Old guy making a comeback...

**1bigun11** · 10-10-2010, 11:33 AM

Hey tbodY!

At first I was just going to congratulate you on your amazing recent progress and say, "If it aint broke, dont try to fix it!"

But then I read through the thread and saw some really valuable advice from gbrice and LBS and the others. I think you are in really good hands here. These are some smart mofos...

Congrats again bro. Looking good!

**tbody66** · 10-10-2010, 03:10 PM

Thanks, bigun, I am truly blessed with smart friends who are willing to help and encourage on this board.

**JR.** · 10-16-2010, 10:22 AM

Dude your kicking some butt! keep up the good work. O im 40 we aint old bro we are in our prime!

**tbody66** · 10-17-2010, 12:31 PM

I have stuck with the diet well all week and even found some interesting ways to make it work when I had to make a last minute road trip. I even talked the cooks at a Pizza Hut into grilling me some chicken to put on my salad. Good stuff.

My workout is changing beginning tomorrow, I change it every two months, where I will be focusing on legs. I picked up some sustonon 250, cypionate , enanthate and deca and am contemplating when and how to run that, I'll bounce that off you experts soon.

Miss hearing from you guys, so make some noise, I'll put some new pics and stats up at the end of this week.

**Twist** · 10-17-2010, 01:49 PM

I wish your thread was in the diet section. I keep on forgetting to come over to this section.

**tbody66** · 10-18-2010, 08:44 PM

Okay, bouncing this off you experts, I've done six cycles, all what I would consider mild to moderate, I have been off for a year and I have learned what works for me and base my cycles on product availability. So here's the gear and the plan.

What I have available: 16 ampules of sust 250, 2 vials of 10ml Cyp 250mg, 3 vials of 10ml 300mg deca ,(let me tell you, my first cycle ever was straight deca and I would do deca every week forever, I LOVE DECA)

How I'll use it: wk 1-4, 500mg sust/600mg deca, wk 5 625mg cyp/600mg deca, wk 6-11 750mg cyp/600mg deca, wk 12-16 500mg sust/600mg deca (obviously my deca will be done in week 15), I take one shot a week in the glute. Also I have access to any pct I'd like and have always had trouble with gyno, more on one side and painful as well, I've heard of some that use nolvadex every day even through the cycle, does this work? I'm still planning on sticking with the diet through the entire process. What are your thoughts?

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-18-2010, 09:25 PM

Why are you ramping the test? Absolutely no need.

Why are you switching blends? Absolutely no need.

Why are you in love with deca ? Are you changing gears and trying to put size on or diet? M

Very very very (close to impossible) to do both.

Personally, I would have gone with an EQ or Winny, var or masteron .

Prop would definately have been my choice of test. Sus 250, prob my last choice.

Just saying.....

**tbody66** · 10-18-2010, 09:41 PM

Originally Posted by LBSOMEIRON

Why are you ramping the test? Absolutely no need.

Habit, not locked in on this, what would you recommend?

Why are you switching blends? Absolutely no need.

Using what's available, every time I've used sust it seems to take forever to feel it start to work.

Why are you in love with deca ? Are you changing gears and trying to put size on or diet? M

I have always had good results with deca and never felt I lost the gains, my joints feel better and I've never had a problem with libido while on, even on it alone. It stays in the system so long and stacks. I am not changing gears, I'm trying to add some quality muscle to help burn the fat. I'm sold out to the diet.

Very very very (close to impossible) to do both.

Personally, I would have gone with an EQ or Winny, var or masteron .

Bad experience with EQ, fever in the muscle and a rash, didn't like that at all.

Prop would definately have been my choice of test. Sus 250, prob my last choice.

I agree about the sus, but disagree about the prop, I prefer cyp.

Just saying.....

So, all that being said, how are you suggesting I use what I have? I'm looking to drop 10 lbs of fat and gain that much in muscle, if it can't happen, tell me what I can expect and how to cycle it to get the most out of it, please.

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-18-2010, 10:14 PM

500 mg test
600 mg deca
12 weeks
Maintenance calories < 500.

Plain and simple.

**tbody66** · 10-18-2010, 10:25 PM

will do, thanks.

**gbrice75** · 10-19-2010, 08:43 AM

What's up t, looking forward to seeing those pics! So your proposed cycle will null and void our competition, but that's all good because my only concern is that we both make progress. Have you had your bodyfat checked since you started on this plan?

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-19-2010, 09:21 AM

Why GB?

THis will probably put his his test levels up to par with yours....AND it's not going to help him lose weight. That's all diet.

It will help him retain muscle.

**gbrice75** · 10-19-2010, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by LBSOMEIRON

Why GB?

THis will probably put his his test levels up to par with yours....AND it's not going to help him lose weight. That's all diet.

It will help him retain muscle.

Regardless of the effects, I don't think a competition between somebody natural and somebody running gear is a fair one. I'm still willing to play just to play, in the end I don't care at all about the competition. Like I said, just like Tbody, i'm here to get in the best shape I can. If he winds up being in better shape, all the more power to him.

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-19-2010, 03:08 PM

I feel you.

It's sort of like the natural dudes that compete in the 'nontested' shows.

Nobody is going to wind up in 'better shape'...trust me. I just want both of you knuckleheads to hit your goals...then life will be good. Seriously, if you guys both hit your goals and I place top three come March/April, life will be even better. Weird thing is that I have more to go than both of you.

I already told you GB, I got you for a day of feasting and I'm serious.

Tboy - I'll think of something....

**gbrice75** · 10-19-2010, 03:19 PM

Originally Posted by LBSOMEIRON

I feel you.

It's sort of like the natural dudes that compete in the 'nontested' shows.

Nobody is going to wind up in 'better shape'...trust me. I just want both of you knuckleheads to hit your goals...then life will be good. Seriously, if you guys both hit your goals and I place top three come March/April, life will be even better. Weird thing is that I have more to go than both of you.

I already told you GB, I got you for a day of feasting and I'm serious.

Tboy - I'll think of something....

You place top 3 brotha, and I might come to wherever you are to take YOU out on a binge!

**tbody66** · 10-19-2010, 09:10 PM

Originally Posted by gbrice75

What's up t, looking forward to seeing those pics! So your proposed cycle will null and void our competition, but that's all good because my only concern is that we both make progress. Have you had your bodyfat checked since you started on this plan?

I can't trust the scale at the gym anymore, I've obviously lost more fat and the scale says I've lost 5 lbs, my arms are bigger and my belly is smaller, but the scale still says I'm 22.7% bf. The current plan is to take some more pics this weekend and see what you all think.

Okay, LB, where is the show you are competing in? Maybe we should come show our support in person.

**tbody66** · 10-20-2010, 08:58 PM

My thread is now moved to the diet section, per request. Now come and give me your suggestions.

**Twist** · 10-20-2010, 11:45 PM

Definitely gear against no gear is an easy contest. Doesn't matter cuz we didn't put any money down... Thought about it though haha. But anyway keep up the good work! Glad this got moved to the diet section. Works out well.

**gbrice75** · 10-21-2010, 03:20 AM

Welcome to the right section my friend!

**tbody66** · 10-21-2010, 10:18 PM

I'm all stalled out on my progress, I'm calculating the macro's and dialing it in this weekend to start making some more progress. I look at myself and see that scrawny guy with a big gut and no size or definition. I'm still taking and posting pics this weekend.

Maybe if GB does good for the next 10 weeks, sticks with the diet and hits his goals, we'll meet halfway, I'll gift him some gear and he can buy dinner.

**Twist** · 10-22-2010, 12:04 AM

Originally Posted by tbody66

I'm all stalled out on my progress, I'm calculating the macro's and dialing it in this weekend to start making some more progress. I look at myself and see that scrawny guy with a big gut and no size or definition. I'm still taking and posting pics this weekend.

Maybe if GB does good for the next 10 weeks, sticks with the diet and hits his goals, we'll meet halfway, I'll gift him some gear and he can buy dinner.

Or you could both come take a vacation to California and I'll give you both gear and buy you dinner haha.

**gbrice75** · 10-22-2010, 03:13 AM

Originally Posted by twist

or you could both come take a vacation to california and i'll give you both gear and buy you dinner haha.

^^^ this!

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-22-2010, 05:27 AM

Originally Posted by tbody66

I'm all stalled out on my progress, I'm calculating the macro's and dialing it in this weekend to start making some more progress. I look at myself and see that scrawny guy with a big gut and no size or definition. I'm still taking and posting pics this weekend.

Maybe if GB does good for the next 10 weeks, sticks with the diet and hits his goals, we'll meet halfway, I'll gift him some gear and he can buy dinner.

Oh here we go....the infamous skinny fat stage that causes 99% of people to freak out...I already counciled GB on this issue....GB, your turn.

**gbrice75** · 10-22-2010, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by LBSOMEIRON

Oh here we go....the infamous skinny fat stage that causes 99% of people to freak out...I already counciled GB on this issue....GB, your turn.

LoL yea bro, i'm the foremost expert on this subject by now simply because I spent the last year in a vicious cycle of cutting/bulking (never allowing enough time for either to 'take') because I was freaked out over looking scrawny... then fat... the scrawny... etc.

TB, just keep doing what you're doing. I know it's WAY easier said then done, but stay out of the mirror as much as possible. Know that you have a good base and muscle memory is a godsend. Get lean, and it'll take a few short months to start packing on some (LEAN) muscle again. Please don't fall into the disgusting rut that has kept me from progressing over the past year. I wound up getting nowhere because I bounced back and forth - probably gained 5lbs, lost 5lbs, gained 6, lost 6, etc. and in the end? I look exactly the same.

Pick one and stick with it! Fight against your intuition that tells you everything you're doing is wrong.

**Twist** · 10-22-2010, 07:33 PM

This is the reason everyone has a personal trainer, even bbers who have been doing it for years. Your mind will mess with you. But what do you mean "stalled"?

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-22-2010, 07:57 PM

I agree.

I either feel tiny or fat.

My gf thinks I'm insane.

**tbody66** · 10-22-2010, 09:31 PM

Stalled out, I look the same, the scale goes up or down 2 lbs every day, I have a great day with no problems sticking with the program and others where it is an intense struggle, I look in the mirror in the morning and think I am leaning out, then by 10 I think my belly is sticking out and my love handles are disgusting and I wonder why I even wear Hurley premium fit shirts. My strength isn't going up, I rarely feel a pump on any muscle group during training and I look at myself in mirrors throughout the day and wonder if anyone would even notice I workout, let alone BB.

I have been eating clean, put not exactly measuring my portions. After calculating my BMR at 1817 and TDEE at 2817, I decided to go with a 2300 cal diet with a 40/45/15 percent split of Proteins/carbs/fats, but I have not measured my meals out and wonder if I am somehow high on my calories or just haven't given it enough time.

On a training note... I usually lift with a designed program for 7 weeks, take an entire week out of the gym, change my program up and go into it for another 7 weeks, with the focus on a particular area for development and maintenance for everything else, this go around I am focusing on legs, my routine is split like this mon/legs(Heavy day - Squats and stiff legged deads with toe extensions for calves) tue/chest-shoulders-triceps(all dumbbell exercises) wed/back-biceps(all dumbbell exercise) thu/legs(high reps low weights-lunges/extensions/curls/standing calf raises) fri/chest-back-tris-bis(one exercise per bodypart-moderate weight high reps minimal rest). On monday I performed 10x10 squats with 225#, full squats(hip below knee) some really odd things occured, one my forearm cramped on my 98th squat and two my legs hurt for three days, I mean like I'd never worked out before, this was just my thighs, when they started not hurting as much(three days later mind you) I noticed my shins hurt for two days, and starting the second day of them hurting my hamstrings and glutes hurt. I had been doing squats for the previous two months, three sets of ten with progressive weight of 225# 275# and 315#, has anyone ever experienced this?

**Twist** · 10-23-2010, 01:55 PM

Your calories are too high. Unless you are doing a lot of cardio your calories should be lower. I mean, you are 5-6 with a good amount of bf. You probably have 145lbs lbm. At 5-6 that doesn't require 2300 for a cut. It's too high. TDEE is useless. Plus the older you get, the slower your metabolism will be.

Have you gotten you t levels checked lately? Sounds like symptoms of low test. When are you gonna run that cycle?

**tbody66** · 10-23-2010, 03:44 PM

I had my t-levels checked a few months back for an insurance policy and they were on the high end of normal limits, I'd have to find the paperwork to be more specific, but my wife is a nurse and read the lab results. I started my first injection last week and just had my second one today. I will take pics this week and post so you can give me a better idea of bodyfat. What should my daily caloric intake be, and is the ratio I am using what I should be shooting for?

**Twist** · 10-23-2010, 04:15 PM

Yes I like your ratio. Your t level doesn't matter if you are injecting anyway. 500mgs per week? If so then just wait lol. It will come.

**gbrice75** · 10-23-2010, 04:28 PM

Man, I wanna cycle again! I'm looking back at pics taken right towards the end of my last cycle and I was lookin pretty big if I do say so myself! If I wasn't carrying that bodyfat, i'd actually be impressed with myself.

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-23-2010, 07:27 PM

It appears that Someone put estrogen in your cypionate . Settle down. You are making me nervous.

Your issue is staring you in the face. I'll shed some light on it.

In no way, no how, not happening can you 'eye ball' anything ESPECIALLY when dieting. I'll bet you the farm you are overestimating all of your food portions. I promise. I been in this game a lot longer and I still weigh everything.

Tomorrow I want you to cook all if your food for the week.

I want you to buy am electronic food scale.

I want you to cook 4-5 lbs of chicken, then weigh out 5oz and seperate into tuppaware.

Then do 1/2 cup COOKED rice (if that's what you are using). Same deal.

Sunday morning, I bet I have 30 Tuppaware containers.

Probably costs (scale) $25 at target or walmart. Best $25 you'll spend.

Trust me bro.

**tbody66** · 10-23-2010, 10:09 PM

Originally Posted by Twist

Yes I like your ratio. Your t level doesn't matter if you are injecting anyway. 500mgs per week? If so then just wait lol. It will come.

Yes, 500mg of test and 600mg of deca .

Originally Posted by gbrice75

Man, I wanna cycle again! I'm looking back at pics taken right towards the end of my last cycle and I was lookin pretty big if I do say so myself! If I wasn't carrying that bodyfat, i'd actually be impressed with myself.

I have people coming up to me at the gym and saying "we saw you a year ago and you were so jacked" I miss it, but want even less BF to be even more impressive.

Originally Posted by LBSOMEIRON

It appears that Someone put estrogen in your cypionate . Settle down. You are making me nervous.

Your issue is staring you in the face. I'll shed some light on it.

In no way, no how, not happening can you 'eye ball' anything ESPECIALLY when dieting. I'll bet you the farm you are overestimating all of your food portions. I promise. I been in this game a lot longer and I still weigh everything.

Tomorrow I want you to cook all if your food for the week.

I want you to buy am electronic food scale.

I want you to cook 4-5 lbs of chicken, then weigh out 5oz and seperate into tuppaware.

Then do 1/2 cup COOKED rice (if that's what you are using). Same deal.

Sunday morning, I bet I have 30 Tuppaware containers.

Probably costs (scale) $25 at target or walmart. Best $25 you'll spend.

Trust me bro.

I do trust you and will do this tomorrow, I promise. I just bought 10 lbs of Talapia though, is it the same ratio if I substitute it for chicken (5 oz) or would you prefer that I just go get the chicken, cause I will. What are you recommending for my daily caloric intake?

**gbrice75** · 10-24-2010, 06:50 AM

I agree with LB 100% on the food thing. Weighing out food takes all the guess work out and you can sleep at night knowing you are coming very close to your goals (macros will ALWAYS be off somewhat).

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-24-2010, 07:11 AM

Originally Posted by tbody66

Yes, 500mg of test and 600mg of deca .

I have people coming up to me at the gym and saying "we saw you a year ago and you were so jacked" I miss it, but want even less BF to be even more impressive.

I do trust you and will do this tomorrow, I promise. I just bought 10 lbs of Talapia though, is it the same ratio if I substitute it for chicken (5 oz) or would you prefer that I just go get the chicken, cause I will. What are you recommending for my daily caloric intake?

There is no need to waste what you bought...when I say chicken *insert any lean meat*

Although I do not like to get all of my protein from one foood source, it's fine....or do 3lbs of each and freeze.....Chicken also last longer in the fridge after cooking.

I think each size should be about 5.2 to 5.6oz cooked....I have a feeling you are going to be surprised

**bigcwithane** · 10-24-2010, 09:02 AM

Weighing your food is key man. Before I weighed it I would eat 1 and a half chicken breast unless they were smaller than my palm because people say three oz. Of meat is the size of your palm and I'm almost positive I was over eating chicken

**tbody66** · 10-24-2010, 05:23 PM

breakfast 6am:

2 whole eggs one bowl of oatmeal 8oz coffee/black

9am: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice cold/steamed veggie(cucumber, bell pepper, broccoli, celery)

12pm: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice cold/steamed veggie

3pm: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice, cold/steamed veggie

4pm: pre-workout sugar free monster, creatine

6pm: post-workout, protein shot, 26g whey protein, sugar free

7pm: 5oz fish, sweet potatoe, green veg

10pm: 8 oz soy milk, 2 tbsp nat pb

**bigcwithane** · 10-24-2010, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by tbody66

breakfast 6am:

2 whole eggs one bowl of oatmeal 8oz coffee/black

9am: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice cold/steamed veggie(cucumber, bell pepper, broccoli, celery)

12pm: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice cold/steamed veggie

3pm: 5oz chicken, 1/2 cup rice, cold/steamed veggie

4pm: pre-workout sugar free monster, creatine

6pm: post-workout, protein shot, 26g whey protein, sugar free

7pm: 5oz fish, sweet potatoe, green veg

10pm: 8 oz soy milk, 2 tbsp nat pb

Drop the milk add casein. Everythig else looks good

**LBSOMEIRON** · 10-24-2010, 06:57 PM

Did you get your scale? I Want those all to be postcooking weights ESP the rice.

We need more protein at 6am. Do you have a whey? 40g or 8 whites please.

I'm good with everything else. I might have you drop the rice at 3pm and add 2 tb of peanut butter.

Then 1/2 cup oats blended with your post whey.

But let's see how you look in 2 weeks.

That sweet potatoe. Weigh it. 4-5oz precooked.

Peanut butter. All natural. No sugar.

Good things to come brother.