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  1. #561
    wenis piggler is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    Please see the reply to bigdawgs post above as I wrote certain parts of that post to answer yours. If that doesnt answer your question to your satisfaction then let me know and I will see what I can do....

    Therefore, both e2 (via aromatase) and exogenous test will suppress the hypothalamus?

    Is it e2, testosterone (exogenous), or both that suppress the hypothalamus? I have heard that it is e2 that suppresses it, but if you use an AI and therefore have low/no e2, then is it the test (exogenous) that is suppressing your natural production?
    Last edited by wenis piggler; 03-12-2009 at 06:12 PM.

  2. #562
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    Quote Originally Posted by wenis piggler View Post
    Therefore, both e2 (via aromatase) and exogenous test will suppress the hypothalamus?

    Is it e2, testosterone (exogenous), or both that suppress the hypothalamus? I have heard that it is e2 that suppresses it, but if you use an AI and therefore have low/no e2, then is it the test (exogenous) that is suppressing your natural production?
    It is both, high E2 (estradiol for those reading at home) plays a dominate role in inhibiting LH production by the Hypothalamus according to some authors. Exogenous steroids also inhibit the hypothalamus but the action of excess E2 can not be the only explanation as some drugs do not increase estrogen production at all. Additionally in genetic disorders such as Klinefelters, there is high levels of serum E2, but there is also high levels of LH and FSH. But there are very low levels of T in serum, and in some cases a decrease in testicular size. So the low levels of T are causing the hypothalamus to produce LH, FSH releasing hormones and the anterior pituitary to produce FSH and LH in higher levels to cope even though E2 is high. As you can see the interplay with these hormones is very complicated.

    Amended for more clarity...
    Last edited by MuscleScience; 03-23-2009 at 08:52 PM.

  3. #563
    Phate's Avatar
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    are 17aa steroids like winny as hepatotoxic if injected as they are if taken orally

  4. #564
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phate View Post
    are 17aa steroids like winny as hepatotoxic if injected as they are if taken orally
    I would think relatively speaking that they would not be. Simple because they bypass the first pass effect via the IM route vs the Oral route. And on a milligram for milligram basis more gets to the target tissue before it actually makes a pass through the liver. But let me say that its probably still going to have an negative impact on liver function if used in an irresponsible manner.

  5. #565
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    In your opinion, what would be less harmful for someone age 20 to take between anavar , a prohormone, or things like CJC-1295, GHRP-6, IGF etc

    would the use of one of these cause enough damage/instability to the HPTA that that person would be negatively impacted for an extended duration of time

  6. #566
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phate View Post
    In your opinion, what would be less harmful for someone age 20 to take between anavar , a prohormone, or things like CJC-1295, GHRP-6, IGF etc

    would the use of one of these cause enough damage/instability to the HPTA that that person would be negatively impacted for an extended duration of time
    The only reasonable thing I can say is potentially. Anything you put in your body can potentially have harmful side effects. Some people never experience them and some do. I could shout load and say no no no, to taking them because they can cause such and such. However I am smarter than all the anti-drug people out there and I just say hey its your body your of age and as long as you know the risks involved with each compound who am I to say otherwise.

  7. #567
    IM708's Avatar
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    Which avatar do you like more? The testosterone molecule im using currently or arnolds tits which was my last one.

  8. #568
    MuscleScience's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ironmaiden708 View Post
    Which avatar do you like more? The testosterone molecule im using currently or arnolds tits which was my last one.
    This one!!!

  9. #569
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    Ok so for the last ten weeks ive had the same routine, for each exercise ive been doing 4 sets of 10 reps and im needing to change it. So im thinking like this, for example if im doing flat bench press, could i do 3 sets of 6 reps but making the weight as heavy as possible.. Would i continue to make gains with this???

    My full chest routine will look like this:

    Flat bp 3x6
    incline db 3x6
    incline bb 3x6
    incline machine press 3x6
    flys 3x6

    I will go as heavy as possible, am i over doing it or do i need to add anything????

    As always thanks...

  10. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAD MATT View Post
    Ok so for the last ten weeks ive had the same routine, for each exercise ive been doing 4 sets of 10 reps and im needing to change it. So im thinking like this, for example if im doing flat bench press, could i do 3 sets of 6 reps but making the weight as heavy as possible.. Would i continue to make gains with this???

    My full chest routine will look like this:

    Flat bp 3x6
    incline db 3x6
    incline bb 3x6
    incline machine press 3x6
    flys 3x6

    I will go as heavy as possible, am i over doing it or do i need to add anything????

    As always thanks...
    These two routines are pretty much identical to how I set up my workouts throughout the year. I switch my routine up every 12 weeks like clock work. Although I usually do not go extremely heavy on my axillary lifts but thats a matter of preference for me. Right now I am coming off my heavy phase, the one thing that needs to be remembered when going to a heavy low rep routine is that every so often to do a light week to keep little nagging injuries down and give your body a little extra rest. I just play that by ear and how my body feels.

  11. #571
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    Thanks lol...

  12. #572
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAD MATT View Post
    Thanks lol...
    your welcome

  13. #573
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    So i did my back today using my new routine, as we talked about. However i found that instead of taking 1 hour it only took 40 mins and i was thinking should i add more exercises or just stop. My back routine goes like this:
    Seated rows 3x6
    Dead lifts 3x6
    Wide grip pull ups 3x6
    Bent over rows 3x6
    Machine rows 3x6

    Now even though it only took 40 mins i dont want to start over training, so shall i stick with it or add to it??

    Thanks..

  14. #574
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAD MATT View Post
    So i did my back today using my new routine, as we talked about. However i found that instead of taking 1 hour it only took 40 mins and i was thinking should i add more exercises or just stop. My back routine goes like this:
    Seated rows 3x6
    Dead lifts 3x6
    Wide grip pull ups 3x6
    Bent over rows 3x6
    Machine rows 3x6

    Now even though it only took 40 mins i dont want to start over training, so shall i stick with it or add to it??

    Thanks..
    No I dont think you really need to add much. Remember your adding more weight in there so your intensity is going up. As I said when you go heavy you need to make sure you do not over do it, which can lead to aches and pains.

  15. #575
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    My pectoralis major is hurting. I think I caused it by close grip bench press. It's been a couple weeks and still has a slight pain to it. The area that hurts is the front of my right shoulder. Are there any exercises that will help make it stronger? I'm switching to DB presses tomorrow.

  16. #576
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severe View Post
    My pectoralis major is hurting. I think I caused it by close grip bench press. It's been a couple weeks and still has a slight pain to it. The area that hurts is the front of my right shoulder. Are there any exercises that will help make it stronger? I'm switching to DB presses tomorrow.
    You may be better off taking some time off from exercising that area.

  17. #577
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    Whats the next best options other than a "release" for curing blue balls ?

  18. #578
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSM4Life View Post
    Whats the next best options other than a "release" for curing blue balls ?
    Ice water

  19. #579
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    Ice water
    outch, ill stick to my first remedy.

  20. #580
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    Quote Originally Posted by DSM4Life View Post
    outch, ill stick to my first remedy.
    Mad Matt???

  21. #581
    jbm's Avatar
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    My Chest workout is like this:
    Bench press
    Flat flys
    Incline dumbell press
    Peck deck
    all are 4 sets 12/10/10/8 reps
    I want to put mass. Is this over training?
    Any opinions bro?

  22. #582
    MuscleScience's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbm View Post
    My Chest workout is like this:
    Bench press
    Flat flys
    Incline dumbell press
    Peck deck
    all are 4 sets 12/10/10/8 reps
    I want to put mass. Is this over training?
    Any opinions bro?
    Well Pec Deck and flat flies are almost exactly the same. I really like Bosu ball push ups or or some other pushup type exercise. I think 4 exercise for chest is pretty close to the perfect number of exercises. The Pecs are not considered a large muscle group as I have said many times before. As such they do not need the same amount of sets and reps like the back or legs do.

    I cant say if its over training, because I am sure for awhile your body can handle that much volume. Its basically a matter of how you feel and knowing the signs and symptoms of overtraining syndrome. Additionally a lot of people are afraid of taking a light day or even a day off for fear of not making gains. When in fact it can be the best thing for your overall routine if you look at the big picture instead of going week by week.

  23. #583
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    Well Pec Deck and flat flies are almost exactly the same. I really like Bosu ball push ups or or some other pushup type exercise. I think 4 exercise for chest is pretty close to the perfect number of exercises. The Pecs are not considered a large muscle group as I have said many times before. As such they do not need the same amount of sets and reps like the back or legs do.

    I cant say if its over training, because I am sure for awhile your body can handle that much volume. Its basically a matter of how you feel and knowing the signs and symptoms of overtraining syndrome. Additionally a lot of people are afraid of taking a light day or even a day off for fear of not making gains. When in fact it can be the best thing for your overall routine if you look at the big picture instead of going week by week.
    Ok! well which is better 3 exercises with 4 sets each or 4 exercises with 3 sets each? for my chest.

  24. #584
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbm View Post
    Ok! well which is better 3 exercises with 4 sets each or 4 exercises with 3 sets each? for my chest.
    Well thats a pretty difficult question to answer really, yet it isnt. What I mean is it really depends on what your training for. If your a BB you need to do different exercise that hit at different angles. Now the pecs will contract entirely no matter the chest exercise. It is the activation of the assisting muscles that will be differ.

    If your training for athletics you want to do exercises that mimic those movement patterns one would expect in competition. That and unstable surfaces are great for enhancing neuromuscular proprioception. Typically to train for neuromuscular improvement, repetition is the key. Its building that neural network between your brain and muscles that takes time and training that only repeated exposure to the movement patterns can provide.

  25. #585
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    I posted on your blog.

    Get back at me.

  26. #586
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    Quote Originally Posted by QuieTSToRM33 View Post
    I posted on your blog.

    Get back at me.
    Replied!!!

  27. #587
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    hey brother. here is the deal. i have had the same as stagnant routine for long enough. what do you suggest doing different as this is what i have been doing for a while. i need a complete overhaul here. if you want i can post up what i think would be revised and you can critique if need be but here is my current.

    (my first exercise of any body parts i do a few warmup sets before progressing to my working sets.)

    CHEST
    DB flat bench
    3 sets of 6-8 reps.
    Hammer strength incline
    3 sets of 6-8 reps
    Hammer decline
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    pec dec flys
    3 sets of 10 (really trying to squeeze at peak contraction)
    weighted dips
    as many as i can do

    BACK
    pull ups or pull downs
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    bent over rows
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    hammer strength iso lateral lat pulldown
    3 sets of 8-12 reps
    seated rows or bent over dumbell rows
    3 sets of 8-12
    END or sometimes burnout w/behind the neck pulldowns

    Shoulders
    DB shoulder press
    3 sets of 6-8
    Lateral raises
    3 sets of 8-12
    clean and press
    3 sets of 10-12
    bent over lateral raises
    3 sets of 8-12
    sometimes finish with front raises as a burnout

    this is all i need revised. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. also wante to ask your take on light weight for growth and rest-pause training. thanks MS.

  28. #588
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    Quote Originally Posted by peachfuzz View Post
    hey brother. here is the deal. i have had the same as stagnant routine for long enough. what do you suggest doing different as this is what i have been doing for a while. i need a complete overhaul here. if you want i can post up what i think would be revised and you can critique if need be but here is my current.

    (my first exercise of any body parts i do a few warmup sets before progressing to my working sets.)

    CHEST
    DB flat bench
    3 sets of 6-8 reps.
    Hammer strength incline
    3 sets of 6-8 reps
    Hammer decline
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    pec dec flys
    3 sets of 10 (really trying to squeeze at peak contraction)
    weighted dips
    as many as i can do

    BACK
    pull ups or pull downs
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    bent over rows
    3 sets 8-12 reps
    hammer strength iso lateral lat pulldown
    3 sets of 8-12 reps
    seated rows or bent over dumbell rows
    3 sets of 8-12
    END or sometimes burnout w/behind the neck pulldowns

    Shoulders
    DB shoulder press
    3 sets of 6-8
    Lateral raises
    3 sets of 8-12
    clean and press
    3 sets of 10-12
    bent over lateral raises
    3 sets of 8-12
    sometimes finish with front raises as a burnout

    this is all i need revised. any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. also wante to ask your take on light weight for growth and rest-pause training. thanks MS.
    Yeah post up your revised routine, I am not sure what types of exercises you like and what equipment you have access to at your gym. You mentioned Hammer Strength, which I absolutely love.

    Just for a initial look, it looks like we are going to need to do something about the reps and weight ranges and maybe not so much changing the exercises themselves. Also I assume your doing Legs???

  29. #589
    jbm's Avatar
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    Muscle, Is it ok to have no abs, bodyfat around 18 to 20% when you do a bulking cycle?

  30. #590
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbm View Post
    Muscle, Is it ok to have no abs, bodyfat around 18 to 20% when you do a bulking cycle?
    Well I guess thats a matter of opinion, if your a powerlifter they usually could care less about BF. If your into bodybuilding then that high a BF kind of hides the muscle mass if you will.

    I personally never try to get much higher than 15% if I can help it barring injury but thats just me. I will say that bulking and high BF can potentially have a negative effect on your BP.

  31. #591
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    Is there any good reason to squat lower than parallel?

  32. #592
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nooomoto View Post
    Is there any good reason to squat lower than parallel?
    Sure there is, ACL strains, meniscus tears, patella tendon tendonitis/osis, quad pulls, lower back strains, SI joint strains.

    What I am saying is that the risk vs benefit by performing below parallel squats, is really not worth the risk. Regardless of what some huge ass bodybuilder says.

  33. #593
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    In bodybuilding point of view. When you bulk which is better free weights or machine?

  34. #594
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    Sure there is, ACL strains, meniscus tears, patella tendon tendonitis/osis, quad pulls, lower back strains, SI joint strains.

    What I am saying is that the risk vs benefit by performing below parallel squats, is really not worth the risk. Regardless of what some huge ass bodybuilder says.
    Thanks.

  35. #595
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbm View Post
    In bodybuilding point of view. When you bulk which is better free weights or machine?
    Well I think a lot of the body builders I know both pro and amateur would say you build your base off of free weights. Machines are good at isolating particular muscle groups and all, but you do not get the full effect of activating the stabilization muscles that you get with free weights, thus less muscles get involved in the exercise.

    But I would like some of the more experienced bodybuilders to chime in on this, because I do not prescribe to traditional bodybuilding practices all the time.

  36. #596
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    Are you familiar with Heat Shock Proteins? Any idea of why these companies are pumping out these products? Do they aid in any way with muscle recovery/growth?

  37. #597
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    Is nolvadex effective at preventing gyno being stimulated by progesterone? I know alot of parrots say it can exacurbate it but im not convinced. What are your thoughts?

  38. #598
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    Quote Originally Posted by ironmaiden708 View Post
    Are you familiar with Heat Shock Proteins? Any idea of why these companies are pumping out these products? Do they aid in any way with muscle recovery/growth?
    Heat shock proteins are a large class of intracellular and extracellular chaperon proteins that help hold other proteins proper three dimensional structure under conditions of increased heat. They basically help the cell maintain its working physiology under times of high heat stress. If you recall, heating a protein is one way to denature or disrupt its normal three dimensional structure, thus affecting its function.

    It has been recently found that some heat shock proteins are also intra and extra cellular messengers. I have not heard of why companies are marketing these products. In fact I seen no such thing at all.

    If you have a link to some of the products out there maybe I could speculate on it some.....

  39. #599
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    Quote Originally Posted by peachfuzz View Post
    Is nolvadex effective at preventing gyno being stimulated by progesterone? I know alot of parrots say it can exacurbate it but im not convinced. What are your thoughts?
    There maybe some truth to that. I do know that progesterones effects are amplified in the presense of estrogen. So mayb by blocking the estrogen receptors that progesterones effects would be minimized or lessened. I dont have and documentations on a SERM's specific effect on that. But that would be my guess as to were some would be lead to believe this. On the flip side of that, since nolvadex mimics estrogen to and extent that it binds to selected estrogen receptors that it may in someway act on this amplification effect.

    The progesterone and estrogen relationship is a fairly complicated one that dont really think that the start of the art if you will fully explains. There are a plethora of papers on it. It seems to me that each and every paper seems to raise new questions on the two's relationships together. That is what the last speaker I heard talk about in later 07 seemed to imply.
    Last edited by MuscleScience; 03-29-2009 at 08:20 PM.

  40. #600
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    http://www.1 fast 400 dot com/?products_id=7292 - myoshock hsp


    http://www.gnc.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3469796 - hsp active


    heres a couple

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