** The ASK GB ANYTHING thread (diet/nutrition related) **

[mockery]

maybe this fasting has made me brain dead, i have been forgetting words the last two days ..

[mockery]

gbrice75's Avatar
gbrice75
gbrice75 is online now AR's Nutritional Rx ~VET~ gbrice75 is a member in good standing

Join Date
Nov 2009
Location
New Jersey
Posts
12,191

Welcome! I agree with Damien in that the diet needs alot of work, or better yet needs to be scrapped and completely reworked. It sounds like you're already doing a TON of cardio and working out, so chances are the diet is where you're going all wrong.

Your total calories are pretty low. I'm willing to bet that with a good diet, we could get you eating MORE and you'd still lose the bodyfat - while effectively satisfying hunger. You may actually be eating too little, and causing your body to not only stubbornly hold on to the fat it already has, but actually making NEW bodyfat via dietary fat. Based on your description, I believe this is your problem. Severe calorie restriction isn't the answer, especially when you have lots of active tissue (muscular legs you described for instance) which needs to be fueled. (relatively) HIGHER calories and the cardio you're already doing is key. See the small article I wrote on this for an explanation - titled 'calories in calories out, but not quite'.

Good luck, looking forward to seeing what kind of diet you can come back with!

this is your post! from 2 years ago :P ring a bell now?

[fatman225]

What I like about gbrice after browsing this thread and some back posts, is that in spite of knowning a lot, he continues to learn himself.

I'm always impressed MORE when a guy is willing to adapt when new information comes out.

There are still people out there insisting that IF for example would cause them to lose a lot of muslce and store more bodyfat even in a caloric deficit, these are the classic so called experts, and the dismiss IF instantly, without actaully researching it at all, and relying on age old bro science while guarding the sacred cows.- I call these the cultist parrots.

The repeat what they are told, and any questioning of their "wisdom" is NOT met with exploration and research, but instead charges of HERESY and "BURN THE WITCH".

So, I'm actually glad to see GB not only tells us what he has learned, but also continues to learn himself.

[Ben_66]

Hello Gb,

I workout first thing in the morning.

I get up and have 4 egg whites, one scoop of whey and half a cup of oatmeal. (I also take amino and my vitamins with a pre workout stimulant) then hit the gym. (my gym is a 5 minute walk)

After the gym I take 2 scoop of whey and again with oatmeal. I'm staying away from fruits and milk as I'm trying to cut.

My question

-is it to early to eat right away then hit the gym?
-and after my pwo shake with oatmeal how long should I wait till my next meal? 2-3 hours? Can you take in your next meal within an hour after pwo meal?
-Also if you can also critique my pre and post workout emal and if you have anything to recommend I should switch.


Thank you.

[gbrice75]

maybe this fasting has made me brain dead, i have been forgetting words the last two days ..

this is your post! from 2 years ago :P ring a bell now?

To be honest - not really, lol! I'd have to search the forum for it as it obviously wasn't a sticky or anything of that sort. I would be interested to see it now though... see how much of it I still agree with haha!!

What I like about gbrice after browsing this thread and some back posts, is that in spite of knowning a lot, he continues to learn himself.

Thanks brother. IMO, anybody who thinks they 'know it all' and isn't willing to learn new ways, admit they were perhaps wrong in their old way of thinking, etc. is narrow minded and arrogant. If you find posts of mine from 3 years ago vs. today, you'd probably think we were 2 different people! That's the beauty of science - there is always more to learn... and new data becoming available which helps debunk - or at least gets us to rethink old theories and practices.

I'm always impressed MORE when a guy is willing to adapt when new information comes out.

There are still people out there insisting that IF for example would cause them to lose a lot of muslce and store more bodyfat even in a caloric deficit, these are the classic so called experts, and the dismiss IF instantly, without actaully researching it at all, and relying on age old bro science while guarding the sacred cows.- I call these the cultist parrots.

Worse than parrots. Complete idiots. I wouldn't comment on something (other than giving my theory based on current knowledge and logical thinking) without first trying it myself. That's just idiotic.

The repeat what they are told, and any questioning of their "wisdom" is NOT met with exploration and research, but instead charges of HERESY and "BURN THE WITCH".

These are guys looking to be forum celebrities. They want everybody to come to them for answers, but they have very little working practical knowledge. They lurk the boards gathering info from informed knowledgeable people and then regurgitate it in hopes people notice how 'l33t' they are.

So, I'm actually glad to see GB not only tells us what he has learned, but also continues to learn himself.

Thanks for the kind words bro, I really appreciate them!

Hello Gb,

I workout first thing in the morning.

I get up and have 4 egg whites, one scoop of whey and half a cup of oatmeal. (I also take amino and my vitamins with a pre workout stimulant) then hit the gym. (my gym is a 5 minute walk)

Decent. Out of curiosity, why no whole eggs? There's hardly any fat in this meal as is, and egg yolks have a ton of nutrients in them - surely adding 1 wouldn't hurt you.

After the gym I take 2 scoop of whey and again with oatmeal. I'm staying away from fruits and milk as I'm trying to cut.

Sounds about right.

My question

-is it to early to eat right away then hit the gym?

How much time elapses between your last bite and your first lift? There's no issue with eating early in the morning (my preworkout meal is at 5am and i'm working out by 6am), it's more about allowing some time for the food to be digested. 1 to 1.5 hours is optimal if possible. If you're eating then working out 10 minutes later, the meal isn't going to do much for your workout.

-and after my pwo shake with oatmeal how long should I wait till my next meal? 2-3 hours? Can you take in your next meal within an hour after pwo meal?

Doesn't really matter. The majority of people I see like to have a 'real food' meal about an hour after the PWO shake. I've eaten an hour later, and i've eaten 3 hours later - it really doesn't matter, just make sure you DO eat.

-Also if you can also critique my pre and post workout emal and if you have anything to recommend I should switch.


Thank you.

The meal looks fine for the most part. As I mentioned, i'd add a whole egg or two (I don't know your total macro allowances or remainder of meals, so I can't really say) to your preworkout. Also, i'm personally not a fan of straight whey, particularly for preworkout - i'd swap it for a protein blend. ON Pro Complex is my fav, but it's pricey.

Hope this helps!

[Ben_66]

Decent. Out of curiosity, why no whole eggs? There's hardly any fat in this meal as is, and egg yolks have a ton of nutrients in them - surely adding 1 wouldn't hurt you.



I thought having a whole egg is longer digesting and that it was better to have egg white right away to avoid catabolic. I will add one for now on. And also I like to seperate fats from carbs.



How much time elapses between your last bite and your first lift? There's no issue with eating early in the morning (my preworkout meal is at 5am and i'm working out by 6am), it's more about allowing some time for the food to be digested. 1 to 1.5 hours is optimal if possible. If you're eating then working out 10 minutes later, the meal isn't going to do much for your workout.

That's the thing... I pretty much get up have my shake then hit the gym. so about 20-25 minutes. It works in my schedule. I'm able to do my workout with intensity, accept on low carb days is a little tougher.



Doesn't really matter. The majority of people I see like to have a 'real food' meal about an hour after the PWO shake. I've eaten an hour later, and i've eaten 3 hours later - it really doesn't matter, just make sure you DO eat.

Perfect, thats what I thought.



The meal looks fine for the most part. As I mentioned, i'd add a whole egg or two (I don't know your total macro allowances or remainder of meals, so I can't really say) to your preworkout. Also, i'm personally not a fan of straight whey, particularly for preworkout - i'd swap it for a protein blend. ON Pro Complex is my fav, but it's pricey.


Sweet I'll look into that.



Hope this helps![/QUOTE]

Yeah! I really appreciate your help, Thanks so much! I wish I had this kind of supports 10 years ago. I used to think ''Slim fast'' had some special ingredients to make me lose weight, so I would take it with my meals lol. I've come a long way. Thanks again

[gbrice75]

I thought having a whole egg is longer digesting and that it was better to have egg white right away to avoid catabolic. I will add one for now on. And also I like to seperate fats from carbs.

I've worked out during 16 hour fasts. The whole 'going catabolic' idea is grossly overblown. Yes the fat will slow digestion; not to the extent it will hinder your progress

That's the thing... I pretty much get up have my shake then hit the gym. so about 20-25 minutes. It works in my schedule. I'm able to do my workout with intensity, accept on low carb days is a little tougher.

Hmm... in this case then, I probably WOULD avoid the whole egg and would stick with straight whey since you're looking for the fastest digestion rate possible. Personally, i'd just wake up earlier and have a better meal... but that's just me.

Yeah! I really appreciate your help, Thanks so much! I wish I had this kind of supports 10 years ago. I used to think ''Slim fast'' had some special ingredients to make me lose weight, so I would take it with my meals lol. I've come a long way. Thanks again

You and me both brother! No problem, you're welcome.

[digsy1983]

awesome thread!, but think this has moved from being a thread to more a nutrition bible!

sorry if you've covered this previously (theres a lot of stuff to get thru for us new memebers!)

whats your stance of thermogenic foods to boost the metabloism? i know during cutting phase that your metabolism slows down so cheat meals come into play to boost it back up, but would a constant supply of green tea, cinnamon, chilli, etc play a part in running a faster metabolism so allow cheat meals to be less frequent or even cut out altogether?

[gbrice75]

awesome thread!, but think this has moved from being a thread to more a nutrition bible!

Thanks man! That's sort of what I had in mind when I started it... glad to see it's still thriving despite my being on much less frequently these days...

sorry if you've covered this previously (theres a lot of stuff to get thru for us new memebers!)

whats your stance of thermogenic foods to boost the metabloism? i know during cutting phase that your metabolism slows down

Not if cutting is done right. Cutting for months on end with no break, severe caloric deficits, etc. can lead to a slowed metabolism. Incorporating refeeds and/or limiting caloric deficits will mitigate this if not stop it all together. You probably know by now that i'm a huge fan of carb cycling - IMO, this is the most efficient way to cut and avoid metabolic slowdown.

so cheat meals come into play to boost it back up

Meh. If that's the direction you want to go in. Clean higher calorie days will do the same... without the concern of adding bodyfat on said days.

but would a constant supply of green tea, cinnamon, chilli, etc play a part in running a faster metabolism so allow cheat meals to be less frequent or even cut out altogether?

They definitely won't hurt. I'd still rely on diet (i.e. foods) manipulation more than anything else, but adding natural thermogenics like the ones you've mentioned will only aid in the process.

[Myapocalypse]

I'm a skinny fat guy trying to cut. I know that I cheat but I want to make sure what I think is clean, IS CLEAN!
Stats: 35yo, 6'3, 240lbs, approx 23% bf. Workout 4-5 times a week, circuit training and cardio mixed.

Ok here's an average diet day
Meal 1: 8oz of egg whites, 1 whole egg, 1oz of green chile(like salsa) and 1 slice of whole wheat bread. 1 cup of coffee with fat free creamer.
Meal 2: Nectur protein shake and another cup of coffee
Meal 3: grilled chicken breast (no idea the size) and a cup of greens (steamer bag of broc of green beans)
Meal 4: handful of bell pepper sticks and 2oz of hummus
Meal 5: same as meal 3
Meal 6: 2 heaping spoon fills of cottage cheese and another coffee

I've lost 25 on this so far but I'm stalling... Maybe it's from the weekend beer binges...

[akali]

Gb, I just recently discovered by reading labels that the noname mustard i have here has 0 calories,0 sugars,etc. While on a cutting diet is it okay to add mustard to more things for flavour? for example; i have been following a strict diet now for over 3 months, foods are getting bland to me just the idea alone of eating egg whites, chicken breast, etc makes me happy!! Is this true 0 calories? it has no artificial sweeteners, what's the catch?

Thanks!~

[gbrice75]

I'm a skinny fat guy trying to cut. I know that I cheat but I want to make sure what I think is clean, IS CLEAN!
Stats: 35yo, 6'3, 240lbs, approx 23% bf. Workout 4-5 times a week, circuit training and cardio mixed.

Ok here's an average diet day
Meal 1: 8oz of egg whites, 1 whole egg, 1oz of green chile(like salsa) and 1 slice of whole wheat bread. 1 cup of coffee with fat free creamer.
Meal 2: Nectur protein shake and another cup of coffee
Meal 3: grilled chicken breast (no idea the size) and a cup of greens (steamer bag of broc of green beans)
Meal 4: handful of bell pepper sticks and 2oz of hummus
Meal 5: same as meal 3
Meal 6: 2 heaping spoon fills of cottage cheese and another coffee

I've lost 25 on this so far but I'm stalling... Maybe it's from the weekend beer binges...

Food choices are ok, but meals 4 and 6 are a joke. 4 isn't even a meal - no solid protein source to speak of. Meal 6... i'm sure you can afford more than 2 heaping spoons, right!??!

Weekend beer binges will never fit in a cutting diet. If you're really serious and you want this, then you need to cut them out, at least for now.

Gb, I just recently discovered by reading labels that the noname mustard i have here has 0 calories,0 sugars,etc. While on a cutting diet is it okay to add mustard to more things for flavour? for example; i have been following a strict diet now for over 3 months, foods are getting bland to me just the idea alone of eating egg whites, chicken breast, etc makes me happy!! Is this true 0 calories? it has no artificial sweeteners, what's the catch?

Thanks!~

Mustard is gtg bro, don't give it a second thought.

[Myapocalypse]

Food choices are ok, but meals 4 and 6 are a joke. 4 isn't even a meal - no solid protein source to speak of. Meal 6... i'm sure you can afford more than 2 heaping spoons, right!??!

Weekend beer binges will never fit in a cutting diet. If you're really serious and you want this, then you need to cut them out, at least for now.



Mustard is gtg bro, don't give it a second thought.

Thanks for the input. I'll def stop my weekend cheating and fix the weak meals.
I'm thinking of adding 4 hard boiled egg whites to my weak hummus snack. And maybe another Nectar shake before bed instead of the cottage cheese.
Some days I feel like I'm making great progress and other days feel like I'm spinning my wheels.

[gbrice75]

Thanks for the input. I'll def stop my weekend cheating and fix the weak meals.
I'm thinking of adding 4 hard boiled egg whites to my weak hummus snack. And maybe another Nectar shake before bed instead of the cottage cheese.
Some days I feel like I'm making great progress and other days feel like I'm spinning my wheels.

What is this nectar shake? Sounds high in sugar to me... personally i'd stick with the cottage cheese and just add more of it.

As for progress... it's like that for all of us bro. Just stick with it, be consistent and you'll get there. Remember that progress isn't linear; you will progress in spurts, and other times will be stagnant... that's just the way our bodies work.

[Myapocalypse]

What is this nectar shake? Sounds high in sugar to me... personally i'd stick with the cottage cheese and just add more of it.

As for progress... it's like that for all of us bro. Just stick with it, be consistent and you'll get there. Remember that progress isn't linear; you will progress in spurts, and other times will be stagnant... that's just the way our bodies work.

Ok thanks man. I'm down 30lbs so far but I still have at least 30lbs of fat to go.
Nectar is a tasty protein shake.

Nutrition Facts
Serving Size: 1 scoop
Amount per Serving
Calories 90
Calories from Fat 0.0
% Daily Value *
Total Fat 0g
0%
Saturated Fat 0g
0%
Cholesterol 5mg
1%
Sodium 60mg
2%
Total Carbohydrate 0g
0%
Dietary Fiber 0g
0%
Sugars 0g

Protein 23g
46%
Est. Percent of Calories from:
Fat
%
Carbs
%
Protein
100%

[gbrice75]

^^ looks legit, no sugar at all, nice. I generally associate nectar with fruit. Fruit = sugar. What kind of protein is this though? i.e. what is the actual protein source?

[Myapocalypse]

Whey isolate. I'm still learning but I guess that's good, right?

I herd about it through a local supplement store and ordered more from amazon.

[digsy1983]

hey, GB!

i've recently started running on treadmills (4% gradient) again to improve cardio and burn fat. im 28 and as a kid i was lucky enough to suffer from osgood-schlatter. docs said i'd grow out of it, but its defo left a lasting impression on my knees! i've felt the weekness in my knees coming back now im running. do you know of any supplements (already taking; glucosamine, calcuim fluride, flaxseed oil, cod liver oil) that would minamize the discomfort. drawing a bit of a blanc really and in the back of my mind im thinking "gona av to stop running" but dont want to if i can find a way around it.

[gbrice75]

Whey isolate. I'm still learning but I guess that's good, right?

I herd about it through a local supplement store and ordered more from amazon.

Not a huge fan of straight whey personally, but yea, it's fine.

hey, GB!

i've recently started running on treadmills (4% gradient) again to improve cardio and burn fat. im 28 and as a kid i was lucky enough to suffer from osgood-schlatter. docs said i'd grow out of it, but its defo left a lasting impression on my knees! i've felt the weekness in my knees coming back now im running. do you know of any supplements (already taking; glucosamine, calcuim fluride, flaxseed oil, cod liver oil) that would minamize the discomfort. drawing a bit of a blanc really and in the back of my mind im thinking "gona av to stop running" but dont want to if i can find a way around it.

Anti-inflammatories will help, but then you're risking other potential issues (stomach lining, etc) to 'mask' an existing one.

I know you don't want to hear it, but personally i'd stop running. Luckily, there are plenty of other cardio options that are lower impact. I have shin splints, so running is tough for me too, especially when i'm close to 200lbs like I am now. Elliptical trainers with or without the 'ski' arms, or my favorite, the stepmill (if your gym has one) - nastiest cardio in the gym IMO! Swimming is great if you wanna go that route and have access to a pool.

Another thing I do - if you want to stay on the treadmill but reduce the impact, try slowing the mph to about 3.5, and bump the incline between 8 - 12. You will get a very cardio intensive workout akin to running if you have it dialed in right.

Hope this helps.

[digsy1983]

yeah defo helps mate, cheers!

will just have to vary it up and maybe just try running once a week n see how it goes. i like the prospect of 8-12 % on the treadmil, wudn't of thought of that!

p.s, and as for the swimming, i only swim depths not lenghts! hehehe

[--->>405<<---]

hey GB did u see who popped in the forum last nite?

[gbrice75]

No, who?

[--->>405<<---]

none other than TBody66!! i figd ud see his thread posted in..

[--->>405<<---]

GB i had a thought! this whole tdee thing has been bugging me. all this time the prob has been the activity multiplier which def can be subjective.. im curious. what if we utilized the one number we have thats going to be fairly objective and accurate (BMR) to base everything on? ive noticed a trend typically when ive been helping people establish their deficits where the usual cutting caloric amt tends to be within around 200cals of BMR.

now i know depending on how much exercise u do and what not there would be variables to consider but it seems to me the BMR is a pretty good solid number that could be built upon. what do u think? just a thought. i havent gotten into crunching numbers just wondered what u thought??

[gbrice75]

none other than TBody66!! i figd ud see his thread posted in..

Hadn't noticed... but then again i'm not on here all that often these days.

GB i had a thought! this whole tdee thing has been bugging me. all this time the prob has been the activity multiplier which def can be subjective.. im curious. what if we utilized the one number we have thats going to be fairly objective and accurate (BMR) to base everything on? ive noticed a trend typically when ive been helping people establish their deficits where the usual cutting caloric amt tends to be within around 200cals of BMR.

now i know depending on how much exercise u do and what not there would be variables to consider but it seems to me the BMR is a pretty good solid number that could be built upon. what do u think? just a thought. i havent gotten into crunching numbers just wondered what u thought??

I agree that BMR is a more 'accurate' number to start with. It wouldn't be a bad idea to start there, and then add calories as required.

Another method I've been employing, specifically with regards to cutting, is to use the formulas but go with the absolute lowest multiplier, i.e. sedentary - and work up from there, if needed. The logic is if calories come in too low, big deal. You've created a huge deficit for a week or two. No harm, no foul (no LBM loss to worry about for somebody with a good amount of bodyfat who would likely be using these to begin with). I don't know about you, but nothing would piss me off more than dieting, being strict, etc. only to find out that I've been overeating (and therefore not making progress), albeit cleanly, because of an overestimated activity multiplier.

You could possibly do the opposite for bulking, although I find dialing in bulking calories (and minimizing fat gains) quite a bit more intricate.

[--->>405<<---]

i tell u GB TBH ive been doing fine with katch/mcardle - 800-900cals for cutting and then staying rite at tdee for bulking.. ive been doing it so long having to come up with a new number has got me all messed up man! LOL

[gbrice75]

^^ if it works for you, stick with it. Just bear in mind when helping others that it can be off by quite a bit.

These days, i'm going on even less personally - I eat when i'm hungry. If i'm not, I don't. Depending on how my body reacts, i'll make some adjustments. It's still putting me right around where I need to be.

[--->>405<<---]

yeh i will keep that in mind. gonna try and be mindful of deficit and its relation to BMR. like i said i believe around 200cals above BMR tends to be the average for cutting. i dont do a lot of helping with bulking. just sometimes. it doesnt interest me like cutting. i guess from being a fat kid i get a lot of satisfaction helping guys get lean because i know the damage people can do to u when ur fat and i know the healing that can be dun when ur cut!

funny i get hungry usually 6x per day. while on veggie carb only i stay hungry a fair amt. to compensate i chug the heck out of water. 32oz at a time. usually on a good day 250oz water (low carb days). helps a lot.

[mockery]

Hello Friend, as my body fat is coming off nicely every week and i plan for my next anabolic adventure, so comes the responsibility of the dreaded eat 9000 calories to grow! ugh

i will be dropping my fasting i think to help have more time to consume calories. But! i will continue to carb cycle.

a few things i am thinking about to help set up my micros.

while anabolic. Protein intake will be 2lbs per LBM

daily fat intake should be in around 100g , avo's, nuts, flax and fish oil.

for carb cycling my low days should not go lower then 150g

So for carbs on high carbs and maintenance. should i just ingest the amount of calories left over after i have calculated 2g Protein x LBm + 100g Fats to make up the difference on the different daily calorie numbers?

I dont want to do a bulk persay, More a body recomp still, slow but solid gains based on quality gear and a strict clean diet over a longer period of time., with this said... how much calorie surplus to start with should i go over my maintenance to start growing, but not necessarily so much that i will put on fat from over eating.

How often should i be checking my lbm to increase my calories to match my growth to continue growing, once a week? every day??

is glycogen depletion still needed on a surplus calorie diet? or does it defeat the purpose of growing lbm?

thanks mate!


** just a theory ** carb cycling lean body mass recomp bulk

tdee 2944 caculated at 18% right now, but will be learner when i start this.

Low day 2738 -206
310p 150c 100f

mod day 2944
310p 200c 100f

re-feed 3445 +500
310p 327c 100f

or do i have to base my maintenance day at a minimum surplus of +500 calories and have my re- feed day even higher? using formulas it looks like i will still be adding 3-4 % body fat over a year. so I need to obviously wait till im down to 11-12% bf ?

this lean mass stuff is confusing

[gbrice75]

Hello Friend, as my body fat is coming off nicely every week and i plan for my next anabolic adventure, so comes the responsibility of the dreaded eat 9000 calories to grow! ugh

Michael Phelps eats 12,000/day ... man up!

i will be dropping my fasting i think to help have more time to consume calories. But! i will continue to carb cycle.

Makes sense. I've always found fasting to work better for calorie restricted diets.

a few things i am thinking about to help set up my micros.

while anabolic. Protein intake will be 2lbs per LBM

Nice

daily fat intake should be in around 100g , avo's, nuts, flax and fish oil.

May be a bit high, but can't say without knowing total calorie intake.

for carb cycling my low days should not go lower then 150g

So for carbs on high carbs and maintenance. should i just ingest the amount of calories left over after i have calculated 2g Protein x LBm + 100g Fats to make up the difference on the different daily calorie numbers?

Pretty much... unless it comes out to a ridiculous number... then you need to recalculate the other macros. e.g. 600g carbs/day - no way you need that.

I dont want to do a bulk persay, More a body recomp still, slow but solid gains based on quality gear and a strict clean diet over a longer period of time., with this said... how much calorie surplus to start with should i go over my maintenance to start growing, but not necessarily so much that i will put on fat from over eating.

General rule of thumb - add 500 calories/day above maintenance to start. Monitor, adjust.

How often should i be checking my lbm to increase my calories to match my growth to continue growing, once a week? every day??

lol, definitely not every day. I'd suggest once a week, under controlled conditions - i.e. same day every week, first thing in the morning, fasted, after going to the bathroom, etc.

is glycogen depletion still needed on a surplus calorie diet? or does it defeat the purpose of growing lbm?

Not needed. The goal here isn't to deplete glycogen. You want to minimize bodyfat GAIN, but you aren't necessarily looking to lose bodyfat (although that would be nice while simultaneously gaining muscle). Your low carb day(s) will help offset the higher ones.

thanks mate!


** just a theory ** carb cycling lean body mass recomp bulk

tdee 2944 caculated at 18% right now, but will be learner when i start this.

Low day 2738 -206
310p 150c 100f

I'd lower the fat tbh. 100g is high IMO. Bump protein to make up for the deficit if you need to. Personally i'd just drop the fat to 75g and call it a day

mod day 2944
310p 200c 100f

I'd drop fat to 75g, and bump carbs to 250g.

re-feed 3445 +500
310p 327c 100f

Again, I'd drop fat to around 75g and bump carbs to 375g.

or do i have to base my maintenance day at a minimum surplus of +500 calories and have my re- feed day even higher? using formulas it looks like i will still be adding 3-4 % body fat over a year. so I need to obviously wait till im down to 11-12% bf ?

this lean mass stuff is confusing

You're calling it a maintenance day but talking about a surplus. With a surplus, it's not a maintenance day! With my adjustment above, you're at least shaving 225 calories off by reducing fat intake. Drop carbs to 125g and you just took off another 100 calories.

It takes experimenting. It will never be perfect right out of the gate. It'll rarely be perfect, EVER. Trial and error is all you can really do. Eventually, you'll get dialed in and find your sweet spot.

[--->>405<<---]

GB in case u didnt see it in the other thread u posted in (not very specific i know ) LBM x 15 seems to be close to BMR x 1.26 (katch/mcardle)

[gbrice75]

^^ which multiplier is that? I don't have the info handy...

[--->>405<<---]

^^ that is not a multiplier. 1.2 is sedentary. I just divided the (lbm x 15) tdee into the katch mcardle tdee and got 1.26

For myself lbm x 15 = 2655

Katch/mcardle bmr is (lbm kg x 21.6) + 370 = 2104

2104 x 1.26 = 2651

I like math

[--->>405<<---]

Also would u mind clRifying again? 2655 for me is what? Maintenance? Tdee? What does that number represent exactly?

[mockery]

Great info and advise. Still looks like I'm gonna put on a lot of body fat from all the eating . Gonna try to organize my refeed on a rest day. Guess I'll have to start cardio, lastly have to figure out my training. I wanna do a push/pull x 2 a week but I'm concerned while anabolic if this is to much strain on the shoulder girdle and if I should go to a body building 5 or 6 day split. ...

[Ben_66]

Hello Gbrice,

I am going for a clean bulk and was wondering what do you think about having skim milk with a scoop of caseing protein in my shake instead of just water?

Thank you,

[mockery]

Hello Gbrice,

I am going for a clean bulk and was wondering what do you think about having skim milk with a scoop of caseing protein in my shake instead of just water?

Thank you,

why use milk when you can buy pasteurized liquid egg whites. they have no taste or odor and 250ml is like 24g protein with no fat or carbs.

[Back In Black]

why use milk when you can buy pasteurized liquid egg whites. they have no taste or odor and 250ml is like 24g protein with no fat or carbs.

If you have them uncooked they are only about 50% bioavailable. So, for 24g pro you are gonna need 500ml. They are, however, lactose (sugar/carb free) unlike milk!

[mockery]

If you have them uncooked they are only about 50% bioavailable. So, for 24g pro you are gonna need 500ml. They are, however, lactose (sugar/carb free) unlike milk!

doh! you're correct. ment to write 12g p for 250ml

[Ben_66]

why use milk when you can buy pasteurized liquid egg whites. they have no taste or odor and 250ml is like 24g protein with no fat or carbs.

I forgot to mention that its consumed before bed that is. *
(casein protein (chocolate) with a tbs of peanut butter and skim milk) the taste to my shake is f**** exhilarating.

That's pretty much why. I do have liquid egg whites. Are you trying to say to just have egg whites with a scoop of casein and pb? with water perhaps?

I could also do that, but Skim milk also has casein protein and pretty good in protein plus my scoop of casein and a little bit of the PB is enough protein as it is. My only concerned would be is the sugar in the skim milk. thoughts?