Frontloaded Test E/Tbol cycle

**Shurik** · 09-10-2008, 11:02 PM

Wow Jc you got way too much time on your hands. Good thread.

**binder** · 09-11-2008, 09:05 AM

umm....just a thought, you might want to get something else to drive if you are building a show truck.

there is no way i could have drove my show truck while i was building it and then once it was done....i'll be damned if i drove that thing around town! haha

**jc95605** · 09-11-2008, 12:21 PM

Oh on i'm driving it around. I spent this much time and money i'm using it!

**jc95605** · 09-11-2008, 07:43 PM

September 11th
PCT Day 2

BB flat bench: 185lbsx10, 205lbsx10, 225lbsx6, 245lbsx3

Pec-Dec Flys (cables): 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Chest Dips: 10, 10, 10

Hammer Curls: 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Alternate Curls: 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (rope attachment): 80lbsx10, 80lbsx10, 80lbsx10, 80lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (triangle attachment): 55lbsx10, 55lbsx10, 55lbsx10, 60lbsx10

BB Bench-Ok since everybody has been on my ass about overtraining my chest i turned it down a lil today. That and its been WAY too long since my last workout so today was definately a weak day, lol. I'd like you guys to critque it and tell me if this is what i should be doing. The one thing that pissed me off was that my 225lbs and 245lbs were exactly 2 reps off today. But again i'm gonna contribute that to being such a weak day.

I also wanna note that the 155lbs set really helps warming up the muscles. When i jumped in to 185lbs i kinda was surprised by the weight. Since this was a weak day i'm gonna contribute it to that since i can't compare workouts because its been too long in between them.

I should get my truck out of paint tomorrow so this crap won't happen again. Just thought you might wanna know that binder.

**bodybldr** · 09-11-2008, 11:20 PM

send us some update pics...

**jc95605** · 09-12-2008, 09:27 AM

I'll try and get to them this weekend. Along with a new avatar. Per your requests.

**jc95605** · 09-12-2008, 09:29 AM

Please critque my previous chest workout. Since i didn't lift what i wanted to i'm really wanting to blast my chest this sunday. Open to changing my workout slightly, mainly on the bench any suggestions will be appreciated and considered.

**binder** · 09-12-2008, 07:47 PM

hmm...maybe there were some underlying reasons you didn't press hard. I have days like that too.

As a sidenote, i don't think you were "overtraining" your chest, but the amount of reps you were doing i think would put you into an overtraining state after multiple weeks of that kind of break down. It wouldn't hurt you too bad to add one of your crazy workouts you like to do every few weeks to get that nice breakdown, then go back down to something your body can repair on a regular basis.

You should have went for a 1 rep. I like to work all the way up to a 1 rep, but that 1 rep usually isn't the same as my max. In the pyramid that was recommended to me does a 1 rep that's somewhere like 10% off your max.

**jc95605** · 09-12-2008, 09:26 PM

I'm kinda glad you said that. I was wanting to go a lil harder on the chest. Like i said the last workout was a lil weak and i'm contributing that to the too much off time. I think the next workout will be better. Since the last workout my chest has been pumped up again and i've been feeling good. I can hardly wait for chest day again.

**ray0414** · 09-12-2008, 10:38 PM

this is what i used to do for chest before i hurt my shoulder, now i cant do any chest and its depressing!
I start by doing warmups of the shoulders and triceps to get my arms warmed up, nothing heavy just light, maybe 10 pullups. so i start out with flies, to get my chest warmed up, i found that warming up my chest before jumping on the bench would help me do more on bench. so id start with like 25x10. 35x10 40x10 45x10 getting a nice good stretch. then on the last one id use the 45's to do some reps benching them. then i went to the bench, 135x15or20. 155x10 185x6 215x10 OR 225x6or7 then i go back down, 215x7-10 if i feel good ill do some negatives with like 245, 2or 3 reps. then i go to incline bench 135x8 155x8 165x8 if i feel strong i go up to 175x8. then i go to decline and do the same thing. then i go do dumbell work, normally 3 sets of 70s or 80s. then i do incline dumbells 3 sets with like 65 or 70. then depending on how i feel i sometimes do some cable flyes going from down to up.

**jc95605** · 09-12-2008, 11:49 PM

that sounds like a fun workout. Thats something to what my chest workout was. Maybe i didn't post it right but it was something like that. I'm gonna have to agree with you i like that workout alot better.

**ray0414** · 09-12-2008, 11:53 PM

and all that was BEFORE i started eating a good diet that was high protien.hurt my shoulder back in late april and have since changed my diet and added alot more REAL protein, so im curious if im strength will go up once i get back at it. then after a month of workin everything again im gonna throw in some tbol for 2 months and hope for the best.

**jc95605** · 09-14-2008, 07:26 PM

September 14th
PCT Day 5

BB flat bench: 155lbsx10, 205lbsx6, 225lbsx6, 275lbsx1, 245lbsx3, 235lbsx3

Pec-Dec Flys (cables): 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Chest Dips: 10, 10, 10

Hammer Curls: 45lbsx4, 45lbsx4, 45lbsx5

Alternate Curls: 45lbsx4, 45lbsx4, 45lbsx5

Cable Curls: 50lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (straight bar attachment): 70lbsx10, 80lbsx10, 80lbsx10, 80lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (triangle attachment): 55lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10

Chest Dips: 10 (for the road)

BB Bench-Yes I changed my workout again. As you can see i got rid of the 185 and jumped straight to the 205lbs. It wasn't bad. Not as bad as i thought it'd be, didn't really notice it. Also from 205 up i reduced the reps to try and save some energy. When i got to 275, I was going to do 270 again but my spotter kept egging me on to do 275, so i figured what the hell. He guided the bar a lil as i pushed it up. Just guided, i really didn't feel any help/support from him. I'm a lil weary or not to count that. What you guys think? It was at this point i wrote down my workout (+ the last sets of the last workout) and took it to the trainer/owner. I told him that i wanted to hit 300 and asked him if i was overtraining. He said no and actually after the 275 he wanted me to add 3 sets of 235lbs or 245lbsx3. Then he decided on the 245lbsx3. He said the purpose of this was to create a good base for benching. Ok...kool....no problem. I went back and did the first set of 245lbs. My left shoulder started hurting so i reduced the weight to 235lbs. Managed to do the 3 reps byt my shoulder still hurt. I decided to call it a day there so i would have some left for the rest of the workout.

Curls-Another thing i've been wanting to improve on was my curls. As you could see i've been stuck at 40lbs for awhile now. So much so a couple of you even commented on it. Thanks for the input by the way. According to my own standards/rules i'm not ready to move up in weight yet. However, i decided to go ahead and force it to 45. Since i forced it i dropped the reps to 4. It wasn't as bad as i thought it'd be. At the end of the 2nd set i had more energy/power than normal, so i upped the reps. I don't know if i was just tired or if 5 reps was the sweet spot. Either way i'm gonna keep it there for a bit and see how it goes. I'll let you guys know.

*Any input is welcomed and appreciated.

**jc95605** · 09-20-2008, 12:50 PM

September 17th
PCT Day 8

BB flat bench: 155lbsx10, 205lbsx6, 225lbsx6, 245lbsx3, 235lbsx3, 225lbsx3

Pec-Dec Flys (cables): 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Chest Dips: 10, 10, 10

Hammer Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Alternate Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Tricep Pulldown (one arm pulling down): 30lbsx10, 30lbsx10, 30lbsx10, 30lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (triangle attachment): 55lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10

BB Bench-The only difference with this is that i took out the superset to try and save energy for the rest of the workout. Worked ok. Not as good as i thought. I think before i go to the gym i'm gonna eat more simple carbs in attempt to spike energy. I take caffine b4 i go to but it doesn't seem to last long enough now.

**binder** · 09-20-2008, 03:28 PM

how much caffeine do you take? caffeine has a half life of 2-3 hours in an adult. There is 54mg of caffeine in a 12oz mt dew. 380mg caffeine in a 12oz starbucks coffee.

I use some fat free yogurt before i workout to get simple carbs and it seems to digest fast with me and doesn't cause me to get sick when i'm working out.

Also, are you just doing a chest workout every 3 days? it seems like that is your entire workout. If you want to gain mass all over you need to hit your back and legs. It WILL put strength in your chest to increase your overall body strength. The back needs to be worked also to balance the chest out otherwise it won't be in harmony and could reduce the effectiveness of the chest muscles.

**jc95605** · 09-20-2008, 03:47 PM

Actually me and that trainer are already talking about that. Right now we're trying to decide what back excercises would be most benefical.

**binder** · 09-20-2008, 07:44 PM

anything heavy.

bent over barbell rows, weighted pull ups, heavy lat pull downs.

for legs: squats, press, deadlift

those are the main ones. There are tons more, but for back the bent over rows and weighted pull ups will be the best mass builders, then the 3 i mentioned for legs.

that's if you wanted to just build mass. You need to add many more combinations into a workout if you are trying for more precision and not just for some bulk/powerlifting.

**jc95605** · 09-21-2008, 01:14 PM

September 18th
Weight 171lbs

*As always the changes are in red.

BB Military Press (behind head): 65lbsx10, 85lbsx10, 95lbsx10, 115lbsx10

Front lateral Raise: 25lbsx7, 25lbsx7, 25lbsx7

Side Lateral Raise: 20lbsx7, 20lbsx7, 20lbsx7

*Upright Row: 45lbsx10, 65lbsx10, 75lbsx10, 75lbsx7

Shrugs ("shrug machine"): 100lbsx18, 120lbsx15, 120lbsx15, 150lbsx12, 150lbsx10]

I think the shoulder/lat/abs workout before this one i forgot to post. Well anyway. The day before this i hurt my left tricep while benching. It didn't hurt too bad for this workout. I went to the gym yesterday and couldn't even lift 185lbs. I'm gonna go again today and see if i can. If not i'll skip the bench or chest workout and just do arms today. I have to do something. Yesterday when i skipped my workout i felt like a waste of space all day, lol. Wish me luck!

**jc95605** · 09-22-2008, 09:29 PM

September 21st
PCT Day 12

BB flat bench: 155lbsx10, 205lbsx6, 225lbsx4, 225lbsx4, 225lbsx4

Pec-Dec Flys (cables): 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Hammer Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Alternate Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Tricep Pulldown (one arm pulling down): 30lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10,

Overhead Rope Pull: 70lbsx10, 70lbsx10, 70lbsx10

Tricep Press (with curl bar): 50lbsx10, 50lbsx10, 50lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (triangle attachment): 55lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10

BB Bench-Well I actually tried to workout the day before but my tricep hurt too bad. In case your not following along i hurt my tricep last workout. I don't see how since i put my hands further apart so if anything i should have hurt my chest. Anyway, so i took a ibprofen before i went this time and tried it again. Last time when i attempted it i could only go up to 185 and that was a struggle. Anyway I was able to go up to 225lbs. That hurt a lil but i didn't wanna go heavier and risk hurting it more. So since I couldn't put up alot of weight i decided that the weight i can put up i'll do it a lil more. So instead of doing 3reps i did 4reps. Also i controlled the reps more. I did a 202, 2secs up and 2secs down. Basically i slowed it down. Also I did extend my arms all the way after each rep, that way there wouldn't be alot of stress on the tricep. It worked pretty good. It would only hurt when i reracked the bar. What you guys think it is?

Triceps-So I thought since my tricep was hurt i wouldn't be able to do triceps today. I tried it anyway cuz i'm stubborn and to my surprise it didn't hurt at all. I don't get that! At any case i worked that out as well. Also as you can see i added a couple of excercises. I tried these excercises before but this was the first time i did them all in the same workout. My Tri's felt pretty good after. Actually i didn't go to high in weight cuz i knew i was still injured and because i wanted to see how much energy i would have after. That way I would know exactly how much i can push myself. Feels like next time i can go up in weight

**ray0414** · 09-23-2008, 12:05 AM

u need to warm up better before benching, do warm ups for all your upper body muscles at light weight for like 15-20 reps, even a few minutes in the bike machine would get blood flowing. and if your going for growth your main sets should be of like 8-10 reps with barly any help. with low reps, your tiring the muscle out before u get a chance to work it good. low reps is for powerlifting, not bodybuilding.

**jc95605** · 09-23-2008, 06:32 AM

Well normally when i start my routine i'll do 155lbsx15. However, with this new training program my trainer wants me to stop at 10 to save some energy for the heavier lifts. I do kinda agree with you more tho. I do think that when i do 15reps i'm more warmed up and have a better workout. Now i'm curious to hear your explaination on how powerlifting is different from bodybuilding. I think this is argueable but i'd like to hear your take on it.

**binder** · 09-23-2008, 10:13 AM

I've had a few friends tell me it hurts when they unrack and rerack weight. I would think because you are pushing the weight up more (up being towards the top of your head) with your arms extended you would be pulling on the back of the shoulder and tricep more. Try keeping your elbows a little relaxed when you rack it verses having your elbows locked. That might take some load off the tricep and keep it from stretching it really far.

**ray0414** · 09-23-2008, 10:34 PM

heres an article about powerlifting/bodybuilding on dave drapers website, famous BBuilder from the70s who trained with arnold, he talks about a few different things with bodybuilding and powerlifting, he says its good to switch it up but he never mentions doing any less than 6 reps though.

http://www.davedraper.com/how-many-reps.html

**jc95605** · 09-24-2008, 02:43 PM

I read over that article and it seems the 2 he likes are 5x5 then switches it to a 5x8 after awhile, then back to 5x5 with higher weight. The other method is the 12,10,8,6. I used something like this a while back ago. I don't think my reps were exactly this but i gradually went down in reps and up in weight. I got pretty good results/strength increases with that. Right now like i said this trainer is talking about the last 3 sets to be fairly heavy. The same 3 reps for 3 sets. According to him this will build muscle memory and allow me to start my bench higher. I think i'm going to combine them. Do something like 12,10,8,6 then the 3 muscle building sets. What you think?

**Bad Viking** · 09-24-2008, 11:24 PM

Hi Jc!

Been following ur log from the start,and think ur doing great bro.
Try to add some deadlifts,squats and leg extensions...will help your core mucles alot and your overall strength.

Best regards BV

**jc95605** · 09-27-2008, 09:17 PM

September 24th
Cycle Off
Weight 171lbs

As always the changes are in red

BB flat bench: 155lbsx12, 185lbsx10, 205lbsx8, 225lbsx6, 235lbsx3, 235lbsx3, 235lbsx3

Pec-Dec Flys (cables): 30lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Hammer Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Alternating Curls: 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5, 45lbsx5

Tricep Pulldown (behind head rope attachment): 70lbsx10, 70lbsx10, 70lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (one-arm cables): 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10, 40lbsx10

Tricep Press (using curl-bar, pushing up from lower chest): 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10, 60lbsx10

Tricep Pulldown (triangle attachment): 55lbsx10, 55lbsx10, 55lbsx10

**binder** · 09-28-2008, 10:53 AM

hmm....have you changed your diet or water intake any?

i noticed you're back down to 171 now. how many weeks ago did you stop your cycle? i think it appears to be what, 4 weeks ago?

**jc95605** · 09-28-2008, 01:17 PM

No i haven't really changed my diet. I've been in pct for a couple of weeks now. My strength seems to be staying to same but since i restarted the clen i went from 178 to 171. My stomach seems to be getting flatter too. I'm starting a new training program with a trainer at my gym tomorrow. I told the other owner/trainer that i wanted to get 300 and we went over a few excercises. Apparently this other guy heard about it and came to me on Friday and asked me. I said yes, and he wants to work with me. I asked a few other ppl there, and this guy is supposed to be the bench king. So it looks like i'll be changing my routine yet again. I'll probably have to devote 1 day solely to chest, then figure out the rest. I'll know more tomorrow. What do you think of the new tricep routine.

**jc95605** · 09-29-2008, 10:03 PM

Has anybody else had trouble logging into this website? I started training with a trainer today. It was a pretty hardcore workout. My chest was way pumped up the whole time. I don't like how i did today but he kept saying that it was my first day so of course it was going to be rough. Thats makes sense. He said just give him 30days and i'll be alot stronger. Last week he told me that he could have me benching 300 by christmas. If we continue this workout i think it'll happen. I can't wait until things become easier.

**binder** · 09-30-2008, 03:06 PM

hmm...dropping that kind of weight that fast makes me think it is more water retention than anything. Dropping 6lbs in a few weeks would require a pretty hefty change in caloric intake. even with clen .

**jc95605** · 09-30-2008, 06:41 PM

I don't think thats it. I'm was at 3500 calories ed. When i started this new training program i'm upping it to about 4000 and 320gs of protein ed. This is more of a lean bulk/bulk program. And its all natural. Starting tomorrow I will not be taking any clen .

I gotta be honest i'm getting kinda tired of doing this log. My last 2 workouts aren't posted. I don't even remember what i did now, it was too long ago. I think i'm just gonna stop it and talk to binder thru private message, lol.