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06-27-2012, 03:57 AM #1Associate Member
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Why do you assume I do not have labs? Do you think I`m that stupid? I`ve posted my blood work in a thread I made earlier, but I did not get much comments on it post HCG.
HCG was not successful since I felt like SHIT after using it for two weeks, although to my major surprise blood work showed a substantial increase in both total and free testosterone . E2 was slightly elevated as well (I don`t have access to a sensitive test here in Norway), so that MAY have explained why I did not feel better on it.
The reasons I started with exogenous testosterone treatment are several: 1) I`ve read about people who have great BW on HCG, but still feel the same. Even Crisler has mentioned this phenomenon; 2) I was desperate to get better and after spending three years of my life feeling like shit, I just don`t have the patience to fool around any longer; 3) I do not have a knowledgeable doctor to help me and he was not interested in prescribing an AI. He did not even know what HCG was before I mentioned it.; 4) I will always have the opportunity to get back on HCG mono at a later date, maybe with a better doctor. For now, my priority is to function normally and get my life back.
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06-27-2012, 04:07 AM #2Associate Member
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HCG may or may not have failed, it`s hard to say and I may have jumped on exogenous testosterone too early, but I`m trying to pull my life together the best I can on my own without a doctor who knows what he`s doing. Read my prior post on why I abandoned HCG mono.
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...14#post6010014
What I intended on discussing was the use of clomiphene VS HCG while on exogenous testosterone.
If I understand correctly, clomiphene is FDA approved for women, but not for use with males and for treating hypogonadism.
Where did you find that it is actually hepatoxic? I`ve only read similar studies that MrManGuy84 linked to and toxicity is not mentioned, I believe.
I have my BW while using clomiphene also.
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06-27-2012, 11:11 AM #3Junior Member
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We're not hunting for your bloodwork, so put it in here if you want an analysis by anyone who can help you. Elevated estrogen, if that was indicated will definitely make you feel like shit. Before stopping you should have added an AI on the day of inj. You cant classify yourself as one of those people with great bloodwork who still feels bad because you didnt have great bloodwork. What im trying to say is you pulled out before you came but then you dIdnt even ccomee--wtf oVer?Last edited by go2failure; 06-27-2012 at 11:19 AM.
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06-27-2012, 01:12 PM #4Associate Member
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No need to hunt for my blood work when I have posted it multiple times and updated my thread several times with questions without getting any new answers.
However, this thread was not about my personal situation, but a discussion on clomiphene VS HCG as an adjunct to TRT.
Not seeing any good reason or arguments against trying it, I will continue with my experiment.
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06-27-2012, 01:25 PM #5Junior Member
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06-27-2012, 01:27 PM #6Associate Member
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06-27-2012, 02:03 PM #7Junior Member
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The results were somewhat difficult to read, but it appears your estrogen spiked--I still say go back on it with a AI used on shot days.
I myself may be getting weaned off of T here soon. I'm going to follow an T + AI usage, followed by lower T dose + HCG + AI, then HCG + AI or clomid + AI, then possibly just AI. That's if I even feel good without a 700+ range level. I'm not sure I'll hit 700+ TT with HCG + AI... I hit that with 200mg/week. TT isnt the key, but it gives an idea.
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06-28-2012, 05:14 AM #8Associate Member
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One of my problems is that I do not have access to a sensitive E2 test here in Norway, so I`m not sure if it is a precise measurement. E2 did fall back into the normal range on my last BW though. I will continue using Nebido for a while and then consider going off exogenous testosterone further down the road under better circumstances and ideally with a doctor who knows more than I do.
Why are you going off T? Are you secondary? And did I just read you saying you may use clomiphene?
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