**Marcus's HIT Dungeon**

[kelkel]

So, marcus talks about a 4-2-2 rep scheme. For the past couple months, I've been doing reps at 8-2-2-2 with DS included sometimes. A 4-2-2-2 setup is something I'm going to start. Change is good. Never done reps this low. I assumed that reps in this range would be more of a strength oriented routine, as opposed to size. Guess I'm wrong again.

Total the reps up! You'll grow.

[kelkel]

..............deleted.

[Capebuffalo]

So, marcus talks about a 4-2-2 rep scheme. For the past couple months, I've been doing reps at 8-2-2-2 with DS included sometimes. A 4-2-2-2 setup is something I'm going to start. Change is good. Never done reps this low. I assumed that reps in this range would be more of a strength oriented routine, as opposed to size. Guess I'm wrong again.

No your right according to his last post on rep range just a little up the page.

[Igifuno]

How much time does everyone spend warning up/stretching before resistance training?

I spend about 10 minutes. 5 stretching and 5 waking on the treadmill. Just curious how much time everyone spends or if you just jump right in..

[marcus300]

So, marcus talks about a 4-2-2 rep scheme. For the past couple months, I've been doing reps at 8-2-2-2 with DS included sometimes. A 4-2-2-2 setup is something I'm going to start. Change is good. Never done reps this low. I assumed that reps in this range would be more of a strength oriented routine, as opposed to size. Guess I'm wrong again.

No


The ideal rep range for building size and stimulating hypertrophy is the 6 to 12 reps. Less than 6 reps will more or less increase strength and a degree of size, performing more than 12 reps will help build muscle endurance. Make sure that your reps fall within this range and your hitting true positive failure for the best chance of hypertrpohy. If your implementing one of the beyond failure methods such as forced & negs, rest pause or dropsetting you use a weight what is heavy enough to bring your positive failure at the low end of the rep range. An example for rest pause you use a weight what you will hit true positive failure at around the 4th rep then you would rest for around 10-15 seconds and do another couple of reps, then rest again for another 10-15 seconds and hit another 2 reps with the same weight. In total your doing 8 reps which is within range and your going to failure on each rest pause so you have a high chance of stimulating the right fibers to produce the best gains. As your rep range and strength increases towards a total of 12 reps you simple increase the weight being used so your constantly increasing intensity and overload, the two keys principles of any HIT programme. You use feeler sets to determine what weight you will be using on your working set, as you use different methods like dropsetting always makes sure you don't drop the weight to much so your not going over 12 reps in total. If you are you need to be using heavier weight on the drops so your rep range hits below the 12 reps in total. I always like to use around the 8 rep range in total and increase the reps upwards until I feel i can increase the weight so my rep range falls around the 8 rep range again. We are aiming for maximum muscle fiber recruitment hitting these rep ranges at failure will have the greatest potential for muscular growth. The above advice is for someone who is already advanced and is looking to build bigger thicker muscles, its not for someone who is building a base and foundation because these people can really benefit from using a lower rep range aswell as the above.

[kelkel]

How much time does everyone spend warning up/stretching before resistance training?

I spend about 10 minutes. 5 stretching and 5 waking on the treadmill. Just curious how much time everyone spends or if you just jump right in..

Always warm up, never stretch but probably should. It's just annoying.

[marcus300]

Much appreciated big man! I wish I could take responsibility for it but it just seems to be how my metabolism is (natural ectomorph, sorry Cape.) One day it'll take a shiat and slow down. Then maybe I can gain some more weight! I thought this was cool though. Was getting ready for bed last night around 1130 and veins were jumping for unknown reasons. I swear I can feel them at times:

Attachment 144966Attachment 144967

Not a chance on this earth I could hold that condition, it takes me around 6-12 week cutting to get anything like and my legs are the very last to shred the bf. Amazing how you just naturally hold it. Now if it was about adding size and exploding my muscle bellies then that's not a problem at all.

[marcus300]

How much time does everyone spend warning up/stretching before resistance training?

I spend about 10 minutes. 5 stretching and 5 waking on the treadmill. Just curious how much time everyone spends or if you just jump right in..

I warm up on the movement I am about to attack, it may take 2-3-4 warm up sets to get the feel right before I go into my working set. In between these warm up sets I do stretch and ive have done some serious stretching protocols in my time on back and biceps and its ingrained now into my routine naturally. I am always stretching if I feel I need it.

[kelkel]

Not a chance on this earth I could hold that condition, it takes me around 6-12 week cutting to get anything like and my legs are the very last to shred the bf. Amazing how you just naturally hold it. Now if it was about adding size and exploding my muscle bellies then that's not a problem at all.

Just sucks to have that problem....

[marcus300]

Just sucks to have that problem....

I'd rather be ripped to the bone mate at my age now, I fight like crazy as I get older to hold condition

[BG]

I do 10-15 minutes now. I feel much better and don't need as many warm up sets. I dont walk though, may try it.

How much time does everyone spend warning up/stretching before resistance training?

I spend about 10 minutes. 5 stretching and 5 waking on the treadmill. Just curious how much time everyone spends or if you just jump right in..

[Rusty11]

Got it. The total reps being up to 12.

No


The ideal rep range for building size and stimulating hypertrophy is the 6 to 12 reps. Less than 6 reps will more or less increase strength and a degree of size, performing more than 12 reps will help build muscle endurance. Make sure that your reps fall within this range and your hitting true positive failure for the best chance of hypertrpohy. If your implementing one of the beyond failure methods such as forced & negs, rest pause or dropsetting you use a weight what is heavy enough to bring your positive failure at the low end of the rep range. An example for rest pause you use a weight what you will hit true positive failure at around the 4th rep then you would rest for around 10-15 seconds and do another couple of reps, then rest again for another 10-15 seconds and hit another 2 reps with the same weight. In total your doing 8 reps which is within range and your going to failure on each rest pause so you have a high chance of stimulating the right fibers to produce the best gains. As your rep range and strength increases towards a total of 12 reps you simple increase the weight being used so your constantly increasing intensity and overload, the two keys principles of any HIT programme. You use feeler sets to determine what weight you will be using on your working set, as you use different methods like dropsetting always makes sure you don't drop the weight to much so your not going over 12 reps in total. If you are you need to be using heavier weight on the drops so your rep range hits below the 12 reps in total. I always like to use around the 8 rep range in total and increase the reps upwards until I feel i can increase the weight so my rep range falls around the 8 rep range again. We are aiming for maximum muscle fiber recruitment hitting these rep ranges at failure will have the greatest potential for muscular growth. The above advice is for someone who is already advanced and is looking to build bigger thicker muscles, its not for someone who is building a base and foundation because these people can really benefit from using a lower rep range aswell as the above.

[marcus300]

Got it. The total reps being up to 12.

The total reps shouldn't be higher than 12 but my sweet spot is around 8 reps in total then I creep up in strength and intensity and get the reps up to around 10-12 then I increase the weight so my total sets come down, do you understand ive explained in my summary post?

[Rusty11]

The total reps shouldn't be higher than 12 but my sweet spot is around 8 reps in total then I creep up in strength and intensity and get the reps up to around 10-12 then I increase the weight so my total sets come down, do you understand ive explained in my summary post?

Yes. I understood exactly what you are/were saying. And I'm excited to
see what going heavier weight with that 4-2-2 rep range will do for me. When I mentioned strength, I was looking at the 4 rep range, not taking into account the extra 2-2 with 20 seconds in between. Total being 8. Chest today after work. I'm sitting here at lunch ready to run home and get at it.

Thanks marcus, kel...and all the other guys here! Awesome info coming through daily.

[DCI]

Tonight is legs , if I don't wobble to the car like a newly born lamb I'll be disappointed

[marcus300]

Yes. I understood exactly what you are/were saying. And I'm excited to
see what going heavier weight with that 4-2-2 rep range will do for me. When I mentioned strength, I was looking at the 4 rep range, not taking into account the extra 2-2 with 20 seconds in between. Total being 8. Chest today after work. I'm sitting here at lunch ready to run home and get at it.

Thanks marcus, kel...and all the other guys here! Awesome info coming through daily.

Good when your doing one of the advance protocols ive mentioned its the total count of rep within that working set you count, because its constant tension and stress on the muscle. There is a huge advantage to lower reps under 6 for strength and limited size but that's for the firsts time guys and intermediates. All ive talked about is using HIT to activate the tough type 2b fast twitch muscle fibers which will grow the biggest and thickest. Also ive mentioned I like the 8 total rep range and work up from there to around in total 10-12 then I will increased base weight on the first section so my reps come down to around 8 again. some guys may prefer doing up to 10 reps or any rep range within that 6-12 section, but this is the best catchment area for stimulating the biggest growth.

[Cuz]

we shall see how back day goes tonight. I feel alright.

[DCI]

Well I webbled and wobbled outta the gym tonight.

Started with squats which I wasn't on form tonight for some reason but powered on got a decent pump by the emd of it.

Moved onto leg press because squats were not 100% I focused my mind to really push these fckers out into the pain that my mind starts screaming at mw to stop but I just keep going telling myself ny mind is weak compared to my body. These were crazy hard and strong reps by the second dropset I could feel the striations in my muscles scream at me at that stage I just did forced reps and negs and then it happend I got off the leg press felt really lighted headed thankfully right behind the press machine is a roller door and walked outside with steam pouring from my head nearly got sick from the rush of blood to my legs.

Then onto leg extensions and raises kept the intensity up on the tease and really was destroyed still can't walk and I'm home 40 mins lol

[Hazard]

Good when your doing one of the advance protocols ive mentioned its the total count of rep within that working set you count, because its constant tension and stress on the muscle. There is a huge advantage to lower reps under 6 for strength and limited size but that's for the firsts time guys and intermediates. All ive talked about is using HIT to activate the tough type 2b fast twitch muscle fibers which will grow the biggest and thickest. Also ive mentioned I like the 8 total rep range and work up from there to around in total 10-12 then I will increased base weight on the first section so my reps come down to around 8 again. some guys may prefer doing up to 10 reps or any rep range within that 6-12 section, but this is the best catchment area for stimulating the biggest growth.

So u meant when doing rest pause..... You get 4 and rest then 2 and rest then 2. Total reps were 8.

When u can do 8 straight - increase the weight.

[marcus300]

So u meant when doing rest pause..... You get 4 and rest then 2 and rest then 2. Total reps were 8.

When u can do 8 straight - increase the weight.

If your doing 8 reps on your first rest pause set then you get another 4 on the rp then another 4 on the last rp that's a total of 16 which is out of the 6 to 12 range which is best for the biggest size increases. So long as you get inside that range your good but for me I'm always tryingt to create overload all the time so when my strength as increased to 12 in total I increase the base weight again so I'm totalling around 8 reps

[Capebuffalo]

If your doing 8 reps on your first rest pause set then you get another 4 on the rp then another 4 on the last rp that's a total of 16 which is out of the 6 to 12 range which is best for the biggest size increases. So long as you get inside that range your good but for me I'm always tryingt to create overload all the time so when my strength as increased to 12 in total I increase the base weight again so I'm totalling around 8 reps

Wait a minute. No one told me I would have to be able to do math to get big.

Well damn I have misunderstood this. Monday a new rule will be implemented on the use of rep numbers.

[Igifuno]

Shoulders/traps today:

Nice workout today.. felt great

Dumbell press:
60sx10
70sx8
70sx8 then drop to 60 for 6 more

Hammer Strength press:
90sx8
110x6
110x6 and then drop to 90s for 6

One arm lateral raises:
30sx 10 (wanted to go heavier but rotator cuff was telling me nooooo)
35sx 6
35sx 6 and then drop to 25s for 10

Rear delt fly machine:
2 feel sets at 12
1 heavy for 6 then rest for 20 seconds, 3 more

Bent over cables/rear delts:
2 feel sets at 10
1 heavy x 6

Smith machine barbell shrug
45s x 20
70sx 10
90s x 6
then repeated weight and reps with reverse shrugs

Seated dumbell shrugs:
70sx10
90sx 8 plus 6 forced reps (thought i injured myself for a minute.. had a sharp pain in my next but it went away)

Shrug machine:
90sx6
45s til failure

followed by 30 mins cardio... then I ate 3 salmon rolls mmmmmmmm.

[Cuz]

back

First exercise tonight
deadlifts
135x12
225x12
315x12
405x8
495x4 totally failure (im no powerlifter lol)

bent over bb rows
225x8 2 sets
185 x 10 drop then set of 135 x12

pretty tired now

lat pulldowns
120x12
220x10 right at failure

hammer strength machine
225x10 315x10 almost failure

reverse pec dec (rear delts)
100x12
130x12

dumbbell rows
80x8
100x8

bout an hour, rested less between sets, badass pump in rear delts and lats looked thick as hell. I thought I looked really good after I pulled my shirt off, too bad I couldnt take a pumped pic of rear lat spread. I think I seen a vein in my right lat could have been dreamin though Gonna suck when I got to come off, hope it aint gonna be that bad recovering.

[kelkel]

Marcus I see we need to attach an on-line calculator to the site for some of the big boys here.....

[kelkel]

back

First exercise tonight
deadlifts
135x12
225x12
315x12
405x8
495x4 totally failure (im no powerlifter lol)

bent over bb rows
225x8 2 sets
185 x 10 drop then set of 135 x12

pretty tired now

lat pulldowns
120x12
220x10 right at failure

hammer strength machine
225x10 315x10 almost failure

reverse pec dec (rear delts)
100x12
130x12

dumbbell rows
80x8
100x8

bout an hour, rested less between sets, badass pump in rear delts and lats looked thick as hell. I thought I looked really good after I pulled my shirt off, too bad I couldnt take a pumped pic of rear lat spread. I think I seen a vein in my right lat could have been dreamin though Gonna suck when I got to come off, hope it aint gonna be that bad recovering.

Looks like you're overworking to me. Should have stopped with lat pulldowns, imho.

[Cuz]

Looks like you're overworking to me. Should have stopped with lat pulldowns, imho.

thanks Kel for your feedback, I appreciate it. Do you think its still to much even on gear? I know I work a lot, but I absolutely love the feeling I get in the gym, the pump, the way I look in the mirror halfway in. its hard not to stop. But your probably right, God I was huffing and puffing so much lol bent over. At least I went hard on those dead. I walked in today feeling like a damn beast and just wanted to own the weights. Lil gym's dumbells don't go past 100lbs I don't do much DB work there usually stick with the bar.

That's usually how it is though, high volume. I rested less in between sets this time thought that might make up for all that time but guess im still overworking. Thanks again big guy!

[Hazard]

Looks like you're overworking to me. Should have stopped with lat pulldowns, imho.

I thought that too..... IMO there's no need for barbell and dumbell rows. While I do get a different feeling from each I rotate them weekly or biweekly.

[Cuz]

erggg, dammit one of these days im have a good size avatar lol. I want to train arms tomorrow.

[Capebuffalo]

Shoulders/traps today:

Nice workout today.. felt great

Dumbell press:
60sx10
70sx8
70sx8 then drop to 60 for 6 more

Hammer Strength press:
90sx8
110x6
110x6 and then drop to 90s for 6

One arm lateral raises:
30sx 10 (wanted to go heavier but rotator cuff was telling me nooooo)
35sx 6
35sx 6 and then drop to 25s for 10

Rear delt fly machine:
2 feel sets at 12
1 heavy for 6 then rest for 20 seconds, 3 more

Bent over cables/rear delts:
2 feel sets at 10
1 heavy x 6

Smith machine barbell shrug
45s x 20
70sx 10
90s x 6
then repeated weight and reps with reverse shrugs

Seated dumbell shrugs:
70sx10
90sx 8 plus 6 forced reps (thought i injured myself for a minute.. had a sharp pain in my next but it went away)

Shrug machine:
90sx6
45s til failure

followed by 30 mins cardio... then I ate 3 salmon rolls mmmmmmmm.

Buddy that's way too many exercises. 8 for shoulders. Try 4. How long did that take you?

[Rusty11]

If your doing 8 reps on your first rest pause set then you get another 4 on the rp then another 4 on the last rp that's a total of 16 which is out of the 6 to 12 range which is best for the biggest size increases. So long as you get inside that range your good but for me I'm always tryingt to create overload all the time so when my strength as increased to 12 in total I increase the base weight again so I'm totalling around 8 reps

I think this is finally penetrating my thick skull. Again, I assumed wrong. I was thinking after you complete a rep scheme of say, 4-2-2-2, I could do a DS of 6-8. But, you're saying max 12-period. Move on. And yes, I know there are many different ways to train, but I'm sticking to this exact formula for a month, or so. It's something I've never done. Maybe my F---ing chest will respond well.

[kelkel]

thanks Kel for your feedback, I appreciate it. Do you think its still to much even on gear? I know I work a lot, but I absolutely love the feeling I get in the gym, the pump, the way I look in the mirror halfway in. its hard not to stop. But your probably right, God I was huffing and puffing so much lol bent over. At least I went hard on those dead. I walked in today feeling like a damn beast and just wanted to own the weights. Lil gym's dumbells don't go past 100lbs I don't do much DB work there usually stick with the bar.

That's usually how it is though, high volume. I rested less in between sets this time thought that might make up for all that time but guess im still overworking. Thanks again big guy!

Remember chad it's the intensity of what you do that determines how many muscle fibers you recruit. Not how much or long the workout is. Beyond that growth is determined by your nutrition and rest. Less is more here if intensity is on point. Once you fully grasp this style training you'll see and feel the difference.

[kelkel]

I think this is finally penetrating my thick skull. Again, I assumed wrong. I was thinking after you complete a rep scheme of say, 4-2-2-2, I could do a DS of 6-8. But, you're saying max 12-period. Move on. And yes, I know there are many different ways to train, but I'm sticking to this exact formula for a month, or so. It's something I've never done. Maybe my F---ing chest will respond well.

Look forward to seeing your results!

[Igifuno]

Buddy that's way too many exercises. 8 for shoulders. Try 4. How long did that take you?

Took 2 hours total, including cardio, so about 90 mins on the floor. I need to get used to doing less and heavier.

[Capebuffalo]

Took 2 hours total, including cardio, so about 90 mins on the floor. I need to get used to doing less and heavier.

Man I'm in and out 40 min. But I'm more fatigued than when I would do 1-1.5 hr workouts. That's the difference with the intensity. You need to make the switch buddy.

[Hazard]

I'm never over 60 min..... I often walk in and see guys workin out - I usually am done and change again before they're finished

[Java Man]

Took 2 hours total, including cardio, so about 90 mins on the floor. I need to get used to doing more work in less time and heavier.

Fixed

[marcus300]

No


The ideal rep range for building size and stimulating hypertrophy is the 6 to 12 reps. Less than 6 reps will more or less increase strength and a degree of size, performing more than 12 reps will help build muscle endurance. Make sure that your reps fall within this range and your hitting true positive failure for the best chance of hypertrpohy. If your implementing one of the beyond failure methods such as forced & negs, rest pause or dropsetting you use a weight what is heavy enough to bring your positive failure at the low end of the rep range. An example for rest pause you use a weight what you will hit true positive failure at around the 4th rep then you would rest for around 10-15 seconds and do another couple of reps, then rest again for another 10-15 seconds and hit another 2 reps with the same weight. In total your doing 8 reps which is within range and your going to failure on each rest pause so you have a high chance of stimulating the right fibers to produce the best gains. As your rep range and strength increases towards a total of 12 reps you simple increase the weight being used so your constantly increasing intensity and overload, the two keys principles of any HIT programme. You use feeler sets to determine what weight you will be using on your working set, as you use different methods like dropsetting always makes sure you don't drop the weight to much so your not going over 12 reps in total. If you are you need to be using heavier weight on the drops so your rep range hits below the 12 reps in total. I always like to use around the 8 rep range in total and increase the reps upwards until I feel i can increase the weight so my rep range falls around the 8 rep range again. We are aiming for maximum muscle fiber recruitment hitting these rep ranges at failure will have the greatest potential for muscular growth. The above advice is for someone who is already advanced and is looking to build bigger thicker muscles, its not for someone who is building a base and foundation because these people can really benefit from using a lower rep range aswell as the above.

The total reps shouldn't be higher than 12 but my sweet spot is around 8 reps in total then I creep up in strength and intensity and get the reps up to around 10-12 then I increase the weight so my total sets come down, do you understand ive explained in my summary post?

Good when your doing one of the advance protocols ive mentioned its the total count of rep within that working set you count, because its constant tension and stress on the muscle. There is a huge advantage to lower reps under 6 for strength and limited size but that's for the firsts time guys and intermediates. All ive talked about is using HIT to activate the tough type 2b fast twitch muscle fibers which will grow the biggest and thickest. Also ive mentioned I like the 8 total rep range and work up from there to around in total 10-12 then I will increased base weight on the first section so my reps come down to around 8 again. some guys may prefer doing up to 10 reps or any rep range within that 6-12 section, but this is the best catchment area for stimulating the biggest growth.

So u meant when doing rest pause..... You get 4 and rest then 2 and rest then 2. Total reps were 8.

When u can do 8 straight - increase the weight.

It doesn't matter what protocol your doing, rest pause, drops, forced and negs etc the total rep range for the best stimulation of the toughest fibers which grows the biggest is 6-12, its irrelevant what advanced technique your doing so long as you stay within this rep range imho. Ive mentioned my sweet spot is around 8 reps and I build the intensity up from the 8 rep mark and once I get to the top end of the rep range I increase the weight so the reps come back down to my ideal reps...

Wait a minute. No one told me I would have to be able to do math to get big.

Well damn I have misunderstood this. Monday a new rule will be implemented on the use of rep numbers.

I thought ive made is very clear but some of you are not fully understanding what I mean, is it that complicated would you like me to go over it again?

Marcus I see we need to attach an on-line calculator to the site for some of the big boys here.....

Am I not being clear with my explanation of rep range and HIT?

I think this is finally penetrating my thick skull. Again, I assumed wrong. I was thinking after you complete a rep scheme of say, 4-2-2-2, I could do a DS of 6-8. But, you're saying max 12-period. Move on. And yes, I know there are many different ways to train, but I'm sticking to this exact formula for a month, or so. It's something I've never done. Maybe my F---ing chest will respond well.

Try 3 months takes time to see results, if your struggling understanding anything please post and I will go over it again. I will even give examples of each way of training if need be to show the right rep range to stimulate the right fibers..

[Capebuffalo]

I can say now without a doubt I understand. I was not counting the drops or rest pauses as individual reps but as a continuation of the last failing rep.

But I'm ok because I was getting 3,4,5 on my heavy working then starting r/p or drop. But not for every set so I do need to be doing more.

If I making back alive from Thomas the Train I will start on Monday.

[marcus300]

I can say now without a doubt I understand. I was not counting the drops or rest pauses as individual reps but as a continuation of the last failing rep.
But I'm ok because I was getting 3,4,5 on my heavy working then starting r/p or drop. But not for every set so I do need to be doing more.

If I making back alive from Thomas the Train I will start on Monday.

exactly

[DCI]

I'm never over 60 min..... I often walk in and see guys workin out - I usually am done and change again before they're finished

That happens reg in my gym that I go to, I really don't know what people are up to when they are there that long