Conspiracy Theories

[thekaydense]

There is one simple reason to dismiss 99% of conspiracy theories, the larger it is the harder it is to keep it a secret.

When it comes to conspiracy theories like 9/11, fake moon landing, roswell UFO crash ect it all means hundrads of people would be involved.

It is not plausible that it would be keept secret for long.

if i were planning something like that. of course i would try and cover it up but i wouldnt count on it being a secret forever. what i would do it control ALL of the media (which they do) and make sure any ideas of the truth that did come out was a bollocks. (which they have)

[singern]

i chose a few examples out of many. my point is you claim people who believe in certain jewish communities being disruptive in western society are ignorant. well, if you think voltaire was ignorant, then you're a few eggs short of a dozen.

if you're having trouble following the logic, then maybe it's because every time anyone critizes the actions of and jew or group of jews, you try to explain it as hate. jimmy carter calls the israeli govenment an aparthied state? hate- total nazi. holocaust survivor yosef lapid criticizes the hebron settlers? self-loather.

you're either deliberately muddling any rational debate, or you can't follow your own preztel logic. maybe it's a little of both.

Your starting to drift a little. I just admitted crimes by Israeli settlers against Palestinians in the other thread.
You should slow down, take a breath and understand that just because someone doesnt agree with your "opinions" it doesnt make them... well.... all the irrational things you keep labeling me. Perhaps social discussions arent for you...

[DTBusta]

wow your both idiots. It's not my fault I don't have an attention span of a goldfish(2 seconds)! Its called research and its not being desperate. To thoroughly look into something isn't pothetic. You are squirel boy and you to Karny, get a life j dogs. Oh wow clinton got a blow job, ironic you mention that, yes impeach that president but not the one for either making an mistake and getting into war and lying about it or deliberately doing it . Maybe its cause of this...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g4-yEp07MM followed by the actual news report of this actually being true msnbc- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdtnrZ_4CM8

If you have the balls to check these out you'd see you are being lied to and its right in your face. Hmm maybe its being held under the major media outlets by something called a gag order? And comapring this to clintons blow job in which only two people knew about are entirely different circumstances then if ...if 9/11 was either let to happen or I will say it, yes planned to happen.

[J.S.N.]

Your starting to drift a little. I just admitted crimes by Israeli settlers against Palestinians in the other thread.
You should slow down, take a breath and understand that just because someone doesnt agree with your "opinions" it doesnt make them... well.... all the irrational things you keep labeling me. Perhaps social discussions arent for you...

nice tactic. act like i'm a mouth-breather when you can't even carry on a discussion. please point out where i've labeled you anything.

[DTBusta]

J.S.N -your right about what youre saying. Any one can confirm this if they saw the way Israel treated settlers to begin with..Yeah lets give the palestinians only 2 hours of water a week, cause thats humane. Oh and Palestinians also we will come in your town once a week and run over your homes with tanks,cause its our land. Screw the people who are in charge of such leadership. And they get away with it by convincing their people their doing it for the betterment of their own people. What a bunch of B.s. they are doing it for money, they are doing to to create an actual "war on terror" .If the american people for years were subject to dirt poor poverty and abuse by another gov't they too would be subject to such extreme ways of communicating dislike of destruction of their lives.

[ecivon]

My comment on the elders of zion was a in fact my general opinion, and not a response to you in particular.

However You say that your dislike of Zionism is derived from a philosophical opinion, yet you regularly contribute to hurtful conspiracy theories against jews, and a general attitude of illogical intolerance toward them. So You will forgive me if I dont take you seriously regarding your "Political considerations"

g'damn, what is the matter with you -- there you go again. Show me where I have contributed to one jewish conspiracy theory. Or for that matter against jews. My dislike of zionism and distrust of zionists is based on 20 years of working between the Palestinians and Israelis -- not on some whimsical notion I came across in the National Enquirer. My political experience is based on working with amongst others Uri Avnery, Adam Keller, Ran HaCohen, Amira Hass, Israel Shamir, the late Israel Shahak, MIFTAH/Hanan Ashrawi, the PLO/PNA and the ICJ.

[manwithin]

Than we have to look at the owner and leasholder of the WTC complex, Larry Silversterin, a long time friend of the Bush Falimy...He purchased the WTCs in July of 2001, just six weeks before the 9-11 attacks...And made sure the lease would cover two seperate terror attacks.


Quote:
From CNN
"Silverstein signed a 99-year lease taking control of the Trade Center in July 2001, six weeks before the attacks that killed 2,749 people and toppled 10 million square feet of commercial space in the twin towers and five other buildings. His insurance policies were not finalized at the time, leading to the legal disputes over which "per occurrence" policies applied."

"The insurers are collectively responsible for a maximum of $1.1 billion insurance per occurrence. The issue before the court was whether the insurers were obligated to pay for one occurrence or two. If the verdict is upheld it means the insurers would be obligated to pay up to $2.2 billion to Silverstein, which he would devote to construction at Ground Zero."
[/B]

You think Larry Silversterin is benefiting from this? Just so you know he has been in litigation for more then 5 years and has lost all but one of his cases all pertaining to the per occurrence policies... he has a policy for 3.2 billion it is estimated to cost about 9 billion to rebuild all the towers at WTC and he still has a lease payment of 120 million a year to make for the next 93 years and he has to rebuild Towers Two, Three, Four, and Seven by no later then 2012 or he will lose his lease.... He didn't know this was going to happen.

[Kärnfysikern]

wow your both idiots. It's not my fault I don't have an attention span of a goldfish(2 seconds)! Its called research and its not being desperate. To thoroughly look into something isn't pothetic. You are squirel boy and you to Karny, get a life j dogs. Oh wow clinton got a blow job, ironic you mention that, yes impeach that president but not the one for either making an mistake and getting into war and lying about it or deliberately doing it . Maybe its cause of this...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g4-yEp07MM followed by the actual news report of this actually being true msnbc- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdtnrZ_4CM8

If you have the balls to check these out you'd see you are being lied to and its right in your face. Hmm maybe its being held under the major media outlets by something called a gag order? And comapring this to clintons blow job in which only two people knew about are entirely different circumstances then if ...if 9/11 was either let to happen or I will say it, yes planned to happen.

Idiots huh? if your refering to me Id say Im a idiot in good company.
The guy that built the WTC say they went down because of the design, all the inspectors concluded the official version is plausible, every physicist, structural engineer and fire engineer on this damn planet say the towers feel in a manner that is to be expected.

The conspiracy theorist have laughable arguments, they dont hold any water under close scrutiny.

If what you call "research" is to browse the web for conspiracy theories then by all means go on with that.
Acctualy research is done by acctual experts. But then again they are to stupid to se whats obvious to every hick with a self proclaimed critical mind right?

Do you also subscribe to the theory that a missile not a plane hit the pentagon?

By the way your imaginary media gag order, even if it was true would not effect me. Know why? Because I am not a american and I dont watch american media.

[ecivon]

You think Larry Silversterin is benefiting from this? Just so you know he has been in litigation for more then 5 years and has lost all but one of his cases all pertaining to the per occurrence policies... he has a policy for 3.2 billion it is estimated to cost about 9 billion to rebuild all the towers at WTC and he still has a lease payment of 120 million a year to make for the next 93 years and he has to rebuild Towers Two, Three, Four, and Seven by no later then 2012 or he will lose his lease.... He didn't know this was going to happen.

Didn't the courts rule in Silverman's favor and gave him two insurance claims he was suing for?

[Kärnfysikern]

Continuation of my above post.

Its quite offensive to even suggest that all the experts that investigated the incident is either dishonest or to stupid to se the truth.

[manwithin]

Didn't the courts rule in Silverman's favor and gave him two insurance claims he was suing for?

Yes like I said "he lost all but one. He wants to recover $7.1 billion from the 22 insurers of the properties, twice the ostensible policy limit, on the ground that the attack of the center was two occurrences... If he knew about it why didn't he have a bigger policy?

[DTBusta]

Still a nice little investment.His lawyers are even paid for through his insurance coverage when he wins the cases/lets not forget that hes a realestate Guru and knows how to flip properties when he sees the chance to make a quick buck.
Immediate access to McGraw-Hill Construction Information and other MHC sites.

Business & Labor
Silverstein Wins Latest WTC Insurance Payment Case

(archrecord.construction.com - 12/08/04)

By Kevin Lerner

On December 6, a federal jury decided that the two planes that crashed into the World Trade Center towers on September 11, 2001, were two separate attacks, entitling Larry Silverstein, the leaseholder, to approximately $2.2 billion from nine different insurance companies. Had the jury, in U.S. District Court in Manhattan, decided that the two planes constituted only a single attack, Silverstein would only have been paid half of that.

Silverstein lost a first trial regarding insurance payouts earlier this year, but this new jury’s decision means the developer could ultimately collect $4.6 billion for the Sept. 11 attacks.

While that decision may still be overturned on appeal, the promise of more money may attract private investors to the site, or help Silverstein attract tenants for the two World Trade Center buildings he is already building, including 7 World Trade Center, where workers completed the steel frame in October, and at the landmark 1776-foot tall Freedom Tower. Neither of the buildings has a tenant.

[DTBusta]

um still made 1.4 billion atleast.And if our friend larry does end up collecting that 7.1 billion which will most likely happen then he will have made a 4.1 billion dollar profit.

[DTBusta]

Karnfysikern- many scientists, academic,and physicists have come out and said based on their studies it leads them to believe it was a demolition. Their tests tested positive for Thermite. Used in demolitions to weaken, eat away and liquify aluminum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermite



Scholars and scientists on the record showing what they found.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1770

[Superhuman]

Hey DTBusta you seem intelligent, as does Johan... some people are just not willing to believe something so evil is actually true so they would rather live in ignorance - but that is okay and expected. I know that I personally don't know the truth about what is going on, and that we ARE being lied to by our government about a whole plethora of different issues. I'm sure that whatever is going on it is truly in our nation's best interests though.

So we are getting Iraq's oil - Good for USA

Getting Afghan Poppy - Good for USA

Maybe faked moon landing to show US Superiority - Good for USA

LET Pearl Harbor happen - there were MANY people in this country who did NOT want to get involved in WWII so if FDR didn't let Pearl Harbor happen congress would not have approved our part in the war - which would mean Hitler would have succeeded.

SURE, the government lies - but in most cases it's for good reasons. Someday I will be President and when I am I will begin a new policy of truth

[mcpeepants]

Hey DTBusta you seem intelligent, as does Johan... some people are just not willing to believe something so evil is actually true so they would rather live in ignorance - but that is okay and expected. I know that I personally don't know the truth about what is going on, and that we ARE being lied to by our government about a whole plethora of different issues. I'm sure that whatever is going on it is truly in our nation's best interests though.

So we are getting Iraq's oil - Good for USA

Getting Afghan ***** - Good for USA

Maybe faked moon landing to show US Superiority - Good for USA

LET Pearl Harbor happen - there were MANY people in this country who did NOT want to get involved in WWII so if FDR didn't let Pearl Harbor happen congress would not have approved our part in the war - which would mean Hitler would have succeeded.

SURE, the government lies - but in most cases it's for good reasons. Someday I will be President and when I am I will begin a new policy of truth

1.Iraq's oil production has dropped--that's not good for US, Iraq, etc

2.******* production has risen since the overthrow of Taliban.

3. I don't think America would of been involved in WW2 if the Japanese hadn't attacked Pearl Harbor (largely due to the effects of WW1). It doesn't necessarily mean Hitler would of succeeded.

4. the moon landing definitely benefited the US

I think governments lie mostly for their benefit and sometimes for the peoples benefit.

[ecivon]

sometimes for the peoples benefit.

I don't think they ever lie for the people's benefit -- just to deceive and mislead people for the advantage of those that hold the power and themselves.

[juicedOUTbrain]

Idiots huh? if your refering to me Id say Im a idiot in good company.
The guy that built the WTC say they went down because of the design, all the inspectors concluded the official version is plausible, every physicist, structural engineer and fire engineer on this damn planet say the towers feel in a manner that is to be expected.

The conspiracy theorist have laughable arguments, they dont hold any water under close scrutiny.

If what you call "research" is to browse the web for conspiracy theories then by all means go on with that.
Acctualy research is done by acctual experts. But then again they are to stupid to se whats obvious to every hick with a self proclaimed critical mind right?

Do you also subscribe to the theory that a missile not a plane hit the pentagon?

By the way your imaginary media gag order, even if it was true would not effect me. Know why? Because I am not a american and I dont watch american media.

Not all engineers said the towers fell properly, Frand A DeMartini, the engineer that helped design the WTC, stated a few months before 9-11 that he thought the towers could take multiple jet impacts, because the outside was like a "screen netting"... He was killed in the south tower on 9-11.

"The building was designed to have a fully loaded 707 crash into it, that was the largest plane at the time. I believe that the building probably could sustain multiple impacts of jetliners. This structure is like the mosquito netting on your screen door, this intense grid. And the plane is like a pencil puncturing the screen netting. It really does nothing to the screen netting.

Video Source

Than you have the 9-11 scholors for truth. They dont make any theorys, just study the physics of ground zero. The leader of the group claims he found thermate residue in the wreckage. There are also videos of melting metal spilling from the impact site. Which is a direct result of thermate (which cuts through metal, and doesnt "explode"...)

Now I know that many of you have seen popular magazines that debunk these 9-11 theories. Many of these magazines are controlled by the same group of people that control big media, big defence, etc...for example when popular mechanics released, debunking 9-11 myths, i listened to what i thought was a credible source...turns out Benjamin Chertoff, michael chertoffs 1st cousin was the reporter and editor of the 2005 cover story...[=check it out.

From Popular MechanicsREPORTING: Benjamin Chertoff, Davin Coburn, Michael Connery, David Enders, Kevin Haynes, Kristin Roth, Tracy Saelinger, Erik Sofge and the editors of POPULAR MECHANICS.
PHOTOGRAPHY RESEARCH: Sarah Shatz.

And I have to add, WTC 1 and 2 being brought down by planes is one thing and very believable to me...But WTC 7 is the strongest piece of physical evidence we have. The media barely reported that at around 5 o'clock WTC 7 which was the furthest from 1 and 2, collapsed in on itself at free fall speed...It collapsed exactly like a controlled demolition, and to this day it is the only building to ever collapse due to fire ( besides 1+2)...It took the NIST 4 years to come up with an explaination as to why it happened, and even that seemed like a bunch of BS...the other closer towers closer to 1 and 2 burned for hours but left skeletons...

Video of WTC 7 collapse...how can any logical person see that and not realize that fire couldnt do that. Steel and concrete dont burn. And there was no jetfuel in that building...Johan your a phycisist, explain that to me? the building gets a crack right down the center which is textbook demolition...the center columns are blown so the building collapses in on itself...

The last thing ill post is a fox news report that only aired once talking about an israeli spy ring in the US, "trained in explosives ordinance" that "knew about 9-11 and didnt tell us"???? Fox News- Israeli Spy Ring

I believe that terrorists committed the attacks on 9-11, but i think some people let it happen and set up gaurentees to make sure the towers would fall and to make wind fall profits...a very important step to ensuring americans were scared out of their wits...I wont elaborate on my claims, I just want to lay out a few facts and let people tie them together...and no i dont think a missile hit the pentagon, i think thats disinformation...

When you have a president that cons his way into office in a legal but unethical way, exploits the 9-11 events to launch an illegal war, and is so intertwined in the defense and oil industries...does it really surprise you that people are suspicious???

[mcpeepants]

I don't think they ever lie for the people's benefit -- just to deceive and mislead people for the advantage of those that hold the power and themselves.

you got me there. I can't think of a case of the top of my head where a government lied for the people's benefits. It's usually a backhanded way of maintaining order, spreading propaganda, starting wars, etc.

[DTBusta]

SuperHuman--I hope your right.I hope Bush sending my brother on an air craft carrier two weeks ago to the Persian Gulf off Irans shoreline next to Iranian aircraft carriers doesnt provoke another war. Cause if it does this time it will be the end for us if it gets nasty like Iraq. This time the oil supply alone will knock us on our debt loving asses. with control of 40% of the oil we will be screwed if something goes wrong. And we all know the Bush administration joined a lawsuit in 2001 to stop production of the Ev1 a totally electric car being made by Gm in cali, well they won that lawsuit, destroyed the cars, conveniently went into a war that is now going bad, and whos going to get screwed if they make one more mistake, ie Iraq with this surge or Iran, the american people middle class and poor are the ones that will be screwed not these rich rich politicians.Anyway I hope all goes well...

[singern]

g'damn, what is the matter with you -- . My dislike of zionism and distrust of zionists is based on 20 years of working between the Palestinians and Israelis -My political experience is based on working with amongst others Uri Avnery, Adam Keller, Ran HaCohen, Amira Hass, Israel Shamir, the late Israel Shahak, MIFTAH/Hanan Ashrawi, the PLO/PNA and the ICJ.

What an impressive resume, but for the most obvious reasons I gotta call a big BS on that fictional load of crap.

Every name you inserted here is openly and enthusiastically anti Israel, pro palestinian, and most have written and preached anti zionism, where is the balance? Its no surprise you dislike and mistrust Israelis if all you subscribe to is the dark side. I can recommend many more names of moderate, intelligent, and credible Israeli sources which will surprise you, if you open up to the possibility that Israelis are good people.

[juicedOUTbrain]

it is truly in our nation's best interests though.

So we are getting Iraq's oil - Good for USA

Getting Afghan Poppy - Good for USA

Maybe faked moon landing to show US Superiority - Good for USA

LET Pearl Harbor happen - there were MANY people in this country who did NOT want to get involved in WWII so if FDR didn't let Pearl Harbor happen congress would not have approved our part in the war - which would mean Hitler would have succeeded.

SURE, the government lies - but in most cases it's for good reasons. Someday I will be President and when I am I will begin a new policy of truth

I agree with your post somewhat...but how is getting afghan poppy good? How does Iraqi oil benefit anyone other than the corporate execs that profit off of it...our gas prices are up...If the supply side is higher, and we are paying more, the only thing that means is that we are tasking it in the ass...

The number one goal of these people is to convnce people like you and I that these policies that are benefitting them, are good for us...and they do a damn fine job at it...

[juicedOUTbrain]

What an impressive resume, but for the most obvious reasons I gotta call a big BS on that fictional load of crap.

Every name you inserted here is openly and enthusiastically anti Israel, pro palestinian, and most have written and preached anti zionism, where is the balance? Its no surprise you dislike and mistrust Israelis if all you subscribe to is the dark side. I can recommend many more names of moderate, intelligent, and credible Israeli sources which will surprise you, if you open up to the possibility that Israelis are good people.

You are a ****ing moron...Not to say that there aren't points to be made on your side of the argument, but you've never made any of them...stop generalizing everything and claiming bias on anything you disagree with...

International law is pro-palestinian, the world community is pro-palestinian, the israelis are asking for peace sitting on another peoples occupied land...The israeli occupation is illegal according to the UN, the Jewish only settlements are illegal to the UN, the bulldozing of homes is illegal to the UN, the building of a wall outside your borders is illegal to the UN...Defending yourself from an occupation is completely legal according to the UN

your the only ignorant bastard here...and your the only one spewing fictional crap...

The only people that agree with you are hardline zionists and the people they control through the media...anyone who knows the truth of the situation, on context, sees the unreasonable requests israel makes, and the true goal behind there plan (annexation of territory) either you are evil and want to steal there land because your racist against muslims, or your just stupid and buy everything that gets pumped into your thick skull...I try not to respond to you, because there is no point...but seriously dude, make a legitimate point or shut the **** up...

research Dr. Norman Finkelstein a orthadox jew, his parents are holocaust survivors and he is starchly anti-zionist...call him a racist

Its people like you that give jews like me a bad name... you dont fear god, you dont listen to the commandments...you are not a true jew...show me where there are exceptions to the 10 commandments...

[spywizard]

Name calling and intolerance are not allowed on this board, so that's enough of that..