this sounds about right

[tiger909]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism

while i dont deny the possibilty of islam, or any other religion as truth, my day to day beliefs are closer to deism

[tiger909]

i say this because no matter what i attemt, theres no way i can prove the gospel, torah,or koran is divine....however, (atheists flame away) i have an innate belief in something bigger....so thats why im a deist

[BgMc31]

Could you explain the difference between a deist and an agnostic, please.

[Phreak101]

Could you explain the difference between a deist and an agnostic, please.

If Im not mistaken, a deist believes in a unified single higher power (a deity), while an agnostic believes we, as humans, simply cannot fathom what comes after death, but there IS something.

[tiger909]

If Im not mistaken, a deist believes in a unified single higher power (a deity), while an agnostic believes we, as humans, simply cannot fathom what comes after death or if a god even exists

thats more like it......however funny thing is many ppl say that for believers it goes like this believer of a religion-deist-agnostic-atheist....i dont believe that as of now, but well see

[biglouie250]

so being a deist in a sense advocates what ive been comtemplating all along. and that is that humans, the self important creatures that we are, have to feel that there is something else out there for us and that we have to feel that we are more special then a lowly creature like an ant. IMO humans cant except the fact that they may share the same fate as such a lowly creature.

[tiger909]

so being a deist in a sense advocates what ive been comtemplating all along. and that is that humans, the self important creatures that we are, have to feel that there is something else out there for us and that we have to feel that we are more special then a lowly creature like an ant. IMO humans cant except the fact that they may share the same fate as such a lowly creature.

that makes two of us.....i also have trouble believing that the entire planet earth in all its perfection and beauty, was created randomly. i believe a higher being had a hand in it

[biglouie250]

i also have trouble believing that the entire planet earth in all its perfection and beauty, was created randomly. i believe a higher being had a hand in it

ya know i thought about that and i honestly think that it is possible for all this to happen randomly. if you consider the sheer size of the universe and all the star systems and planets, etc. i mean mathematically speaking the probability of other earth like planets existing is greater then most people think. if we arent "alone" in the universe i dont think that any modern religion can explain within their scripture how E.T.'s fit in their divine plan, thus proving them wrong indirectly.

[tiger909]

ya know i thought about that and i honestly think that it is possible for all this to happen randomly. if you consider the sheer size of the universe and all the star systems and planets, etc. i mean mathematically speaking the probability of other earth like planets existing is greater then most people think. if we arent "alone" in the universe i dont think that any modern religion can explain within their scripture how E.T.'s fit in their divine plan, thus proving them wrong indirectly.

ive though about and know what your saying....but at times its hard not to believe otherwise..idk maybe its just me, or maybe its innate

[Phreak101]

thats more like it......however funny thing is many ppl say that for believers it goes like this believer of a religion-deist-agnostic-atheist....i dont believe that as of now, but well see

Your modification of my post is incorrect. Agnostics do believe in a higher power, atheists question the existence.

[tiger909]

from wikipedia

Agnosticism is the philosophical view that the value of certain claims as truth—particularly theological claims regarding the existence of God, gods, or deities—are unknown, inherently unknowable, or incoherent, and therefore, irrelevant to life. The term and the related agnostic were coined by Thomas Henry Huxley in 1869, and are also used to describe those who are unconvinced or noncommittal about the existence of deities as well as other matters of religion. The word agnostic comes from the Greek a (without) and gnosis (knowledge). Agnosticism is not to be confused with a view specifically opposing the doctrine of gnosis and Gnosticism—these are religious concepts that are not generally related to agnosticism.

[Phreak101]

from wikipedia

Agnosticism is the philosophical view that the value of certain claims as truth—particularly theological claims regarding the existence of God, gods, or deities—are unknown, inherently unknowable, or incoherent, and therefore, irrelevant to life. The term and the related agnostic were coined by Thomas Henry Huxley in 1869, and are also used to describe those who are unconvinced or noncommittal about the existence of deities as well as other matters of religion. The word agnostic comes from the Greek a (without) and gnosis (knowledge). Agnosticism is not to be confused with a view specifically opposing the doctrine of gnosis and Gnosticism—these are religious concepts that are not generally related to agnosticism.

Keyword, unconvinced...

[Kärnfysikern]

that makes two of us.....i also have trouble believing that the entire planet earth in all its perfection and beauty, was created randomly. i believe a higher being had a hand in it

IMO that is a matter of perspective.

Turn it around instead.
Malaria isnt beutifull, worms eating through a decaying corps isnt beautifull, a mudslide wiping out villages isnt beautifull, kids with distended bellies dying out of starvation isnt beautifull, a rapist raping and murdering 8 year old kids isnt beautifull, vultures feasting on a dead and rotting animal isnt pretty.

Maby a pretty sunset in a mountain region, northern lights a cold winter night or a mighty thunderstorm might seem perfect and beautifull, but it doesnt mean the earth as a whole is perfect and beautifull. Id say the earth is a very very far from perfect. If I can imagine a better place than a omnipotent god would easily be able to create a better place. So either he choose to fill the earth with horror or its just a random creation in a mindless universe...

In the end beauty is just a creation of the human mind. The universe cares not about beauty. Its more likely we have evolved to appriciate some of the things in our world.

Thats just my view offcourse

[Phreak101]

IMO that is a matter of perspective.

Turn it around instead.
Malaria isnt beutifull, worms eating through a decaying corps isnt beautifull, a mudslide wiping out villages isnt beautifull, kids with distended bellies dying out of starvation isnt beautifull, a rapist raping and murdering 8 year old kids isnt beautifull, vultures feasting on a dead and rotting animal isnt pretty.

Maby a pretty sunset in a mountain region, northern lights a cold winter night or a mighty thunderstorm might seem perfect and beautifull, but it doesnt mean the earth as a whole is perfect and beautifull. Id say the earth is a very very far from perfect. If I can imagine a better place than a omnipotent god would easily be able to create a better place. So either he choose to fill the earth with horror or its just a random creation in a mindless universe...

In the end beauty is just a creation of the human mind. The universe cares not about beauty. Its more likely we have evolved to appriciate some of the things in our world.

Thats just my view offcourse

Being able to interpret the bad and the good of all creation (or existence, depending on your view) is one of the beauties of being human. We can work to extinguish the evil while embracing the good. Granted good and evil are relative, but I would imagine we could all agree on basic principles that are essential to civilization flourishing (do not steal, do not murder, etc)

[Kärnfysikern]

Being able to interpret the bad and the good of all creation (or existence, depending on your view) is one of the beauties of being human. We can work to extinguish the evil while embracing the good. Granted good and evil are relative, but I would imagine we could all agree on basic principles that are essential to civilization flourishing (do not steal, do not murder, etc)

Yupp I agree

I just think the evil is as abundant(if not more so) than the good and that from my perspective puts a dent into the view that the universe must be created because it is perfect and good...

But I do think the universe is a amazingly beautifull place. Nothing like watching a thunderstorm or the night sky.

[tiger909]

anyone else agree with this...why or why not?

[Kale]

I am a devout Agnostic. I was brought up a roman catholic but I am firmly of the view that I will believe it when I see it. Anything else is a leap of faith, and thats a faith that makes no sense to me until it can be proven