is hcg dangerous?

[Vettester]

OP, I can't see where the HCG mono therapy will do anything to stimulate gonadotropin production with the HPTA. Thus, it is usually used in conjunction with a SERM, e.g., Clomid, which does have the ability to promote endogenous LH & FSH production. Again, based on a negative feedback loop process, the HPTA won't have any reason to be responsive if testosterone serum levels are elevated.

Now I'm completely open for new ideas, as this is a continual lifelong learning curve. I'm all ears if LowT Mike or any of our talented group of members can elaborate on this subject further. I come from a pretty basic school of thought that HCG, an exogenous LH analog, will not have any positive outcome on getting the pituitary to produce its own LH. However, if I've learned anything it's that there's always more to learn in this field.

[powerlifterty16]

OP, I can't see where the HCG mono therapy will do anything to stimulate gonadotropin production with the HPTA. Thus, it is usually used in conjunction with a SERM, e.g., Clomid, which does have the ability to promote endogenous LH & FSH production. Again, based on a negative feedback loop process, the HPTA won't have any reason to be responsive if testosterone serum levels are elevated.

Now I'm completely open for new ideas, as this is a continual lifelong learning curve. I'm all ears if LowT Mike or any of our talented group of members can elaborate on this subject further. I come from a pretty basic school of thought that HCG, an exogenous LH analog, will not have any positive outcome on getting the pituitary to produce its own LH. However, if I've learned anything it's that there's always more to learn in this field.

vettester, i have read your posts, and i have read the pms that mike sent me as well. I was of the same opinion of you vettester(that hcg only mimics lh, and doesnt stimulate it like a serm does)...however when asking mike about the 6 week protocol...he said it has worked for many guys my age.

I, like you am very confused. I respect the knowledge of you both, and look forward to hearing mike's expert pinion on this matter. Perhaps he may even post a new thread with this information if he turns out to be correct.

I agree..there is always more to be learned. I scheduled another uro appt for wednesday to tell my dr exactly what you said vettester(which were my concerns as well), but if low t mike can convince me otherwise, i will give the hcg therapy a shot.

[powerlifterty16]

bump

[Java Man]

Very interesting thread. Interested to see how this turns out for you. GL!

[powerlifterty16]

Thanks brutha. i was hoping lowtmike would weigh in, as i have an appt with my uro on wednesday to express my concerns over the suggested protocol...but it appears mike hasnt logged on since the 17th.

[powerlifterty16]

Thanks brutha. i was hoping lowtmike would weigh in, as i have an appt with my uro on wednesday to express my concerns over the suggested protocol...but it appears mike hasnt logged on since the 17th.

my uro appt is wednesday to discuss my concerns over the 6 week protocol...i get very anxious about drs visits since i feel like i fight a losing battle. He told me last time to just take the hcg and he didnt wantt to run a repeat blood test...but im gonna ask for them this time anyway.

im basically making an appt to tell him he is wrong..and the anxiety is killing me lmfao...not to mention this guy is going to be mixing my hcg together for me so dont wanna anger him ahah

[powerlifterty16]

my uro appt is wednesday to discuss my concerns over the 6 week protocol...i get very anxious about drs visits since i feel like i fight a losing battle. He told me last time to just take the hcg and he didnt wantt to run a repeat blood test...but im gonna ask for them this time anyway.

im basically making an appt to tell him he is wrong..and the anxiety is killing me lmfao...not to mention this guy is going to be mixing my hcg together for me so dont wanna anger him ahah

wonder why low t mike hasnt chimed in

[SEOINAGE]

when he said it lowers libido i saw red flags in my head..considering it is meant to do the opposite.

He probably thinks you are doing hcg based on the hcg diet or something of the sort. At least that's what his comments sounded like, and that you should go to the gym to make progress. HCG will obviously notice a libido increase while on, but decrease when you come off, not sure if there is any HPTA suppression but from what it sounds like from LowT Mike is that that is not the case. I would think it would take a little for your own LH and FSH levels to bump back up.

Anyways it is really unrelated, I have heard some odd stuff about HCG, but feel completely safe taking it at my low dose that is used for TRT. It flat out makes me feel good, I love the stuff, wouldn't want to take testosterone without it.

[powerlifterty16]

what odd stuff have you heard? Im using it by itself..not with testosterone . Im just so confused..both my dr and low t mike say it can restart me...but nearly everyone else says otherwise since it's only an lh analog. I hope low t mike visits this thread before my dr's appt on wednesday as im curious to hear what he has to say.

im super nervous for my appt, as im basically meeting the dr to tell him he's wrong LOL.

[Rusty11]

So, you've not started the hCG yet...correct? Look, I have no knowledge about hcg monotherapy, but I say just do what the uro wants. He'll check levels in 6 weeks and you can go from there. I know what everyone here is telling you, but go with the doc's advice. At this point, you have nothing to lose. And, please don't be so anxious. It's hard, I know.

[chi]

hcg killled osama bin laden highly dangerous

[powerlifterty16]

rusty, i havent done the hcg yet. a big reason is im confused on what im supposed to do...like if im supposed to buy it, and then make an appt, or buy it and drop it off..so im going to ask him this all on wednesday. I just get nervous with a llot of these docs. The uro didnt even know that hcg aromatizes..but i do think he will check my estradiol if i ask him..since he checked it originally without me ever asking.

i will see what he has to say, but ill probably give the hcg a try..i really dont want to try nolva or clomid...they scare me more

[Vettester]

When you get it, let us know, we'll step you through the reconstituting process. Storage and mixing is crucial, so you want to make sure it's done right.

At the end of the cycle your testosterone serum level should up, and your testis should be functioning nicely. When your testis stop receiving the LH analog, your serum level will start to drop. What you are counting on is that your HPTA is awake and going to secrete GnRH, triggered through the feedback loop process.

[powerlifterty16]

thanks man, but the doctor is mixing it together for me, after i buy it, and he's giving me the first shot.
So, even though my lh was 5.2 my test should increase?
Not sure what gnrh is, but is that something that can potentially make the hcg cycle a permanent restart?

When you get it, let us know, we'll step you through the reconstituting process. Storage and mixing is crucial, so you want to make sure it's done right.

At the end of the cycle your testosterone serum level should up, and your testis should be functioning nicely. When your testis stop receiving the LH analog, your serum level will start to drop. What you are counting on is that your HPTA is awake and going to secrete GnRH, triggered through the feedback loop process.

[powerlifterty16]

thanks man, but the doctor is mixing it together for me, after i buy it, and he's giving me the first shot.
So, even though my lh was 5.2 my test should increase?
Not sure what gnrh is, but is that something that can potentially make the hcg cycle a permanent restart?

bump since i saw mike was on

[powerlifterty16]

OP, I can't see where the HCG mono therapy will do anything to stimulate gonadotropin production with the HPTA. Thus, it is usually used in conjunction with a SERM, e.g., Clomid, which does have the ability to promote endogenous LH & FSH production. Again, based on a negative feedback loop process, the HPTA won't have any reason to be responsive if testosterone serum levels are elevated.

Now I'm completely open for new ideas, as this is a continual lifelong learning curve. I'm all ears if LowT Mike or any of our talented group of members can elaborate on this subject further. I come from a pretty basic school of thought that HCG, an exogenous LH analog, will not have any positive outcome on getting the pituitary to produce its own LH. However, if I've learned anything it's that there's always more to learn in this field.

should have bumped this too

[jr292]

i have read alot of stuff about hcg can cause or accelerate cancer...how it gives bad migraines(which i already suffer from)..and i just talked to a pharmacist about it, and he told me he'd advise against using hcg, and that it's dangerous and causes low libido, and liver problems among other things.

he told me to ''go to the gym to get it'' which was a pretty ignorant statement.

dr wants me on 350 iu 3xwk for 6 wks

Effect of rejuvenation hormones on spermatogenesis.
Moss JL, Crosnoe LE, Kim ED.
Source
University of Tennessee Graduate School of Medicine, Knoxville, Tennessee.
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To review the current literature for the effect of hormones used in rejuvenation clinics on the maintenance of spermatogenesis.
DESIGN:
Review of published literature.
SETTING:
Not applicable.
PATIENT(S):
Men who have undergone exogenous testosterone (T) and/or anabolic androgenic steroid (AAS) therapies.
INTERVENTION(S):
None.
MAIN OUTCOME MEASURE(S):
Semen analysis, pregnancy outcomes, and time to recovery of spermatogenesis.
RESULT(S):
Exogenous testosterone and anabolic androgenic steroids suppress intratesticular testosterone production, which may lead to azoospermia or severe oligozoospermia. Therapies that protect spermatogenesis involve human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) therapy and selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs). The studies examining the effect of human growth hormone (HGH) on infertile men are uncontrolled and unconvincing, but they do not appear to negatively impact spermatogenesis. At present, routine use of aromatase inhibitors is not recommended based on a lack of long-term data.
CONCLUSION(S):
The use of hormones for rejuvenation is increasing with the aging of the Baby Boomer population. Men desiring children at a later age may be unaware of the side-effect profile of hormones used at rejuvenation centers. Testosterone and anabolic androgenic steroids have well-established detrimental effects on spermatogenesis, but recovery may be possible with cessation. Clomiphene citrate, human growth hormone (HGH)/insulin -like growth factor-1 (IGF-1), human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG), and aromatase inhibitors do not appear to have significant negative effects on sperm production, but quality data are lacking.

[sirupate]

Bump or a piggyback...veteran member here. HCG does good things for me, but I am about out (last vial) and my usual sources no longer carry it. PM me if you know of a reliable seller who still has HCG. And, yes, I'll bring this up with my urologist at my next visit since I am having trouble getting supply. I didn't need to mention HCG to him as long as I was able to procure supply. My last doctor, an endocrinologist, wasn't interested in writing scrips for HCG to hypogonadal males. I "fired" him. Thanks.

[powerlifterty16]

Effect of rejuvenation hormones on spermatogenesis.
Moss JL, Crosnoe LE, Kim ED.
Source
University of Tennessee Graduate School of Medicine, Knoxville, Tennessee.
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
To review the current literature for the effect of hormones used in rejuvenation clinics on the maintenance of spermatogenesis.
DESIGN:
Review of published literature.
SETTING:
Not applicable.
PATIENT(S):
Men who have undergone exogenous testosterone (T) and/or anabolic androgenic steroid (AAS) therapies.
INTERVENTION(S):
None.
MAIN OUTCOME MEASURE(S):
Semen analysis, pregnancy outcomes, and time to recovery of spermatogenesis.
RESULT(S):
Exogenous testosterone and anabolic androgenic steroids suppress intratesticular testosterone production, which may lead to azoospermia or severe oligozoospermia. Therapies that protect spermatogenesis involve human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG ) therapy and selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs). The studies examining the effect of human growth hormone (HGH) on infertile men are uncontrolled and unconvincing, but they do not appear to negatively impact spermatogenesis. At present, routine use of aromatase inhibitors is not recommended based on a lack of long-term data.
CONCLUSION(S):
The use of hormones for rejuvenation is increasing with the aging of the Baby Boomer population. Men desiring children at a later age may be unaware of the side-effect profile of hormones used at rejuvenation centers. Testosterone and anabolic androgenic steroids have well-established detrimental effects on spermatogenesis, but recovery may be possible with cessation. Clomiphene citrate, human growth hormone (HGH)/insulin-like growth factor-1 (IGF-1), human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG), and aromatase inhibitors do not appear to have significant negative effects on sperm production, but quality data are lacking.

cool study, although when i started this thread i meant dangerous as in complicating health.
i have my uro appt tomorrow, so curious what low t mike has to say in response to me and vettester..i'll feel like a real douschebag complaining to my uro if im wrong

[powerlifterty16]

just spoke with mike....and im excited to give the hcg a try. since he pmed me i will respect him and not post his pm,unless he gives me permission.

One reason i have put off getting therapy all these years, is that im pretty masculine even without the high t(prob because i have low e too?) i jsut keep telling myself reasons i dont need it....but truth be told my test has never been high. lowest it's been was 277 at 19, and highest was 535 at 21.

i dont think any of those were at 8am though, but idontt think it matters that much...do you think i should insist that my urologist gives me one more test or just say fugg it and got for it?

[Weavz]

Bump or a piggyback...veteran member here. HCG does good things for me, but I am about out (last vial) and my usual sources no longer carry it. PM me if you know of a reliable seller who still has HCG. And, yes, I'll bring this up with my urologist at my next visit since I am having trouble getting supply. I didn't need to mention HCG to him as long as I was able to procure supply. My last doctor, an endocrinologist, wasn't interested in writing scrips for HCG to hypogonadal males. I "fired" him. Thanks.

Did you end up finding someone? My Dr. sells it without a script to me, but now he can't find anywhere to get it. Has been out for several months. He offered to write a script, for $200.

[powerlifterty16]

Did you end up finding someone? My Dr. sells it without a script to me, but now he can't find anywhere to get it. Has been out for several months. He offered to write a script, for $200.

if they dont have it in stock see if theyll order pregnyl.

[Weavz]

I'll check on that. Is there any reason I should ask about Nolva? He mentioned it during my initial consultation when I told him I'm trying to get my wife pregnant, as an option to Hcg . I see it mostly as something to be taken after a cycle, not continuously.

[sirmike]

It's been my experience that most pharmacist are stupid... I wish they would really quit trying to be dr's ... They do not know what they are talking about

[imom]

for all TRT patients cancer DRE imaging and/or PSA testing and comprehesive labs are done before hand to make sure the patient is cancer free.

This is an important point. Could you elaborate on what tests we should perform before HRT? Is it too late to do the tests once you are already doing HRT? Perhaps this is worth a new thread as I'm willing to bet there are a lot of guys here taking testosterone , HGH, etc without checking for cancer first.