Chinese HGH concerns

[EasyDoesIt]

You sound like someone who was hired by pharmacy companies to ruin the reputation of all Chinese HGH, to increase the sales of pharmacy HGH.

The pharmacies do not need hgh to be pushed on this forum, but you sound like someone working for just the opposite. KEEP TAKING YOUR CRAP AND PUSH IT ELSEWHERE!

[KRH]

Yes I'm 12.

Haha wow bet you will get a few likes for that 3 worder. You're so funny, I could just cry laughing at how you wasted money on HGH that has a badge on it.

Face it, you don't know how to reply sensibly because you're not smart enough and you're wrong so instead you post something that you fin d funny, oh well at least it gives you a break from watching donkey porn in your mums basement. Good luck and bye.

The pharmacies do not need hgh to be pushed on this forum, but you sound like someone working for just the opposite. KEEP TAKING YOUR CRAP AND PUSH IT ELSEWHERE!

Oh really? So a forum with the amount of traffic this forum gets isn't doing pharmacy companies any favours? They're a company, their aim is to make money, what planet do you live on? You must be ignorant and stubborn if you don't think this thread hasn't made them a few sales, indirectly or directly, it doesn't matter.

As for your accusations, I buy straight from the Chinese manufacturers, I buy for my own personal use, HGH is illegal in most countries, so I don't fancy going to jail, I have a job that I value and want to keep, thanks.

[Mp859]

The pharmacies do not need hgh to be pushed on this forum, but you sound like someone working for just the opposite. KEEP TAKING YOUR CRAP AND PUSH IT ELSEWHERE!

I agree that's why I called him an angry china man

[Mp859]

You're not even worth arguing with


Nobody is buying into your Chinese gh bull$hit

[Sgt. Hartman]

See can't have a sensible discussing? How old are you 12? I can afford Humatrope, it's just not very cost effective when the Chinese can also produce HGH, common sense is lacking for some people.

And real experience with the varying brands of gh, especially pharm gh is lacking for others. You have run pharm gh right?

Let's just think about this for a second.

Chinese HGH gives; good results, the same effects as real HGH and the same bloodwork as HGH, so why the f*** would you spend triple the times more on something that has a pharmacy label on it. It sounds to me that you're angry that you've wasted money on something that can be bought a hell of a lot cheaper

Who says generics yield the same effects as pharm GH? You?? Anyone experienced with gh would disagree with that even the guys who run generics and believe them to be legit. Whether it be because the body creates antibodies to the generics more rapidly and easier, or because they are less bio-available due to the 191aa structure being slightly different there is no doubt that these are not bio-identical hormones nor yield the same results as pharm gh.

haha you moron!

Thanks for not flaming, it's against the board rules and can result in banning. I'd say a person who is constantly forking over money and receiving an inferior (or completely useless) product than what he's paying for would be a bigger moron anyway.....

Oh right that's funny I've tried both igf-1 and ghrp as they were suggested as being the peps the Chinese use and guess what, it didn't give the same bloodwork neither did it give the same effects. So you're wrong there, just more conspiracy BS that has no evidence behind it. This thread proves nothing and member like you are angry about it and get overly defensive about anyone questioning your stupid flawed logic. You sound like someone who was hired by pharmacy companies to ruin the reputation of all Chinese HGH, to increase the sales of pharmacy HGH.

If you're happy with your chinese generics you should keep running them but save you're argumentative propaganda bs for those who are naive enough to believe it.

[KRH]

And real experience with the varying brands of gh, especially pharm gh is lacking for others. You have run pharm gh right?

Who says generics yield the same effects as pharm GH? You?? Anyone experienced with gh would disagree with that even the guys who run generics and believe them to be legit. Whether it be because the body creates antibodies to the generics more rapidly and easier, or because they are less bio-available due to the 191aa structure being slightly different there is no doubt that these are not bio-identical hormones nor yield the same results as pharm gh.

Thanks for not flaming, it's against the board rules and can result in banning. I'd say a person who is constantly forking over money and receiving an inferior (or completely useless) product than what he's paying for would be a bigger moron anyway.....

If you're happy with your chinese generics you should keep running them but save you're argumentative propaganda bs for those who are naive enough to believe it.

Read my posts again, I've ran Humatrope.

Me plus many others have noticed the effects are the same.

Look who started the flaming first, I tried to have a sensible discussion as I thought this is what this thread was all about, but because 2 idiots disagreed with me, they threw accusations and name calling my way.

So I can't state my opinions? Isn't that what this whole thread is based on, opinions? Please show me one piece of solid evidence posted in this thread, how many times do I have to ask for someone to show me solid evidence, no one ever does, I wonder why?

If I can't give my opinion on Chinese HGH without being accused of selling something, then I wouldn't call this a non biased thread, would you?

[DPTUK]

Read my posts again, I've ran Humatrope.

Me plus many others have noticed the effects are the same.

Look who started the flaming first, I tried to have a sensible discussion as I thought this is what this thread was all about, but because 2 idiots disagreed with me, they threw accusations and name calling my way.

So I can't state my opinions? Isn't that what this whole thread is based on, opinions? Please show me one piece of solid evidence posted in this thread, how many times do I have to ask for someone to show me solid evidence, no one ever does, I wonder why?

If I can't give my opinion on Chinese HGH without being accused of selling something, then I wouldn't call this a non biased thread, would you?

Look even if we play's devil's advocate here for one second and lets just assume hypothetically that you can obtain legitimate generic GH from China, the mere transportation process from China to your doorstep in itself would make the GH redundant and useless.

On my human grade Genotropin instruction leaflet it clearly states keep the GH refrigerated but do not freeze and do not shake whatsoever as this can make the GH redundant!

How on earth can you possibly account for what temperatures the GH you get have been stored at or that they haven't they been rigorously shaken up in the transportation process from China to you?

Genuine human grade GH is delivered if via courier from legitimate pharmacies using specialist medical courier companies that take into account the delicacies involved.

Whatever was you look at it, not one of the arguments you present any logical sense and respectfully I would say to you that you are in denial.

[Sgt. Hartman]

If I can't give my opinion on Chinese HGH without being accused of selling something, then I wouldn't call this a non biased thread, would you?

Your opinions are welcomed.

The flaming and angry china man bickering isn't.

[KRH]

Look even if we play's devil's advocate here for one second and lets just assume hypothetically that you can obtain legitimate generic GH from China, the mere transportation process from China to your doorstep in itself would make the GH redundant and useless.

On my human grade Genotropin instruction leaflet it clearly states keep the GH refrigerated but do not freeze and do not shake whatsoever as this can make the GH redundant!

How on earth can you possibly account for what temperatures the GH you get have been stored at or that they haven't they been rigorously shaken up in the transportation process from China to you?

Genuine human grade GH is delivered if via courier from legitimate pharmacies using specialist medical courier companies that take into account the delicacies involved.

Whatever was you look at it, not one of the arguments you present any logical sense and respectfully I would say to you that you are in denial.

Actually you're the one person I can say is definitely pushing pharmacy grade HGH. In all most every post you're advertising the fact that you've got Genotropin, you even created a whole thread on it. You are obviously hoping for users to PM you, so that you can sell it to them.

Let's forget about you're selling of Genotropin for a second. To answer your questions:

Whenever I order my GH, it comes in isothermal packaging, it's packed very well, so it can't move. Of course any package can be damaged in transit, but that's just stupid, so could pharmacy grade HGH or anything for that matter. Wow so your calling all Chinese GH fake because of your paranoia of couriers? Well to be fair your point makes about as much sense as the rest of this nonsensical thread.

Also you're wrong Genotropin can be kept at room temp for 1 month, read their site.

Has anyone here ever been to China? Because I have. If China are not capable of manufacturing HGH, then how on earth would they cope? China has a large population, with any population there will be medical problems, China also has people who suffer from GH deficiency. They don't prescribe American brands in China, they prescribe their own Chinese HGH to GH deficient patients. Some of these patients are GH deficient children, now there's no way in hell that fake HGH would ever combat a child's deficiency problems and allow them to grow at a normal rate, fake HGH wouldn't work for GH deficient children. So calling all Chinese HGH fake just because respected members here have had bad luck with it is incredibly narrow minded. China isn't Somalia, they have proper medical equipment and proper medicines.

Your opinions are welcomed.

The flaming and angry china man bickering isn't.

Then maybe you should quote Mp859 then, check out post 1958, who started the name calling flaming?

[EasyDoesIt]

You're not even worth arguing with


Nobody is buying into your Chinese gh bull$hit

I agree a waste of data usage. Even a good MMA fighter knows when to tap out.

[DPTUK]

I agree a waste of data usage. Even a good MMA fighter knows when to tap out.

Couldn't have put it better myself, I am however curious as to what the forum stance is members making libelous accusations?

[Mp859]

I don't understand why someone would try so hard to prove there product is legit. If you believe it is legit then continue using it.

THE END

[@rt]

I don't understand why someone would try so hard to prove there product is legit. If you believe it is legit then continue using it.

THE END

Not trying to take sides here, but I think this thread was based on idea, to prove if Chinese make legit HGH. KRH states that there are no proofs here, only opinions stated. So I guess, if he can prove that legit Chinese HGH still can reach US borders that would be awesome to know, if no facts can be given from KRH, lets stick with opinions. And if there are only opinions and no facts, then no point to argue about this.

[Mp859]

Personal experience=proof


I went and bought a kit AFTER the warning from Marcus and was glad I only bought one kit.

Can you post your bloods just for the helll of it?

[KRH]

I agree a waste of data usage. Even a good MMA fighter knows when to tap out.

You mean you got proved wrong and you're pissed about it?

Couldn't have put it better myself, I am however curious as to what the forum stance is members making libelous accusations?

The accusations I'm making are correct. You're full of crap, you posted how your doctor just gives you Genotropin because you asked for it, then you post that he has given you contacts that sell you Genotropin for a cheaper price, in the UK that wouldn't happen. No doctor in the right mind would risk his £50k+/year job for the sake of prescribing you something that you don't need. I don't know what it's like in other countries, but I know in the UK this wouldn't happen. It's very obvious that your trying to lure users into your scam. You want them to PM you so that you can scam them. There's no accusations here, it's the truth and it's obvious.

I don't understand why someone would try so hard to prove there product is legit. If you believe it is legit then continue using it.

THE END

There's a flip side to this coin, why would someone go extremely out of there way (50 page thread full of false opinions) to prove Chinese are fake? I was simply adding my opinions and experience to this thread, all of a sudden I get flamed by members like you. Your over defensive attitude shows that this thread is clearly biased. There was another absolutely ridiculous thread posted about Hyge containing no HGH and I made a post in that, because the whole proof came from a dodgy looking site that had laughable proof. The fact there's multiple threads created about the same subject and the fact that if anyone disagrees with this wild theory they get attacked, shows me that there's clearly only one motive by members of this forum. I'm pretty sure some of them have been hired by pharmacy companies, I'm not even joking. I've seen it before, because the Chinese are able to make something for so much cheaper, other non Chinese companies can't compete, so they hire people to ruin the reputation of these companies. It's called ORM (Online Reputation Management), ORM means that they will buy certain people to slag off the reputation of certain companies, in this case Chinese companies producing HGH.

Not trying to take sides here, but I think this thread was based on idea, to prove if Chinese make legit HGH. KRH states that there are no proofs here, only opinions stated. So I guess, if he can prove that legit Chinese HGH still can reach US borders that would be awesome to know, if no facts can be given from KRH, lets stick with opinions. And if there are only opinions and no facts, then no point to argue about this.

You are not getting the point. It's the opposite way around, this thread is about proving Chinese HGH is fake, so the evidence should be posted by the people making accusations, so far there's 50 pages and no solid evidence for such strong claims. Do you not find this slightly concerning? Also just look this forum, someone outsmarted one of these so called 'Senior' members before, I can't find the thread but I will edit my post if I find the thread, but basically someone was asking the same questions as me and they got the same answer about China using peps to throw the bloodwork off. However, this member posted facts about the peps not being able to elevate the IGF levels for more than a certain time, the 'Senior' member was proved wrong so he just ignored this post and it died. This is just one of the many examples about the biased posting that goes on here at this forum.

I'm not the one making very strong claims, it's the people calling all Chinese HGH fake that are the ones who should be posting solid evidence.

[marcus300]

So because you and others have a crap source it means all of Chinese GH is fake? This is what I'm talking about, there's so many strong opinions in this thread backed up by no evidence. Do you know what evidence means? More to the point, do you know the difference between a fact and an opinion?

You said you have good results, so I take it you were on your fake GH for a while, surely you'd notice you were taking GHRP-6, if I remember correctly, it makes you really hungry, surely this might have made you question it? Secondly I like to make sure to get bloodwork done frequently, that way I can monitor my levels and watch for anything unusual, maybe you should have done the same.

Also serostim is one of the most faked brands of GH around, what makes you think that's not fake crap as well?

I do buy my Chinese GH and I monitor my bloodwork constantly, it does as it's supposed to, I'm happy and that's all that matters. I'm following the trend of this thread and posting my opinions rather than evidence as it seems like that's what this thread is all about.

Prove me wrong, tell me exactly what magical chemicals the Chinese are throwing in to mimic the exact effects and bloodwork of GH and then I'll believe you. You won't be able to do this as it's not possible, there's nothing that can mimic the identical effects of GH while giving bloodworks that match that of Humatrope.

This thread wasn't started to bash generic gh is was started because there was concerns related to Chinese gh it grow and things developed due to the mounting evidence or should I say opinions lol, why on earth you cant comprehend why and what this thread is about is beyond me and shows how little you understand and know.



You clearly haven't read the whole thread because you will see it evolved and the concerns turn into real solid evidence opps I mean opinions lol, You know when 100 people have concerns about something and start exploring why they are experiencing some strange sides, no sides, no results or dangerous sides opinions turn into evidence, the side of caution prevails. Let me try and help you with your understanding because you do lack a hell of a lot of knowledge on the subject which is seen from your previous posts



You started your first gh cycle on the 8/8/13

Hi,

I will soon be starting my first HGH cycle. I am 31, 6ft, 205lbs and about 12% BF. I am just curious if I took 8iu's for 3 days a week, would the sides be worst than taking 4ius for 6 days a week? They both add up to 24iu's a week, so wouldn't the side effects be the same? How quickly do the common side effects occur e.g swollen hands?

Preferably I don't want to start with 2iu's ED as the less injections the better. I am not afraid of injections I am just not a big fan of them, but I am not letting this discourage me from HGH. I know it's a pretty stupid reason.

Thanks any advice is really appreciated.

The gh you was planning on using were hyges which is a company which isn't even regulated in China it produces gh for the underground market, ive use them before bought directly from there lab but they produce all types of fakes, the evidence opps opinions all over the internet on other forums not just this one shows something is drastically wrong with hyges and the other generics. That's why this thread was started not to bash but to explore what's happening, if you really read the whole thread you will see this but with your tunnel vision and only allowing yourself to see what you want to read you have very closed opinions. You didn't even know what growth releasing agents were so how on earth can you even think anyone is going to listen or take your opinion in from someone who has zero knowledge zero experience and lack of common sense. Even you thought they were fake after you read part of this thread.

Yeah I think I'll give my Hyges a miss. I'll try and dispose of them later. My supplier also has Serostim GH, have you tried that?

If nothing else I've learnt something new today. I knew about the HCG scam but I didn't know the whole Hyge think was a scam. It makes you wonder who you can trust these days.

8/12/13

Yeah I'm sorry, I went off on one. It won't happen again. You're 100% right, I have decided to give Hyge as miss and I'm now about to get pharma grade GH, I just really hope I don't get some fake knock off Omnitrope gh.

Many of the guys like myself have been using generic and pharm grade for years, do you hear this correctly YEARS ive been using pharm/generic for 20+ years and been training for around 28 years. I use to use the best source available in china. I use to buy 10k per month directly and they openly told me as the yrs went on they can offer me every box on the market, every single label on the market and every single shape of vial and coloured top I want. My contact even told me the gh wasn't real gh because now after the shutdown after the Olympics things have got tough and they have started to make some compounds what produce and mimics gh sides. This is when I lost confidence. You have been using weeks, even if you tried pharm grade you have no idea what real gh does to you and how it can transform your body because you haven't spent enough time on the gh you first cycle of gh was on the 8/8/13 or that's when you was talking about going on so its much later than that. Your playing at it and your foolish responses show how frustrated you are.



I even went direct to the licence manufacturers like jins and AnkBio etc and they even started to turn out bad, Ankbio even paid me 1000ius to keep my mouth shut on the forum, they did this with another member who also use to buy a lot from them. They even had an advert on their web page telling people to be aware of fakes from this other company but when you looked into it the other company had the same bank details as the main site but within 2 months that was changed because they knew they made a mistake, same vials, same boxes but the product not the same. They were bang at it and it shows in this thread via the emails I and others had something was seriously wrong with even the pharma stuff.


What happens is they are willing to produce and sell fakes to the underground even the regulated companies because we cant do anything about it. Do you really think these generic companies what are set up to sell to the underground have the equipment to make these hormones active. It costs millions of $'s for the equipment and they biggest counterfeit country in the world who poisons its own people aren't going to sell clean 100% real deal gh to the underground..



I have told you time and time again read the thread but I know you haven't because you would see the evidence opps sorry opinions of a lof of people's experiences. You would of seen and learnt that testing for gh/igf levels is a mine field and the chances of a accurate reading are very slim. Have you had 3 baseline tests done at the same time and blood tested at the exact same time??? I will answer for you NO you haven't because if you did you will see even the natural gh pulse or igf and blood test are not that accurate, over 3 tests you would get 3 different readings. If you have done your research which I am no doing for you like you keep crying people to do for you that yes peps can show some good readings, can show more or similar readings.


You would of also seen many members posted strange and bizarre sides, this isn't one person its a group of members who started sharing their experience and sides, some have dangerous sides like the increased bp which takes them to some serious life threatening levels, my friend was nearly hospitalized with it after 6months worth of generics. Other guys reports zero sides and some others report serious CTS what goes on for months and months. Other report weight gain and an increased level of water retention. Even some reported gyno after they stopped the gh again two of my friends reported this with generics which clearly shows they had an estrogen rebound due to the so called gh being some kind of AI what would strip the water and estrogen out of the body, which in some inexperienced people like yourself think would be a result. To the inexperienced like yourself these sides would be results and good to go gh but for the experienced guy who has used pharm grade for many months/years will understand gh doesn't do these types of things.



What happened the market was flooded with generics what mimic gh sides, they also produce some gains or what they thought were gains due to the increased weight or drop of weight. Some are plain peps which will give and throw off blood test and yes they do produce some high reading which have been posted. What do you think a large number of people giving their opinion and experience on a certain product is?? come on oh wise one who's been using gh since 8/8/13??? if a new steroid came out what you never used before lets call it cvntaroid and you ask for advice/opinions on that drug and you get 25 members or more, lets say 50+ members saying its rubbish, didn't gain anything, give me bad sides, had to stop due to feeling unwell etc you get what I am saying don't you? then you get 2 guys saying they gained. Now looking at the OPINIONS and experience of the majority would you say the evidence points to the drug being sh1t? yes the mounting evidence shows you that it isn't worth trying or risking, the opinions turn into evidence if the amount of opinions and views show the weight is on the side of caution for the drug, so that turns into real solid evidence. What do you think the opinions of people are in a court setting is, they telling their side of the story that they saw a certain person at the scene of a crime, say 15 people give their opinion that they saw his car or the saw someone wearing the same clothes, or the saw someone look like him running away, what do you think the vast majority of their opinions turns into? when the defence have one person saying he was at home with me in the night in question. what do you think the jury will say " its only opinion no evidence" no the majority of their same opinions turns into evidence.



Your not going to get evidence from a lab because its impossible to test if the gh is active or not, i'm not even going to go into this with you because if you read the thread you will see why you cant etc. The questions you ask show your lack of experience and I'm not going to go over and over the same old questions what have been answered, because they all have been answered in here or other threads concerning the same subject.


The problem is you have underlining anger issues due to being ripped off from the Chinese, we all have been there I got ripped for thousands of $$$'s for yrs and yrs. What you got to do is stop fighting your own stupid opinion and start looking the mounting opinions/evidence of guys who have used for yrs and know what they are talking about and starting excepting this otherwise you will carry on using your hyges and not get the proper results etc form 100% gh. Now you can say or do what you want but i'm not trying to convince you anymore, your happy you carry on so fill your boots with those hyges/generics but I;m not going over old ground with someone who doesn't have any experience and just started using gh on the 8/8/13 and doesn't understand the basics of gh use and application.


I'm not here to push any pharmacy, I don't sell pharm grade gh, I am not linked to anyone who can supply gh and I have not given my opinion and experience to trick and fool the members, if you think I have that's fine but in all honesty I am trying to help you but all your doing is separating yourself with your foolish responses like "where the evidence" lol . Do you understand that were you are with your gh therapy, knowledge, experience and buying gh from china is weeks old, were you are is were I was years ago before you even picked up a weight. I am here to help and advice I am not here to trick people and direct them down the wrong avenue. Think what ever you like but I am done with you. All I ask is please take your blinkers off and listen to people who know what they are talking about but if your convince of your source and generics due to your lovely blood tests lo you carry on. Please don't take my post as an attack on you its a post to try and make you open your eyes and see things cleary because your very confused and lack of experience is shining though.


Best of luck to you either way you go.


Marcus

[belva]

Thank you Marcus, Much knowledge and experience going on here. From your advice I clearly see that you really want to help people in this forum. I'm happy to have the possibility to read those treads.

[KRH]

Marcus, thanks for finally replying with the only sensible reply I've seen so far. I was pushing for some decent info, but instead I got flamed. Although your reply isn't something we both agree on, I appreciate the time you took to type it out. However, I'll stand by the fact that my Chinese HGH is legit, maybe most of Chinese HGH is shit, but if my GH matches the results of Humatrope, the bloodworks of Humatrope and feels very much like Humatrope and is less than a quarter of the price, then I'll happily stick to using that.

I think you've got my interpretations all wrong, I'd have been happy to have been proved wrong about Chinese HGH, I still haven't been proved wrong. Although your reply was lengthy there was unfortunately no evidence just all opinions again.

I'm not pushing anything Chinese either, I'd agree, if you have the money then go for pharma grade, if not then the right Chinese HGH is the next best thing.

Best of luck to you as well, hopefully there may be some 'solid' evidence posted in this thread soon.

I'm out of this argument from here on in (no matter if some prick tries to flame my replies when I've stopped posting, I'm refering to Mp859)

[marcus300]

Marcus, thanks for finally replying with the only sensible reply I've seen so far. I was pushing for some decent info, but instead I got flamed. Although your reply isn't something we both agree on, I appreciate the time you took to type it out. However, I'll stand by the fact that my Chinese HGH is legit, maybe most of Chinese HGH is shit, but if my GH matches the results of Humatrope, the bloodworks of Humatrope and feels very much like Humatrope and is less than a quarter of the price, then I'll happily stick to using that.

I think you've got my interpretations all wrong, I'd have been happy to have been proved wrong about Chinese HGH, I still haven't been proved wrong. Although your reply was lengthy there was unfortunately no evidence just all opinions again.

I'm not pushing anything Chinese either, I'd agree, if you have the money then go for pharma grade, if not then the right Chinese HGH is the next best thing.

Best of luck to you as well, hopefully there may be some 'solid' evidence posted in this thread soon.

I'm out of this argument from here on in (no matter if some prick tries to flame my replies when I've stopped posting, I'm refering to Mp859)

Your inexperience shines through with your reply, best of luck you will need it.

[DeniZen]

Thanks Marcus that was a world class post. I'm new to researching HGH and your response summarized up the entire thread for me.

[thisAngelBites]

There's a flip side to this coin, why would someone go extremely out of there way (50 page thread full of false opinions) to prove Chinese are fake?

There isn't a "someone" - many people posted in that link, so hopefully that gets rid of the insinuated conspiracy theory argument about the post, unless now a whole coterie of pharm shills are posting here and there has been for a long time.

I'm pretty sure some of them have been hired by pharmacy companies, I'm not even joking.

I take it then you are not aware that in some markets, several of the pharmaceutical companies try make it very difficult for people without documented proof of the conditions that GH is licenced to treat to buy growth hormone , even at pharmacies. It's odd they would do that AND pay loads of people to post on this forum.

You are not getting the point. It's the opposite way around, this thread is about proving Chinese HGH is fake, so the evidence should be posted by the people making accusations, so far there's 50 pages and no solid evidence for such strong claims.

You're just evading the issue. This thread is about wherever the conversation goes. It's not about absolute evidence or else someone would have posted assays by brand and that would have been the end of it. Then you claimed in a later post: "I'll stand by the fact that my growth hormone is legit."

I'm not the one making very strong claims,

Well, since you claim that it is a fact that your growth hormone is legit, where's your evidence? You made a "strong claim".

The cognitive error of which you accuse others cuts against your argument all the same. They think that most Chinese HGH is rubbish due to their experience, exactly the same as you. So if their reasoning is nonsense, so is yours. Many of them having been taking growth hormone for many years, unlike you.

The truth is that no one has any solid evidence. People are only relating experiences and trying to do some inductive reasoning, the same as you, the only difference being that there a lot more of them than you. This isn't absolute evidence of anything, but I think a lot of people find many accounts of personal experience more persuasive than just one, which is also extremely short-lived.

And please don't go on about how they cannot possibly know ALL Chinese GH is fake - that's a red herring. The claim of Marcus and the others here is not that literally, every single thing in the country of China that is alleged to be GH is fake; that would be ridiculous. I would not have thought this needs to be stated, but for the very literal people, here it is: the claim is that the Chinese sell a lot of fake growth hormone, including directly from factories, and even to people to whom they have sold genuine growth hormone is the past, and the experience of many long term members here, is that it is often fake, and that you simply cannot trust Chinese GH to be real. Therefore, the collective advice is not purchase Chinese GH because it is likely to be a waste of money.

So your argument that you have (allegedly) a box of real GH from China doesn't impact their claim in any way.

[KRH]

There isn't a "someone" - many people posted in that link, so hopefully that gets rid of the insinuated conspiracy theory argument about the post, unless now a whole coterie of pharm shills are posting here and there has been for a long time.



I take it then you are not aware that in some markets, several of the pharmaceutical companies try make it very difficult for people without documented proof of the conditions that GH is licenced to treat to buy growth hormone , even at pharmacies. It's odd they would do that AND pay loads of people to post on this forum.



You're just evading the issue. This thread is about wherever the conversation goes. It's not about absolute evidence or else someone would have posted assays by brand and that would have been the end of it. Then you claimed in a later post: "I'll stand by the fact that my growth hormone is legit."



Well, since you claim that it is a fact that your growth hormone is legit, where's your evidence? You made a "strong claim".

The cognitive error of which you accuse others cuts against your argument all the same. They think that most Chinese HGH is rubbish due to their experience, exactly the same as you. So if their reasoning is nonsense, so is yours. Many of them having been taking growth hormone for many years, unlike you.

The truth is that no one has any solid evidence. People are only relating experiences and trying to do some inductive reasoning, the same as you, the only difference being that there a lot more of them than you. This isn't absolute evidence of anything, but I think a lot of people find many accounts of personal experience more persuasive than just one, which is also extremely short-lived.

And please don't go on about how they cannot possibly know ALL Chinese GH is fake - that's a red herring. The claim of Marcus and the others here is not that literally, every single thing in the country of China that is alleged to be GH is fake; that would be ridiculous. I would not have thought this needs to be stated, but for the very literal people, here it is: the claim is that the Chinese sell a lot of fake growth hormone, including directly from factories, and even to people to whom they have sold genuine growth hormone is the past, and the experience of many long term members here, is that it is often fake, and that you simply cannot trust Chinese GH to be real. Therefore, the collective advice is not purchase Chinese GH because it is likely to be a waste of money.

So your argument that you have (allegedly) a box of real GH from China doesn't impact their claim in any way.

I was going to stop posting in this, but I knew someone would have to reply to my post.

Firstly, there is a 'someone', if you haven't worked that out by now then you're either too stubborn to realize it or just aren't very mentally alert.

Ok so how do you explain good old DPTUK's post. He posted this:

I have no idea what the situation is like in the states. However, when my doc first wrote my script I went to the local pharmacy to obtain prices for what I needed. No need for me to say the that prices from the pharmacy were extortionate! I went back and discussed this with my doc and he put me in touch with the wholesaler that actually supplies the high street pharmacies in the UK and the prices were 50% less than what the high street pharmacies were charging for the same exact product.

You need to find the wholesalers that supply the high street pharmacies and build up a relationship there if possible.

According to such an upstanding member of this community, it's very possible to buy HGH, hell the doctor even makes a few pennies on the side for his referral. My point is there's a lot of contradicting going on throughout this thread, it's starting to become a new trend in this thread. You've managed to contradict yourself many of times in your useless, boring, lengthy post that I've been forced to reply to.

But let's get real for a second, are pharmaceutical brands like Genotropin, Omnitrope or Norditropin a company? What's their overall priority? In case you don't know the answer, it's to make money, they are a company. So the Chinese producing and selling HGH for such a cheap price will affect their profits, which means they will need to find a way to get rid of competition like this. So how would you do it? What's the most powerful tool you can think of? The internet! And guess where's the best place to find out information on the internet? Forums! And guess how many forums there are that discuss HGH, not many is the answer. This forum is definitely in the top 3 forums for volume of traffic, there's 24888 users online at the minute, that's a hell of a lot of people, all a targeted audience as well. This thread has had 150,967 views, this is a lot of views from unique people. Also this thread is instantly given credibility as 'Senior' members have posted evidence (opinions) for 50 pages.

I think we finally agree on something. There's no evidence posted in this thread, it's all just opinions from members who have a hidden agenda.

So which company do you work for? Norditropin? Saizen? Pfizer? Neither would surpise me, sorry if I got in the way of your companies promotion.

[marcus300]

I was going to stop posting in this, but I knew someone would have to reply to my post.

Firstly, there is a 'someone', if you haven't worked that out by now then you're either too stubborn to realize it or just aren't very mentally alert.

Ok so how do you explain good old DPTUK's post. He posted this:



According to such an upstanding member of this community, it's very possible to buy HGH, hell the doctor even makes a few pennies on the side for his referral. My point is there's a lot of contradicting going on throughout this thread, it's starting to become a new trend in this thread. You've managed to contradict yourself many of times in your useless, boring, lengthy post that I've been forced to reply to.

But let's get real for a second, are pharmaceutical brands like Genotropin, Omnitrope or Norditropin a company? What's their overall priority? In case you don't know the answer, it's to make money, they are a company. So the Chinese producing and selling HGH for such a cheap price will affect their profits, which means they will need to find a way to get rid of competition like this. So how would you do it? What's the most powerful tool you can think of? The internet! And guess where's the best place to find out information on the internet? Forums! And guess how many forums there are that discuss HGH, not many is the answer. This forum is definitely in the top 3 forums for volume of traffic, there's 24888 users online at the minute, that's a hell of a lot of people, all a targeted audience as well. This thread has had 150,967 views, this is a lot of views from unique people. Also this thread is instantly given credibility as 'Senior' members have posted evidence (opinions) for 50 pages.

I think we finally agree on something. There's no evidence posted in this thread, it's all just opinions from members who have a hidden agenda.

So which company do you work for? Norditropin? Saizen? Pfizer? Neither would surpise me, sorry if I got in the way of your companies promotion.

Your inexperience and tunnel vision is shining though yet again, its getting painful to read. You have been using gh for weeks you have zero experience and you have no idea about blood test. Do yourself a favour and go and do some research.

Infact forget it, you carry on buying them, you keep thinking you got a good deal and you come back after you got some years worth of experience in using gh, understanding about hgh/igf blood test and when you hopefully get some common sense

members I really think we should leave this guy to argue and fight with himself. He's to blind to see the obvious

[KRH]

Your inexperience and tunnel vision is shining though yet again, its getting painful to read. You have been using gh for weeks you have zero experience and you have no idea about blood test. Do yourself a favour and go and do some research.

Infact forget it, you carry on buying them, you keep thinking you got a good deal and you come back after you got some years worth of experience in using gh, understanding about hgh/igf blood test and when you hopefully get some common sense

members I really think we should leave this guy to argue and fight with himself. He's to blind to see the obvious

Haha you really crack me up. Thanks for the words of wisdom, I'll take that on board after I've finished laughing to myself about people with lesser common sense still being ripped off by pharmaceutical companies.

I'll leave you and others to your sales, best of luck, take care, farewell, bye.

[EasyDoesIt]

Your inexperience and tunnel vision is shining though yet again, its getting painful to read. You have been using gh for weeks you have zero experience and you have no idea about

members I really think we should leave this guy to argue and fight with himself. He's to blind to see the obvious

In bold, "I AGREE" at some point after purchasing a product and sitting on who knows how much, it begins to be a question of whether they are trying to convince themselves that they have good product.

[thisAngelBites]

Marcus, do you know of anything that might raise both IGF levels and paranoiac episodes ? And leave one unable to think clearly? We might be on our way to figuring out what's in those vials.

[thisAngelBites]

In bold, "I AGREE" at some point after purchasing a product and sitting on who knows how much, it begins to be a question of whether they are trying to convince themselves that they have good product.

Of course, the only other option is to realise you've been scammed. And since GH is a long term thing, getting lucky on one box of real stuff at a cheap price is not enough. You have to be lucky like that over and over and over. So you have to tell yourself your source (who also always has a financial interest) is trustworthy.

[DPTUK]

Honestly why anyone would entertain this imbecile is beyond me!

Not that it's anyone's business but I run a highly successful company in the UK that turns over several million pounds a year but this buffoon seems to have me confused as some drug dealer interested in selling human grade GH (very expensive and hard to obtain) via PM on a public forum to idiots like him who would gladly hand over their hard earned cash for fake Chinese HCG under the delusion that "something is better than nothing"!

Apart from libeling himself in his post he is also of the expert opinion that multi billion dollar companies like Pfizer employ people as part of their strategic advertising plan to post on forum boards such as steroid .com because they are in competition with the Chinese HCG suppliers that supply him his bunk!

If you ever read any of my posts you would have noted that I have stated several times that:

a) I never advocate buying any products from any underground source from anyone ever. PERIOD!
b) I would never use any product that is not human grade and is not supplied to me by a certified doctor.
c) I always abide by the law.

Some people are genuinely naive and don't know better for those people education is the answer and there is hope, other people are just plain stupid and deserve to be ripped off and for those people I have no time, sympathy or remorse and clearly you little boy are the latter!

[KRH]

Honestly why anyone would entertain this imbecile is beyond me!

Not that it's anyone's business but I run a highly successful company in the UK that turns over several million pounds a year but this buffoon seems to have me confused as some drug dealer interested in selling human grade GH (very expensive and hard to obtain) via PM on a public forum to idiots like him who would gladly hand over their hard earned cash for fake Chinese HCG under the delusion that "something is better than nothing"!

Apart from libeling himself in his post he is also of the expert opinion that multi billion dollar companies like Pfizer employ people as part of their strategic advertising plan to post on forum boards such as steroid .com because they are in competition with the Chinese HCG suppliers that supply him his bunk!

If you ever read any of my posts you would have noted that I have stated several times that:

a) I never advocate buying any products from any underground source from anyone ever. PERIOD!
b) I would never use any product that is not human grade and is not supplied to me by a certified doctor.
c) I always abide by the law.

Some people are genuinely naive and don't know better for those people education is the answer and there is hope, other people are just plain stupid and deserve to be ripped off and for those people I have no time, sympathy or remorse and clearly you little boy are the latter!

Ok so how much are you selling your Genotropin for? And do you accept WU?

[EasyDoesIt]

[QUOTE=DPTUK;6737602]
Apart from libeling himself in his post he is also of the expert opinion that multi billion dollar companies like Pfizer employ people as part of their strategic advertising plan to post on forum boards such as steroid .com because they are in competition with the Chinese HCG suppliers that supply him his bunk!

If there was a chance of KRH having any credibility, which there is not, this comment about Pharm grade hgh mfgs. being in competition with chinese junk mfgs is not even a conversation and shows the weak thought pattern.

Ok so how much are you selling your Genotropin for? And do you accept WU?

Grow up, man up, move on!
At this point the only thing you have said that makes sense is that you were "out of this argument" Great advice for yourself, take your own advice!

[aenox]

Just wanted to say hello to everybody and what an amazing thread. I have used hgh for the last 10 years. My experiences with US pharma grade such as Saizen and Genotropin far out weigh any chinese bunk i have experimented. I had high hopes when Genheal 1st came to the european market, but later to discover that there were so many fakes around. I am an American from Santa Cruz, California, and moved to Portugal 2 years where it is considerably harder to obtain pharma grade hgh, nevertheless i made a really good contact through a friend who owns a pharmacy, hence i was able to get Saizen, Genotropin and Norditropin at a fairly good price. Unfortunately this August, there was a major stamp down on portuguese pharmacies selling steroids and HGH so i have 2 questions to pose.

1 - Does anybody know about Evogene Alley, which on their site says they are based in Belgium, but i have a suspicion they are based in China..

2 - Are the Genotropin GoQuick pens 36 ius Packed by Pfizer Manufacturing NV, Puurs, Belgium faked, or are they trustworthy.. ?

Once again thank you for such an informative thread. I also understand the frustration of certain members who have invested dearly into buying large quantities of Chinese HGH. Admitting to oneself that one has erred is difficult.

[thisAngelBites]

They say on their website that they manufacture in central Europe and China. The website is being hosted out of Malaysia, and the contact info on the domain is via an anonymous email provider based in Japan and Panama. So I'd say they are working pretty hard to try and make sure no one knows who they are.

I've often heard the pens/cartridges are harder to fake, and then the standard argument is to ask why would anyone go to the trouble to make cartridges when they can just put some crap in a vial, label it and sell it?

Of course, that is easier, but faking the cartridges would bring a lot more money, so that is a large incentive right there. I've seen photos of pens on other sites where people said they were fake. I wouldn't trust a cartridge or pen just because it's a pen. I have some genotropin cartridges that I bought from a chemist in an eastern european country, and it seems good, but I use a lot less than most people here, so side effects etc. are not as apparent as in people who use higher doses and I haven't ever used any that I KNOW is legit, so I am far from an authority in this way.

[EasyDoesIt]

I really don't think Phizer is going to sell off a website. Matter of fact Sero or any of the brand names IMO are going to be counterfeit selling off a website. They do not solicit business that way. They have too much to risk.
I would not trust any of the pharm grades sold on a website. Do they make you provide a script?
I would not trust any of that unless it was a script. At least someones script.

[aenox]

They say on their website that they manufacture in central Europe and China. The website is being hosted out of Malaysia, and the contact info on the domain is via an anonymous email provider based in Japan and Panama. So I'd say they are working pretty hard to try and make sure no one knows who they are.

I've often heard the pens/cartridges are harder to fake, and then the standard argument is to ask why would anyone go to the trouble to make cartridges when they can just put some crap in a vial, label it and sell it?

Of course, that is easier, but faking the cartridges would bring a lot more money, so that is a large incentive right there. I've seen photos of pens on other sites where people said they were fake. I wouldn't trust a cartridge or pen just because it's a pen. I have some genotropin cartridges that I bought from a chemist in an eastern european country, and it seems good, but I use a lot less than most people here, so side effects etc. are not as apparent as in people who use higher doses and I haven't ever used any that I KNOW is legit, so I am far from an authority in this way.

Yeah i had a vague feeling that Evogene are covering their tracks,,., I have heard from the portuguese bodybuilding community that Evogene is actually quite good, but once again, with the cheap prices one can attain this hgh, i highly doubt it is HGH and instead a concoction of peptides which elude the user into thinking that he is making all kinds of gains.

As for the genotropin cartridges, well it makes sense that these could easily be counterfeited since the profit is much higher than the normal chinese bunk that conniving scammers flog for a penny and a dime...

I really don't think Phizer is going to sell off a website. Matter of fact Sero or any of the brand names IMO are going to be counterfeit selling off a website. They do not solicit business that way. They have too much to risk.
I would not trust any of the pharm grades sold on a website. Do they make you provide a script?
I would not trust any of that unless it was a script. At least someones script.

Yes, that is true, pharm grades on websites have a 50-50 chance of being fakes. And no, these sites never ask for a script.

[DPTUK]

Just wanted to say hello to everybody and what an amazing thread. I have used hgh for the last 10 years. My experiences with US pharma grade such as Saizen and Genotropin far out weigh any chinese bunk i have experimented. I had high hopes when Genheal 1st came to the european market, but later to discover that there were so many fakes around. I am an American from Santa Cruz, California, and moved to Portugal 2 years where it is considerably harder to obtain pharma grade hgh, nevertheless i made a really good contact through a friend who owns a pharmacy, hence i was able to get Saizen, Genotropin and Norditropin at a fairly good price. Unfortunately this August, there was a major stamp down on portuguese pharmacies selling steroids and HGH so i have 2 questions to pose.

1 - Does anybody know about Evogene Alley, which on their site says they are based in Belgium, but i have a suspicion they are based in China..

2 - Are the Genotropin GoQuick pens 36 ius Packed by Pfizer Manufacturing NV, Puurs, Belgium faked, or are they trustworthy.. ?

Once again thank you for such an informative thread. I also understand the frustration of certain members who have invested dearly into buying large quantities of Chinese HGH. Admitting to oneself that one has erred is difficult.

Yes they are 100% fake!

[SpanishStallion]

The totally wrong thing in all this thread is the discussion IF THE CHINESE CAN MAKE SOMATROPIN OR NOT. They can make it, at very low cost. The iranians also make it at very low cost, extremely less than the western pharma. It doesn't cost billions to develop E.coli expression capabilities and some might find surprising the relative low costs needed to equip a bio-pharma company.

The discussion should be correlated with the other quality related scandals engulfing China: tainted milk, tainted toys etc. You think a proper argumentation against tainted toys would be the technical shortcomings of Chinese factories to make some plush toys? Definitely not.

THE PROBLEM WITH CHINESE PHARMA IS THEIR WORK ETHICS. Nothing to do with technical capabilities.

[Horsemnn]

I can only reply from my my experience. I have been injecting HGH for about two months. I have purchased my supply from a company in China whom I trust. In support of that company, I have also purchased mesterolone from them. I have enough experience with mesterolone to be reasonably sure that it is real. (Reason I mention mesterolone is because it is not cheap to produce). It is the correct consistency (difficult to reproduce crystalline similarity) and yields the same result. My HGH dissolves slowly and leaves some flakes which I then swirl around and they dissolve after several minutes. The solution is slightly cloudy
(I do not know if this tells anybody anything) so it is not really a solution, but rather a suspension. I tried injecting 10 iu of this product at one time for a couple of days and I did have a tingling in my hands and wrists. I do not know if this is significant but I have read elsewhere on this website that it is. In the past two months I have noticed an increasing muscle definition which I have not until now been able to achieve. Gradually, day by day, a very slight increase in muscle definition. I do not really know if I have the real deal or not. Another interesting point about my supplier. I have really bad blepharospasm which is treatable with botox. I buy botox from them and it works perfectly. It can not be something else, and it is an expensive product to produce. It comes in vials with purposely ruined labels. The purposely ruined labels seem that they used to be the label of a good brand. Now this botox is something that they can not fake me out with because I would know in two days. The price is only 1/10 of the price of botox in the good old USA, or for that matter, elsewhere in the world. My reasoning (which may very well be bad reasoning) is that if they are shooting straight with me on these two very expensive products (mesterolone and botox) then maybe they are shooting straight with me on HGH also. I do not know. I am asking advice and comments. Thank you.

[marcus300]

I can only reply from my my experience. I have been injecting HGH for about two months. I have purchased my supply from a company in China whom I trust. In support of that company, I have also purchased mesterolone from them. I have enough experience with mesterolone to be reasonably sure that it is real. (Reason I mention mesterolone is because it is not cheap to produce). It is the correct consistency (difficult to reproduce crystalline similarity) and yields the same result. My HGH dissolves slowly and leaves some flakes which I then swirl around and they dissolve after several minutes. The solution is slightly cloudy
(I do not know if this tells anybody anything) so it is not really a solution, but rather a suspension. I tried injecting 10 iu of this product at one time for a couple of days and I did have a tingling in my hands and wrists. I do not know if this is significant but I have read elsewhere on this website that it is. In the past two months I have noticed an increasing muscle definition which I have not until now been able to achieve. Gradually, day by day, a very slight increase in muscle definition. I do not really know if I have the real deal or not. Another interesting point about my supplier. I have really bad blepharospasm which is treatable with botox. I buy botox from them and it works perfectly. It can not be something else, and it is an expensive product to produce. It comes in vials with purposely ruined labels. The purposely ruined labels seem that they used to be the label of a good brand. Now this botox is something that they can not fake me out with because I would know in two days. The price is only 1/10 of the price of botox in the good old USA, or for that matter, elsewhere in the world. My reasoning (which may very well be bad reasoning) is that if they are shooting straight with me on these two very expensive products (mesterolone and botox) then maybe they are shooting straight with me on HGH also. I do not know. I am asking advice and comments. Thank you.

You wouldn't see any results in 8 wks with gh so doubt you got real stuff and I wouldn't inject their botox oh my Lord that could be anything and probably is

[Cuz]

Marcus wow hell of a job you done laying everything out on gh. If anyone can get a thread back on track its you lol.

[DPTUK]

Marcus wow hell of a job you done laying everything out on gh. If anyone can get a thread back on track its you lol.

Yeah Marcus is the man!