human nature in a "more is better" society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better. Then again is it a problem or an individual choice?

[Metalject]

But steroids are illegal. You are being given 100mg/wk for your medical condition and you should be honest. Seeing guys ons teroids hurts me, because it makes me feel inferior. I partly lift weights to stand out, to make me able to defend myself better, to be more attractive to girls.but mostly for myself. It becomes disheartening seeing guys juice up and dl 500 with a few months of training.
I do agree though, that steroids arent as dangerous as cigs or alcohol. I ahte when people smoke near me

So people shouldn't do things they enjoy if it makes someone else feel inferior? Maybe I'm missing your point but that doesn't make sense to me. If someone's doing something for the sole purpose of making others feel inferior (whatever that may be) that's a little messed up but in the end feeling inferior is on you and you alone. If you're in the gym and a guy who uses no gear whatsoever benches a lot more than you does this make you feel inferior? Should he not bench when you're in the gym so your feelings don't get hurt?

[bigt405]

So people shouldn't do things they enjoy if it makes someone else feel inferior? Maybe I'm missing your point but that doesn't make sense to me. If someone's doing something for the sole purpose of making others feel inferior (whatever that may be) that's a little messed up but in the end feeling inferior is on you and you alone. If you're in the gym and a guy who uses no gear whatsoever benches a lot more than you does this make you feel inferior? Should he not bench when you're in the gym so your feelings don't get hurt?

Sounds like OP should just go train at the no judgement zone ie Planet Fitness lol

[FONZY007]

But steroids are illegal. You are being given 100mg/wk for your medical condition and you should be honest. Seeing guys ons teroids hurts me, because it makes me feel inferior. I partly lift weights to stand out, to make me able to defend myself better, to be more attractive to girls.but mostly for myself. It becomes disheartening seeing guys juice up and dl 500 with a few months of training.
I do agree though, that steroids arent as dangerous as cigs or alcohol. I ahte when people smoke near me

Steroids are not illegal everywhere!!

[bigt405]

More on topic...... I have been on trt for almost ten years and yes I just did my first blast a 400 mg and I felt great with no sides. I am on trt because I have no choice but to be on it to live normally, but the blast on other hand my personal choice. I am not trying to make anyone feel inferior. I am just trying to make myself better.

[PeteyP]

Well my story.....I have been on trt for almost 2 months. Originally went to HRT doctor to get a prescription for test because my job randomly tests for aas. Come to find out when I get there that my levels are that of a 50+ year old man! No wonder I've been feeling like crap the past couple of years. I always thought it was just stress related. Sorry to put everyone to sleep with this but my point is that NOW I AM WAY MORE CONCERNED ABOUT WHY MY LEVELS ARE SO LOW AT 29 YEARS OLD AND I WOULD LIKE TO TRY TO FIND THE CAUSE SO MAYBE I DONT HAVE TO STAY ON TRT FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE! MY WHOLE OUTLOOK HAS CHANGED!

[calstate23]

I hope this thread can remain open for intelligent discussion, as i think it would be enjoyable to debate on this amturely of course. I see tons of people who have either
1-self induced hypogonadism by abusing steroids
2-claim they want to ''blast''
3-only care about building more muscle
4-want hgh
5-think that there is no such thing as too much testosterone and dont really how ahrmful too much is(neurotoxic)
6-talk about adding tren , deca , winny

the biggest thing that bothers me, is that people are doing blasts. Im not trying to ruffle feathers, but trt is supposed to be replacement therapy to live a healthy life, it isnt supposed to be free steroids. 100mg/wk as it is is more than most 20 yr olds produce..and 200 is much more..why blast?

This stuff makes it hard for guys like me, who havent even done steroids and are hypogonadal at a young age to get proper care. I dont even want to blast..i just want a t level of 800-900 with low normal estrogen, so ican improve my lifts(yes i care about muscle too), and feel better.

I still have to work on my cortisol though.

side question-do you think there is any merit t the ''test causes cancer'' claims

That is true but a lot of guys feel exactly how you feel improve lifts and feel better...

But to tell you the truth I think it should make it easier for you to get proper care...Years ago TRT really wasn't even in option in fear of getting heat from the DEA/FDA...

More doctors are also understanding how to ACTUALLY properly treat it...

And if you think about it a lot of the older grew up in this area of steroids and now suffer from low t..So it makes sense they talk about wanting to add in more things...

And once you're actually there where you need trt and you know it's for life...Why not play around with it to maximize the benefits?

And like I've always said if you can't find someone to help you sometimes you have to do it yourself...No point in suffering..

[Metalject]

Steroids are not illegal everywhere!!

Exactly, very true. The legality of something is not what makes something right or wrong, just or unjust.

[powerlifterty16]

but what makes something wrong is that you are being given a medical drug for a specific condition and you are using it in a deceitful way. You guys are on trt for life, which means you could have your test at 1200 in your 80s and still be in the normal range..isnt that enough?

Exactly, very true. The legality of something is not what makes something right or wrong, just or unjust.

[bigt405]

but what makes something wrong is that you are being given a medical drug for a specific condition and you are using it in a deceitful way. You guys are on trt for life, which means you could have your test at 1200 in your 80s and still be in the normal range..isnt that enough?

I am not using anything that was gotten from my doctor's script in an deceitful manner

[Metalject]

but what makes something wrong is that you are being given a medical drug for a specific condition and you are using it in a deceitful way. You guys are on trt for life, which means you could have your test at 1200 in your 80s and still be in the normal range..isnt that enough?

Who determines what's enough? Why can't an individual determine what's enough for him? If a guy makes $80,000 a year, which is above what the average man makes, should he not be allowed to make more if he desires to and earns it? If that same guy wants to use hormones in a way that's beyond TRT and hurting no one (hurting someone's feelings doesn't qualify as hurting someone) why shouldn't he be allowed to?

[crashfirepm53]

200mg gets me to 717 not anywhere near 1000. The "little is good so alot must be great" is easily to start to think when lower doses show positive results. It doesnt matter if its steroids , recreational drugs or motorcycles and sports car. Most Americans live their life in excess.
I remember an article a few years about sly Stallone after he got caught in Australia with large amounts of Test and HGH. He said that every guy over 40 should be on both. Look at him and he's what 70?? Who wouldn't want to be on HGH?

[Ryanmcd]

I had LowT all my life is my guess, around 2-300, never had a sex drive and was taking 2 naps a day. It was a last resort for me. Most people are just lazy as shit and think if they get on TRT something magical is going to happen and that's not the case, I still had great lifts @ 200, 500+ dead, 300+ bench and 400+ squat. The only reason I went on it was because I was sleeping all the time and could not work and never left the house.

I wish people would do a little more work such as clean up a shit diet and get more sleep and try EVERYTHING else 1st because if you throw test on a shit diet and bad training it's not going to fix ANYTHING, then they do the dumbest thing even LETS ADD MORE lolrof.

[Metalject]

TRT definitely improves ones life regardless of his diet. Of course a healthier diet and regular exercise is the best way to live in terms of your health but this doesn't mean TRT is useless for guys who don't live that way.

The average guy, wife 3 kids, a full time job, living check to check. He may eat OK, but you know he misses a lot of meals and at times has to eat whatever he can get his hands on. He might get to the gym some but his family is his priority. Now, take this guy and his test levels are in the dirt and now change nothing in his life except introduce TRT into his life. Of course his life is going to change and for the better.

Regardless of how you live you need testosterone just as your car needs gas and when you run out of gas you have to put gas in your care just as you have to put in testosterone when the tank gets low.

[calstate23]

I will agree it is stupid to hop on with bad diet and no work ethic...Rule out everything first and try to do it naturally but if you feel like shit and the numbers conclude why not....

In the end, it doesn't matter if you're 60 or 20 we all want to feel our best....No one should be limited to feeling like shit just because of their age...

[sirmike]

I'm 37 played college football I'm a big guy ... 6'5" 365
I got hooked on opiates for 10 years ... Currently been off of them for a year
I'm taking suboxone ... Anyway when I got off ... I secluded my self from fan and friends super depressed ... Trt saved my life ... Levels were 250 now 3-4 months in 1200 I WANT TO DO THINGGS I WANT TO DIET I WANT is the key word.... Thanks to test .. It's for life but I don't care

[powerlifterty16]

I'm 37 played college football I'm a big guy ... 6'5" 365
I got hooked on opiates for 10 years ... Currently been off of them for a year
I'm taking suboxone ... Anyway when I got off ... I secluded my self from fan and friends super depressed ... Trt saved my life ... Levels were 250 now 3-4 months in 1200 I WANT TO DO THINGGS I WANT TO DIET I WANT is the key word.... Thanks to test .. It's for life but I don't care

well it sounds like you are doing this for the rightt reasons....you had hypogonadism even if it was self induced through opiates, and you had symptoms of low test which thankfully are now resolved. Im surprised you are having such a hard time dieting though. Test speeds the metabolism and helps burn fat, so as long as you are not eating too badly you should be able to lose quality weight. Dont worry so much about the number though. From what it sounds like in the other thread, you were around 250 pounds before test, and gained a lot of muscle to be 350....so you are prob just a tall big boned massive guy...with just a little too much bodyfat.

[powerlifterty16]

imo diet can only help so much..if you are a guy who is well below normal, a perfect diet wont help much. I'll admit that my diet could be better, but i have lifted weights for years, i have NEVER ONCE smoked a cig, done drugs of any kind, or drunk alcohol, and all in all would say that my lifestyle is healthier than the typical 750 total test 23 y/o. I have an ectomorphic build, and I have no appetite most of the time, so to reach my lifting goals i usually eat dirty....but to say that is why i have low test is a little insane imo. In fact, FAT AND CHOLESTEROL promote test so you can say my high pizza diet should help my test or at the worst not hurt it too much. I have made efforts to improve my diet though as it's not a heart healthy diet.

I will agree it is stupid to hop on with bad diet and no work ethic...Rule out everything first and try to do it naturally but if you feel like shit and the numbers conclude why not....

In the end, it doesn't matter if you're 60 or 20 we all want to feel our best....No one should be limited to feeling like shit just because of their age...

[calstate23]

imo diet can only help so much..if you are a guy who is well below normal, a perfect diet wont help much. I'll admit that my diet could be better, but i have lifted weights for years, i have NEVER ONCE smoked a cig, done drugs of any kind, or drunk alcohol, and all in all would say that my lifestyle is healthier than the typical 750 total test 23 y/o. I have an ectomorphic build, and I have no appetite most of the time, so to reach my lifting goals i usually eat dirty....but to say that is why i have low test is a little insane imo. In fact, FAT AND CHOLESTEROL promote test so you can say my high pizza diet should help my test or at the worst not hurt it too much. I have made efforts to improve my diet though as it's not a heart healthy diet.

I wasn't saying that is why you have low t and I was just speaking in general to everyone....Also, I didn't say it was the cause either...

I just said everyone should try to do it before just to see how they feel and react to a healthier lifestyle....

So has a doctor concluded that you have primary hypogonadism or secondary? Have they figured out the cause?

[powerlifterty16]

yeah man, i know i was just giving my piece..sorry if it sounded like I was accusing you of attacking me lol.

Well, i have been getting blood work for years, and have had several tests as well. One pituitary mri in 200 showed a probable microadenoma of 2mm that the neuros all said was an incidentiloma(incidental innocuous finding)...all of my followup mris from 2010-2011 showed no microadenoma....i jsut got my first followup in 2 years last week, and im going to pick up the report so i can be prepared for my urology appt on friday...ill update you guys alter today.

My blood work always shows HIGH cortisol which i think is the reason my t is so low. Urine tests showed it as well. I bought myself some phosphatydyl serine which i've heard lowers cortisol.

dhea is at 606 which is nice and high, prolactin is low, estradiol was 9(non sensitive), and lh was 5.6 or so? He didnt do fsh..but im going to ask him to recheck everything. my free t was 10.1 and range is 9.3=26.4 lol
tt was 339 on labcorps range of 348-1197.

only dr who ever told me officially that i was hypogonadal was dr barry gordon, but he is a pill pusher. I am hoping my urologist agrees that my 339 is cause for concern, but im not holding my breath, because he said my old blood work fro m19 at 277 was not necessarily bad and im probably fine.....he does prescribe hcg though, so im hoping he works with me.

[ironbeck]

With respect to the original Poster......your 23, and even though u may be a nicely well adjusted, educated fellow....U don't know Jack bro. The only thing I would tell my 23yr old self is to get off your high horse. IT's literally impossible for you to comprehend the point of view of someone who is 40 yrs old or even 35 for that matter. Do U make some valid observations yes of course, and with anything it's human Nature to want more. Are their a lot of dumb ass idiots on this forum, yes there are, but in my observations most are under 30.