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Thread: Free Diet advice by Narkissos & Novastepp: Intro to Performance Nutrition 101

  1. #801
    xlxBigSexyxlx's Avatar
    xlxBigSexyxlx is offline CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
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    Speaking of steamers. I got a bamboo steamer.
    Just place it over hot pot of water, for how ever long you want to steam them.
    My personal favorite is asparagus, but it makes urine smell funky lol

  2. #802
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    novastepp is offline Have You Picked a Fight Lately?
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    I'm going to try papertowel, and broccoli with water in the micro. with a few attempts i'm sure i'll get it right.

  3. #803
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    UberSteroids is offline Anabolic Member
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    Nark,

    What is your opinion on pre-workout and through the workout mixtures?

    Goal: Muscle building

    I will give you example of what I was thinking of trying...

    10 minutes before workout - 1scoop whey (24g prot) 1/4 cup dex (25g carbs)

    Now through the whole workout I would drink the Endurox R4 - 2 scoops with 36oz water (14g prot, 53g carbs).

    Then, immediately after workout I would have 1 scoop of Ednurox R4 (7g prot, 26g carbs) along with C1000 and E1000 caps (1 of each).

    Thanks a lot!

  4. #804
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    this is off subject but nova, you and nark are 2 valuable assets to this board and any other board you 2 post on. your both extremly intelligent and your info. seems to be endless.
    source checks- 200 posts and 6 month membership min. entirely within my discretion
    PT is a fictional character and all posts are for entertainment purposes only.




  5. #805
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    Quote Originally Posted by UberSteroids View Post
    Nark,

    What is your opinion on pre-workout and through the workout mixtures?

    Goal: Muscle building

    I will give you example of what I was thinking of trying...

    10 minutes before workout - 1scoop whey (24g prot) 1/4 cup dex (25g carbs)

    Now through the whole workout I would drink the Endurox R4 - 2 scoops with 36oz water (14g prot, 53g carbs).

    Then, immediately after workout I would have 1 scoop of Ednurox R4 (7g prot, 26g carbs) along with C1000 and E1000 caps (1 of each).

    Thanks a lot!
    There're different schools of thought in this regard.

    Some claim it's superior to ingest a fast-acting pro/carb mix before/during training.

    In my personal experience however, the results/effects are inconsistent.

    Sometimes w/ pre-work-out/intra-workout beverages I get a better pump.

    Sometimes, the opposite happens.

    Sometimes I feel stronger, sometimes i feel weaker.

    I've worked with clients who believed that it was 'necessary' for them... so I manipulated the surrounding meals (etc.) to facilitate the inclusion.

    Like I stated above though... It's inconsistent.

    I don't believe it's a 'must'.

    What is however, is formulating (and adhering to) a solid diet plan.



    -CNS

  6. #806
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    Quote Originally Posted by PT View Post
    this is off subject but nova, you and nark are 2 valuable assets to this board and any other board you 2 post on. your both extremly intelligent and your info. seems to be endless.
    You flirt you

  7. #807
    goose is offline Banned
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    Hey buddy....

    Nice to see you around.

    Do you rate Hydrolysed Whey protein,its quite rare ? How do you think it compares to eggs PWO?

    Its the only whey product that has high appeal to me,im thinking PWO and using it as one of my meals,to save time.

  8. #808
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    Quote Originally Posted by goose View Post
    Hey buddy....

    Nice to see you around.

    Do you rate Hydrolysed Whey protein,its quite rare ? How do you think it compares to eggs PWO?

    Its the only whey product that has high appeal to me,im thinking PWO and using it as one of my meals,to save time.
    That depends on what you're asking exactly.

    H.WPI v.s. whole-egg protein... or whole eggs period?

    H.WPI + carbs v.s. the above + carbs?

    H.WPI alone v.s. the above + carbs?


    Please clarify.

    -CNS

  9. #809
    goose is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    That depends on what you're asking exactly.

    H.WPI v.s. whole-egg protein... or whole eggs period?

    H.WPI + carbs v.s. the above + carbs?

    H.WPI alone v.s. the above + carbs?


    Please clarify.

    -CNS


    So H.WPI with amino acids and whole eggs with amino acids.....No carbs at all.

  10. #810
    sonysucks is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    Sorry bud.

    I don't get email notifications when i get PMs. (though I'm sure I turned the notification on )

    Bleh.

    -CNS
    Got ya, were you able to give me some thoughts on the questions in my pm?
    Thanks.

  11. #811
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    Quote Originally Posted by goose View Post


    So H.WPI with amino acids and whole eggs with amino acids.....No carbs at all.
    In the pwo environment: H.WPI FTW!

  12. #812
    I_Want_Abs is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by novastepp View Post
    I'm going to break my one candle rule and post up my current diet without macros.

    I feel like many see me post up critiques for all these diets and they see me do this without knowing what my diet looks like. So here it is, I will add values later, but I am in between grad classes today and I feel like talking diet, not health information systems.

    Pro/Carb/Fat...

    Meal 1:

    2 cups skim milk
    2 scoops whey protein
    1 cup fat free cottage cheese + splenda + cinnamon

    76/40/2
    Totals: 482cals

    my first meal of the day can really bog me down and make it hard for me to eat 2.5 hours later. SO i myself do resort to whey, and milk. However, I feel teh benefits of whey+casein are not only documented, but beneficial to me.

    Meal 2; 2.5 hours later:

    12oz eye round steak
    2 medium red potatoes

    68/48/24
    Totals: 680cals

    this meal sums up my diet. I aim for about 50-60g protein in each meal and about 40g carbs.

    Meal 3; 2.5 hours later:

    16oz pork chops
    one medium sweet potato

    72/48/16
    Totals 624cals

    This is the time of day where I either feel like a bunny in heat, or i get sluggish, I down as much meat as i can at this point and try to stay a little active so i can survive without a nap. Naps destroy my diet because i always end up sleeping for 3-4 hours...


    Meal 4; 2.5-3 hours later; pre workout

    12oz eye round steak
    2 medium red potatoes

    68/48/24
    Totals: 680cals

    I also will mix powerade zero + 5g creatine +10g BCAA's. I sip this before i hit the gym, sip a little during my workout (but i mainly drink water when i lift) and i finish the drink after i train.

    Meal 5; PWO (probably 15 or so minutes after I finish lifting)

    2 cups skim milk
    2 scoops whey
    1-2 cups of fat free cottage cheese + cinnamon + splenda

    76/40/2
    Totals: 482cals (calculated with just one cup of cottage cheese)

    Meal 6; 1.5 hours after PWO

    12oz beef or steak
    medium sweet potato

    68/48/24
    Totals: 680cals

    This meal is sometimes hard to stomach, but it's all about recovery, so I lay down and take my time eating here.

    Meal 7; before bed

    12-16oz flat iron steak
    2 cups green beans
    1Tbsp natty peanut butter

    74/24/28
    Totals 644cals

    I enjoy food before bed, so sometimes I throw in an apple as well.


    Daily Totals:
    Pro-502g
    Carb-296g
    Fat-120g
    Cals-4,272kcals


    *This is the gist. Certain days require different foods. For example, on thursdays i'm on campus for 6 hours, so i just bake an enitre bag of chicken breasts with me and 5-6 red potatoes. But the amount of protein and carbs consumed stays relatively the same.

    I brew hot tea in between every meal that I can. I have quite teh stock pile of teas and I enjoy them with my meals. They also help slow blood sugar spikes if that is something you need to worry about with your diet. I drink tea because of the anti-o's, the flavanoids, and the health benefits... plus i enjoy it.

    If it is an off day, I will just eat 10-12oz meat and potatoes in place of my PWO meal, and other meals move to an appropriate time. The appropriate time is 2.5 hours in between meals. The longest I like to go without food is 3 hours in between meals. I aim for 8-9 hours of sleep a night, and if I wake up to use the restroom I will sometimes drink some milk.

    Also, I eat about 4 cups of broccoli a day. In meals 2 and 3 i will eat about two florettes or a cup in each meal. I use it to help keep me regular. This isn't really an issue because i eat teh skin on my potatoes as well.

    Supplements I consume:

    Meal 1: multivitamin + 2 g vitamin c
    Meal 2: b-complex vitamin +400mcg chromium
    Meal 3: 200mg ALA
    Meal 4: n/a
    PWO: 3g vitamin c + 400iu vitamin E
    Meal 6: b-complex vitamin + 400mcg chromium
    Before Bed: 3g Vitamin C


    Currently I am

    5'9"
    212lbs
    Hovering around the 10%bf mark
    I am bulking, naturally, and I hope to bulk until March or April.
    My goal is to reach 225lbs and stay under 12-13%bf.

    I cut down around 8%bf for the summer and I have been bulking for 4 weeks. I have gained about 8 pounds since I started bulking, and I hope to continue to gain weight at a rate of 1-2 pounds per week.

    If you have any questions or comments let me know. Again, I will add macros and specific numbers later when I have time at home.

    Hey Nova, I was just reading back through this thread and I noticed your diet and have a question about it.

    Adding up your daily macro's they work out to be at a ratio of about 47/27/25 Pro/Carb/Fat (For some reason there is a 1% error in my caculations lol).
    Just wondering why you use this ratio? I thought yourself and Nark advised a 40/40/20 ratio was optimal?


    Also just to add to my diet. Over the last 2 weeks I have been feeling really tired and a bit slow on my high carb days, and have also been getting sharp pains in my stomach after some of my later meals. Now the progress is going well, I am loosing BF and looking great but I dont like the feelings i'm getting from my body so I have been doing a bit of remodeling to my "high days"
    Instead of keeping protein and fat constant, I am going to use your version of cycling Nark (but only on the high days ), and basicaly keep a 40/40/20 ratio on my high days. Cals will still be at about 3600 - as they have been (about 600 over maintenance) while on my lower days keeping pro/fat at maintenace level and dropping carbs to only 20g per meal as I have been doing.

    All in all the cals will remain very much the same as I am basicaly taking cals from my carb alotment and adding them to my protein so they even out at a 1:1 ratio with each other. I have a feeling my body didn't like processing that many heavy carbs in each sitting, so hopefully this little modification will help!
    Last edited by I_Want_Abs; 12-12-2008 at 06:45 PM.

  13. #813
    Narkissos's Avatar
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    ^^Bump!

  14. #814
    sizerp is offline Banned
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    Nark-Sauce/Nova-Step how do you feel about the 4:1 carb/pro ratio for PWO nutrition, followed by a full meal 30-40 minutes after? I see Nova's diet includes a 1:2 carb/pro ratio just about. The idea is that too much pro PWO can bog down the system. Thoughts?

  15. #815
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    4:1 carb/pro?

    Unless you're using a nutrient-partitioning agent AND your protein is way low, I don't see how that'd be feasible.

    -CNS

  16. #816
    sizerp is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    4:1 carb/pro?

    Unless you're using a nutrient-partitioning agent AND your protein is way low, I don't see how that'd be feasible.

    -CNS
    Well yeah, keeping pro levels low. Basing your intake on the amount of carbs firstly.

  17. #817
    jdmscene is offline New Member
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    Ok here is my Diet can you please look at it and let me know if I missed anything or need to take something away or change it. I am going to be doing the same diet 7days a week. I am 29yo male 200lb 5' 11" Chest is 44inch, waist 37 1/4 at the belly button, Hips 41 1/2, and thighs 22 1/2.
    thanks

    2 cantaloupe halves with 1 cup 1% cottage cheese

    one cup green tea with 1/2 tbsp raw honey

    Prot: 32, Carb: 50, Fib: 5, Fat: 3, Cal: 340

    _________________________________________________
    Meal 2

    3 hard boiled eggs and one large orange

    Prot: 20, Carb: 25, Fib: 5, Fat: 14, Cal: 291

    _________________________________________________
    Meal 3

    Grilled chicken salad with 4 oz chicken, olive oil vinagrette dressing, 1 slice whole grain toast with whipped butter

    one cup green tea

    Prot: 32, Carb: 30, Fib: 7, Fat: 18, Cal: 389

    _________________________________________________
    Meal 4

    1 banana with 2 tbsp natural peanut butter and 1 cup skim milk

    Prot: 18, Carb: 44, Fib: 6, Fat: 17, Cal: 383
    _________________________________________________
    Meal 5

    chicken fajitas: whole wheat tortillas, chicken breast, onion, peppers, salsa, low fat cheddar, low fat sour cream, guacamole

    one cup green tea

    Prot: 40, Carb: 55, Fib: 8, Fat: 19, Cal: 527

    _________________________________________________

    Total

    Prot: 142, Carb: 204, Fib: 31, Fat: 71, Cal: 1930

  18. #818
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    Deltasaurus is offline The Over Analyzing Nattabolic
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    Bump this thread is the best thread in this section and needs to be up top!!!!!

    -AJ

  19. #819
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    Hey Nark/Nova, wondering how you feel about midsleep protein shakes? Is it worth disrupting my sleep halfway to take in a shake? I was doing this early in the year and my body got used to it, I would wake up like clockwork on my own at 4.00 am to take my shake and go back to sleep.

    Since your body is so used to sleeping youd think it would use lipolysis to give it the little energy it needs but you know best... thanks!

  20. #820
    sizerp is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zino View Post
    Hey Nark/Nova, wondering how you feel about midsleep protein shakes? Is it worth disrupting my sleep halfway to take in a shake? I was doing this early in the year and my body got used to it, I would wake up like clockwork on my own at 4.00 am to take my shake and go back to sleep.

    Since your body is so used to sleeping youd think it would use lipolysis to give it the little energy it needs but you know best... thanks!
    I'd figure I'd chime in -

    Personally - since I eat before I sleep - I always seem to wake up 3-4 hours later to take a pee anyway. May as well down a shake that's been prepared if you're up, right?

    At a low heart rate, like sleeping, the body burns 90% fatty acids, and even while sleeping your body needs some glucose for efficient fat-burning.

    Not really sure this answered the question... lol.
    Last edited by sizerp; 12-21-2008 at 07:39 PM.

  21. #821
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    Quote Originally Posted by sizerp View Post
    I'd figure I'd chime in -

    Personally - since I eat before I sleep - I always seem to wake up 3-4 hours later to take a pee anyway. May as well down a shake that's been pre-prepared if you're up, right?

    At a low heart rate, like sleeping, the body burns 90% fatty acids, and even while sleeping your body needs some glucose for efficient fat-burning.

    Not really sure this answered the question... lol.
    Yea I have a biiig cassein shake before bed too. So i guess if you wake up and do the midnight shake you so prevent any muscle wasting and keep nitro positive helping your body rebuild better...

  22. #822
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    Hey guys I was wondering if I could get a little help with the diet, Nova helped me a while back and it really helped.. I started dieting very well 9 months ago, I started at 178lbs, mat. calories were at 3200, I ate 4200 and since then I've gained 16lbs..
    I'm now at 194lbs, 10-12%body fat, and I train 6 times a week. I got my routined from an NFPT trainers manual..
    Mon. Legs/Traps, Tues. Back/Bices. Wed. Triceps,Delts,Chest Repeat Thurs,Fri,and Sat. Sunday off..
    My Goal is to bulk and bulk until I'm satisfied with my appearance and then I'll cut..

    Cals/Pro/Carbs/Fat

    Meal 1: 650/42/-/-: I dont have time to cook eggs, cause school..
    1 Cup Oats: 300/10/56/1
    1 Scoop Casein/Whole Milk: 270/32/13/-
    1 Banana: 80Calories?

    Meal 2:600/50/-/-
    8oz Chicken: 240/42/-/-
    12oz yams: 300 calories with garlic powder..
    1 cup brocolli/carots/peppers

    Meal 3: 600/48/-/- Pro/Fat
    1 Can Tuna: 160/32/-/-
    1/2 Cup Peanuts: 320/16/12/28

    Meal 4: Pwo 600/46/-/-
    6oz Lean beef (96/4) 200/32/-/-
    80g Pasta 400/14/-/0

    Meal 5: PPWO 850/68/-/-
    3 SLices White Bread 240/6/-/-
    Turkey 135/15/-/-
    5 SLices Turkey Bacon 100/15/-/-
    Whey Shake 270/32/-/-
    1 Banana
    table Sugar.. probably bad idea but its working I think..

    Meal 6: Varies 600/45/-/-
    8egg whites 2Whole/Salmon/Chicken/ Sometimes Sirloin
    2 slices wheat bread/1 Cup Oats/12oz Red taters
    veggies

    Meal 7: Bed 650/50/-/-
    6oz turkey breast 175/32/-/0
    brown rice 200/10/-/-
    1 cup yogurt 200/7/-/-

    Total Macros: 4450/350/-/about 150g Fat

    Sorry if it got messy.. but thats it.. My diet is working and I am seeing results but I want to maximize results.. training naturally, not taking anything at all besides protein shakes.. I started off bench repping 205lbs at beg. and now I'm rep between 295-320..reg bench and decline..

    Overall: maintenance calories have gone up from 3200 to 3500.. intaking 4500Calories
    I'll post additional information if you need, thanks for your help in advance..
    Last edited by NeedAnabolics; 12-21-2008 at 11:24 PM.

  23. #823
    Deltasaurus's Avatar
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    Where is Nova???
    off topic

  24. #824
    Narkissos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jdmscene View Post
    Ok here is my Diet can you please look at it and let me know if I missed anything or need to take something away or change it. I am going to be doing the same diet 7days a week. I am 29yo male 200lb 5' 11" Chest is 44inch, waist 37 1/4 at the belly button, Hips 41 1/2, and thighs 22 1/2.
    thanks
    protein too low... macros all over the place... too much wheat, too much fat...too much sugar.

    Horrible diet to be honest.

    5'11" with a 37+" waist pegs you at what... 20+% BF?

    -CNS

  25. #825
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zino View Post
    Hey Nark/Nova, wondering how you feel about midsleep protein shakes? Is it worth disrupting my sleep halfway to take in a shake? I was doing this early in the year and my body got used to it, I would wake up like clockwork on my own at 4.00 am to take my shake and go back to sleep.

    Since your body is so used to sleeping youd think it would use lipolysis to give it the little energy it needs but you know best... thanks!
    Purposely interupting sleep sucks unless you're a pro bodybuilder... i.e. unless you're using a shit-ton of ergogenics.

    If you get up to pee however, I see no issue with chugging back a casein shake... Providing you have one already prepared.

    It can really throw the sleep cycle if one ingests too much mid-sleep... or takes too long to go back to sleep (due to prep time).

    -CNS

  26. #826
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zino View Post
    Yea I have a biiig cassein shake before bed too. So i guess if you wake up and do the midnight shake you so prevent any muscle wasting and keep nitro positive helping your body rebuild better...
    Honestly this is over-rated you know.

    People really take this catabolism discussion too far.

    You won't piss away muscle overnight.

    If you're consuming a casein shake or solid protein pre-bed... there really is no reason to pile in more calories mid-sleep.

    No need at all to induce gastric stress.

    -CNS

  27. #827
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeedAnabolics View Post
    Hey guys I was wondering if I could get a little help with the diet, Nova helped me a while back and it really helped.. I started dieting very well 9 months ago, I started at 178lbs, mat. calories were at 3200, I ate 4200 and since then I've gained 16lbs..
    I'm now at 194lbs, 10-12%body fat, and I train 6 times a week. I got my routined from an NFPT trainers manual..
    Mon. Legs/Traps, Tues. Back/Bices. Wed. Triceps,Delts,Chest Repeat Thurs,Fri,and Sat. Sunday off..
    My Goal is to bulk and bulk until I'm satisfied with my appearance and then I'll cut..

    Cals/Pro/Carbs/Fat

    Meal 1: 650/42/-/-: I dont have time to cook eggs, cause school..
    1 Cup Oats: 300/10/56/1
    1 Scoop Casein/Whole Milk: 270/32/13/-
    1 Banana: 80Calories?

    Meal 2:600/50/-/-
    8oz Chicken: 240/42/-/-
    12oz yams: 300 calories with garlic powder..
    1 cup brocolli/carots/peppers

    Meal 3: 600/48/-/- Pro/Fat
    1 Can Tuna: 160/32/-/-
    1/2 Cup Peanuts: 320/16/12/28

    Meal 4: Pwo 600/46/-/-
    6oz Lean beef (96/4) 200/32/-/-
    80g Pasta 400/14/-/0

    Meal 5: PPWO 850/68/-/-
    3 SLices White Bread 240/6/-/-
    Turkey 135/15/-/-
    5 SLices Turkey Bacon 100/15/-/-
    Whey Shake 270/32/-/-
    1 Banana
    table Sugar.. probably bad idea but its working I think..

    Meal 6: Varies 600/45/-/-
    8egg whites 2Whole/Salmon/Chicken/ Sometimes Sirloin
    2 slices wheat bread/1 Cup Oats/12oz Red taters
    veggies

    Meal 7: Bed 650/50/-/-
    6oz turkey breast 175/32/-/0
    brown rice 200/10/-/-
    1 cup yogurt 200/7/-/-

    Total Macros: 4450/350/-/about 150g Fat

    Sorry if it got messy.. but thats it.. My diet is working and I am seeing results but I want to maximize results.. training naturally, not taking anything at all besides protein shakes.. I started off bench repping 205lbs at beg. and now I'm rep between 295-320..reg bench and decline..

    Overall: maintenance calories have gone up from 3200 to 3500.. intaking 4500Calories
    I'll post additional information if you need, thanks for your help in advance..

    I'm not really sure how to 'optimize' this diet mate.

    Your food choices and quantities, as well as your statements convey to me that you're just about putting on weight... and loads of it.

    I don't believe in getting fat while bulking personally.

    -CNS

  28. #828
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    Quote Originally Posted by A2thej2008 View Post
    Where is Nova???
    off topic
    Last i heard he was naked in a basement somewhere.

  29. #829
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    I'm out.

  30. #830
    novastepp's Avatar
    novastepp is offline Have You Picked a Fight Lately?
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    Quote Originally Posted by I_Want_Abs View Post
    Hey Nova, I was just reading back through this thread and I noticed your diet and have a question about it.

    Adding up your daily macro's they work out to be at a ratio of about 47/27/25 Pro/Carb/Fat (For some reason there is a 1% error in my caculations lol).
    Just wondering why you use this ratio? I thought yourself and Nark advised a 40/40/20 ratio was optimal?


    Also just to add to my diet. Over the last 2 weeks I have been feeling really tired and a bit slow on my high carb days, and have also been getting sharp pains in my stomach after some of my later meals. Now the progress is going well, I am loosing BF and looking great but I dont like the feelings i'm getting from my body so I have been doing a bit of remodeling to my "high days"
    Instead of keeping protein and fat constant, I am going to use your version of cycling Nark (but only on the high days ), and basicaly keep a 40/40/20 ratio on my high days. Cals will still be at about 3600 - as they have been (about 600 over maintenance) while on my lower days keeping pro/fat at maintenace level and dropping carbs to only 20g per meal as I have been doing.

    All in all the cals will remain very much the same as I am basicaly taking cals from my carb alotment and adding them to my protein so they even out at a 1:1 ratio with each other. I have a feeling my body didn't like processing that many heavy carbs in each sitting, so hopefully this little modification will help!
    I know I have a lot of fat in that diet. I had to sort out my protein sources. The fat was coming from my actual protein sources (beef, steak, pork chops). So I had to reevaluate and substitute chicken into more meals than I would have initially wanted/liked. But in the grand scheme of things I still eat steak when I want and beef at times.

    Your idea of the carb/protein replacement is a good one, but don't overdo those carb meals. If you're feeling bloated, back them off. Bloat is either an allergy, or your body letting you know you've reached or surpassed a digestive limit. You may have to sub back in protein to keep the macros correct. If that doesn't seem like a good idea or feasible, a handful of almonds is my choice for rounding off those tricky edges. Fat will also slow down digestion as we all know, possibly helping with the carb digestion.

  31. #831
    novastepp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    Honestly this is over-rated you know.

    People really take this catabolism discussion too far.

    You won't piss away muscle overnight.

    If you're consuming a casein shake or solid protein pre-bed... there really is no reason to pile in more calories mid-sleep.

    No need at all to induce gastric stress.

    -CNS
    I share your point of view here, but I have a question on which I would like your point of view. I myself eat a meal and then I'm off to bed. However sometimes I am definitely catching up on my sleep-debt, and can sleep for 10hours. At what point does a long sleep duration need to be better fueled in your opinion?

    Also, sometimes I still enjoy waking and doing some morning cardio...fasted. At what length of sleep should I nix the fasted cardio and do something after a meal? I never will do fasted cardio if I sleep more than roughly 8 hours, I feel it may cause me more harm than good.

  32. #832
    mholla is offline Junior Member
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    Narkissos thanks for all the advice. i'm looking to cut bf down and build muscle. can you take a look at my diet? what do i need to change? thanks.

    im 25 yrs old, 6'3", 210 lbs, bf approx. 14%. i train 5 days on 2 days off for 60-90min each, ill do 5-10min hiit cardio pwo probably 3 times a week.

    I'm carb cycling (5 low, 2 high). any advice is appreciated. thanks again.

    High carb day

    -------------------------Cal Fat Carbs Pro


    Upon waking(approx. 9:30am)
    whey protein (1.75 scoops) 210 2 6 40
    orange juice (16oz) 220 0 52 4

    Breakfast(approx. 10.30am)
    Peanut butter (5 tbsp) 475 40 17.5 20
    Whole wheat (2 slices) 200 3 40 14

    Lunch(approx. 1:00pm)
    7 eggs (3 whole,4 whites) 356 13.5 6 34
    oatmeal [steel cut oats] (3/4 cup raw)400 7.5 81 13
    Skim milk (16oz) 172 1 24 16

    snack(approx. 4:00pm)
    chicken breast(4oz) 140 3 0 27
    banana 105 0 27 1

    Pre-work out(approx. 5:30pm)
    whey protein (1.5 scoop) 180 1.5 4.5 36
    almonds (1oz) 160 14 6 6

    Post-work out(approx. 7:30pm)
    whey protein (1.5 scoop) 180 1.5 4.5 36
    casein protein (0.5 scoop) 60 0.5 2 12.5
    Gatorade powder (3 scoop) 200 0 56 0

    Dinner(approx. 9:00pm)
    Chicken breast (8oz) 280 6 0 54
    broccoli (2 cup) 150 0 12 18
    brown rice (1 cup) 230 2 54 6
    olive oil (2 tbsp) 220 28 0 0

    snack(approx. 12:00am)
    1 low-fat string cheese 70 4 1 8
    almonds (1oz) 160 14 6 6

    before sleep(approx. 2:00am)
    Casein protein (2 scoop) 260 2 8 48


    ----------Cal Fat Carbs Pro
    total 4,088 141.5 415 399.5


    Low Carb day

    -------------------------Cal Fat Carbs Pro


    Upon waking(approx. 9:30am)
    whey protein (1.75 scoops) 210 2 6 40

    Breakfast(approx. 10.30am)
    7 eggs (3 whole,4 whites) 356 13.5 6 34
    oatmeal [steel cut oats] (1.5/4 cup raw) 225 4 41 8

    Lunch(approx. 1:00pm)
    chicken breast(4oz) 140 3 0 27
    almonds (1oz) 160 14 6 6

    snack(approx. 4:00pm)
    chicken breast(4oz) 140 3 0 27
    banana 105 0 27 1

    Pre-work out(approx. 5:30pm)
    whey protein (1.5 scoop) 180 1.5 4.5 36

    Post-work out(approx. 7:30pm)
    whey protein (1.5 scoop) 180 1.5 4.5 36
    casein protein (0.5 scoop) 60 0.5 2 12.5
    Gatorade powder (3 scoop) 200 0 56 0

    Dinner(approx. 9:00pm)
    Chicken breast (8oz) 280 6 0 54
    broccoli (2 cup) 150 0 12 18
    brown rice (1/2 cup) 115 1 27 3
    olive oil (2 tbsp) 220 28 0 0

    snack(approx. 12:00am)
    1 low-fat string cheese 70 4 1 8
    almonds (1oz) 160 14 6 6

    before sleep(approx. 2:00am)
    Casein protein (2 scoop) 260 2 8 48


    ----------Cal Fat Carbs Pro
    total 3,211 98 205.5 364.5
    Last edited by mholla; 01-12-2009 at 09:08 PM.

  33. #833
    Zino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    Honestly this is over-rated you know.

    People really take this catabolism discussion too far.

    You won't piss away muscle overnight.

    If you're consuming a casein shake or solid protein pre-bed... there really is no reason to pile in more calories mid-sleep.

    No need at all to induce gastric stress.

    -CNS
    But im scared!

    Thanks for the response!, it was a pain waking up with protein shake breath anyway.

  34. #834
    dehydromethandrotren's Avatar
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    subscribed for later questions....

  35. #835
    bodybuilder1107's Avatar
    bodybuilder1107 is offline Senior Member
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    Question

    when on keto version that allows some carbs post wo carbs(30g) and thats it with 2 cheat meals and take 16g per meal fats with 45g protein and dropped fat like crazy first two weeks now weight is stuck and kinda feels like alittle fat has come back to mid section is this norma ? fat shifting as bf gets lower maybee? or is the only way to correct by dropping fats and by how much seeings how im 15 lbs lighter than before i started with that ammount? was told to drop to 13 after 3 weeks should i do it now instead(2 weeks)thanks alot bro

  36. #836
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    Deltasaurus is offline The Over Analyzing Nattabolic
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    Ok im cutting untill the end of this month getting down to 10% my LBM is about 155ish, I train 4 days a week with HIT. 2 on 1 off 2 on 2 off. I also do cardio often and run at least 4-6 miles a week.
    Im going to start lean bulking at the end of this month. Cut back on the cardio quite a bit but still do some to maintain my leaness
    here is a over view of my diet
    3000kcal a day give or take
    Pro-200grams about 25 grams in each meal slightly more
    Fat-70 grams 10 grams each meal
    Carbs 390

    7 meals a day

    More Carbs in Pre-WO, PWO, and Post-PWO for energy and recovery.

    Protein sources are
    Lean Beef
    Chicken Breast
    Egg whites
    Lean fish
    Whey


    Carbs sources
    Oats
    Red potatoes
    sweet potatoes
    Green fiberous veggies
    and Fruit Pwo Only
    Also Considering Brown rice and Quinoa


    Fats
    Mostly comming from the food but any extra needed will be from

    olive oil
    Natty peanut butter
    whole eggs
    Flax oil
    Fish




    Also im on a budget and things will be tight but im pretty sure i can manageto pull this off no problem if i try

    Goal is to gain 1.5-2.0 of LBM a month untill i obtain a LBM of 165 and then Re-evaluate, and obviously ill have to add calories along the way.

    Any and All critique is Appreciated and Welcomed thank you

  37. #837
    jdmscene is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by *Narkissos* View Post
    protein too low... macros all over the place... too much wheat, too much fat...too much sugar.

    Horrible diet to be honest.

    5'11" with a 37+" waist pegs you at what... 20+% BF?

    -CNS
    yes sir I think im about 20 Im down to 190 right now 35 on the waist if I can get this diet down ill drop more faster. ok back to the net to find what I can eat. Im trying to make a diet around me and my wife she is OMG a picky eater. She has went from 230 to alittle under 200 now

  38. #838
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    Quote Originally Posted by novastepp View Post
    I'm out.
    Did i give you permission?

    I hope dinner's done by the time I get home.

    lmao.

  39. #839
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    Quote Originally Posted by novastepp View Post
    I share your point of view here, but I have a question on which I would like your point of view. I myself eat a meal and then I'm off to bed. However sometimes I am definitely catching up on my sleep-debt, and can sleep for 10hours. At what point does a long sleep duration need to be better fueled in your opinion?
    Personally I don't believe said point really exists.


    Effect of weight-training on energy expenditure and substrate utilization during sleep.

    VAN ETTEN LM, WESTERTERP KR, VERSTAPPEN FT. Med Sci Sports Exerc 1995;27(2):188-93.
    Abstract

    This study was performed to investigate the effect of weight-training (12 wk; 21 male subjects) on energy expenditure and substrate utilization during sleep.

    Sleeping metabolic rate (SMR) as measured in a respiration chamber was calculated according to three procedures: the lowest mean energy expenditure of a shiftable 3-h interval between 0:00 and 6:00 (SMR3) and SMR over predetermined intervals from 3:00 to 6:00 (SMR3-6) and from 0:00 to 6:00 (SMR0-6). in analogy with SMR the corresponding respiratory quotients were expressed as RQ3, RQ3-6, and RQ0-6.

    Changes in body composition were assessed from changes in body weight, body volume (densitometry), and total body water (deuterium dilution). Weight-training induced an increase in fat-free mass (+1.11.3 kg; P<0.001) and a decrease in fat mass (-2.31.5 kg; P<0.001) and body weight (-1.12.1 kg; P<0.05).

    There was no significant change in SMR, irrespective of the way SMR was expressed. Only RQ3 decreased significantly (from 0.820.04 to 0.930.02; P<0.05). Remarkably RQ3, RQ3-6, and RQ0-6 were highly negative correlated with the pre-training RQ (r=-0.93, -0.91, and -0.90, respectively: P<0.001) resulting in a diminished variation in post-training RQ (P<0.001).

    These results suggest that weighttraining has no effect on SMR but increases relative fat utilization in low fat oxidizers and vice versa for individuals displaying high pretraining lipid oxidation.

  40. #840
    Narkissos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by novastepp View Post
    Also, sometimes I still enjoy waking and doing some morning cardio...fasted. At what length of sleep should I nix the fasted cardio and do something after a meal?
    I never do fasted state cardio.

    Not in the 'first thing in the a.m.' capacity at least.

    How low is your BG when you wake in the a.m.?

    -C

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