Most Common Beginners Cycles - Look here..

[>Good Luck<]

Hey noobs, look here!

[Armykid93]

Bump

[ichad]

Really? Not in my city. Why have i not heard of any Canadian, on here up until now, purchasing BW over the counter? I assumed it was the same everywhere in Canada. Im not doubting you, Im simply surprised.

Do you mind me asking where you purchased your BW? Shoppers, Walmart, Rexall?

Thanks for the heads up!

At a privately owned pharmacy. I also had no luck at Walmart etc.

[ichad]

Honestly I would grab a phone book and phone around to the pharmacy in your area. Much better than getting shot down in person.

[MickeyKnox]

At a privately owned pharmacy. I also had no luck at Walmart etc.

Honestly I would grab a phone book and phone around to the pharmacy in your area. Much better than getting shot down in person.

Thats very interesting that Shoppers Drug Mart requires an Rx but a privately owned Pharmacy doesn't.

Regardless, i have tons now and when it's gone, i'll simply make my own.

Thanks for tip!

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[AliYousaf]

And Bump

Sent from my iPhone.

[adam123456]

Hey man i got my d bol and testo luck thati found this thred, I need go get ahold of hcg and hcg and also armomasim and clomid if it is needed but I got no ide how.. I was planing on starting my cycle soon

[MickeyKnox]

Hey man i got my d bol and testo luck thati found this thred, I need go get ahold of hcg and hcg and also armomasim and clomid if it is needed but I got no ide how.. I was planing on starting my cycle soon

The site sponsor above AR-R .com will have all that and more, including pins, Nolva Clomid, Aromasin ..ect.

Nolva = Liquid Tamox

Clomid = Liquid Clomi

Aromasin = Liquid Stane

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[AliYousaf]

This is knowledge.

Bump...

Sent from my iPhone.

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[MickeyKnox]

Bump..

[AliYousaf]

Yo.. Mickey bro!! I have given up on Bac Water. The link some one provided in this thread , they won't send it to my region. I have lost hope on Bac thing.Would have been a good idea to use one vial of hCG for as much shots as possible during my cycle but apparently it doesn't seem like happening.
Any suggestions ?

Sent from my iPhone.

[MickeyKnox]

Yo.. Mickey bro!! I have given up on Bac Water. The link some one provided in this thread , they won't send it to my region. I have lost hope on Bac thing.Would have been a good idea to use one vial of hCG for as much shots as possible during my cycle but apparently it doesn't seem like happening.
Any suggestions ?

Sent from my iPhone.

What about making your own?? Can you locate these items? AR-R .com has everything except water and alcohol.

Homemade Bac Water

99ml Distilled Water
1ml Benzyl Alcohol
1- .2 micron syringe filter
1- 100ml sterile vial
1- 20ml syringe

1. Boil water, then add BA.
2. Pull water/BA mixture into syringe.
3. Attach filter to syringe with a needle and insert into sterile vial.
4. Insert another needle into Vial to release air pressure as you filter water/BA mixture into sterile vial.

[jaswave125]

Hi mickey thanks for all of this information it really helped a newbie like me i would like to thank you for the time and effort you put in here now im a newbie with roids but iv been doing some research. And i would like to ask some questions here they go :

1. In your sample cycle 1 and 2 I see that you advise to run test cyp at 10 weeks and test enanthate at 12 weeks i was wondering why? Aren't they basically the same?

2. I'v been reading a lot about hcg and test enanthate almost all of them suggest that i drop hcg 1 week after I drop the test in your sample cycle it run for 2.5 weeks more. Can you clarify to me why?

3. If i choose to use test enanthate or cyp which usually kicks in around 3
rd week bec its a long ester shouldn't I start hcg in the 3rd week? The reason i asked this is again iv read that one should not run hcg for longer than 8weeks as it could harm your natural test production.

This are my personal questions and feel free the correct me sir.

Thanks!

[MickeyKnox]

1. Yes they are very similar. That was simply to illustrate that you could run a ten wk cycle or twelve. Some new members think that if you run a ten wk cycle the PCT changes or you dont need an AI or..ect. And this of course, is not the case.

2. I think Swifto said it best when i asked him that same question. This was his response to me,"...when we inject HCG endogenous testosterone spikes twice, not once. It spikes it the first time almost immediately and then the larger spike in Test is around 72 hours. During this period there is a leydig cell refractory period, where the leydig cells are non-responsive. We don't want to be going into PCT (even for a few days) with our leydig cells un-responsive and testes unable to increase Test.

This refractory period is over if we do our final injection more than 4-5 days out from PCT. The added endogenous Test, if we went into PCT, may also cause androgen and estrogen inhibition at the hypothalamus if used too close to PCT IMO as well.

Endogenous LH levels can rise fairly quickly during PCT, in days, not weeks too."

3. Anytime you introduce supra physical amounts of exogenous testosterone into the body, you halt your natural test production. Using an analog like hCG to mimic the LH is one of the only sure ways to continue endogenous testosterone production which prevents testicular atrophy.

I haven't read about this claim of yours. But if you provide a link i'll be more than happy to look it over - and then formulate my own opinion and share it with you, if you like. Until then, this claim is unsubstantiated, for me at least.

[Tron3219]

1. Yes they are very similar. That was simply to illustrate that you could run a ten wk cycle or twelve. Some new members think that if you run a ten wk cycle the PCT changes or you dont need an AI or..ect. And this of course, is not the case.

2. I think Swifto said it best when i asked him that same question. This was his response to me,"...when we inject HCG endogenous testosterone spikes twice, not once. It spikes it the first time almost immediately and then the larger spike in Test is around 72 hours. During this period there is a leydig cell refractory period, where the leydig cells are non-responsive. We don't want to be going into PCT (even for a few days) with our leydig cells un-responsive and testes unable to increase Test.

This refractory period is over if we do our final injection more than 4-5 days out from PCT. The added endogenous Test, if we went into PCT, may also cause androgen and estrogen inhibition at the hypothalamus if used too close to PCT IMO as well.

Endogenous LH levels can rise fairly quickly during PCT, in days, not weeks too."

3. Anytime you introduce supra physical amounts of exogenous testosterone into the body, you halt your natural test production. Using an analog like hCG to mimic the LH is one of the only sure ways to continue endogenous testosterone production which prevents testicular atrophy.

I haven't read about this claim of yours. But if you provide a link i'll be more than happy to look it over - and then formulate my own opinion and share it with you, if you like. Until then, this claim is unsubstantiated, for me at least.

if it spikes twice, once and then 72 hours later, why is the common protocol 250 x 2 a week. i know in a perfect world itd be an injections at the 84th hour, but thats not always possible and there is likely often an overlap and the intitial shot could be rendered useless becuase the leydig cells are unresponsive. why isnt the protocol 250 e4d to prevent ANY overlap and ensure all shots are producing BOTH spikes.

[MickeyKnox]

if it spikes twice, once and then 72 hours later, why is the common protocol 250 x 2 a week. i know in a perfect world itd be an injections at the 84th hour, but thats not always possible and there is likely often an overlap and the intitial shot could be rendered useless becuase the leydig cells are unresponsive. why isnt the protocol 250 e4d to prevent ANY overlap and ensure all shots are producing BOTH spikes.

From what i understand, I dont think the second spike is that significant to warrant a longer inject protocol as the half life is 33 hours.

[Tron3219]

From what i understand, I dont think the second spike is that significant to warrant a longer inject protocol as the half life is 33 hours.

But you stated that during that 72 hour period the leydig cells are non responsive. If they are non responsive within that 72 hours, the first spike from the second shot (if inside the 72h mark from the first shot) would b pointless because the leydig cells are non responsive. Even if they are responsive but desensitized (imagine its not loke a light switch) your not getting full response from the lh analog on the leydig cells. But of course we may b talking about second shot at 68-70 hours. Can imagine it'd be that detrimental huh?

-TroN-

[MickeyKnox]

But you stated that during that 72 hour period the leydig cells are non responsive. If they are non responsive within that 72 hours, the first spike from the second shot (if inside the 72h mark from the first shot) would b pointless because the leydig cells are non responsive. Even if they are responsive but desensitized (imagine its not loke a light switch) your not getting full response from the lh analog on the leydig cells. But of course we may b talking about second shot at 68-70 hours. Can imagine it'd be that detrimental huh?

-TroN-

The second shot doesn't take place for 84 hours, not 72 (for me E3.5D) But for some reason my testies are full all the time, and i have been running this protocol for a long time (TRT patient) So im not sure what to say there, to be perfectly honest Tron. I haven't really dig my heels in that deep because this protocol works very well.

If you run across something in your research, please let me know.

[Tron3219]

The second shot doesn't take place for 84 hours, not 72 (for me E3.5D) But for some reason my testies are full all the time, and i have been running this protocol for a long time (TRT patient) So im not sure what to say there, to be perfectly honest Tron. I haven't really dig my heels in that deep because this protocol works very well.

If you run across something in your research, please let me know.

Like I said before, in a perfect world it would take place at 84h, but say for me, I have a crazy ass schedule and can't always get the 84 hour mark. The chance may b closer to 72 or 96. Which is why I usually do it every 4th morning. Just wondering if there was any downfall to this that u knew of. I had read that before (the two spikes in 72h) and just decided to go every 4th morning. I was more or less seeing what you had to say about it since te opportunity arose. Plus figured it may help some of the noobs (or confuse them? Lol) with a lil discussion.

-TroN-

[MickeyKnox]

Good question.

Whats even more peculiar is, regardless of whether im on TRT or on cycle, my hCG protocol never changes. Go figure..

[jaswave125]

1. Yes they are very similar. That was simply to illustrate that you could run a ten wk cycle or twelve. Some new members think that if you run a ten wk cycle the PCT changes or you dont need an AI or..ect. And this of course, is not the case.

2. I think Swifto said it best when i asked him that same question. This was his response to me,"...when we inject HCG endogenous testosterone spikes twice, not once. It spikes it the first time almost immediately and then the larger spike in Test is around 72 hours. During this period there is a leydig cell refractory period, where the leydig cells are non-responsive. We don't want to be going into PCT (even for a few days) with our leydig cells un-responsive and testes unable to increase Test.

This refractory period is over if we do our final injection more than 4-5 days out from PCT. The added endogenous Test, if we went into PCT, may also cause androgen and estrogen inhibition at the hypothalamus if used too close to PCT IMO as well.

Endogenous LH levels can rise fairly quickly during PCT, in days, not weeks too."

3. Anytime you introduce supra physical amounts of exogenous testosterone into the body, you halt your natural test production. Using an analog like hCG to mimic the LH is one of the only sure ways to continue endogenous testosterone production which prevents testicular atrophy.

I haven't read about this claim of yours. But if you provide a link
i'll be more than happy to look it over - and then formulate my own opinion
and share it with you, if you like. Until then, this claim is unsubstantiated, for me at least.

Thanks for clearing that up for me more power! And i cant find where i read about it hahaha im currently in india and im going to buy my first cycle here from a reputable pharmacy. But im planning on taking it at the end of the year still got to learn a lot and have to get my diet straight it been messed up since im here.

[bigZthedestroyer]

Take it to the top for those who don't sleep

[jaswave125]

Mikey sir another question as my first test cycle how many weeks would you recomend on running it? 8 10 or 12? Thanks

[Tron3219]

Mikey sir another question as my first test cycle how many weeks would you recomend on running it? 8 10 or 12? Thanks

What ester is the test your running? Prop? Enthenate? Cypionate ?

-TroN-

[jaswave125]

What ester is the test your running? Prop? Enthenate? Cypionate ?

-TroN-

Im going to run test enanthate

[Tron3219]

Im going to run test enanthate

10-12 weeks is best for test e. IF I run test e, I run it for 12 weeks. After about 12 weeks the gains tend to slow down. 10 weeks would still show good gains, depending on diet and training of course. May help you recover a bit easier, and lower your time off period by 2 weeks as well, providing blood work is a-ok. Recommend you get bloodwork before you start as well to get a baseline.

-TroN-

[mr.lenny]

Hi guys..so am new to AAS I taken my body for 9years to where am at!
185lbs 30y/o first cycle did research for about a year before, and you guys help me a lot. With your advice am doing test cypionate 250x2week= 500mg, now am in my second week haven't felt or seen negative side effects just began to feel a hardening effect or maybe it's a placebo effect! Lol now I know it's a long ester so, and I should be seeing a change in week 5,6,7,8 since am doing a slingshot program, it's just hard to do less reps and keep it at a 9- 12 rep per body part,am use to working out till my body is sore, well changing my way of thinking! My question are:
In my second reload should I continue with test cyp or choose another test??? Like a short ester?? And I was told to keep with test and don't implement more AAS.? Any advice will be helpful. I always read the post and stickies here daily!!! ?

[Tron3219]

Hi guys..so am new to AAS I taken my body for 9years to where am at!
185lbs 30y/o first cycle did research for about a year before, and you guys help me a lot. With your advice am doing test cypionate 250x2week= 500mg, now am in my second week haven't felt or seen negative side effects just began to feel a hardening effect or maybe it's a placebo effect! Lol now I know it's a long ester so, and I should be seeing a change in week 5,6,7,8 since am doing a slingshot program, it's just hard to do less reps and keep it at a 9- 12 rep per body part,am use to working out till my body is sore, well changing my way of thinking! My question are:
In my second reload should I continue with test cyp or choose another test??? Like a short ester?? And I was told to keep with test and don't implement more AAS.? Any advice will be helpful. I always read the post and stickies here daily!!! ?

Are you on trt?
Is this ur first cycle? If so, this is more of an advanced technique and think you should try a simple cycle first....
For the shits if it...this is my answer...
And proper way would b to keep the same dosage of ass until your gains slow. More compounds=more sides. However for your second, maybe third, you can switch to a shorter ester plus the long ester. Run the trt dose cyp constantly and reload with prop. That way when you deload the prop is out in 3 days.
Example:
1-20 : cyp @ 150mg
1-8 : prop @ 350mg
13-20 : prop @ 350mg

But for what it's worth, this is in the wrong thread, it should have it's own thread. Not really a beginners question.

-TroN-

[mr.lenny]

Thanks Tron for the reply, yes it's my first cycle! And am not on trt, what do you mean it's an advance cycle? I don't want to do orals not right now! I read treads that specify to do a short test in order to began your pct afterward, am doing the20 weeks and I was advices by many here to just do test first due to my background, And see how my body reacts to it then maybe by cycle 3 or 4 think of other AAS. I do thank you guys cause besides reading I do want to know more about it! And I know reading and actually using it and seen results manifest in my body it's totally different, cause like a newbie I got many AAS and almost used then like D-Bol, deca , tren A. But you guys help out a lot, so I listen and looking forward the results, any thing you or any one can recommend ??? Thanks

[Tron3219]

Thanks Tron for the reply, yes it's my first cycle! And am not on trt, what do you mean it's an advance cycle? I don't want to do orals not right now! I read treads that specify to do a short test in order to began your pct afterward, am doing the20 weeks and I was advices by many here to just do test first due to my background, And see how my body reacts to it then maybe by cycle 3 or 4 think of other AAS. I do thank you guys cause besides reading I do want to know more about it! And I know reading and actually using it and seen results manifest in my body it's totally different, cause like a newbie I got many AAS and almost used then like D-Bol, deca, tren A. But you guys help out a lot, so I listen and looking forward the results, any thing you or any one can recommend ??? Thanks

I said advanced technique, meaning the slingshot. Reload and deload is basically a blast and cruise method. Even if you don't continue with test throughout and take 4 weeks off(not just the 2 Ronnie recommended) and do a pct, that's not enough time off to fully recover. Personally I recommend you do the 8 week prop or 10-12 week test e cycle, complete with ai, hcg an proper pct until you know how ur body reacts to aas and get a little better understanding of the compounds ur putting in ur body. Once u pull the blast and cruise trigger (or reload and deload) your pretty much signing up for trt.

-TroN-

[mr.lenny]

Ok, I understand, question; being that am on test cypionate can I finish the 10ml I should be done in 3 more weeks, then can I jump to test e or ?? Which one you recommend , can I do that or should I stop and just switch immediately? And my understanding is one is short ester therefore I should be pining eod, and how Much do you think? Sorry to pick your head but I want to learn..

[MickeyKnox]

Hi guys..so am new to AAS I taken my body for 9years to where am at!
185lbs 30y/o first cycle did research for about a year before, and you guys help me a lot. With your advice am doing test cypionate 250x2week= 500mg, now am in my second week haven't felt or seen negative side effects just began to feel a hardening effect or maybe it's a placebo effect! Lol now I know it's a long ester so, and I should be seeing a change in week 5,6,7,8 since am doing a slingshot program, it's just hard to do less reps and keep it at a 9- 12 rep per body part,am use to working out till my body is sore, well changing my way of thinking! My question are:
In my second reload should I continue with test cyp or choose another test??? Like a short ester?? And I was told to keep with test and don't implement more AAS.? Any advice will be helpful. I always read the post and stickies here daily!!! ?

Thanks Tron for the reply, yes it's my first cycle! And am not on trt, what do you mean it's an advance cycle? I don't want to do orals not right now! I read treads that specify to do a short test in order to began your pct afterward, am doing the20 weeks and I was advices by many here to just do test first due to my background, And see how my body reacts to it then maybe by cycle 3 or 4 think of other AAS. I do thank you guys cause besides reading I do want to know more about it! And I know reading and actually using it and seen results manifest in my body it's totally different, cause like a newbie I got many AAS and almost used then like D-Bol, deca, tren A. But you guys help out a lot, so I listen and looking forward the results, any thing you or any one can recommend ??? Thanks

Mr Lenny,

This is your first cycle. Do not complicate it with slingshots, or intermediate, or any other advanced cycle. Just stick to whats contained in this thread.

Your first cycle is test ONLY and should begin with a long ester for 12 wks in order for you to experience injecting twice a wk and administering your AI and hCG correctly. This will also allow you to develop the senses required to understand your body and the reactions you will discover, not only with the added exogenous testosterone , but with the inevitable unwanted associated sides.

I highly recommend your first cycle to be Option 2 Long Ester. This is a terrific first cycle, and contains all the elements previously mentioned.

Good luck.


Option 2. Long Ester

Wk 1-12 Testosterone Enanthate = 250mg twice/wk e3.5d
Wk 1-12 Aromasin 10mg ED - monitor and adjust accordingly.
Wk 1-14.5 hCG = 250iu twice/wk day before test injection.

PCT
Begins wk 15 to wk 19

Clomid 75/50/50/50
Nolva 40/20/20/20

[Tron3219]

Ok, I understand, question; being that am on test cypionate can I finish the 10ml I should be done in 3 more weeks, then can I jump to test e or ?? Which one you recommend , can I do that or should I stop and just switch immediately? And my understanding is one is short ester therefore I should be pining eod, and how Much do you think? Sorry to pick your head but I want to learn..

Just stick with cyp of that's what u have. The difference between cyp and e is about a day and a half of active half life and 1 mg in ester weight.

Cypionate : 12 days active half life; 31mg per 100mg of hormone+ester
Enanthate : 10.5 days active half life; 30mg per 100mg per hormone+ester

Ester weight may be off by one or two tho...might b 31 and 32%...I'm rounding...I know it's like 31.69 or something like that...but virtually the same weight and not much difference on active half life.

-TroN-

[mr.lenny]

Thank you Mickyknox and Tron I will listen and stick with test only and see how my body reacts , i will gather more info and educate my self, later on the future do a slingshot, now should I continue working out as slingshot program which is one body part a day and no more then 9-12 sets and do the high intensity 8-10 all the way since am not doing a Deload anymore what do you guys in your experience should I do cause before AAS I will workout till my body part felt accomplish about 12-15 sets and I was mixing high intense with high reps, like a pyramid. What you guys recommend. You don't know how much you guys are helping me ?