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05-10-2013, 09:36 PM #161
I've read what you've said in the other thread so this stack below is a 2-part stack that will help, as I believe the issue is mostly in your head, but I'm going to suggest some mood enhancers as well.
L-Tryptophan: 1 gram in the morning, 1 gram at lunch
L-Theanine: 200mg 4 to 5 times per day.
L-Citrulline (Malate version if possible): 1 gram in the morning, 1 gram at night.
Horny Goat Weed (Epimedium): 1 gram in the morning, 500mg before bed.
MACA: 800mg in the morning, 800mg before bed
This is basically working on your mood with a little help in libido and increasing blood flow. I think if you relieve some stress, you will get there, but the other ingredients will get you there faster.
Please try this and let me know how it works for you. Allow it at least 3 to 4 weeks. I'd love to see this work for you before going the cialis route.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-10-2013, 09:41 PM #162
I'm going to call my local Vitamin Shoppe tomorrow to see if they have all of those products in stock. If they don't I will order through ebay or amazon and when I have everything I will take a picture and post them here as an update! Thank you very much for taking your time to read a 10 paragraph background story and taking your time to post these in order to help me... Thankyou!!!!
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05-10-2013, 09:43 PM #163~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-11-2013, 04:52 AM #164Junior Member
- Join Date
- Sep 2012
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- 98
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05-11-2013, 05:07 PM #165
Thanks for the wealth of information on these vitamins and amino acids!
I am looking to increase my vascularity. I have used L-Arginine in the past. From reading this I see L-Citrulline will also help with vascularity. Any preference in pill or powder for the arginine? I noticed that powder form gives 4,600 mg a serving where as pill form there was a max of 1,000mg a serving. Cost analysis would favor powder. However is one more effective than the other?
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05-11-2013, 05:18 PM #166
Hey LFTP!
Not sure what you mean by powder gives more mg's. You would just use whatever dose you wanted. There are no "Servings" so to speak. Pill come in all kinds of sizes. Anyway, the important thing with Arginine is to find a micronized version for better absorption. Pill or powder, just as effective.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-11-2013, 10:12 PM #167L-Cysteine 3000mg
L-Lysine 750mg
L-Methionine 3000mg
L-Arginnine AKG 3000mg
L-Citrulline DL Malate 3000mg
L-Leucine 1750mg
Beta-Alanine 1500mg
L-Valine 875mg
L-tyrosine 1000mg
L-isoleucine 875mg
L-Gluteamine 1250mg
Taurine 1000mg
I do have one other sup which i don't take.. This contains
L-valine 500mg
L-isoleucine 500mg
L-leucine 4000mg
N-Acetyl-L-Tyrosine 700mg
L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate 2000mg
D-Aspartic Acid 3000mg
Plus i have other suppliments like
liv.52
Fish oils
Udo's oil blend
multi vits ect ect
That's a considerable amount for a pre-workout. You'll find that some of your Amino's are counter productive...
I recommend you remove the following from your pre-workout:
- L-Cystiene (take post workout)
- L-Tyrosine (take before bed)
- L-Glutamine (take before bed)
I'm still debating the Arginine:Citrulline ratio. I'm leaning towards higher Cit than Arg. But I haven't made that decision yet.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-11-2013, 10:22 PM #168
Original post update with corrected protocol. Probably still off since I'm absolutely exhausted and my eyes are blurry. Here's a copy:
~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 11:05 AM #169
Vascularity stacks and protocols have been added to the original post, here is a quick copy:
VASCULARITY
I don't know about you, but I certainly love the vascular look. The more the better! Some may not like it, but I think most of us regular gym goers crave the look. It's not just a look, it's motivating. Especially at the gym when you get that nice pump and your veins start popping out from everywhere. There are tons of positive things that happen in our bodies that lead to this. As a lifter and/or body builder, it's crucial to achieve the steps that lead to vascularity.
Before we move forward with explanations and supplementation I need to make sure to get the main key out of the way. Diet. you've heard it a million times... "Abs are made in the kitchen", well that goes for vascularity as well What you consume and how much of it will eventually determine your body fat percentage. A lower body fat percentage will yield a higher level of vascularity I'm not saying you have to be "stage ready" at 4 to 6% body fat. But certainly not easily attainable when we're over 15%. Now again, that number is not set in stone. Everyone is different and genetics play a strong role here.
Nitric Oxide levels have a massive effect on our bodies with tons of benefits. But today we will discuss the ones that are related to this topic:
Blood Flow/Circulation:
Increasing your blood flow is the first key. Boosting your nitric oxide levels will achieve this by relaxing the blood vessels, leading to an increase in diameter. Blood flows better in bigger/wider veins.
Muscle Cell Endurance:
Endurance is not only related to your cardio abilities. Your muscles' endurance can be targeted by boosting your nitric oxide levels. This will allow you to lift heavy. But also helps with efficient recovery from strenuous lifting, inevitably leading to growth.
Muscle Mass:
This goes hand in hand with the 1st one mentioned, blood flow. Imagine your body is a plant that needs watering. If you water this plant with a tiny hose that has the diameter of a drinking straw, it will take forever to feed it. It's just not effective. But if you water the plant with a large diameter hose, you'll feed it quickly and efficiently. Same goes for your muscles. The larger the vessels that lead to your muscles, the more nutrients they will get. It's that simple. Open the flood gates.
What can I supplement with to increase vascularity?
Ok, so some of you probably jumped straight to this section. there are many supplements out there that will help. Strategically stacking some of these supplements will better your chances. Amino acids are a key player here, obviously.
Our good friend gdevine saved us a ton of time and has put together a stack that works. I say this because I've replicated it and I'm very happy with the results. Now, some of you may not be able to attain some of the prescription medications and/or afford the cost, so I will also give you another option that you can get at a fair price over the counter from your local pharmacy.
gdevine's vascularity stack and protocol:
NOTE: gdevines protocol goes far beyond vascularity. Below you will see his objectives and protocol, which most certainly leads to outstanding levels of vascularity.
Objectives:
* Increased Blood Flow
* Increased Vascularity
* Increased Erection Quality
* Increased Libido
* Increased Prostate Health
* Increased Performance in Gym
* Prophylactic Neurological Benefits (Decrease likelihood of Alzheimer's & Dementia)
* Optimize Blood Pressure
* ...the list goes on.
Mornings:
25 mg of micronized SR DHEA
50 mg of micronized SR Pregneneolone
2.5 mg of Selegiline
Afternoons:
5 mg of Tadalafil
1 mg of Doxazosin
1000 mg of L-Carnitine
1500 mg of Horny Goat Weed (Icariin)
1000 mg of L-Arginine
1000 mg of L-Citrulline
Bed:
25 mg of micronized SR DHEA
1000 mg of L-Tyrosine
5 mg of Tadalafil
1 mg of Doxazosin
1000 mg of L-Carnitine
1500 mg of Horny Goat Weed (Icariin)
1000 mg of L-Arginine
1000 mg of L-Citrulline
Pre & Post Workout Shakes:
Syntha-6 Isolate
NOW L-Arginine Powder Pharmacy Grade Micronized
BCAA's
Creatine Monohydrate
MYO-X
Pre: C-4
Please understand: You do not want to cut corners here. When I made my first attempt, I did not have all the drugs on hand and my results were not as effective. Once I managed to follow the stack precicely, I almost didn't recognize myself after my workout.
What can I take over the counter?
My main goal for my pre workout was to achieve a great pump, vascularity and muscle endurance. The key players have always been L-Arginine and L-Citrulline. After extensive research, I've come to a conclusion (for myself), that both are required here, but L-Citrulline needs to be dosed at a high ratio than L-Arginine.
PRE-WORKOUT:
L-Citrulline Malate - 3 grams
L-Arginine (micronized) - 2 grams
L-Lysine - 2 grams
L-Methionine - 1 gram
Pycnogenol - 120 mg (this stuff is not cheap)
POST WORKOUT:
L-Cysteine - 1 to 2 grams
Vitamin C - 2 grams
BEFORE BED
L-Tyrosine - 1 gram
L-Glutamine - 1.5 grams
Magnesium Citrate - 400 mg
Note that the compounds mentioned are strategically chosen as they work in synergy. They all compliment each other and give you better results than taking them at random. Follow this protocol and give it time to build up, you will see results getting better and better over time. My personal protocol includes other drugs such as cialis, doxa, etc.. but I extracted those from the protocol above, which will still yield some outstanding results for you.
Good luck, stay vascular my friends.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 11:10 AM #170
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05-12-2013, 11:59 AM #171
Great update austinite, and unsurprisingly I have more questions. There are few additional compounds that you have not provided information on in the original post.
I assume you take aspirin so that your blood is kept thin and for the potential of reducing heart attacks? I see you are still taking pycnogenol, do you have an update on that yet? Based on your vitamin E supplement, 1 capsule is equal to 45 IU; so you only take 1 capsule per day? I thought you had mentioned that you take two capsules per day? What is NAC? What is metformin hcl? What purpose do you take hydrocortisone for?
Lastly, is "pharmaceutical grade" arginine the same as "micronized" arginine? I found the powder that NOW Foods makes, but it doesn't explicitly state "micronized" (NOW Foods L-Arginine Powder 1 lb Pwdr - Swanson Health Products).
There is one slight inconsistency with your new chart in that you still have your dose of arginine at 3000 mg and citrulline at 2000 mg. Members should read this entire thread though, so it should be obvious. I just thought I should mention it. Thanks a bunch for all of this information. I can't wait to begin my stack.
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05-12-2013, 01:32 PM #172
Your assumption regarding aspirin is correct. It's exactly why I take it.
Vitamin E on the protocol is an error, as I suspected would happen considering it was 3am when I typed it up. So, 45 x 2 for a total of 90 iu daily, which is taken in 2 doses with the 2 omega-3 doses. I'll fix that later.
NAC is N-ACETYL CYSTEINE. I think we discussed this earlier in this thread. If not let me know.
Metformin HCL is common for diabetics, although I am not a diabetic, my doctor recommended this to lower blood glucose levels. It's almost time to revisit this one with my doc and it most likely will be discontinued from my regimen. I do not recommend this whatsoever without a doctors order.
Hydrocortisone is a prescription to raise my cortisol levels. Levels in everyone typically drop in the afternoon. My levels drop too much. Again, not recommended without doctor's orders.
"NOW" products are very high quality. It is not the micronized, however. A micronized version will absorb better.
I'll adjust the chart to reflect cit/arg ratios. Again, I was on no sleep for too long - as mentioned earlier in the thread I've been playing with the ratios and only recently, literally 2 days ago, came to the decision to dose cit higher.
no reports on Pycnogenol yet. Soon though. So far so good but I want to make sure I'm on it long enough to justify the profiles on the internet and a more personal view.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 02:17 PM #173
Yeah, I understand that is was really late when you made your changes. I promise I was not complaining. As far as NAC goes, we have talked about it; so I apologize. I forgot what NAC stood for. Why is it that you take both NAC and regular cysteine though? When we had talked about it before, I was referring to NAC as a replacement for cysteine. Also I noticed that in this updated regimen you take arginine, lysine, citrulline, cysteine, and glutamine all in one dose now (not necessarily together). Why do you no longer split the doses (e.g. 1000 mg of glutamine in the morning and 500 mg of glutamine at night)?
It is definitely smart to use a supplement for an extended period of time before you talk about its effects, so I am not trying to rush you even though it may come off that way. I was just making sure I hadn't missed any information about pycnogenol.
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05-12-2013, 02:57 PM #174
lol. I wasn't implying that you were complaining Glad you pointed it out so I can fix it.
Well, we know what Cysteine and Nac do, but what you may not have known (which I also learned recently) is that NAC can increase the pathway to Coagulation. (the process that will lead to blood clots). So it acts as a preventative measure. The results from using NAC can be measured with bloodwork and is referred to as "prothrombin time". Nac is also more stable and produces a greater deal of glutathione, the great antioxidant mentioned earlier in this thread.
I use Cysteine because the conversion of NAC to cysteine in our bodies is not sufficient (not much actual cysteine left after all the conversions). This is better way of dosing (for me) rather than taking a ton of NAC. Also note that I'm not taking NAC daily anymore. I switched to 3 times a week because of my awesome math skills. 3 times a week is plenty.
Arginine, Citrulline and Lysine are the only ones I take in the morning also. (I workout at night), I take a gram of each every morning. That's not on the chart. The preworkout dose listed is the actual dose, not the combination of morning/pre-workout.
Through a recent elimination process that I did, I noticed that Glutamine has been causing a bit of drowsiness for me. I'm recommending it before bed along with the other muscle relaxers.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 03:11 PM #175
Haha, yeah I didn't think you thought I was complaining; but I wanted to make sure because of how grateful I am for all of your help. I definitely did not know about 'prothrombin time," so you have piqued my interest in reading about it. I don't exactly understand how your "awesome math skills" led you to switch your NAC dosage though, but it made me laugh when I read it. Thanks for all of the clarification.
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05-12-2013, 03:36 PM #176
lol, not entirely awesome, But I took the absorption ratio, conversion ratio and half life to determine dose and frequency needed. Not getting into all that, but my math brings me to an effective dose of NAC @ 3 mg per LBM weight So LBM x 3 = how many mg's of NAC needed. Dosed 3 times weekly. And Cysteine at 5.25mg per LBM weight, so LBM x 5.25 = daily dose needed. I was good on Cysteine, but taking an unnecessarily higher dose of nac. These numbers simply double when cycling.
~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 04:48 PM #177
Fantastic thread! For those who have taken the time to read I have no doubt it will help. There is no question it has helped me. Thanks again for the work u put into this thread.
-Heat
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05-12-2013, 04:53 PM #178
Last edited by basketballfan22; 05-12-2013 at 04:57 PM.
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05-12-2013, 05:01 PM #179
Last edited by austinite; 05-12-2013 at 05:04 PM.
~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 05:02 PM #180~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 05:08 PM #181
Ok. Chart finally updated and fixed. Thanks for looking out, BBfan. I think I got it right this time, lol.
I want to remind everyone NOT to follow the D3 dose that I take. I do this because my body doesn't take to it very well. Most people will be just fine at 2000 iu daily.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 05:13 PM #182
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05-12-2013, 05:15 PM #183
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05-12-2013, 05:15 PM #184~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-12-2013, 05:17 PM #185
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05-13-2013, 06:58 PM #186
about your advice
Hey Austinite. I picked up some vitamin E (Natures made) brand. It says 400i.u per pill and to take 1 to 2 a day on the bottle. I was going to take 4 a day. But I can’t really understand any of the conversion calculators so if you could verify that 4 is right I would greatly appreciate it. As far as I can tell I should be taking about 15g worth a day but it is in international units so I can’t figure out if four of those is right or not? Thanks again here is a link to the product Nature Made Natural Vitamin E 400 IU d-Alpha
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05-13-2013, 07:16 PM #187
Hey drake.
Are you taking 4 servings of fish oil per day? You only need one of these per dose of Fish Oil. I use tocopherols but this is fine. When I took that same brand, I took 400iu in the morning with my fish oils, and another 400iu at night with fish oil again.
So 2 pills a day.~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-13-2013, 07:29 PM #188
I don’t know why they can’t standardize measurements IUs, MG, G, ect… gets confusing
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05-13-2013, 07:30 PM #189~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-13-2013, 07:56 PM #190
Yep
sure thing here it is Nature Made Fish Oil 1200 mg
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05-13-2013, 07:59 PM #191~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-13-2013, 08:07 PM #192
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05-13-2013, 10:04 PM #193
I just noticed this post. I knew you took 50,000 IU of vitamin D on certain days because your levels were still low, but I wasn't aware that your normal 10,000 IU dose was because of that too. I am glad you pointed that out because I was planning on taking 10,000 IU of vitamin D per day. I will be sure to take 2000 IU instead. Thanks.
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05-13-2013, 10:15 PM #194~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-14-2013, 08:04 AM #195Associate Member
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
- Posts
- 408
I am gonna try that pre workout you suggested. Supposed to give pretty good vascular pumps?
Citruline Malate
Arginine
Lysine
Methionine
Pycnogenol
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05-14-2013, 10:03 AM #196~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-15-2013, 04:31 AM #197
Hey austinite. I noticed one of the posts you made in another thread a couple of months ago (http://forums.steroid.com/supplement...st-brands.html). You mentioned that the doses and frequencies change when you are on AAS vs. off it. Is this your on cycle regimen? If so, how do you modify the doses for when you are off cycle?
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05-15-2013, 08:34 AM #198
Well, it kind of depends on my cycle. Short cycles tend to have small changes, while long cycles might have quite a few. That list has changed since. I dropped Rhodiola and Calcium. NAC dose dropped and increased D. Added a a lot more Amino's.
Generally the ones that are affected are B12, Amino Acids and the "mood" enhancers. They increase on cycle. Cycling for me takes me on a roller coaster ride (depending on the compounds), and increasing these certainly helps stabilize my attitude, emotions, etc...
The dosing varies. B12 goes to daily vs. weekly, amino's are more "spread out" through the day with higher doses, mood enhancers sometimes double. Anything that impacts blood for the better (lowers pressure, thins blood, better flow) also increases on cycle.
Most of my changes in the past were due to cycling with Tren . Which I will no longer be using. Too much "yo-yo"-like imbalance for me with Trenbolone .~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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05-15-2013, 08:43 AM #199
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05-15-2013, 08:47 AM #200~ PLEASE DO NOT ASK FOR SOURCE CHECKS ~
"It's human nature in a 'more is better' society full of a younger generation that expects instant gratification, then complain when they don't get it. The problem will get far worse before it gets better". ~ kelkel
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