Advice?

[Lifted1]

glad to hear you're getting everything checked out.

depending on what total testosterone test you pulled, you might only get a maxed out reading like >1500ng/dl and not an absolute value like 2500ng/dl.

[IronClydes]

How do I ensure I'm getting absolute values tested?

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[kelkel]

I'll share all results as they present. I anticipate getting the results of the total testosterone bw from yesterday by tomorrow. I'll have two of those now.

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Good. Post up when you get them.

[kelkel]

How do I ensure I'm getting absolute values tested?

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By choosing a lab that doesn't cut them off. Some do, some don't.

[IronClydes]

Kelkel,

Okay, so I purchased tomorrow's panel though Private MD Labs, it is being completed at LabCorp. Hoping they don't cut it off...

Doing that tomorrow morning and scheduled blood donation after.

Taking 0.5 Anastrozole every 2 days as well. Getting back on track. Thanks guys.

Let me know if you find a good HcG source for me as well. Not starting until a month from now, after normal TRT blood test, as kelkel advised.

Also, I ordered the testosterone book from nelson as well. Should get that in mail Tuesday.

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[kelkel]

Nice. Better take your receipt from your blood draw to the donation as they will view your arms as part of their protocol and you may need to justify the needle hole....
You'll like the book.

[IronClydes]

Kelkel,

Good point. Thanks!

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[IronClydes]

First testosterone test result returned. Over 1500 it shows. Who knows how high it really was...sure hope tomorrow's test is absolute...same lab, different location, ordered through different company. Darn

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[kelkel]

No clue how high as it's not the same for everyone. Example is myself, my normal trt dose is 60mgs twice per week. If I bump it to 70 twice per week I'll be anywhere from mid-1400's to over 1500. Many factors play into this so guessing is really out the window. That said, you need to know where your actual TRT dose puts you. Then and only then, you can make proper adjustments for balance so you know exactly where to return to when not on a cycle. Make sense?

Being written for 200 mgs per week does not mean you really require that much. More is not better. Better is better. I'm personally written for 200mgs per week also but use much less. I requested this with my doc as I don't want to be micromanaged by my pharmacy. You can also build up some stock as well.

[IronClydes]

Thanks kelkel.

I understand, it's just frustrating to pay for a test on a tight budget and get a vague result from it. ?

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[IronClydes]

Asked them how I could get absolute values beyond their cutoff range, this was their response:

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[Lifted1]

damn that's what i thought.

fwiw, there's a thread in the steroid section that forum member "doc" posted that tells you exactly how to request the proper test for the exact value. it shouldn't matter moving forward though as you should be below 1500ng/dl soon enough.

[kelkel]

it shouldn't matter moving forward though as you should be below 1500ng/dl soon enough.

If he stays at 200 per week odd are (imho) he'll be over it. Guys on a typical 500mg per week cycle can pull anywhere from 3-4k ng/dl.

[IronClydes]

Just talked to Private MD Labs. Apparently I can get absolute readings over 1500, it just requires me to but a more expensive test (see attached screenshot). Unfortunately, I really can't afford to spend anymore money here.

Got the hormone panel bw done and donated blood this morning. Guy said my iron was a bit high and this "oil change" would help lol.

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[Lifted1]

If he stays at 200 per week odd are (imho) he'll be over it. Guys on a typical 500mg per week cycle can pull anywhere from 3-4k ng/dl.

totally brain farted that he was running 200mg/wk. ya you are probably right Kel that should put him over 1500 ng/dl. What about the free T reading though? I've never seen anyone's cut off above the reference range...that would be better to know anyway.

Edit
I just read tduff's above post that says they cannot come to a free T reading when you exceed the 1500ng/dl range with the standard test. looks like he will need to spring for the $90 test to get any accurate results.

[IronClydes]

totally brain farted that he was running 200mg/wk. ya you are probably right Kel that should put him over 1500 ng/dl. What about the free T reading though? I've never seen anyone's cut off above the reference range...that would be better to know anyway. Edit I just read tduff's above post that says they cannot come to a free T reading when you exceed the 1500ng/dl range with the standard test. looks like he will need to spring for the $90 test to get any accurate results.

Unfortunately, the accumulating costs here are too high for another test. Additionally, wouldn't the results of another test be affected by my blood donation today?

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[Lifted1]

you don't need to run another test now. for future reference at your dose you will need to run that specific test to obtain any sort of accurate testosterone results. blood donation wouldn't have any effect on testosterone/estrogen levels...only hematocrit.

just pull some blood about 4~5 weeks after your new dosage using lc/ms-ms and e2 sensitive to see where you stand.

[kelkel]

you don't need to run another test now. For future reference at your dose you will need to run that specific test to obtain any sort of accurate testosterone results. Blood donation wouldn't have any effect on testosterone/estrogen levels...only hematocrit.

Just pull some blood about 4~5 weeks after your new dosage using lc/ms-ms and e2 sensitive to see where you stand.

x2...

[IronClydes]

Sounds good, thanks!

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[IronClydes]

Curious, in TRT and cycling, is it advised to donate blood often? Every 2 months even?

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[kelkel]

Some need to on TRT, some don't. Many will say that a properly dialed in protocol should not require it, but I don't necessarily buy into that logic. Personally, I donate every couple months as it's good for me and good for society. Regarding a cycle I donate before, during and after.

[IronClydes]

Thanks kelkel. I was hesitant as I wondered if scarring of the artery could occur with such frequent donations and those larger needles piercing the same areas over time. Just imagined blood clots sticking to scar tissue when I get older lol.

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[IronClydes]

Hey guys,

Quick inquiry. I donated blood Friday morning. I took that day off from the gym as they recommended. The next day I did legs, avoiding arms, as they recommended (heavy deadlifts did make it tender, so I limited sets). Today, 2 days after donating, I hit my upper body but had to cut the workout short as the vein they drew from is aching throughout the entire length of my arm. It is throbbing!

Is this normal?

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[Beethoven]

Hey guys,

Quick inquiry. I donated blood Friday morning. I took that day off from the gym as they recommended. The next day I did legs, avoiding arms, as they recommended (heavy deadlifts did make it tender, so I limited sets). Today, 2 days after donating, I hit my upper body but had to cut the workout short as the vein they drew from is aching throughout the entire length of my arm. It is throbbing!

Is this normal?

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No. But I usually schedule my phlebotomies on a Friday afternoon and usually take the weekend off. But I have worked out the following day and have been fine.

[IronClydes]

Test results are in.

Please let me know your thoughts.

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[IronClydes]

Page 2.

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[Paragon73]

Hematocrit is still high after the donation. I do double red cell donations. It takes about an hour and can be done every 16 weeks. AST and ALT are elevated too, as are mine. Those are commonly elevated after strenuous exercise (lifting) but can also be caused by many things (alcohol, NSAIDS, even too any OTC supplements).

As advised earlier, lower your dose. >1500 total test is too much for the long term, and is giving you these hematocrit troubles.

[IronClydes]

Paragon73,

Thank you for the advice and your time!

I actually donated the blood after this test. I'm also going on day 14 since my last extra 300 mg injection. Just sticking with the 200 mg weekly now, alternating deltoids, administered by nurse.

Also, still taking the .5 Anastrozole e2d. Should I keep that going?

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[kelkel]

You need to reduce your AI dosage as your E2 is rather low and maintaining the same dosage will crash your E. .5 eod is a relatively large cycle dosage considering most get by with .25 eod on a 500mg cycle. And most still do not need 200mgs per week. Future BW will probably show you that. It's really a guessing game right now as to how much of an AI you will need until your stable with your current test dosage and you obtain more BW.

[IronClydes]

Thank you, KelKel.

I am getting an updated total/free/bio available test be done soon. Since its been 14 days since my last extra 300mg injection, how soon before itwod be ideal to test at TRT dosage?

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[kelkel]

I'd wait about 4 total weeks while stable on test and your AI dosage.

[IronClydes]

Okay, thanks!

And step my AI dosage to taking .5 less often, such as e4d?

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[kelkel]

It's a guessing game as to how much. Pick your poison (amount) and dose either the day of or day after injection and one other day of the week. Remember, you're lowering your test dose therefore your AI has to be lowered. At the same time you need to let your E2 rise. Err on the lower side and stick with it for a month and retest it.

[IronClydes]

21 days since transferring from 500 weekly to 200. Definitely beginning to show some love handles now...should I have decreased Citicorp intake with decreases testosterone ? Training and diet has stayed same.

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[IronClydes]

Calories, not Citicorp. Should have proofread that first!

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[IronClydes]

Kelkel,

I don't like how I feel now. Low energy, hit a plateau in all my workouts, gaining fat, difficulty sleeping. Is this normal when dropping from 500 to 200 only 3 weeks in?

I've reading these forums and there are so many taking more than 500 test weekly in addition to other steroids . At 230 pounds, 6 foot, 33 years old, and over 15 years spent lifting with no long breaks....it appears as though I would be a good candidate for cycling, regardless of being on TRT. Once I can establish my baseline TRT dosages and values, I am anxious to begin cycling. What is a good place to start researching how to cycle? It would be necessary to bear in mind I am blood tested every 6 months or so for my TRT and 1-2x a year for my occupation. So, I would need to work around these tests in my cycles.

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[Beethoven]

Nh

Kelkel,

I don't like how I feel now. Low energy, hit a plateau in all my workouts, gaining fat, difficulty sleeping. Is this normal when dropping from 500 to 200 only 3 weeks in?

I've reading these forums and there are so many taking more than 500 test weekly in addition to other steroids . At 230 pounds, 6 foot, 33 years old, and over 15 years spent lifting with no long breaks....it appears as though I would be a good candidate for cycling, regardless of being on TRT. Once I can establish my baseline TRT dosages and values, I am anxious to begin cycling. What is a good place to start researching how to cycle? It would be necessary to bear in mind I am blood tested every 6 months or so for my TRT and 1-2x a year for my occupation. So, I would need to work around these tests in my cycles.

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Just my .02. Of course you're going to feel a difference, you were on cycle dosage and have come down. You shouldn't mistake how you feel on cycle with TRT. You haven't had BW so you don't really know where you are. As for beginning cycling, you should dial yourself in first before you go back to cycling IMO.

[kelkel]

Nh
Just my .02. Of course you're going to feel a difference, you were on cycle dosage and have come down. You shouldn't mistake how you feel on cycle with TRT. You haven't had BW so you don't really know where you are. As for beginning cycling, you should dial yourself in first before you go back to cycling IMO.

Exactly. It's apples and oranges. Do your research here in the anabolic Q & A. Very knowledgeable members here that are concerned with your safety and do not dish out reckless advice. Most of us have BW done twice per year and you simply plan cycles out in between. When it comes to drug testing at work I'd be shocked it they tested for testosterone . Not cost effective for them...

[IronClydes]

Exactly. It's apples and oranges. Do your research here in the anabolic Q & A. Very knowledgeable members here that are concerned with your safety and do not dish out reckless advice. Most of us have BW done twice per year and you simply plan cycles out in between. When it comes to drug testing at work I'd be shocked it they tested for testosterone. Not cost effective for them...

Thanks KelKel,

What about my earlier question regarding diet. When coming off a cycle, should I also be stepping down my caloric intake? I ask because my "love handles" are making a reappearance since I came off. My diet and training has remained consistent, if not more challenging without that dosage.

[IronClydes]

Nh
Just my .02. Of course you're going to feel a difference, you were on cycle dosage and have come down. You shouldn't mistake how you feel on cycle with TRT. You haven't had BW so you don't really know where you are. As for beginning cycling, you should dial yourself in first before you go back to cycling IMO.

Thanks for your response Beethoven.

Should I make any dietary/supplementary adjustments when off-cycle to maintain my training intensity and stay lean? Consistently tired now, not sleeping great, and putting on love handles. Workouts are no where near as satisfying...