"Same sex marriage" What is your opinion?

[Gaylord Focker]

I just want my child to be hetro.

I don't think you get to pick your childs sexual preference...I believe more and more studies show it to be a biological thing...having said that I don't care if gays get married or not...I do however believe gay marriages should be child free...based simply on the fact of the ridicule the child will face growing up...kids are mean to one another...why stack the cards against them anymore then neccesary...two gay people may be the most caring parents the world...but the child is what I am concerned with...and how society will view and judge them...because they will be judged...

[TheMudMan]

I don't think you get to pick your childs sexual preference...I believe more and more studies show it to be a biological thing...having said that I don't care if gays get married or not...I do however believe gay marriages should be child free...based simply on the fact of the ridicule the child will face growing up...kids are mean to one another...why stack the cards against them anymore then neccesary...two gay people may be the most caring parents the world...but the child is what I am concerned with...and how society will view and judge them...because they will be judged...

I agree kids are mean but I don't think it makes a difference who the parents are........ Kids will always find something to pick on......... comming from a poor family, being fat, ugly, mixed raced marriage couples, the list could go on....... It's the parents job to make their children understand not everyone is the same but all should be given the same respect they would want. JMO

[Carlos_E]

I don't think you get to pick your childs sexual preference...I believe more and more studies show it to be a biological thing...having said that I don't care if gays get married or not...I do however believe gay marriages should be child free...based simply on the fact of the ridicule the child will face growing up...kids are mean to one another...why stack the cards against them anymore then neccesary...two gay people may be the most caring parents the world...but the child is what I am concerned with...and how society will view and judge them...because they will be judged...

All kids that are different get teased. Based on your logic minorities or over weight or ugly parents or anyone who's different shouldn't have kids because of the way society will view and judge them. They have more cards stacked against them.

[Mart651]

All kids that are different get teased. Based on your logic minorities or over weight or ugly parents or anyone who's different shouldn't have kids because of the way society will view and judge them. They have more cards stacked against them.

Even the fat and ugly kids will pick on them.

[Carlos_E]

Even the fat and ugly kids will pick on them.

Only if you teach them to do so. Remember, kids follow your example.

[daman1]

Only if you teach them to do so. Remember, kids follow your example.

ditto.

[Mart651]

Only if you teach them to do so. Remember, kids follow your example.

So when the kid at my school picked on me because I was talking to a girl he liked, it was because his parents did not teach him any better. BS. BS. if anything comes natural it is kids picking on kids.

[Tock]

1) people want to have a contract denoting inheritence rights, medical, etc - I cant see any problem with that no more than 2 people making any other type of contract - but marriage, NO

2) Because it is part of the agenda to make marriage just seem like a civil contract - and that is not what it is -

3) the same way that parenting has been devolved to almost something that you pick up at the grocery store - and that is not what it is.

4) and say what you will - the desire to engage in homosexual acts is a LEARNED response - doesnt mean that some may indeed have a predisposition (I would say spiritually so, but many of you dont believe in that so I will say genetic) for homosexual acts.

5) See, when it all boils down to it "gayness" is simply one thing - a person wants to have sex with people of the same gender -

6) thats all it is

7) - but they want to couch it in so much BS, lifestyle, blah blah etc - its just ****ing someone of the same gender - thats all -

8) and in the end, it is not enough that they do this (which I could care less, since everyone is entitled to their own way) they are determined to convince everyone that sex with same gender is just as "moral" as sex with the opposite

9) - and if they cant raise themselves up then society will see to it that it lowers the institution of marriage untill it is no longer considered anything but a piece of paper given by the state for convinient financial reasons

10) a la the Soviet Union

1) Huh . . .

2) For all practical matters, it is a civil contract. Sure, you can skip the legal part of filling out the forms at the Courthouse and just have a church ceremony, but for all practical matters, it doesn't mean much.
All that gay folks are asking for are the same legal recognitions that you straight folks get when you sign those papers at the Courthouse. That's it. Why should that be a problem?

3) Gay folks haven't done anything to influence the problems that straight folks have with their marriages or with their kids. There's some gay and lesbian couples who, after intense scrutiny by adoption agencies, take up some of the slack for those kids from failed heterosexual marriages.
. . . I guess what I'm saying here is that I don't know what you're talking about . . .

4) And you know this from what?
Having been gay all my 48 years and had lots of time to figure this out, I don't think you're correct. I grew up amongst a bunch of heterosexuals, never knew any gay people in school, in fact, I didn't even know what the word "gay" meant until after I was in the USAF (which is NOT the best time or place to discover such things, let me tell ya).
So despite having been surrounded by straights, watched 'em on TV, had heterosexuality modeled for me day after day everywhere I went, I turned out gay.
I've lived with this for 48 years, and you're gonna tell me how I wound up gay? Ok, Einstein . . . You tell me how.

5) Not quite. Homosexuality is sex with the same gender. "Gayness" covers the accompanying lifestyle. Friends, spouse, abuse by those who don't know what they're talking about, abuse by those who like to beat up queers, discrimination, forming friendships with other people in the same situation and socializing together.
Didn't they teach you any of this in school? No? Did they want you to be ignorant about the gay lifestyle and about gays and lesbians? Shame on them . . .

6) Tsk tsk tsk . . .

7) Let me ask you this . . . if ****ing is "all it is" for gays, why isn't ****ing "all it is" for straights?

8) . . . and just how is gay sex less moral than straight sex?

9) I am not a religious person. Lots of people aren't. Lots of straight atheist couples regard marriage as purely a civil matter where the government recognition of their coupleship makes a practical difference. There's all sorts of social benefits that come with that recognition; cheaper taxes, cheaper insurance, cheaper season tickets at the opera, that sort of thing. Plus there's the intangible thing about "being married" that makes a coupleship seem a bit more, um, "special" than any of their other relationships.
Some religious folks like the "spiritual thing" they get from going through a religious ritual, which is fine by me; nothing wrong with that. But I don't think there should be a requirement that everyone submit to a religious ritual to have the government's legal recognition of their coupleship. That's going just a bit too far, IMHO.

10) or like the "quickie" drive-through marriages (and divorces) in Las Vegas? Oh yah, those marriages are a real boon to society . . . yep . . . get those love puppies ****ing ASAP, have a bunch of kids, get tired of each other and the yapping kids, leave the kids with the folks, and run away in different directions. Oh yah. Sure, pick on gay couples instead of problems like this. Right. **** up the US Constitution with an amendment.
Sounds like something the Soviet Union would do, allright . . .

Not to sound condescending or anything, but Cycleon, Boopsie, you don't have the foggiest idea of what you're talking about. I've lived with this for 48 years . . . you need to spend some time with me and learn a thing or two about gay people.

--Tock

[TheMudMan]

So when the kid at my school picked on me because I was talking to a girl he liked, it was because his parents did not teach him any better. BS. BS. if anything comes natural it is kids picking on kids.

No it was because he felt threaten that you may end up with the girl he liked. You are right though kids love to pick on other kids no matter what it's about.

[spywizard]

You and Tock.........

So being Pedophiles is not a choice, but a chemical predetermined behavoir??? Just like being Gay???

that is the what you are saying.???

I can never understand how you hipacrites can say "I'm gay... i don't have a choice... "

but you refuse to support someone else's choice... ......

and yes........ same sex relations is a choice.........

I don't think you get to pick your childs sexual preference...I believe more and more studies show it to be a biological thing...having said that I don't care if gays get married or not...I do however believe gay marriages should be child free...based simply on the fact of the ridicule the child will face growing up...kids are mean to one another...why stack the cards against them anymore then neccesary...two gay people may be the most caring parents the world...but the child is what I am concerned with...and how society will view and judge them...because they will be judged...

[Tock]

Originally Posted by abstrack
Comparing guys coming out gay and staying gay is like apples and oranges. Being raped or being turned into somones bitch is a whole different ball game were talking about. You cant compare normal life to prison life, 2 different worlds.

Have you ever been in prison? Then don't give me that liberal b.s.
Not all of them stay for 20 yrs and it totaly kills the choice idea.
I have expierenced many different things in my life and have many friends that have been changed by certain things in their lives.

Um, I think what you're talking about is what's called "opportunistic homosexuality." It's something that happens when guys are away from women for extended periods of time. When the women come back, the gay sex stops.
--Tock

[tryingtogetbig]

2) For all practical matters, it is a civil contract. Sure, you can skip the legal part of filling out the forms at the Courthouse and just have a church ceremony, but for all practical matters, it doesn't mean much.
All that gay folks are asking for are the same legal recognitions that you straight folks get when you sign those papers at the Courthouse. That's it. Why should that be a problem?

So why would passing a "civil union" law not make the gay population happy? That would allow the same legal recognitions.

Oh yeah...you didn't read my long post.

peace,

ttgb

[Tock]

1) So being Pedophiles is not a choice, but a chemical predetermined behavoir??? Just like being Gay???
that is the what you are saying.???



2) I can never understand how you hipacrites can say "I'm gay... i don't have a choice... "

3) but you refuse to support someone else's choice... ......

4) and yes........ same sex relations is a choice.........

1) IMHO, that's probably part of the reason why some folks (the lucky ones) are gay. I'm gonna guess here and say it's probably a combination of genetics and environment. Experts who have studied this for years and years don't agree, and admit they don't really know, either.
All I can say is that I grew up in a house with 2 brothers and 2 sisters, we all had the same parents and same living conditions, and only one of us is gay.

2) Let me put it this way . . . ya, I could choose to marry a woman, but our sex life would suck, so to speak. I'd always know I wanted a man, so why should I marry a woman? Sure wouldn't be doing her any favors . . .

3) Hey, if you want to turn gay, I have no problem with that. In fact, you can choose to be gay as easily as I can choose to be straight. What do you say we trade sexual orientation for a week and see how it goes?

4) If you say so. But I'm as inclined to choose being straight as much as you are (I think anyway-ya never really know about these things) to choose being gay.

Even if it is a choice, what difference does it make? So my boyfriend and I get together and ****. So what? Who says I have to stop? You? Your religion? In case you didn't know this . . . I am under no obligation to comply with the rules of your religion. You can, if you like. But I ain't gonna.

--Tock

[Animal Cracker]

Adoption-Inheritence-Pensions-..not an issue. These degenerates just want to make a statment to normal folks...queers have been schlong sucking for years..it has never been an issue until recently.
Sodom and Gomorrah all over again. Next child molester will want absolute immunity to diddle with your young'uns.

[Tock]

So why would passing a "civil union" law not make the gay population happy? That would allow the same legal recognitions.

Oh yeah...you didn't read my long post.

peace,

ttgb

If all 50 states passed civil union laws for both straights and gays, that would do the trick. Make everyone happy. Then let the churches determine who they want to marry.

--Tock

[tryingtogetbig]

Somewhat off topic...funny none the less!

[Beat]

Gay marraige means they will be able to adopt kids and raise them as they see fit.
Here is my problem with men adopting boys. I have a son who is 2. When he gets older I assume that he will be curious as all kids are. If the next door neighbors kid is father by gays, he more than likely will be curious about men. Now my son goes to play in the field and the little neighbor boy comes over asking to play doctor or show me and I will show you. This is usualy between boys and girls but because thats all the little neighbor boy has ever seen, my son has now been subjected to homosexuality. Needless to say I go kill the parents.

word, i agree.. for those who say: "as long as faggs dont affect me directly, its alright".. sooner or later it will affect you directly like in mart651s example.. as gay relationships get more and more accepted the society in whole becomes gay accepting, before you know it your son is gay because "its normal" wtf

[spywizard]

Here's one for ya Tock..

You are gay because you are insecure, and lazy....

In the gay community... even ugly gays (not alot of them) can get laid, any time of the day or night..

So when you were in the AF, and away from home for the first time, it was easy to get with guys.. .it was fun, the secracy, the naughtyness of it.. and if one guy at a party said no... there were 3 others that would say.. yea baby... a club a way to exlude others..

so no rejection, no competition (that you couldn't handle) and you get to be special for once in your life.

Just a thought................. and it may not apply to you.... but i believe there is some truth in it........????????

1) IMHO, that's probably part of the reason why some folks (the lucky ones) are gay. I'm gonna guess here and say it's probably a combination of genetics and environment. Experts who have studied this for years and years don't agree, and admit they don't really know, either.
All I can say is that I grew up in a house with 2 brothers and 2 sisters, we all had the same parents and same living conditions, and only one of us is gay.

2) Let me put it this way . . . ya, I could choose to marry a woman, but our sex life would suck, so to speak. I'd always know I wanted a man, so why should I marry a woman? Sure wouldn't be doing her any favors . . .

3) Hey, if you want to turn gay, I have no problem with that. In fact, you can choose to be gay as easily as I can choose to be straight. What do you say we trade sexual orientation for a week and see how it goes?

4) If you say so. But I'm as inclined to choose being straight as much as you are (I think anyway-ya never really know about these things) to choose being gay.

Even if it is a choice, what difference does it make? So my boyfriend and I get together and ****. So what? Who says I have to stop? You? Your religion? In case you didn't know this . . . I am under no obligation to comply with the rules of your religion. You can, if you like. But I ain't gonna.

--Tock

[tryingtogetbig]

When laws are added, deleted, or amended in the United States (and elsewhere I would assume), it is typically done for the "better good of the nation" and to have a positive affect on the "overwhelming majority."

How does this apply to gay marriage?

peace,

ttgb

bump...nobody addressed this....

[spywizard]

How silly and young are you????????

You haven't live enough life to know what is good or not...

Science has not proven anything regarding this subject.. there are papers written for and against.....

Silly wacker............


Keep your mouth shut, and have others think you ignorant, that's better than opening it, and proving that you have no common sense.

and stop spouting off the opinions of your teachers.........

Same sex relations is a choice? That's pretty ignorant of you. Do you know from experience? I'm not gay and I can figure this one out. It's not hard. Science has proven that the brain wave patterns of many homosexuals are that of the opposite sex, which would explain why they find the same sex so appealing, since that kind of stuff is hard-wired into our brains. Now granted, there are people who are homosexual because of a number of negative childhood experiences, but again, They can't help it. They're a product of our society. Just like pedophiles. Pedophiles aren't born. They're turned that way because someone in their childhood molested them, likely on numerous occasions. It's an on-going cycle. This doesn't or shouldn't exempt them from their behavior, but it's not completely their fault. I'm sure some gays could be "treated", much in the same way other abnormal sexual behavior (anyone who's gay, please take no offense to this, I'm referring to those who are gay because of childhood experience...) is treated, but why mess with it? These people are happy with who they are, and you should at least respect that. Not many people in this world are happy with themselves or proud for who they are, and one reason why a number of gays don't feel so proud to be gay is oppressive attitudes like yours. Why not try looking at things with an intelligent and open mind next time? Just because someone chooses to live their life differently from you, gives you no right to ostracize them for doing so...

[Mart651]

I agree with you spy, maybe a little hersh but true.

His comments sound just like a speach I heard from my proffesor years ago.
His biggest problem was he was a Democrat.

How silly and young are you????????

You haven't live enough life to know what is good or not...

Science has not proven anything regarding this subject.. there are papers written for and against.....

Silly wacker............


Keep your mouth shut, and have others think you ignorant, that's better than opening it, and proving that you have no common sense.

and stop spouting off the opinions of your teachers.........

[Carlos_E]

it was easy to get with guys.. .it was fun, the secracy, the naughtyness of it.. and if one guy at a party said no... there were 3 others that would say.. yea baby... a club a way to exlude others..

so no rejection, no competition (that you couldn't handle) and you get to be special for once in your life.

Is this why you hook up with guys? If you're not gay, how did you come to this conclusion?

[Mart651]

Is this why you hook up with guys? If you're not gay, how did you come to this conclusion?

Your stuff is always confrontational bro. Why?

[spywizard]

Tock.


Even if it is a choice, what difference does it make? So my boyfriend and I get together and ****. So what? Who says I have to stop? You? Your religion? In case you didn't know this . . . I am under no obligation to comply with the rules of your religion. You can, if you like. But I ain't gonna.


True, and i agree with you.......... i have never forced anyone to be like me... I believe everyone has a right to seek happiness...

The issue becomes.............. I don't have to like your choices... I don't have to like them, or accept you into my existance simply because you are a human being..

I would rather never know your sexual orientation... i would rather never know that you are a different color, or religion....

(When i say you, i mean this is for everyone) i would rather build relationships based on common goals, and interest, a commonality... that is what we are striving for.. (at least i am).....

When a teacher, or a coworker, or business partner tells me his or her sexual orientation, they are asking for trouble, not from me per say because my experience with gay men has always been very possitive.. I tell them no, and they don't approach anymore... they can still be in the same group where we are enjoying a common event, but i am not so inclined..

[spywizard]

Actully carlos, i have never had a sexual encounter with a male..

I have been Hit on, numerous times..... especially when i visit my brother and spend time with his friends in atlanta.. he is gay..........

and to cover the situation further.......... he was molested at the age of 13 by a man........ at least that's what he attributes his choices.......

but he's 41............. and it is easier...........

Is this why you hook up with guys? If you're not gay, how did you come to this conclusion?

[Gaylord Focker]

All kids that are different get teased. Based on your logic minorities or over weight or ugly parents or anyone who's different shouldn't have kids because of the way society will view and judge them. They have more cards stacked against them.

good point..that makes sense...I guess what I am trying to say is don't make a poilitical statement at the expense of a child...just because a person can...and be prepared to handle the hate that will come from it...be ready for the ridicule that will follow...because it will...I just worry about the child...

You and Tock.........

So being Pedophiles is not a choice, but a chemical predetermined behavoir??? Just like being Gay???

that is the what you are saying.???

I can never understand how you hipacrites can say "I'm gay... i don't have a choice... "

but you refuse to support someone else's choice... ......

and yes........ same sex relations is a choice.........

Let me see...I can't tell you much about being a pedophile nor a homosexual...because I am neither...so there goes your I'm a hipocrite argument...and whos choice did I refuse?...also any sexual relations is a choice regardless if it be straight or gay...IMO what sex gives you a chub isn't...

[Carlos_E]

When laws are added, deleted, or amended in the United States (and elsewhere I would assume), it is typically done for the "better good of the nation" and to have a positive affect on the "overwhelming majority."

That is very true. How will adding an amendment to the constitution to ban gay marriages benefit everyone? It doesn't.

[Mart651]

Are you gay? no
Do you have kids? no
Then you have no dog in this race.

Hate to break it to you, but it doesn't work that way. Yes, there will be a few "psychos" out there who might attempt to force their child to behave homosexually, but that doesn't mean all gay parents will do so. Being gay isn't like a religion, where people push it on you. So are you saying that if a mentally retarded person or amputee adopts a child, that they're gonna turn the kid into a retard or an amputee? That's just silly. People are so quick to blame others for their bad parenting. Kids follow the example that is exposed to them the greatest, which means, if you have a wife or girlfriend, and your son is with you the most, he's gonna likely follow in your shoes. But then again, if he was born gay, you couldn't change it anyways, though I bet you'd be quick to blame it on someone else. What if your son turned out to be gay? Would you hate him for that? Hate him for wanting something you don't? My family is Catholic, but even though I was raised one, I couldn't allow myself to practice that religion anymore. It was partially because it didn't make logical sense to me, and partially because my dad would take me home and beat my ass everytime I talked in church. My parents don't hate me because I choose not to follow their religion. I'm an independent human being, and I can live my life how I choose. Welcome to America.

By the way, kids will be kids. That "doctor" crap your talking about won't make your kid "gay". Jesus Christ! Would it make you feel any better to know that I had that happen to me as a kid, and also once when I was 5, I was held down by three 13 year olds and sexually abused? (I wasn't raped, they just pulled down my pants and hit & slapped me "there", following with laughing and ridicule). I can tell you, despite those "childhood experiences" , I'm VERY STRAIGHT, and I LOVE WOMEN! (just ask my g/f... )

So is it any worse for a gay person to raise their child gay than it is for a racist family to teach their child to be a bigot? If a family is Jewish, and their child is exposed repeatedly to a child who is Lutheran, will this turn the Jewish child into a "Lutheran"? NO. Stop worry about how other people might affect your children and start concerning yourself with how YOU are affecting your children...

[Gaylord Focker]

Are you gay? no
Do you have kids? no
Then you have no dog in this race.

Does he live in America? Yes
Might he have kids yes?

As a citizen his right to debate this issue is just as valid as yours...no matter what the reasons be...

[Mart651]

I respect your oppinion because it is your own.
His is not. His has been taught. No more than I will listen to Democratic BS speeches I will not listen to taught oppinions.

Just because he agrees with you does not mean you need to run to his protection.

Does he live in America? Yes
Might he have kids yes?

As a citizen his right to debate this issue is just as valid as yours...no matter what the reasons be...

[tryingtogetbig]

I guess I don't fully understand some things involving the whole issue:

1.) What exactly do gay couples want. Not a slam here at all. I have heard about a gay couple and one goes to the hospital and can't go visit their signifcant other in the hospital because only immediate family allowed. I don't like that. But, what I need is a bigger picture of what all will be gained, and lost for that matter.

2.) I know very well that gay couples could (and do) make GREAT parents...no doubt there. But....

My concern with this issue is that it seems greedy. Let me explain...adopting a kid is for a couple (gay or hetero) to enjoy the love of being a parent and raising offspring. Seems fine and dandy at this point. But, I don't think it's fair for the child for a number of reasons.

For one, growing up is hard business...adding in the complications a child will have to face because of having gay parents seems to put a needless amount of challenges to a child that they should never have to endure. Not that they wouldn't have supportive and good parenting...it's just a cruel world out there to begin with. I think that any gay person can truly attest to the fact that it's a cruel world sometimes.

Secondly, there's some things in life that kid's shouldn't have to understand until a certain age. Growing up in a gay parent situation will, at some point, cause a kid to have to try and understand some things in life that they really shouldn't have to for years to come.

Again...I'm not saying that gay couples wouldn't be good parents....please don't misunderstand what I'm concerned about. I really don't care what 2 people do with their lives...but when you have children involved, well, then their is a party involved that didn't get to make any decisions for themselves.


My last concern regarding gay marriage is this...the sanctity of marriage is already at an all time low. The divorce rate is above 60% here in the USA. People don't take their wedding vows serious enough, and as soon as things start getting tough in the marriage, they bail out and get a divorce. Unfortanutely, usually there are already kids involved in the marriage by the time the parents quit trying to make it work...whole different topic though.

So, I don't want the value of a marriage to go down hill any more than it already is. I don't know that allowing gay marriages will do this, but I have a feeling that it is a strong possibility. The gay friends that I have, god bless them, are not the "marrying" type. Although they may truly settle down with 1 person sometime in the future, I don't see it happening anytime soon. I don't want to generalize an entire population off of my handfull of gay friends, but I am afraid that gay marriage divorce rate will be even higher than the hetero divorce rate (as hard to believe as that is).

I'll quit now....please don't take my questions and ideas as any type of personal attacks...that's not how they are intended. As a matter of fact, I'm really open to whole issue, but I really need to know more about all parties involved.

peace,

ttgb

Bump

[abstrack]

You and Tock.........

So being Pedophiles is not a choice, but a chemical predetermined behavoir??? Just like being Gay???

I would say so. Just like mass murders, depressed people, neurotic people. Something is chemically unbalanced in their head. My brother is mentally handi-capped and becasue of his chemical unbalance he is a 8 yrd old in a 41 yr old body. Does he have a choice also??

[
[

font='Times New Roman']I can never understand how you hipacrites can say "I'm gay... i don't have a choice... "[/font]

[/QUOTE]

You probably will never ever understand because you're not gay.

[tryingtogetbig]

Excuse me, but how many people on this board do we have that can't have an intelligent debate? First of all, you're right. I'm not gay. Are you? That means you can piss up a rope and suck on the wet end for all I care. If I have no say because I'm not gay, then you have no say. 'Nuff said. Did I ever say I didn't have kids? Nope. You assumed that. Just because I didn't say it, doesn't mean I do or don't. That shows ignorance, my friend. You happen to get lucky, as I don't have children yet, but I will, probably within the next 5-6 years. And if my child happens to be gay, I'll support that. I'm not some homophobic gay-basher like yourself. I'll be slightly disappointed because I'd like my bloodline to be passed on, but it's out of my control. I'll have other children who likely will be heterosexual that I can rely on this for. Nevertheless, I will love my son or daughter for who they are. If my kids don't make it to college, that's fine. They're not less of a person for this. If they choose to change their religion or hate bodybuilding, I won't shun them. I have my life to live, and they have their own as well. All I care for is my childrens' happiness. Nothing else matters. RESPECT YOUR CHILDREN FOR WHO THEY ARE, NOT HOW THEY CHOOSE TO LIVE THEIR LIFE.

calm down bro....and hit the 'return' button every now and then...you are hurting my eyeballs.

peace,

ttgb

[spywizard]

Good point.............

so lets assume that a gay, or murder, depressed people, all of these have no choice because of the chemical make up in thier brain....

do we treat these as a desease, seeking to fix that which society sees as out of the normal range???

And no i don't want to introduce the idea of the Natzi, and the genetic selections that were going on all through our history...

and who decides what is normal, or not............

I would say so. Just like mass murders, depressed people, neurotic people. Something is chemically unbalanced in their head. My brother is mentally handi-capped and becasue of his chemical unbalance he is a 8 yrd old in a 41 yr old body. Does he have a choice also??

[
[

You probably will never ever understand because you're not gay.[/QUOTE]

[Mart651]

Hey bro. It does not take much to read people on here. So it was not a lucky guess, it was an educated one.

Now for me being a gay basher you may want to read all my post.
As for me not loving my kids if they are gay. Once again you need to go back and read my post.

Excuse me, but how many people on this board do we have that can't have an intelligent debate? First of all, you're right. I'm not gay. Are you? That means you can piss up a rope and suck on the wet end for all I care. If I have no say because I'm not gay, then you have no say. 'Nuff said. Did I ever say I didn't have kids? Nope. You assumed that. Just because I didn't say it, doesn't mean I do or don't. That shows ignorance, my friend. You happen to get lucky, as I don't have children yet, but I will, probably within the next 5-6 years. And if my child happens to be gay, I'll support that. I'm not some homophobic gay-basher like yourself. I'll be slightly disappointed because I'd like my bloodline to be passed on, but it's out of my control. I'll have other children who likely will be heterosexual that I can rely on this for. Nevertheless, I will love my son or daughter for who they are. If my kids don't make it to college, that's fine. They're not less of a person for this. If they choose to change their religion or hate bodybuilding, I won't shun them. I have my life to live, and they have their own as well. All I care for is my childrens' happiness. Nothing else matters. RESPECT YOUR CHILDREN FOR WHO THEY ARE, NOT HOW THEY CHOOSE TO LIVE THEIR LIFE.

[tryingtogetbig]

...so lets assume that a gay, or murder, depressed people, all of these have no choice because of the chemical make up in thier brain....

do we treat these as a desease, seeking to fix that which society sees as out of the normal range???

Abstrack...that's a good point he makes...the people you describe in your logic are considered by society to be subpar and ther are continual efforts and research going on to "fix" these individuals.

peace,

ttgb

[spywizard]

1st...... don't refer to me as friend... we would not be in the same group of people...... ignorance... those that don't understand, always point and make fun of thier betters.............

age and wisdom.... alot more often than you might think...... they do go hand in hand.....

Boob?? You silly Bitc_h,,,,,,,,,,,, is it the problem that you were beat up on the playground too much as a child...........

That my friend, is an ignorant, and unintelligent statement. It's not age that dictates the wisdom of a man or woman, you boob. It would seem you haven't experienced life enough to know what the hell you're talking about. Some of us here can understand something when it's run by us the first time... BTW, how many gay people do you know to draw your conclusions? I live in a city where gays are treated equally, sorry if you don't live in such an open-minded community.



That's funny. I guess when a test is repeated on different individuals and the same results are acheived, I guess that means it's NOT proven. Silly me, what the hell was I thinking?


No.......... dumba$$,,,,,,,,,,, when a control is set in place, and experiment is proven, and then the results are supported by others duplicating the results... that's when it is accepted... not proven.....


Keep my mouth shut? Why because you know that I could out-argue you on a topic you know little about? Tell you what. Disprove every post I wrote on here, and I might think of you as a respectable human being. No common sense? Sure, think what you like. BTW, those opinions weren't of any teachers of mine. It was from my own research and personal experience, you clown...

No... keep your mouth shut because you show people how stupid and childish your opions are..................

[TheMudMan]

Good point.............

so lets assume that a gay, or murder, depressed people, all of these have no choice because of the chemical make up in thier brain....

do we treat these as a desease, seeking to fix that which society sees as out of the normal range???

And no i don't want to introduce the idea of the Natzi, and the genetic selections that were going on all through our history...

and who decides what is normal, or not............



You probably will never ever understand because you're not gay.

Being depressed, or a murder is not the same thing as being gay. Either they are a danger to themselves or society and yes in that case they do need to be "fixed".

[Animal Cracker]

WWJD?

[Carlos_E]

Lets quit the flames so the thread does not degenerate further.