Free Diet advice by Narkissos & Novastepp: Intro to Performance Nutrition 101

[T3/T4 GSR]

I just saw about the AM cardio....if you are doing 45-60 min in the AM then I would drop cardio after your lifting. You can do whatever program suits your life better.

[smokeyd]

Originally Posted by smokeyd
well i have tryed for a while to cut down and it seems like im not moving as fast as i want to but then again who does, i loose and average pound a week

A pound per week average is good.

I'm sure you didn't put it on this fast... so why would you want to lose it at an even faster rate?like you stated below i do want to keep ALL muscle and gain if possible, and also as fast as possible, you know the shit that everyone wants lol and thanks for this thread!!!

2 lbs is the max you should shoot for if retaining muscle is your desire... as it well should be.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
Im 6'3 282 and 20% body fat train 3 days a week with cardio post workout and cardio also on 2 other days, hiit 30min 2 times and steady state for 45 min 3 times.

How long have you been doing this?
I have been doing this workout split and cardio for about 2 months now


Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
I need 4000 calories a day to maintain from one of the calculators i put my info into

Height is 6'3 and weight is now 278, pants are a 38 and age is 24. came out with a body fat of 20 percent.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
here is what i have had today and i added the last meal in but its what im going to have.

ok.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
breakfast: one can tuna w/ 2eggs and 1/2 cup oats broiled
Cals: 440 Fat: 15 Carb: 15 Prot: 60

meal 2: 8oz steak and half large sweet potatoe
Cals: 812 Fat: 49 Carb: 24 Prot: 65

meal 3: 8oz chicken breast half large sweet potatoe
Cals: 525 Fat: 16 Carb: 24 Prot: 66

meal 4 post workout: Protein shake with half cup oats
Cals: 315 Fat: 4 Carb: 20 Prot: 51

meal 5: 12oz steak
Cals: 1064 Fat 74 Carb: 0 Prot 94

Your calories are all over the place.

What is your rationale for the meal timing?I dont have a rationale, this is my first attempt at a proper diet other than eating clean.

You need to split meal 5... You need to spread your kcal intake into around 7 meals.Where do you suggest i add meals at, just split 5 into two meals

5 isn't cutting here.Yeah no more beef.

Too many kcals to be ingested to pile 'em into 5 meals.
going to split into 7 meals as you suggested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
Total for the day is
Cals: 3232 Fat: 159 Carb: 96 Prot: 337

kcals are around right.

42% of your food intake is fat? now that i have removed beef the percentage should be lowered a good amount.

Why would you allot your macros in that manner?because i pretty much dont know what im doing, i barely grasp the idea of dieting so thats why i came for help. I dont know what times and what to eat with each other. i know what foods to eat but like i said not when and where so to speak.


Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeyd
I just feel like it should be fallin off and its not. i just recently upped my carbs. buddy said i wasnt eating enough.

Did your buddy look at what else you're ingesting.. as opposed to just your carb intake? Yeah but he isnt a diet guru just thought i should mix it up a little because it helped him out.



Thanks for your time...

[Narkissos]

Imma bump this

[smokeyd]

hey nark i posted a reply right before your last post giving you the info and answering the questions you had... thanks for your time!!!

[texasmk4]

Nark, i have a question; is it more efficient to spread out the cal/carbs/fat/pro equally in every meal through out the day or it should'nt matter as long as you're taking the appropiate amount?

Also i am going to need your help in determing my carbs cycling, abbot helped me, but i just did'nt want to annoy him by asking him too many questions. currently i am 195 with 19% of bf i would like to drop it down to 15% before oct because that's when i start my cycle. According to Katch-McArdle formula my kcal to maintain LBM should be 3306 since i am planning on doing cardio 6 days a week along with 5 days of weight training. I am using the 40% carbs 40% pro and 20% fat macro. I am getting most o fmy carbs from sweet potato and two meal of oats early in the morning right after AM Cardio. I'll be doing a slow joggin for 50 to 60 mins 6 days a week empty stomach.

This is my diet looks like.

AM cardio

1, 80g of oats with 1 scoope of whey protein. Cals = 420, Carbs = 57, Pro = 34, Fat = 6

2, 80g of oats with 1 scoope of whey protein. Cals = 420, Carbs = 57, Pro = 34, Fat = 6

3, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

4, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

5, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

6, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

7, 150g chicken breast, 146g brown rice . Cals = 412, Carbs = 34, Pro = 49, Fat = 6

8, PWO shake 2 scoope, 2 scoope Waxy Maize Starch. Cals = 500, Carbs = 66g, Pro = 48g

Total Calories = 3596

Total Carbs = 410g

Pro = 361g

Fat = 38g

But this is what I do, weigh all the sweet potato together which comes out to be around 950g put it in a bowl and eat one with every meal, does it have to be equal in every meal ( carbs and calories wise) same thing with the chicken baked all the breast together and put it in a bowl and eat it at work but don't really know how much i am eating per meal.

[smokeyd]

watch the videos in the sticky that guy tells you when to have what carbs and fat and pro at what times during the day depending on your activities

[RapaciousShark]

Nark and Nova,

I read your first post and skipped the rest, so sorry if I missed something important (it's a long thread, gimme a break.) I'm excited to possibly get a diet critique from you. I got great diet info from PB a while back, but I got disorganized and in to different foods.

So here it is:

meal 1: ~8am, two bowls of multigrain cheerios w/ nonfat milk OR original quaker oats, and a nu-tek pro5 shake.

meal 2: 10-11am, chicken breast w/ brown rice with mixed veggies mixed in, maybe some cheese on that,

WORK OUT ( i drink about 16 oz of gatorade during so i dont have the shakes), PWO shake

meal 3: 2-3pm, salmon (or some kind if fish) filet w/ mixed veggies (always different combos of veggies) and one slice of whole, multigrain bread.

meal 4: 4-5pm, pork, beef, chicken, or salmon w/ brown rice and veggies OR whole grain pasta with too much ground beef and not much sauce.

meal 5: 7- 9pm, Bowl of beans or meat/veggie combo, depends on how i feel about carbs and such for the day. If i eat beans, i usually eat pinto beans with some cheese and hot sauce.

meal 6: Shake, then bed. 11pm-12am

Thats it, in a nutshell. I dont measure the portions exactly cuz i tired that and for me the diff is not worth the effort. It comes out to about 3300 cal/day with 20% prot (between 150-200g a day, depending). I use ***** balance oil in all my meats and veggies for better fat, snack on almonds thru the day, and take EFA supps when i have the dough. My diet is not at all precise, obviously. I just try to keep it simple and affordable and not too painfully time-consuming. Sometimes I eat some sweets or have cheat meals at restaurants, maybe a couple times a week.

Anyway, I'd be way grateful if you could show me some simple, easy ways to improve. Thanks guys.

[texasmk4]

watch the videos in the sticky that guy tells you when to have what carbs and fat and pro at what times during the day depending on your activities

which sticky

[200byjune]

watch the videos in the sticky that guy tells you when to have what carbs and fat and pro at what times during the day depending on your activities

where might this video be might i ask

[T3/T4 GSR]

Nark and Nova,

I read your first post and skipped the rest, so sorry if I missed something important (it's a long thread, gimme a break.) I'm excited to possibly get a diet critique from you. I got great diet info from PB a while back, but I got disorganized and in to different foods.

So here it is:

meal 1: ~8am, two bowls of multigrain cheerios w/ nonfat milk OR original quaker oats, and a nu-tek pro5 shake.

meal 2: 10-11am, chicken breast w/ brown rice with mixed veggies mixed in, maybe some cheese on that,

WORK OUT ( i drink about 16 oz of gatorade during so i dont have the shakes), PWO shake

meal 3: 2-3pm, salmon (or some kind if fish) filet w/ mixed veggies (always different combos of veggies) and one slice of whole, multigrain bread.

meal 4: 4-5pm, pork, beef, chicken, or salmon w/ brown rice and veggies OR whole grain pasta with too much ground beef and not much sauce.

meal 5: 7- 9pm, Bowl of beans or meat/veggie combo, depends on how i feel about carbs and such for the day. I usually eat pinto beans with some cheese and hot sauce.

meal 6: Shake, then bed. 11pm-12am

Thats it, in a nutshell. I dont measure the portions exactly cuz i tired that and for me the diff is not worth the effort. It comes out to about 3300 cal/day with 20% prot (between 150-200g a day, depending). I use ***** balance oil in all my meats and veggies for better fat, snack on almonds thru the day, and take EFA supps when i have the dough. My diet is not at all precise, obviously. I just try to keep it simple and affordable and not too painfully time-consuming. Sometimes I eat some sweets or have cheat meals at restaurants, maybe a couple times a week.

Anyway, I'd be way grateful if you could show me some simple, easy ways to improve. Thanks guys.

So basically you're saying you don't actually folow this diet or know if it is even accurate?

[smokeyd]

go to the diet section and there is a sticky that says so you wanna know how to cut? there is a link to a 5 part series on pro bodybuilders diets, how they work and breaks down everything really well

[RapaciousShark]

So basically you're saying you don't actually folow this diet or know if it is even accurate?

What? I'm being realistic with the info I give. Let's face it, 90% of the people on this forum dont follow any precise diet, they prob just cram food in their face with some slight attention to macros. I have a life, a job, and school, so obviously I'm not sitting around with a scale and a calculator doin this ya know. I eat just as i posted, plus some cheat meals every now and then. I can take a couple hours and construct a perfect diet, but it wouldnt be a real diet, it would be bullshit. And acting like i never eat anything tasty would be dishonest bullshit too. Works great so far, just looking for easy ways to improve. I never said i was pro, just interested in quick fixes. Also, i think eating the same exact things every day is bad for gains, which is why i dotn do that

[T3/T4 GSR]

Well I guess being honest is important so I am sorry if I came off sounding mean I was just being serious since it is hard to monitor exact results of a diet if it isn't closely followed. So few questions. What are your goals for this diet and what are your stats? After that info we can all help you better. Either way though you might want to consider atleast trying to measure out portions and pre make your meals so you can follow a fairly set diet while still living your day to day life easier.

[mex83]

What? I'm being realistic with the info I give. Let's face it, 90% of the people on this forum dont follow any precise diet, they prob just cram food in their face with some slight attention to macros. I have a life, a job, and school, so obviously I'm not sitting around with a scale and a calculator doin this ya know. I eat just as i posted, plus some cheat meals every now and then. I can take a couple hours and construct a perfect diet, but it wouldnt be a real diet, it would be bullshit. And acting like i never eat anything tasty would be dishonest bullshit too. Works great so far, just looking for easy ways to improve. I never said i was pro, just interested in quick fixes. Also, i think eating the same exact things every day is bad for gains, which is why i dotn do that

Why are you posting if you are not going to be open to comments that other people will post about your diet. We are all real people with real 40+ hours, 8-5 jobs here... We just dont sit all day with a scale and calculator busting out number out of our ass if not you wouldnt have all these guys and gals in great shape in here.... We might not all have the dough to spend in expensive diet plans but we do a develop a plan that is within our funds and that works around our schedules.

I was not a morning person at all and I had to change my schedule to do cardio at 6 AM, I was not used to eating 6 meals a day and I had to change that, I was not used to having breakfast and more so Oatmeal and guess what I had to change that why, because If you really want to reach your goal you will go out of your comfort zone to try and do whatever it is possible and however it is possible to reach that goal. You should be thankful that there are people in this world who are willing to take time out of there busy lives to post advise and to help you out. Take every comment positive or negative in cause you are learning you are not the teacher in here.

Are you trying to bulk up or cut what is your stats: age, height, weight, BMI, BF% give Nark the basics along with your meal plan so he can have a better idea on what he is working with.


Sorry for any typos lol.

[mex83]

I just saw about the AM cardio....if you are doing 45-60 min in the AM then I would drop cardio after your lifting. You can do whatever program suits your life better.

Yes I am doing the AM cardio in an empty stomach for 45-60 mins 5 times a day sometimes even weekends. I do the three days workout routine because I got it from bodybuilding.com under the transformation section. Its a very intense work out routine that changes every 2 weeks.

[T3/T4 GSR]

I used to do the three day a week style split and I find it works pretty good when building mass but my personal experiance is that I lose more fat by doing the 5 day split with short rest intervals. However if it is working don't change it since everyone differs here. If you find your diet is good and you are still at a sticking point then try that split.

[FireGuy]

What? I'm being realistic with the info I give. Let's face it, 90% of the people on this forum dont follow any precise diet, they prob just cram food in their face with some slight attention to macros. I have a life, a job, and school, so obviously I'm not sitting around with a scale and a calculator doin this ya know. I eat just as i posted, plus some cheat meals every now and then. I can take a couple hours and construct a perfect diet, but it wouldnt be a real diet, it would be bullshit. And acting like i never eat anything tasty would be dishonest bullshit too. Works great so far, just looking for easy ways to improve. I never said i was pro, just interested in quick fixes. Also, i think eating the same exact things every day is bad for gains, which is why i dotn do that

I am interested in hearing your theory as to why eating the same thing everyday is bad for gains. Please explain to me the science behind the statement.

[Narkissos]

What? I'm being realistic with the info I give. Let's face it, 90% of the people on this forum dont follow any precise diet, they prob just cram food in their face with some slight attention to macros. I have a life, a job, and school, so obviously I'm not sitting around with a scale and a calculator doin this ya know. I eat just as i posted, plus some cheat meals every now and then. I can take a couple hours and construct a perfect diet, but it wouldnt be a real diet, it would be bullshit. And acting like i never eat anything tasty would be dishonest bullshit too. Works great so far, just looking for easy ways to improve. I never said i was pro, just interested in quick fixes. Also, i think eating the same exact things every day is bad for gains, which is why i dotn do that

While you personally may look good, 90% of most forum viewers look like shit.

So it is a poor statistic.

Before I semi-retired due to injury two years ago, I had competed in 13 shows over 6 years... I ate the same thing 6-7 times per day for 6 years.

I competed while studying, and working full-time.

I still study and work full-time.

It doesn't take a year to compile a diet.

It takes hours.

Not hours per day.

One single session ever 6-12 weeks, and voila... you have a structured diet.

It doesn't take months to cook and package meals.

It takes hours.

Not hours every day.

A couple hours on saturday..and voila, you have your meals for the week.

So it really bores me when people talk about how hard it is...and make excuses for themselves:

"I'm not a bodybuilder"

"I don't want to get huge"

"I only want [*insert mediocre goal here*]"


I say it bores me, as opposed to annoys me... because ultimately I don't care.

I work with people who want something.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

I am interested in hearing your theory as to why eating the same thing everyday is bad for gains. Please explain to me the science behind the statement.

There is no science... Unless laziness and indiscipline count as sciences.

I never said i was pro, just interested in quick fixes.

Then this is obviously the wrong thread.

This is the performance nutrition thread.

It is a lifestyle upheaval thread.

No 'quick fixes' to be found here.



-CNS

[smokeyd]

hey nark can you reply to my edited post its number 402 on page 11. thanks!!!

[RapaciousShark]

woah dudes, im not tryin to be all up in anyone's face, jeez. I do appreciate your input, just felt a little spit on there. My bad.

As for eating the same thing every day, great if that works for you, but it doesnt for me. Can we agree that it takes a well-rounded diet with plenty of nutrients/vitamins/minerals to gain some hard muscle? Yes, we can. Is difficult to consume every single thing the body would ever have a need for (and enough of it) in one day? Yes, we can say that too. Maybe nutrition experts can do it, but that's not me, and thats why I'm asking for advice. And i asked politely bc i have respect. I need to mix up what I eat to gain. Gains need nutritional diversity for me, and many others. I'll go find a gay ass study if thats what you want, but its common sense so quit acting like I'm talking out of my ass.

My goals are not mediocre, they are lofty, but they are also realistic. I came to this thread to ask you guys if theres anything OBVIOUSLY wrong with my diet that I can fix. Thats not pathetic, and im sorry if it bores you that i know I'm no expert and you are but i just dont have the devotion to nutrition that you do. I'll get help somewhere else if your shit really smells that much sweeter than mine.

And I do spend every single sunday shopping and cooking, all f**king day, and i portion out all my meats in plastic bags to take with me. My carbs and veggies i keep in huge plastic buckets.

Stats: 5'8'' 182 lb
bf 11-12%
22 yo
BMI 27

Goal: slow, clean bulk. I want to make solid gains without too much fat over the next few months. If I get too fat, i up the cardio til i have nice abs again, then get back to bulking. Unconventional and inefficient, yes, but I hate looking pudgy.

Looking to get to 190-195 lbs then cut to a shredded 185.

Now, let me say i respect people who know what they're talking about, but i will not bend over and take bullshit from anyone, no matter who they are, what they have, or what they have accomplished. Nark, i respect that you have a life (and all the rest of you) and accomplishments aside from being a professional. I apologize if I have offended anyone.

[FireGuy]

In your statement you state you "are no expert" but the body of your email is full of rhetorical questions where your conclusions are just plain wrong. The reason eating the same thing everyday doesnt work for you is either because you are not eating the RIGHT same things everyday or you do not have the mental discipline to stick with a bland diet.
You state it's common sense that muscle gains need nutritional diversity. I dont know what common sense you are subscribing to but muscle gains need nutritional CONSISTENCY.
Also, since you dont want to spend time with a calculator. If you are 182 and 12%, even if you were able to gain the 8 lbs of muscle you want then diet back down to 185, losing nothing but bodyfat you will still be just under 10% bodyfat which is not shredded.

[mex83]

I used to do the three day a week style split and I find it works pretty good when building mass but my personal experiance is that I lose more fat by doing the 5 day split with short rest intervals. However if it is working don't change it since everyone differs here. If you find your diet is good and you are still at a sticking point then try that split.

FO SHO no doubt man.... I will keep that 5 day split in mind when changing my routine.... I should be able to change it after this 12 week routine that I have...

[Narkissos]

You state it's common sense that muscle gains need nutritional diversity. I dont know what common sense you are subscribing to but muscle gains need nutritional CONSISTENCY.

This gets my post of the week award.

I think I will need to reward you.

Hit me with a PM.

-CNS

[FireGuy]

Thanks for the compliement Nark, I did try and PM you but it says you are not accepting them. Let me know when that's fixed, I am less than 48 hours from prejudging and wouldnt mind picking your brain a bit anyways.

[Narkissos]

Bump for Nark or Nova? pleeeeeeeeeese

Sorry Q.

Just downloaded your .jpeg

5'10"
185lbs.
9%BF

You always did stay really lean.

You're up two points over your normal 7% though...so I'm assuming your goal here is to get back down to around that specific bf% while bumping your LBM.

What's your activity like?

-C

[Narkissos]

Thanks for the compliement Nark, I did try and PM you but it says you are not accepting them. Let me know when that's fixed, I am less than 48 hours from prejudging and wouldnt mind picking your brain a bit anyways.

Ah... send me a friend request.

I have PMs restricted to the few people on my friends list solely.

-C

[Narkissos]

Stats Represented:

5'10"
185lbs.
9%BF

Macros Listed:

315.15gr protein
207.3gr carbs
28.16gr fat

2377kcals

Based on the stats solely, the calories are about right.

I'd spread your macro intake differently... protein's way too high...fat's too low:

270gr pro
207gr carbs (i.e. leave your carbs unchanged)
<>50gr fat

I'd stock up on fish oil caps.

Scrolling down your .jpeg, here's where I'd supplement w/ fish oil:

Meal 1: 5 gr
Meal 2: 4 gr
Meal 3: 3 gr
Meal 4: nil
Meal 5: 3 gr
Meal 6: 3 gr
Meal 7: 5 gr


-CNS

[Narkissos]

So using my current macros how would you go about modifying them for high, moderate and low carb days? Something like 220/150/100?

Not exactly.

Also should I add prtien to compensate for carb calories?

No.

Let's review your current diet lay-out:

Meal 1:
250ml of egg whites - 125 cal, 0 fat, 4 carb, 25 pro
Scoop of whey - 120 cal, 1 fat, 3 carb, 24 pro
1/2 cup of oatmeal - 150 cal, 3 fat, 27 carb, 5 pro

Meal 2:
Can of tuna - 180 cal, 1 fat, 0 carb, 33 pro
Table spoon of olive oil with ***** 3s - 120 cal, 14 fat, 0 carb, 0 pro

Meal 3:
PWO Shake
2 scoops of whey - 240 cal, 2 fat, 6 carb, 48 pro
1.5 scoop of waxy maize - 180 cal, 0 fat, 45 carb, 0 pro

Meal 4:
1/4 cup of brown rice - 170 cal, 1 fat, 35 carb, 5 pro
4oz of steak strips - 187 cals, 8 fat, 1 carb, 24 pro
Scoop of whey - 120 cal, 1 fat, 3 carb, 24 pro

Meal 5:
Can of tuna - 180 cal, 1 fat, 0 carb, 33pro
Table spoon of olive oil with ***** 3s - 120 cal 14 fat, 0 carb, 0 pro

Meal 6:
4oz ground lean turkey - 160 cal, 8 fat, 0 carb, 22 pro
Package of broccoli - 75 cal, 0 fat, 12 carb, 6 pro
Scoop of whey - 120 cal, 1 fat, 3 carb, 24 pro

Meal 7:
Fat free Cottage Cheese - 80 cal, 0 fat, 8 carb, 12 pro
Scoop of casein protien - 120 cal, 1 fat, 4 carb, 24 pro

Total:
Calories - 2447
Fat - 56
Carb - 152
Pro - 308

Only change I have made is that instead of sliced steak in meal 4 is chicken instead of steak so calories are like 50 less.

Previous Stats:

I ran a bit of a clean bulk diet and dropped some fat and held onto the 170 so as of right now I am 170 and body fat calipers show me at 14.5% BF.

What are your current stats mate?

-C

[Narkissos]

like you stated below i do want to keep ALL muscle and gain if possible, and also as fast as possible, you know the shit that everyone wants lol and thanks for this thread!!!

Don't rush it.. Recomposition will be particularly difficult at your current level of bodyfat.

I'd stick with one primary goal: fatloss.

Anything else accrued (i.e. lean tissue) will be a bonus.

I have been doing this workout split and cardio for about 2 months now

Stick with it for another 4 weeks... and then I'd switch it up.

It's obviously working, so i'd leave it for now.

Height is 6'3 and weight is now 278, pants are a 38 and age is 24. came out with a body fat of 20 percent.

Noted.

Caliper-tested?

[quote=smokeyd;4078428]

I dont have a rationale, this is my first attempt at a proper diet other than eating clean.

Ok.. not bad for a first attempt.

Plenty of room for work however.

Where do you suggest i add meals at, just split 5 into two meals

I think you need to start over... as opposed to targeting that last meal solely.

Let's start from the BMR/TDEE

Yeah no more beef.

going to split into 7 meals as you suggested.

Good stuff.

For reference:

Cals: 3232

now that i have removed beef the percentage should be lowered a good amount.

Yep.

What protein source will you be using instead?

because i pretty much dont know what im doing, i barely grasp the idea of dieting so thats why i came for help. I dont know what times and what to eat with each other. i know what foods to eat but like i said not when and where so to speak.

Understood.

Yeah but he isnt a diet guru just thought i should mix it up a little because it helped him out.

Understood

Thanks for your time...

np mate.

[Narkissos]

Stats
Resident Western USA
Age 28
Female
Height 5’3”
Workout Time line 2 years

Noted

Starting weight 190 LBS
Starting BF% 39
Staring size 20
Current Weight 132 LBS
Current BF% 32
Current size 4

Starting LBM: <> 115 lbs
Current LBM: <> 90 lbs

Congrats on losing a lot of weight.

Your body composition has not changed much however... You lost a lot of muscle in the process of losing that much weight though.

I don't like that.

So we'll have to address that.

Supplements
Fish Oil, Multivitamin, ECCA’s, Cranberry, B complex, and Chromium Picolinate

Dedicated Women’s Whey Protein Powder
Creatine

Good supps.

Diet
Meal 1 Protein shake Fruit
Meal 2 1 serving meat (lean turkey, chicken), ½ cup brown rice
Meal 3 Protein Shake
Meal 4 Fruit, green vegetable
Meal 5 serving meat (lean turkey, fish, chicken) ½ cup brown rice or wheat pasta
Meal 6 Protein Shake
Meal 7 an occasional protein bar (cliff builders or snickers)

For what it's worth...that's a decent lay-out.

You haven't given any indication of the portion sizes.. calories or much else however.

Workout Schedule
Tuesday-Sunday Lifting one muscle group per day 45-50minutes, 20-30 minutes cardio
Monday OFF

How long were you working out in this exact manner?

What bodyparts do you train on what days?

How many exercises and sets per session?

Problem
Goal to lower BF % to 15-20% and gain lean muscle mass/strength.
Attempt 1
In addition to diet and exercise; took one cycle of CLEN for 12 weeks with no results no decrease in BF % or Weight in LBS
Attempt 2
In addition to diet and exercise; engaging in current cycle of Winstrol Stanozol 100mg/ml taking .5ml ED at bed time on day 13 have seen no decrease in BF %, weight in pounds or inches lost.
Request
Need some advice as to changes I can make in Winstrol dosage, diet, exercise, supplements; any advice anyone is willing to offer to so I can get some results.
Through experience how long will it take to see results? Decrease in weight, BF% or inches.

You won't get drug advice on this thread to be honest... We can, however, sort your diet et. al. out.

bump for more information.

-CNS

[T3/T4 GSR]

Not exactly.



No.

Let's review your current diet lay-out:





Previous Stats:



What are your current stats mate?

-C

10.5% BF and hitting around the 167-168 mark...getting a little lighter than I planned but no noticeable loss in strength or muscle size. I have a feeling I am more like 11-11.5% though by eye but calipers said 10.5

[QBERT]

Thanks Nark! Yes I am trying to get back to my 7%..........and maybe even 6%? You guessed exactly what I am trying to do (LBM). My activity is high thus my concern for kcals. Gonna TRY and do 2 cardio sessions per day AM and PM with HIIT on my non resistance days. If I am burning too many kcal and not gaining I'll back off of the cardio. Also my PWO nutrition is going to bump up my macros. Is this still ok? Only on WO days. 2:1 carb/pro

PRO CARB FATS KCAL
Whey 48g 16g 0g 256
Oligdextrin 4g 92g 0g 380

TOTALS 52g 108g 0g 636

[RapaciousShark]

Here's some shit i pulled from a report that took me 30 seconds to find.

"A handful of epidemiological studies uphold the conventional wisdom embodied in
dietary guidelines concerning the benefits of a varied diet" - so yes, common sense

"Nutritional quality of the diet
improves with consumption of greater food diversity" - as i said

"Traditional concepts of diet may include associations with health. Generally speaking
these do not refer to nutrients but to specific functional properties. Some traditional
attributes such as tonics or strengtheners may be understandable in nutritional terms.
Other concepts of food-derived benefits relate to physiological and pharmacological
properties and can be supported by scientific investigations in these areas." - this means that the benefits of the foods you eat are not limited to the simple nutrition facts you know about them, but in their specific chemical compositions and how that affects the interconnected systems of your body.

"Diversity of function and of chemical composition, then, add further dimensions to the diversity inherent in the food and medicinal plants used around the world." - see above


"The diversity of plant resources plays an essential role for enabling populations to meet
their nutritional, health and socio-cultural needs. Biodiversity equates with dietary
diversity which equates with health."
- bottom line

So no, I wasnt talking out of my ass. I agree about consistency, never fought anyone on that. Now I see that you will not be helping me with my diet. O well. If all you seem interested in doing is calling me out on unimportant statements you think I cant support bc you want to make yourself look better on the internet, then I'm sorry i wasted my time in this thread. I need diet help, bc as i said, im no expert. I asked respectfully, and then i replied respectfully when this bullshit began. Instead of forthcoming assistance i get self-righteous lectures from a chode.

I dont gain well eating the same things every day, and that makes sense according to conventional wisdom regarding dietary diversity. Get over it.

10% body fat is great, and quite shredded imo. I dont compete so theres no need for me to go below that. I've been there before and it was sexy as hell. I dont care what else anyone has to say about 10% bf.

heres the link to the study, and b4 you start picking apart my quotes, read some of the cited studies and then bring some research saying eating the same thing all the time is better than a diverse diet.

http://www.unu.edu/env/plec/cbd/Mont...pers/Johns.pdf

[Narkissos]

I will waste 5 minutes responding to your post... after which time I will waste no more time.

I will caution others to do the same as well.

Here's some shit i pulled from a report that took me 30 seconds to find.

Next time take the time to search for information pertinent to this thread.

To reiterate: This thread deals with performance nutrition.

Not reduced mortality rates.

Not increased life expectancy.

(Ironically, if increased life expectancy is your concern, you're indulging in the wrong lifestyle... because steroid use , are concomitant high calorie intake are negatively related to life expectancy. Re: organ and systemic strain etc.)

Not gout prevention.

..or any other such condition as alluded to in your 'literature'.

"A handful of epidemiological studies uphold the conventional wisdom embodied in
dietary guidelines concerning the benefits of a varied diet" - so yes, common sense

"Nutritional quality of the diet
improves with consumption of greater food diversity" - as i said

'Nutritional quality' is an overstatement.

..as 'quality' is not related to source primarily, but also to the organism's ability to assimilate said source.

Let me take you to the elementary level... hopefully we need not regress here again:

'Conventional wisdom' would denote that dairy is great... Adds to the diversity of the diet.

Great source of calcium.. blah blah blah.

But... what is the truth of the matter?

Let's tick off the negatives:

1. A large percentage of the general populace is allergic to dairy.
2. Dairy is a hormone-dependent product.
3. *insert random negative fact here*

'Conventional Wisdom' would denote that grains are awesome.

Lowers high blood pressure and all that jazz.

But what's the truth of the matter?

Let's tick off the negatives:

1. A large percentage of the general populace are allergic to grains.
2. Grains are high in lignans: estrogen-like phytochemicals
3. *insert random negative fact here*

I could go on about just about every food.

The fact of the matter is that variety is over-rated.

What isn't, is covering your nutritional bases.. as well as picking foods you can assimilate.

...Not ingesting a bunch of foods, under the misguided impression that it will give you some special ingredient.

Complete protein = complete protein.

Consuming shrimp for protein over chicken won't give you bigger biceps.

"Traditional concepts of diet may include associations with health. Generally speaking
these do not refer to nutrients but to specific functional properties. Some traditional
attributes such as tonics or strengtheners may be understandable in nutritional terms.
Other concepts of food-derived benefits relate to physiological and pharmacological
properties and can be supported by scientific investigations in these areas." - this means that the benefits of the foods you eat are not limited to the simple nutrition facts you know about them, but in their specific chemical compositions and how that affects the interconnected systems of your body.

LMAO.

I love your 'studies'.

"Diversity of function and of chemical composition, then, add further dimensions to the diversity inherent in the food and medicinal plants used around the world." - see above


"The diversity of plant resources plays an essential role for enabling populations to meet
their nutritional, health and socio-cultural needs. Biodiversity equates with dietary
diversity which equates with health."
- bottom line

You know you clearly have no grasp of what you've read..and what you're trying to relate.

Refer to my post about covering nutritional bases.

When i build a diet, I cover my nutritional bases: protein; carbs; fats; vitamins (and other phytochemicals); minerals.

Your body cannot distinguish one source of vitamin B (for example) from another.

You are just using what you've read, and clearly not understood, as an excuse not to stick to a diet.

So no, I wasnt talking out of my ass. I agree about consistency, never fought anyone on that. Now I see that you will not be helping me with my diet. O well. If all you seem interested in doing is calling me out on unimportant statements you think I cant support bc you want to make yourself look better on the internet, then I'm sorry i wasted my time in this thread. I need diet help, bc as i said, im no expert. I asked respectfully, and then i replied respectfully when this bullshit began. Instead of forthcoming assistance i get self-righteous lectures from a chode.

I dunno who this is w/ reference to.

But this clearly isn't the thread for you.

I dont gain well eating the same things every day

This is an admission of ever trying such?

If so, this goes against you other posts in this thread.

and that makes sense according to conventional wisdom regarding dietary diversity. Get over it.

You've over-reaching on this one.

'Diversity' doesn't mean 'junk'.

10% body fat is great, and quite shredded imo. I dont compete so theres no need for me to go below that. I've been there before and it was sexy as hell. I dont care what else anyone has to say about 10% bf.

*yawn*

heres the link to the study, and b4 you start picking apart my quotes, read some of the cited studies and then bring some research saying eating the same thing all the time is better than a diverse diet.

http://www.unu.edu/env/plec/cbd/Mont...pers/Johns.pdf

I don't see a study.

I see an article which is a summary of a summit.

Furthermore, the summit did not deal with muscularity.. or muscular performance.

...and is of no relevance to this thread.

an FYI: a 'diet' is not non-diverse.

I don't know where you got those wires crossed.

Now, back to the thread...and helping people who wish to get in shape.

-CNS

[Narkissos]

guys, i was in a pretty serious smash-up tonight...

Was a passenger.

Just got a ride to my house...

Pain and stiffness has started to set in... and will intensify by morning.

Dunno how the rest of the day will go, so hopefully Nova chimes in.

Laters.

-CNS

[FireGuy]

Glad to hear you are still in one piece brother. Relax and hope you are feeling better soon.

[RapaciousShark]

I will waste 5 minutes responding to your post... after which time I will waste no more time.

I will caution others to do the same as well.



Next time take the time to search for information pertinent to this thread.

To reiterate: This thread deals with performance nutrition.

Not reduced mortality rates.

Not increased life expectancy.

(Ironically, if increased life expectancy is your concern, you're indulging in the wrong lifestyle... because steroid use , are concomitant high calorie intake are negatively related to life expectancy. Re: organ and systemic strain etc.)

Not gout prevention.

..or any other such condition as alluded to in your 'literature'.



'Nutritional quality' is an overstatement.

..as 'quality' is not related to source primarily, but also to the organism's ability to assimilate said source.

Let me take you to the elementary level... hopefully we need not regress here again:

'Conventional wisdom' would denote that dairy is great... Adds to the diversity of the diet.

Great source of calcium.. blah blah blah.

But... what is the truth of the matter?

Let's tick off the negatives:

1. A large percentage of the general populace is allergic to dairy.
2. Dairy is a hormone-dependent product.
3. *insert random negative fact here*

'Conventional Wisdom' would denote that grains are awesome.

Lowers high blood pressure and all that jazz.

But what's the truth of the matter?

Let's tick off the negatives:

1. A large percentage of the general populace are allergic to grains.
2. Grains are high in lignans: estrogen-like phytochemicals
3. *insert random negative fact here*

I could go on about just about every food.

The fact of the matter is that variety is over-rated.

What isn't, is covering your nutritional bases.. as well as picking foods you can assimilate.

...Not ingesting a bunch of foods, under the misguided impression that it will give you some special ingredient.

Complete protein = complete protein.

Consuming shrimp for protein over chicken won't give you bigger biceps.



LMAO.

I love your 'studies'.



You know you clearly have no grasp of what you've read..and what you're trying to relate.

Refer to my post about covering nutritional bases.

When i build a diet, I cover my nutritional bases: protein; carbs; fats; vitamins (and other phytochemicals); minerals.

Your body cannot distinguish one source of vitamin B (for example) from another.

You are just using what you've read, and clearly not understood, as an excuse not to stick to a diet.



I dunno who this is w/ reference to.

But this clearly isn't the thread for you.



This is an admission of ever trying such?

If so, this goes against you other posts in this thread.



You've over-reaching on this one.

'Diversity' doesn't mean 'junk'.



*yawn*




I don't see a study.

I see an article which is a summary of a summit.

Furthermore, the summit did not deal with muscularity.. or muscular performance.

...and is of no relevance to this thread.

an FYI: a 'diet' is not non-diverse.

I don't know where you got those wires crossed.

Now, back to the thread...and helping people who wish to get in shape.

-CNS

i realize that is not a study, but it cites studies. I knew you would say that too. No the article does not deal with muscularity, it dealt with health. My point is that "dietary diversity" is not something i just pulled out of my ass.

now back to your thread.

[Narkissos]

hey nark i posted a reply right before your last post giving you the info and answering the questions you had... thanks for your time!!!

See the above response: Free Diet advice by Narkissos & Novastepp: Intro to Performance Nutrition 101

bump for more info



-CNS

[texasmk4]

Nark, i have a question; is it more efficient to spread out the cal/carbs/fat/pro equally in every meal through out the day or it should'nt matter as long as you're taking the appropiate amount?

Also i am going to need your help in determing my carbs cycling, abbot helped me, but i just did'nt want to annoy him by asking him too many questions. currently i am 195 with 19% of bf i would like to drop it down to 15% before oct because that's when i start my cycle. According to Katch-McArdle formula my kcal to maintain LBM should be 3306 since i am planning on doing cardio 6 days a week along with 5 days of weight training. I am using the 40% carbs 40% pro and 20% fat macro. I am getting most o fmy carbs from sweet potato and two meal of oats early in the morning right after AM Cardio. I'll be doing a slow joggin for 50 to 60 mins 6 days a week empty stomach.

This is my diet looks like.

AM cardio

1, 80g of oats with 1 scoope of whey protein. Cals = 420, Carbs = 57, Pro = 34, Fat = 6

2, 80g of oats with 1 scoope of whey protein. Cals = 420, Carbs = 57, Pro = 34, Fat = 6

3, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

4, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

5, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

6, 150g chicken breast, 237g baked sweet potato. Cals = 461, Carbs = 49, Pro = 49, Fat = 5

7, 150g chicken breast, 146g brown rice . Cals = 412, Carbs = 34, Pro = 49, Fat = 6

8, PWO shake 2 scoope, 2 scoope Waxy Maize Starch. Cals = 500, Carbs = 66g, Pro = 48g

Total Calories = 3596

Total Carbs = 410g

Pro = 361g

Fat = 38g

But this is what I do, weigh all the sweet potato together which comes out to be around 950g put it in a bowl and eat one with every meal, does it have to be equal in every meal ( carbs and calories wise) same thing with the chicken baked all the breast together and put it in a bowl and eat it at work but don't really know how much i am eating per meal.

Nark, i'm Still waiting for your response