Var/Nolva stack female log

[megang]

I have actually been struggling mentally and am back on track. We are focusing on getting consistent on everything

[GirlyGymRat]

I have actually been struggling mentally and am back on track. We are focusing on getting consistent on everything

Understood. Consistency is key. I am working on my diet. I gained 5 lbs over holidays and finally starting to move it off!

[ambernightly]

I have no experience using other then Clen. I am not w fan of Clen. I can deal with the shakes. Writing was troublesome. Ppl at work noticed. It's not gonna shred you. It's for the last 5 lbs IMHO. Diet is far more effective. But I did say I HATE Clen. Lol.

Propranolol (beta blocker) for the shakes. You still get all of the sympathomimetic benefits of Clen (+ increased respiratory for blood oxygenation benefits) without the shakes. I've run up to 160mcg/day of Clen while on AAS and it's alllllll about the beta blockers for making the shakes manageable. It's the same medication that surgeons take. Most doctors will prescribe it without much debate if you go in with shaky hands or hyperhydrosis (sweaty hands), etc.

The last 5lbs... yeah Clen is for more than that. I dropped ~20lbs last summer in 1.5 months while taking Clen, Vyvanse (lysine-bond time release amphetamine - like adderall), Spironolactone (for diuretic), and changing diet. 192 to 170. Then lost more before starting my last AAS cycle in August where I ran Clen and Insulin at the same time (omg the pump) - you remember that thread I'm sure.

Clen is a miracle I love that shit. YMMV. But definitely diet is always always always important no matter what the goal is.

[ambernightly]

I know you're not taking the Nolva, but what was your reason for wanting to use it? All it will really do is shrink your breasts.
If you want to harden up by reducing estrogen, an AI (anastrozole) would be more effective. Androgens themselves (especially if DHT-derived), antagonize estrogen as well.

I second the motion. When I ran Primo, Var, and Mast - all DHT derived - while taking 2mg/estradiol per day (oral) my E2 plummeted. That did not happen while running EQ and test-derived compounds due to the aromatase process (which I was not inhibiting b/c... I like estrogen and my boobs!). Visuals are even better than words some times... here's some blood work results to show my cycles last year.

[ambernightly]

I didn't really know either. I just knew they weren't actually the products they're named after.
Then OP mentioned not knowing why she's retaining water.
Thought I'd dig out the actual ingredient. Might be useful to her.

*edit* Meg also had mentioned cycling her Clen . Which we now know is actually B12, caffeine, synephrine and some other fillers.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum

Yep, those supps are just garbage marketed with "hey it's like steroid names but it's totally not like steroids at all". Waste of time and money, just hard on the organs. Better to get the education, a real source for real steroids, and blood work done. There's all kinds of reasons for water retention - her aldosterone could be too high, her E2 could be too high, progesterone or prolactin too high, menstrual cycle irregularities, sodium issues, etc etc etc.

real bodybuilding = education, time, money, dedication.

I'll stick by my rule: blood work before anything else. No conjecture needed: base decisions on facts and statistics. The blood does not lie. Use a food tracker to log every bit of food, wear a heart rate monitor 24x7 to track BMR and workout calories. People just need to use the math... it's there... it's not a secret.

[Bonaparte]

Propranolol (beta blocker) for the shakes. You still get all of the sympathomimetic benefits of Clen (+ increased respiratory for blood oxygenation benefits) without the shakes. I've run up to 160mcg/day of Clen while on AAS and it's alllllll about the beta blockers for making the shakes manageable. It's the same medication that surgeons take. Most doctors will prescribe it without much debate if you go in with shaky hands or hyperhydrosis (sweaty hands), etc.

Unfortunately, Beta-1 agonism from clen at higher doses is responsible for much of its effects. It is only truly selective for B-2 at very low doses.
So by taking propranolol, you're blocking all the B-1 activity (which is very effective for weight loss) and relying on the B-2 effects, which are milder. I'm not crazy about the idea of taking 2 potent drugs to mostly cancel each other out (taking a low dose of clen would be simpler and more fool-proof), but I'll admit that the idea is interesting and has its merits (mostly because it should be blood pressure friendly, since you're cancelling out all adrenergic pressor activity).

[megang]

Yeah I learned from this and won't be getting anymore products from them! I finally have health insurance with my employer so I am going to find a doctor here and get my annual physical and blood work to see where everything is at.

I do use a fitbit charge hr to track my calories, activity and sleep. As long as I have it on it is tracking my heart rate which means it also tracks my resting heart rate, which is also now in the 50s. My coach does my diet.

I don't know pretty much anything about those supplements you have mentioned but I am willing to learn.

[Mr.BB]

Megan the bloowork Amber is talking will hardly be prescribed by your doctor. Believe her point was that one should self educate and know which bloodwork tests to take and analyse it so we know our bodies better.

Totally agree with her.

[megang]

What blood work should I get?

[ambernightly]

Unfortunately, Beta-1 agonism from clen at higher doses is responsible for much of its effects. It is only truly selective for B-2 at very low doses.
So by taking propranolol, you're blocking all the B-1 activity (which is very effective for weight loss) and relying on the B-2 effects, which are milder. I'm not crazy about the idea of taking 2 potent drugs to mostly cancel each other out (taking a low dose of clen would be simpler and more fool-proof), but I'll admit that the idea is interesting and has its merits (mostly because it should be blood pressure friendly, since you're cancelling out all adrenergic pressor activity).

mmm, good point... I only take prop if I'm pre-hypertensive from Clen - prefer lower doses whenever possible (which also seems to be body weight dependent but isn't easily equated to a linear scale). I was 30lbs heavier when I was doing >150mcg doses (and that only at last 3 days of the two week clen cycle). Now I can't get above 75mcg without it feeling kinda awful (though maybe it's to do with thyroid med combo?). Going to read more about how Clonidine works with receptors in the presence of Clen - I have a bunch of that on hand... then was considering buying some manner of ACE Inhibitor to try out but I don't know where to start on those yet, still researching. oooh the fun with my home pharmacy never ends!

What blood work should I get?

These are the ones I always ask for

• Total & Free testosterone (not serum only, need total and free)
• DHT (dihydrotestosterone)
• Estradiol (E2 - estrogen. keep in mind this fluctuates very much during the menstrual cycle, so timing of the blood test needs to take that into account when it's being used as a decision making statistic. strive to get blood work done at the same time of the menstrual cycle each time.)
• DHEA (precursor to the aboves)
• Prolactin (progesterone related)
• TSH and/or T3 (thyroid info)
• Lipid panel (need to know cholesterol and other aspects)
• Complete Metabolic Panel (so much useful info)
• CBC w/ automated differential (complete blood cell count)

Been wanting to add these to my consistent list but then I feel like I don't want to pay extra....

• SHBG (see note below)
• Aldosterone (because I'm curious...)
• Progesterone (self explanatory)

Testosterone and estradiol circulate in the bloodstream, bound mostly to SHBG and to a lesser extent serum albumin and corticosteroid-binding globulin (CBG) (AKA transcortin). Only a very small fraction of about 1-2% is unbound, or "free," and thus biologically active and able to enter a cell and activate its receptor. SHBG inhibits the function of these hormones. Thus, bioavailability of sex hormones is influenced by the level of SHBG. The relative binding affinity of various sex steroids for SHBG is dihydrotestosterone (DHT) > testosterone > androstenediol > estradiol > estrone.[3] DHEA is weakly bound to SHBG as well, but DHEA-S is not.[3] Androstenedione is not bound to SHBG either, and is instead bound solely to albumin.[4]

[megang]

These are the ones I always ask for

[*]Total & Free testosterone (not serum only, need total and free)[*]DHT (dihydrotestosterone)[*]Estradiol (E2 - estrogen. keep in mind this fluctuates very much during the menstrual cycle, so timing of the blood test needs to take that into account when it's being used as a decision making statistic. strive to get blood work done at the same time of the menstrual cycle each time.)[*]DHEA (precursor to the aboves)[*]Prolactin (progesterone related)[*]TSH and/or T3 (thyroid info)[*]Lipid panel (need to know cholesterol and other aspects)[*]Complete Metabolic Panel (so much useful info)[*]CBC w/ automated differential (complete blood cell count)


Been wanting to add these to my consistent list but then I feel like I don't want to pay extra....

[*][*]SHBG (see note below)[*]Aldosterone (because I'm curious...)[*]Progesterone (self explanatory)

Ok I will take this list on when I get my physical. Not sure how much of that would be covered by my insurance if any.

[megang]

My weight this morning is 147.6

[Bonaparte]

mmm, good point... I only take prop if I'm pre-hypertensive from Clen - prefer lower doses whenever possible (which also seems to be body weight dependent but isn't easily equated to a linear scale). I was 30lbs heavier when I was doing >150mcg doses (and that only at last 3 days of the two week clen cycle). Now I can't get above 75mcg without it feeling kinda awful (though maybe it's to do with thyroid med combo?). Going to read more about how Clonidine works with receptors in the presence of Clen - I have a bunch of that on hand... then was considering buying some manner of ACE Inhibitor to try out but I don't know where to start on those yet, still researching. oooh the fun with my home pharmacy never ends!

Clonidine decreases all sympathetic NS activity by causing norepinephrine reuptake (through Alpha 2 agonism). So it is basically the anti-caffeine in its effects. You wouldn't want that if you're trying to lose weight and taking clen. But an ACE inhibitor would be fine for treating just the hypertension without messing up any of the other effects. You can't really go wrong with lisinopril (so long as you aren't in the 15% of people who experience a persistent dry cough from ACE inhibitors). Ramipril is more potent and fast-acting, but needs to be dosed twice daily.

[megang]

Post chest and back this afternoon

[ambernightly]

Clonidine decreases all sympathetic NS activity by causing norepinephrine reuptake (through Alpha 2 agonism). So it is basically the anti-caffeine in its effects. You wouldn't want that if you're trying to lose weight and taking clen. But an ACE inhibitor would be fine for treating just the hypertension without messing up any of the other effects. You can't really go wrong with lisinopril (so long as you aren't in the 15% of people who experience a persistent dry cough from ACE inhibitors). Ramipril is more potent and fast-acting, but needs to be dosed twice daily.

very interesting, great information. will be ordering up ACEs next! also noticed that Propranolol can inhibit T3 activity/functionality, so that's another consideration with weight loss and general bodybuilding.

[megang]

Post arm workout....trying to get my baby arms to grow....or at least look bigger....

[ambernightly]

Post arm workout....trying to get my baby arms to grow....or at least look bigger....

They'll look bigger with a 5% body fat cut (as in lose 5% off of current). What are your macros and ($Total Cal Intake - $Total Burn - $BMR) calorie values for weekly nutrition? Not gonna get rid of that puff without lower body fat and <2000mg/day sodium intake. Size is relative, definition determines visual impact (eg: not being an puffy anadrol baby!)

[megang]

During my leg workout, hamstrings are starting to show

[GirlyGymRat]

[megang]

Post shoulder workout

[megang]

Check-in in this morning 148.2

[GirlyGymRat]

And there she is! Every Sunday!!!

I am retuning my diet this week. Going back to paleo complaint. Bring on the sweet potatoes. lol

[megang]

Lol check-in is every Sunday. Here is what my meals were as well as training schedule.

Meal 1:
5 egg whites (3/4c)
1 whole egg
1 cup green veggies (spinach)
1/3 cup oatmeal (measure before cooking)

Meal 2:
1 scoop whey isolate
Small apple
10 almonds

Meal 3:
3.5oz chicken breast (cooked weight)
½ cup white rice (cooked measure) (Jasmine)
1 teaspoons extra-virgin olive oil
1 cup green veggies (green beans)

Meal 4:
1 scoop whey isolate (25g protein)
Small apple (20g carbs)
10 almonds or cashews

Meal 5:
3.5oz chicken breast(cooked weight)
4oz Potatoes, white (20g carbs)
1 tsp. extra-virgin olive oil (5g fat)
Salad with vinegar

Meal 6:
1 scoop protein powder
1/3 cup oatmeal (measure before cooking)
10 almonds

Post-workout meal - Replace the meal directly after your workout with the following:

4oz lean beef (cooked weight)
1 cup white rice (cooked measure) (Jasmine)

Sunday: chest/back
Monday: legs
Tuesday: arms
Wednesday: chest/back
Thursday: legs
Friday: shoulders

Current cardio setup (30 minutes, 7 days per week, Steady state/moderate): 30 mins 7 days, jogging at a 5.0 at a 1.0 incline with the last 5 mins of walking being walking lunges

*************

Changes are as follows:

-Off Days only - remove the carbs from meals 2, 4, 6. No changes to training days.

- Cardio - 2 days per week, I'd like to turn your 30 min cardio session into: 10 minute warmup followed by 20 minutes of 60/60 second intervals (go as hard as you can for a minute, rest for a minute, etc). The other 5 days will continue to be 30 min steady state.

[GirlyGymRat]

I was incorrectly using my fitness pal as cooked weight and consuming more calories then I thought I was. 4oz of cooked chic is more calories then 4 oz of uncooked chic.

I know u have a coach advising you. I personally cannot cut with the amount of none fruit and veggy carbs you consume. Those Carbs absolutely stick to me in my stomach. My Genetics sux thus the reason for my change to paleo complaint diet. I love bread but it hates me back. Lol.

Food choices look yummy. I am going to eat my dinner now. Salad and some chic!

[GirlyGymRat]

Since u are training everyday, do u ever not remove the carbs?!?

[megang]

Since u are training everyday, do u ever not remove the carbs?!?

I have one day a week that I don't lift

[megang]

Here are some side by side comparisons from the beginning of Dec when I started this plan with my coaches to today. My diet hasn't been perfect the entire time and neither has my training but I still have had results

[megang]

From after chest and back earlier

[GirlyGymRat]

This is exactly why Pics are so critical in a log. It's noticeable! Esp in shoulders, back and stomach!!!!

[megang]

Definitely! The pics from the beginning of Dec I was at 161 and today I was at 148.2. It isn't a big difference weight wise but I am definitely leaner.

[GirlyGymRat]

Definitely! The pics from the beginning of Dec I was at 161 and today I was at 148.2. It isn't a big difference weight wise but I am definitely leaner.

More then 10 lbs is huge!!! Especially during recomposition!!!!!

[TheTaxMan]

Well done megan

Can see the difference especialy round your abdominal area
And the slight back fat you had around the bikini strap has really came in

Keep up the good work

[megang]

Well done megan

Can see the difference especialy round your abdominal area
And the slight back fat you had around the bikini strap has really came in

Keep up the good work

Thank you!

[megang]

Post arm workout....



Comparison from when I started my journey of taking control of my health and fitness back in Jan 2008 to today. It's been a difficult journey so far but well worth it. I can only get better from here

[GirlyGymRat]

Comparison from when I started my journey of taking control of my health and fitness back in Jan 2008 to today. It's been a difficult journey so far but well worth it. I can only get better from here <img src="http://forums.steroid.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=161947"/>

Impressive!

[GirlyGymRat]

Could u share what triggered the 2008 lifestyle change?

[megang]

Could u share what triggered the 2008 lifestyle change?

I couldn't pass my pt test and was having back pain. When I went to get my back checked out, I was told part of the reason was due to my weight as I was around 185. I knew something had to change otherwise I was going to get kicked out thigh I didn't know how closer I was to that until a few months later when I was told the paperwork was already filled out to kick me out and all it needed was a signature. I am thankful I started changing my habits earlier cause they allowed me to finish my enlistment though I could not reenlist.

I still see myself as a big girl thigh I am working on trying to see myself as others do. I acknowledge what I see in the mirror is different from what others see. It's a constant battle.

[megang]

144.4 this morning

[GirlyGymRat]

Down another 4 lbs!!!! That has got to make u feel Fabulous!

[megang]

Post shoulders and arms.....#neversettle