Should Obesity be classified as a disease?

[MuscleScience]

Yes it kind of should be a disease because we have too many fat fucks causing $$$ issues in any country where they choose to stay obese and drain the country resources
Here's the thing the leading cause of death is heart disease and has been for what 60 years now? Its a serious issue and we need to figure this out

I'm still pro eating meat and don't think going vegan is the total solution but there is something seriously wrong with the modern diet and living style of human beings
Heart disease is killing more people every year than anything else (this shit has been worrying me lately as well because of gear use and popping a heart valve during lifting, not sure anymore)

Carbs are also an issue in some cases, people eating straight up junk food. They buy donuts and sugary cookies at work and I don't get it, you're not getting anything but sugar and fat out of that donut
I dont need that

Simple Carbs are probably 70% of the problem. Then you throw seed oils/fats and animal fats on top of it and it’s like throwing gas on a fire. Obesity and diabetes were non-existent in the general population. It was only a affliction or affluence. Being fat was actually so social status. If you were fat you had a lot of money to over eat.

Heart disease does have a genetic component but it’s not as wide spread of a culprit as many have made it out to be. Our genes haven’t drifted enough in the last 100 years to cause our skyrocketing rated of obesity. Cheap food, with high energy balance and low nutritional quality is the culprit.

“Poor people in America are fat, think about that shit for a moment.”
Roe Rogan

[Gallowmere]

Simple Carbs are probably 70% of the problem. Then you throw seed oils/fats and animal fats on top of it and it’s like throwing gas on a fire. Obesity and diabetes were non-existent in the general population. It was only a affliction or affluence. Being fat was actually so social status. If you were fat you had a lot of money to over eat.

Heart disease does have a genetic component but it’s not as wide spread of a culprit as many have made it out to be. Our genes haven’t drifted enough in the last 100 years to cause our skyrocketing rated of obesity. Cheap food, with high energy balance and low nutritional quality is the culprit.

“Poor people in America are fat, think about that shit for a moment.”
Roe Rogan

It all boils down to this: food is too damned easy to come by, period, full stop, end of debate. We’re not wired, as a species, to turn away from easily sourced calories. Most return for least investment and all of that. We see the same behavior in pretty much all living things. The only difference is that they don’t have thumbs, nor the brainpower to mass manufacture Doritos.

[Proximal]

It all boils down to this: food is too damned easy to come by, period, full stop, end of debate. We’re not wired, as a species, to turn away from easily sourced calories. Most return for least investment and all of that. We see the same behavior in pretty much all living things. The only difference is that they don’t have thumbs, nor the brainpower to mass manufacture Doritos.

And that crappy food is cheaper. We are also more attracted to sweet, salty & fatty foods (why not, they usually taste better to most). Thus the beauty of fast food (made even more appealing if you have a time crunch).

Within a stones throw from my high school (typical breakfast and/or lunch for most kids): 7-11, Starbucks, McDonalds, Taco Bell and In & Out Burger (which kicks major ass by the way).

[Gallowmere]

And that crappy food is cheaper. We are also more attracted to sweet, salty & fatty foods (why not, they usually taste better to most). Thus the beauty of fast food (made even more appealing if you have a time crunch).

Within a stones throw from my high school (typical breakfast and/or lunch for most kids): 7-11, Starbucks, McDonalds, Taco Bell and In & Out Burger (which kicks major ass by the way).

There are biological reasons for this that all tie into exactly what I said about most return for least investment. Fats and sugars are easily consumed in large quantities due to their being easily converted energy sources.

Sodium lacing does something similar, as it’s biological uses and requirements are vast. Hell, prior to the modern age, salt was a precious commodity, to the point where many ancient militaries paid a salt ration to soldiers. If you look at most foods in their natural states, they are all VERY potassium rich, but very sodium poor. As such, it makes sense that we developed a taste receptor specifically for it.

[Eduke93]

Haven’t read other posts...

But my opinion.

No, not unless the root cause is a disease/problem e.g thyroid issues.

Otherwise, anyone can control their eating habits and exercise. Obesity is the direct cause of multiple diseases, it’s beyond me when a perfectly healthy person can’t control their habits to help themselves live a healthier/disease free life...

[Chrisp83TRT]

There are biological reasons for this that all tie into exactly what I said about most return for least investment. Fats and sugars are easily consumed in large quantities due to their being easily converted energy sources.

Sodium lacing does something similar, as it’s biological uses and requirements are vast. Hell, prior to the modern age, salt was a precious commodity, to the point where many ancient militaries paid a salt ration to soldiers. If you look at most foods in their natural states, they are all VERY potassium rich, but very sodium poor. As such, it makes sense that we developed a taste receptor specifically for it.

Eat bad processed foods , you will get 400% over your daily sodium needs no problem

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[Proximal]

There are biological reasons for this that all tie into exactly what I said about most return for least investment. Fats and sugars are easily consumed in large quantities due to their being easily converted energy sources.

Biological reasons, yes of course, goes without saying. Regarding the special sensory receptor for salt, you lost me. We have specific sensory receptors for just about anything, not sure why you would think sodium is special.

Actually it would be “easier” for the body to covert a complex carbohydrate into ATP, than fat during cellular respiration, plus you don’t have the waste product of ketones. Sugar is not more “easily” converted into energy, it just passes through the digestive system & into the blood more quickly than complex carbohydrates (or carbohydrates lower on the GI index).

[Gallowmere]

Biological reasons, yes of course, goes without saying. Regarding the special sensory receptor for salt, you lost me. We have specific sensory receptors for just about anything, not sure why you would think sodium is special.

Actually it would be “easier” for the body to covert a complex carbohydrate into ATP, than fat during cellular respiration, plus you don’t have the waste product of ketones. Sugar is not more “easily” converted into energy, it just passes through the digestive system & into the blood more quickly than complex carbohydrates (or carbohydrates lower on the GI index).

We do not have sensory receptors for most micronutrients, at least in the quantities that would be biologically useful versus toxic. You can’t taste useful amounts of things like iron, magnesium, copper, etc. in the context of foods. You can detect them when in excessive quantities that could poison you, but that goes for pretty much anything. Sodium on the other hand, can be detected in very trace amounts, at least in people who haven’t had their senses pounded with stupid amounts of it from birth.

As for the carbohydrate versus fat thing: yes, it does convert more readily to usable energy, but contains FAR less. That said, my point was that people currently like to blame “carbs” for the obesity problem, when in reality, the only instance I can think of that isn’t a mixture of carbohydrate and fat that is constantly over-consumed is in the form of sodas.

It’s absurd to call ice cream, pizza or donuts “carbs”, just as it’s absurd to call them “fats”. They’re all very dense in both. Again, the only problematic exception is soda, and if you find someone trying to extoll the benefits of Mountain Dew, feel free to headbutt them in the throat.

[Gallowmere]

Eat bad processed foods , you will get 400% over your daily sodium needs no problem

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Which is why I said “foods in their natural state”. Sodium is rather hard to come by without salting, even at my current 4250 kcals/day, specifically because I’m not eating out of boxes and cans. The most sodium rich things I currently eat are spinach and carrots.

[Chrisp83TRT]

Which is why I said “foods in their natural state”. Sodium is rather hard to come by without salting, even at my current 4250 kcals/day, specifically because I’m not eating out of boxes and cans. The most sodium rich things I currently eat are spinach and carrots.

You're eating clean 4250 cal!?!

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[GearHeaded]

You're eating clean 4250 cal!?!

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to put it in perspective, thats 7 pounds of lean chicken breast per day with 5 cups of rice per day . thats a chore to get down I'm sure

[Gallowmere]

You're eating clean 4250 cal!?!

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You say that as if it were difficult. Rice is cheap AF and makes for an easy to eat carb source.

[Gallowmere]

to put it in perspective, thats 7 pounds of lean chicken breast per day with 5 cups of rice per day . thats a chore to get down I'm sure

Pffft, fuck chicken. 90/10 sirloin all day.

[Gallowmere]

Today as an example:

[GearHeaded]

Pffft, fuck chicken. 90/10 sirloin all day.

yeah I agree . steak is the way to go , way more nutrient dense.

I was just talking shit about what "clean" looks like to some people and its "chicken breast and rice" all day. ugh

[fiddlesticks]

Sodium is extremely important for blood volume and lots of other things.

And to further play devil's advocate, soda is extremely good at suppressing one's appetite most of the time. Better to drink 2 140 cal cans than 4 pieces of 350 cal pizza. The combo of stomach bloating and caffeine increases sympathetic drive alot. It would be nearly impossible to overeat calories consuming nothing but soda from the bloating.

[Proximal]

We do not have sensory receptors for most micronutrients, at least in the quantities that would be biologically useful versus toxic. You can’t taste useful amounts of things like iron, magnesium, copper, etc. in the context of foods. You can detect them when in excessive quantities that could poison you, but that goes for pretty much anything. Sodium on the other hand, can be detected in very trace amounts, at least in people who haven’t had their senses pounded with stupid amounts of it from birth.

AGREED ABOUT TASTE RECEPTORS. YES WE HAVE THEM FOR SALT, THUS WE TASTE THE SALT, THUS WE ENJOY THE SALT. IF IT IS MORE READILY AVAILABLE, WE EAT MORE SALT.

As for the carbohydrate versus fat thing: yes, it does convert more readily to usable energy, but contains FAR less. That said, my point was that people currently like to blame “carbs” for the obesity problem, when in reality, the only instance I can think of that isn’t a mixture of carbohydrate and fat that is constantly over-consumed is in the form of sodas.

YES THERE IS MORE ATP IN FAT (144 MOLECULES OF ATP VS. 34 PRODUCED IN THE MITOCHONDRIA), BUT WITH THAT SAID, PEOPLE DON'T GO TO MCDONALDS THINKING/FEELING THEY NEED THE EXTRA ATP, THEY ARE GOING THERE BECAUSE OF EASE OF AVAILABILITY AND "TASTE". PASTA, RICE, POTATOES, BREAD ARE OVERLY CONSUMED (AS IS EVERYTHING) AND THEY ARE NOT ALWAYS COMBINED WITH FAT. AGREED WITH SODAS (AND POWER AIDE, GATORADE, REDBULLS, ETC.)

It’s absurd to call ice cream, pizza or donuts “carbs”, just as it’s absurd to call them “fats”. They’re all very dense in both. Again, the only problematic exception is soda, and if you find someone trying to extoll the benefits of Mountain Dew, feel free to headbutt them in the throat.

ABSURD IS A POWERFUL WORD. IN FACT ALL OF THOSE ARE CARBOHYDRATES (AND FATS, AND PROTEIN IN SOME CASES). I'M NOT TRYING TO BE HARD HEADED. BUT JUST AS YOU GUYS ARE QUITE LITERAL AND EXACT WHEN YOU DISCUSS AAS, I AM VERY EXACT WITH WORD USAGE IN THIS INSTANCE (AND GET A BIT KNIT-PICKY IN THE CASE OF PHYSIOLOGY, LOL). NOT FAMILIAR WITH INSULIN USAGE, BUT COULDN'T MOUNTAIN DEW HELP IF YOU WERE GOING HYPO?

Not trying to bust your chops, just passing some time along with my coffee before I start the day . In short, the average individual's perception of proportions is out of whack & they eat too much. Fast & junk food is calorie dense, thus mix that with large proportions & that truly is a recipe for disaster.

[Gallowmere]

Not trying to bust your chops, just passing some time along with my coffee before I start the day . In short, the average individual's perception of proportions is out of whack & they eat too much. Fast & junk food is calorie dense, thus mix that with large proportions & that truly is a recipe for disaster.

Oh definitely. We’re not in disagreement at all about that. These last few years on the internet have just started to chafe my ass about the “carbs iz ze devil” nonsense. As we both know, it’s plain overconsumption that is the problem, carbs AND fats, usually in the form of shit like cookies, cakes, ice creams, etc.

“Carbs made me fat cuz potatoes”. No bitch, french fries did that, which are more fats than carbs.
“Carbs made me fat cuz sugar”. No bitch, that was donuts and cake. The only exception, again, is soda.

Then all of these mongoloids saying that shit talk about “eat vegetables”. Mmhmmm...what are most of the calories in vegetables from? Right, carbohydrates.

Yes I know, it’s semantics, but it aggravates the fuck out of me for some reason. Hah.

[Proximal]

Oh definitely. We’re not in disagreement at all about that. These last few years on the internet have just started to chafe my ass about the “carbs iz ze devil” nonsense. As we both know, it’s plain overconsumption that is the problem, carbs AND fats, usually in the form of shit like cookies, cakes, ice creams, etc.

“Carbs made me fat cuz potatoes”. No bitch, french fries did that, which are more fats than carbs.
“Carbs made me fat cuz sugar”. No bitch, that was donuts and cake. The only exception, again, is soda.

Then all of these mongoloids saying that shit talk about “eat vegetables”. Mmhmmm...what are most of the calories in vegetables from? Right, carbohydrates.

Yes I know, it’s semantics, but it aggravates the fuck out of me for some reason. Hah.

We're seeing eye to eye. Yeah, semantics. There was a time I read a lot of philosophy and took courses for fun of it. You could struggle/argue with a single sentence, hell a single word for hours.

Plus, many parents are so clueless. I do apologize, I do like my Starbucks. One morning a father and his son are ordering. The kid wants a x-large mocha frappachino with whip-cream. The dad interrupts and asks the cashier, "hey, there's not a lot of caffeine in there is there"? The cashier says no and the dad is greatly relieved, so that's what the kid ordered (plus some pastry). I did everything I could to not utter a word or give him a look of total disbelief. F'n idiots.

[Gallowmere]

We're seeing eye to eye. Yeah, semantics. There was a time I read a lot of philosophy and took courses for fun of it. You could struggle/argue with a single sentence, hell a single word for hours.

Plus, many parents are so clueless. I do apologize, I do like my Starbucks. One morning a father and his son are ordering. The kid wants a x-large mocha frappachino with whip-cream. The dad interrupts and asks the cashier, "hey, there's not a lot of caffeine in there is there"? The cashier says no and the dad is greatly relieved, so that's what the kid ordered (plus some pastry). I did everything I could to not utter a word or give him a look of total disbelief. F'n idiots.

Haha, yeah it’s out of hand. It’s worse than the old joke about diet soda with a supersized fries and triple quarter pounder.

“Here’s your 1200 calorie ‘coffee’...decaf, cuz ya know, that 150mg of caffeine is far worse for your CV system than the beetus.”

[Beetlegeuse]

Go watch an old WWII war movie made in the 1940s & 50s and look how conspicuously lean the men are. Most look like their clothes are hanging off them. But they didn't spend weeks on a starvation diet to get that way, that was their walking around weight. Back then it was uncommon to see someone who was substantially overweight. These days when you see someone who looks like that, it makes you wonder if their health is okay.

Or watch the film "Woodstock." As random a gathering of tens of thousands of young people as you're ever likely to see, which took place 49 years ago. Search through the crowds for the fat people. They're there, but you've got to hunt to find them.

Then fast-forward to Modern America. Go to the local mall or Wally World. Walk around and try to keep a running tally of what percentage of the people you see there who you reckon are morbidly obese.

There are some few who are the victims of genetics but for the better part, disease doesn't cause obesity, lifestyle choices do.

And the food isn't to blame, its all a matter of how much you eat, and how much movement you create from all of those calories.

There is a bicycle race called the Race Across America (RAAM). You might never have heard of it but it is one of the most gruelling sporting events ever dreamt up. As the name implies, they race from one side of America to the other, start out at one ocean and finish at the other. The distance depends on that year's route but it's usually around 3000 miles.

Except unlike races such as the Tour de France, where the race is run in "stages," Point A to Point B on day one, then Point B to Point C on the next, the race starts when it starts and it ends whenever they get to the other coast. There are no scheduled breaks or rest stops. It effectively is a sleep deprivation contest rather than one of athletic prowess because to have a chance to win you can't afford to sleep more than about 90 minutes per day. Because while you're napping, the others are still riding.

The winner finishes in 8 or 9 days, having ridden a bicycle something like 200 of the last 215 hours. Besides staying awake, the biggest problem is getting enough to eat. Because your stomach and gut can only process only so much food in a given day. But it takes fuel to keep the pedals turning over for nine days, so they eat the most calorie-rich diet they can stand.

In the early 1990s, ultra-cyclist Rob Kish hit upon the idea of fat. The RAAM riders fuel mostly on liquid because it's easier on the stomach than solids and it's easier to get rid of the waste. You can pee while continuing to ride but you pretty much need to stop to poop. So they usually run on high-carb sports drink.

But it struck Kish that carbs are only four calories per gram where fats are nine calories per, so fats are more calorie-dense. So he shouldn't have to eat as much fat to get by as he had to eat of carbs. The question was how to feed on fat for nine days in a form that was both liquid and palatable. And the idea hit him of the ideal source.

Ice cream.

Häagen-Dazs, to be specific. With 60% of its calories from fat. So Kish decided he'd ride a bicycle (more or less) continuously for eight days eating nothing but Häagen-Dazs ice cream.

And he won. The Häagen-Dazs doesn't get all the credit because Kish owned the RAAM. He rode it 17 times, finished all 17 and won three. Including the one he rode on ice cream. But in that one race, it sure didn't hurt his time any.

At the finish he was so gaunt he looked like an escapee from Auschwitz. He'd lost weight on the trip (as they all do) because even eating more than 10,000 calories of ice cream a day didn't offset the calories burned riding a bicycle 375 miles.

You can eat pure sugar ...or lard ...and it won't make you fat if you're expending more energy than you're ingesting. Not possible. The laws of thermodynamics forbid it.

[fiddlesticks]

Just had a pretty weird thought about those bikers peeing while riding.... Dangerous me thinks

Increasing physical activity is extremely effective for obese people to lose fat, when I was 270 a while back I got to 250 in like 7 days from simply working outside more, throwing logs around whatever lol. When you are heavy just moving around burns tons of calories.

[Gallowmere]

Just had a pretty weird thought about those bikers peeing while riding.... Dangerous me thinks

Increasing physical activity is extremely effective for obese people to lose fat, when I was 270 a while back I got to 250 in like 7 days from simply working outside more, throwing logs around whatever lol. When you are heavy just moving around burns tons of calories.

Yeap. This is why it’s such a pain in the ass for me to gain weight now. I can’t fucking sit still for more than 30 minutes at a time unless I’m sleeping. When I was 165, this meant I needed 3000 kcals/day to maintain weight. 175? 3400. My current on cycle 195? Around 4000. Stuffing 4250 into myself every day has me barely trending upward still.

[EDCG19]

You contradicted yourself in your final paragraph: “carbs are also an issue”, then went on to acknowledge the actual problem. I’ll let this shot from Stephan Guyenet’s book cover the point for me:Attachment 175608

good catch but carbs are actually the issue the way i see it, the sugar industry fucked everything up 60 years ago telling people to eat more carbs instead of fats

[fiddlesticks]

Yeap. This is why it’s such a pain in the ass for me to gain weight now. I can’t fucking sit still for more than 30 minutes at a time unless I’m sleeping. When I was 165, this meant I needed 3000 kcals/day to maintain weight. 175? 3400. My current on cycle 195? Around 4000. Stuffing 4250 into myself every day has me barely trending upward still.

It's fucking annoying how I eat too much when I'm attempting to lean down then don't want to eat when I'm gaining lol.

[Gallowmere]

It's fucking annoying how I eat too much when I'm attempting to lean down then don't want to eat when I'm gaining lol.

The body always strives toward homeostasis. It’s why obesity doesn’t usually set in over a period of weeks or months, unless something really fucked up happens, like a debilitating accident or metabolic insult (glandular cancers and the like).

The brain fight our attempts to both gain and lose weight, tooth and nail, under normal circumstances.

[Gallowmere]

good catch but carbs are actually the issue the way i see it, the sugar industry fucked everything up 60 years ago telling people to eat more carbs instead of fats

Nope. See my recent conversation here with Prox. Taubes can get on his sugar nonsense all he wants, but the fact is, if you look at the data, people were still overeating on fat through all of that stuff. Sugar consumption has gone down over the last decade, yet asses continue to expand. It’s both, and always has been, it’s just a matter of the dance being skewed from time to time.

[kelkel]

Today's lunch:

[Gallowmere]

Today's lunch:

Careful Kel, there’s carbs in that there pizza. You might wake up with the beetus, especially with all of the sugar in that pineapple and sauce.

[Proximal]

Go watch an old WWII war movie made in the 1940s & 50s and look how conspicuously lean the men are. Most look like their clothes are hanging off them. But they didn't spend weeks on a starvation diet to get that way, that was their walking around weight. Back then it was uncommon to see someone who was substantially overweight. These days when you see someone who looks like that, it makes you wonder if their health is okay.

Or watch the film "Woodstock." As random a gathering of tens of thousands of young people as you're ever likely to see, which took place 49 years ago. Search through the crowds for the fat people. They're there, but you've got to hunt to find them.

Then fast-forward to Modern America. Go to the local mall or Wally World. Walk around and try to keep a running tally of what percentage of the people you see there who you reckon are morbidly obese.

There are some few who are the victims of genetics but for the better part, disease doesn't cause obesity, lifestyle choices do.

And the food isn't to blame, its all a matter of how much you eat, and how much movement you create from all of those calories.

There is a bicycle race called the Race Across America (RAAM). You might never have heard of it but it is one of the most gruelling sporting events ever dreamt up. As the name implies, they race from one side of America to the other, start out at one ocean and finish at the other. The distance depends on that year's route but it's usually around 3000 miles.

Except unlike races such as the Tour de France, where the race is run in "stages," Point A to Point B on day one, then Point B to Point C on the next, the race starts when it starts and it ends whenever they get to the other coast. There are no scheduled breaks or rest stops. It effectively is a sleep deprivation contest rather than one of athletic prowess because to have a chance to win you can't afford to sleep more than about 90 minutes per day. Because while you're napping, the others are still riding.

The winner finishes in 8 or 9 days, having ridden a bicycle something like 200 of the last 215 hours. Besides staying awake, the biggest problem is getting enough to eat. Because your stomach and gut can only process only so much food in a given day. But it takes fuel to keep the pedals turning over for nine days, so they eat the most calorie-rich diet they can stand.

In the early 1990s, ultra-cyclist Rob Kish hit upon the idea of fat. The RAAM riders fuel mostly on liquid because it's easier on the stomach than solids and it's easier to get rid of the waste. You can pee while continuing to ride but you pretty much need to stop to poop. So they usually run on high-carb sports drink.

But it struck Kish that carbs are only four calories per gram where fats are nine calories per, so fats are more calorie-dense. So he shouldn't have to eat as much fat to get by as he had to eat of carbs. The question was how to feed on fat for nine days in a form that was both liquid and palatable. And the idea hit him of the ideal source.

Ice cream.

Häagen-Dazs, to be specific. With 60% of its calories from fat. So Kish decided he'd ride a bicycle (more or less) continuously for eight days eating nothing but Häagen-Dazs ice cream.

And he won. The Häagen-Dazs doesn't get all the credit because Kish owned the RAAM. He rode it 17 times, finished all 17 and won three. Including the one he rode on ice cream. But in that one race, it sure didn't hurt his time any.

At the finish he was so gaunt he looked like an escapee from Auschwitz. He'd lost weight on the trip (as they all do) because even eating more than 10,000 calories of ice cream a day didn't offset the calories burned riding a bicycle 375 miles.

You can eat pure sugar ...or lard ...and it won't make you fat if you're expending more energy than you're ingesting. Not possible. The laws of thermodynamics forbid it.

You genius mf’r. I myself use the Woodstock reference all of the time. Nice one and SO spot on!

[Proximal]

Today's lunch:

Hey, that’s natural chicken though and no added hormones to boot.

Speaking of pizza, isn’t Dominos an official sponsor of the NFL? Have you seen that newer add with that God forsaken meal that dad serves his family? And what does it cost, like $7 or some other insanely low price. We’re doomed as a culture.

[fiddlesticks]

I would prefer my chickens to be injected with insulin , gh, igf, mgf ,methyltren, test, superdrol and epo personally.

Judging by the size of the chicken breasts at walmart, it seems they are listening to my wishes.

[Proximal]

I would prefer my chickens to be injected with insulin , gh, igf, mgf ,methyltren, test, superdrol and epo personally.

Judging by the size of the chicken breasts at walmart, it seems they are listening to my wishes.

Isn’t that what syringes are for? We used to do something similar with vodka in fruit.

[fiddlesticks]

Isn’t that what syringes are for? We used to do something similar with vodka in fruit.

I would love to see what happens to a chicken on that regimen. Cockzilla

[Proximal]

I would love to see what happens to a chicken on that regimen. Cockzilla

What? Oh thought my wife was calling me.

Cockzilla. How’d you know, lol?

Got to find a chicken where genetically the body doesn’t stop the production of muscle cells as an embryo (like that breed of cattle and a few dogs).

[fiddlesticks]

What? Oh thought my wife was calling me.

Cockzilla. How’d you know, lol?

Got to find a chicken where genetically the body doesn’t stop the production of muscle cells as an embryo (like that breed of cattle and a few dogs).

And then, get those genetically fudged chickens on a Big Ramy style regimen. 24/7 IV glucose and aminos too. Force them to lift some heavy shit to get fed or something like that. A heavy switch that dispenses bird food.

[Proximal]

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/193865958930118014/

[fiddlesticks]

And the final dopamine cherry on top, put MDPV or a similar drug in the food to amp them birds up. 24/7 growing and training. I shall patent this.

[redz]

I think it’s a mental illness.

[SocioMachiavelli]

Today as an example:

Is that the IOS version of myfitness?