**Marcus's HIT Dungeon**

[kelkel]

Yea true..... I asked him if he thought I was big enough to compete in the super heavy division and he said yea so.... Those guys are BIG but the competition here in jersey has dwindled over the last few years. It's not quite what it used to be.

We'll see..... For now I'm focusing on chest and legs.

I moved.

[Bedford]

Igi said to come over so I'm here . Been reading for a few days great stuff on this thread.
Killed my shoulders today felt amazing with nice controlled reps.

Arnold Presses DB
12 x 25 warm up
8 x 45 with 10 sec rest
8x45 with 10 sec rest
7x45 with 10 sec rest
6x45 failure

4 min break

Seated Side laterals DB
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x7 with 10 sec rest
20x6 failure

4minute break

Seated underhand press DB
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x7 with 10 sec rest
45 x5 failure

4 minute break

Upright Rows DB
52.5x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5x6 failed

3 minute break

Front laterals DB

25x10 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x9 failed

That was it, the (about) 10 second rest was a new thing I tried tonight. I liked it but it kicked my ass.

[Hazard]

I moved.

Lmfao nice one

[Cuz]

Igi said to come over so I'm here . Been reading for a few days great stuff on this thread.
Killed my shoulders today felt amazing with nice controlled reps.

Arnold Presses
12 x 25 warm up
8 x 45 with 10 sec rest
8x45 with 10 sec rest
7x45 with 10 sec rest
6x45 failure

4 min break

Seated Side laterals
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x7 with 10 sec rest
20x6 failure

4minute break

Seated underhand press
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x7 with 10 sec rest
45 x5 failure

4 minute break

Upright Rows
52.5x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5x6 failed

3 minute break

Front laterals

25x10 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x9 failed

That was it, the (about) 10 second rest was a new thing I tried tonight. I liked it but it kicked my ass.

great workout man. the guys here will be able to assist you in HIT style training. personally I wouldnt make the.10 sec.rest a habit. you will learn aloy here anout drop.sets and.rest pauses. when.true failure comes you will need a little.more.than 10 secs lol.

[Igifuno]

Gotcha IG

Here you go big. I think you'll find this interesting..

http://forums.steroid.com/nutrition-...ml#post6759373

[Giggle]

Hey Kel -
On that first exercise, what was it 8 reps of?
Unless "balls out heavy" is some new leg move lol!
Thanks!

Legs today as well. All straight sets today, no RP's or drops.

One balls out heavy for 8 reps. Knee felt ok. Sat down for a quick minute then cranked out one more set with a little less weight for 12.
Two sets vertical presses. Minimal rest between. 12-15 reps each.
Two sets extensions
Two sets curls
Usual calf stuff

Knee's a little tender now but all in all I'm not complaining. Was strong today.

[Igifuno]

Igi said to come over so I'm here . Been reading for a few days great stuff on this thread.
Killed my shoulders today felt amazing with nice controlled reps.

Arnold Presses DB
12 x 25 warm up
8 x 45 with 10 sec rest
8x45 with 10 sec rest
7x45 with 10 sec rest
6x45 failure

4 min break

Seated Side laterals DB
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x10 with 10 sec rest
20x7 with 10 sec rest
20x6 failure

4minute break

Seated underhand press DB
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x8 with 10 sec rest
45x7 with 10 sec rest
45 x5 failure

4 minute break

Upright Rows DB
52.5x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5 x8 with 10 sec rest
52.5x6 failed

3 minute break

Front laterals DB

25x10 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x8 with 10 sec rest
25x9 failed

That was it, the (about) 10 second rest was a new thing I tried tonight. I liked it but it kicked my ass.

yeah buddy glad you came over. You'll get a ton out of the knowledge shared by the members in here.

couple things on your training routine:

- With regard to proper implementation of the advanced training techniques (RP, Forced Reps, drop sets, negatives), you'll want to push yourself and choose weight that you can rep in the range of 6-12 in order to stimulate hypertrophy. This includes your drop sets, RP, etc.

- For example, with your DB presses, you had a warm up/feel set, then 4 more sets on the same movement. In order to hit TRUE positive failure, you can reduce the amount of sets you're doing and increase the weight. This will hit those fast twitch 2b fibers you want to stimulate for growth. So feel set, another feel set if you want, then your working set of no more than 12 reps including your RP, Forced Reps, drop sets, negatives - make sense?

I'm going to repost marcus's peice on this topic for you momentarily.

[Igifuno]

Reposting marcus's piece on rep range, stimulating growth, advanced training techniques and nutrition:

1. This is just a reminder how I go about my training, many of you use different HIT approaches which is fine but for me these below work and they will also help some of you have a better understanding what this style is all about. I've seen many training styles being mixed up but I just want to get this out there for the people who are getting confused. It also explains some of the terminology I and others use.

Rep range
The ideal rep range for building size and stimulating hypertrophy is the 6 to 12 reps. Less than 6 reps will more or less increase strength and a degree of size, performing more than 12 reps will help build muscle endurance. Make sure that your reps fall within this range and your hitting true positive failure for the best chance of hypertrpohy. If your implementing one of the beyond failure methods such as forced & negs, rest pause or dropsetting you use a weight what is heavy enough to bring your positive failure at the low end of the rep range. An example for rest pause you use a weight what you will hit true positive failure at around the 4th rep then you would rest for around 10-15 seconds and do another couple of reps, then rest again for another 10-15 seconds and hit another 2 reps with the same weight. In total your doing 8 reps which is within range and your going to failure on each rest pause so you have a high chance of stimulating the right fibers to produce the best gains. As your rep range and strength increases towards a total of 12 reps you simple increase the weight being used so your constantly increasing intensity and overload, the two keys principles of any HIT programme. You use feeler sets to determine what weight you will be using on your working set, as you use different methods like dropsetting always makes sure you don't drop the weight to much so your not going over 12 reps in total. If you are you need to be using heavier weight on the drops so your rep range hits below the 12 reps in total. I always like to use around the 8 rep range in total and increase the reps upwards until I feel i can increase the weight so my rep range falls around the 8 rep range again. We are aiming for maximum muscle fiber recruitment hitting these rep ranges at failure will have the greatest potential for muscular growth. The above advice is for someone who is already advanced and is looking to build bigger thicker muscles, its not for someone who is building a base and foundation because these people can really benefit from using a lower rep range aswell as the above.


Stimulating growth
Remember going to true positive failure like I've describe previously hits the toughest muscle fibers what grow the biggest these are the fast twitch type 2b fibers, you hit these fibers and you will have the biggest chance of increasing in size. What we are aiming for is progression overload so you keep hitting the muscles with an increased weight so they need to change and adapt to the overload its being put under. This kind of continuous stress will have a reaction on the body and it will have no other alternative but to grow. We keep within the right rep range what stimulates the biggest growth and we continuously try and increase the intensity by increasing the reps then once the reps increase you increase the weight to bring the reps down within the correct range again. I can't stress enough about taking your muscle to true positive failure, this takes a lot of mental preparation. Before any muscle contraction occurs it originates from the brain sending signals to the nerves, the stronger the signal the more forceful the muscle contraction, in other words control your mind set pre working set and you will be in the best position to take your body to failure and beyond. I've commented many times how I go about doing my mental preparation but you master the mental side and you will see huge leaps in achieving your goals.Release the aggression by talking to your inner self and you will take your body to places its never been before. Stimulate growth by overloading your body to a state were its screaming for you to stop and no matter what you couldn't do one more rep even if your life depended on it, if you don't train in this fashion your not training hard enough.

Advanced training techniques
Forced and negatives
When your going to be implementing forced and negatives you need to be using a weight what your going to be hitting around the 3-4 rep range at true positive failure, then your spotter with help you with another 2 reps. I say 2 reps because its about the limit you can do once you have come to true positive failure and your partner is taking some of the weight off you, these forced reps will dig very deep into your muscle fiber recruitment. Once you have finished the forced reps the weight will be at the starting position and you start to complete negatives by lowering the weight very slowly, make sure you resist and fight the weight coming down and once at the bottom your partner will assist you to get the weight to the top of again and you will do another negative and you keep going until you cant do another negative, usually its around 2 negatives. Negatives done at this stage of a working set after positive muscle failure causes serious trauma to the muscle which will stimulate the release of growth factors. Your also 40% stronger on the eccentric part of the lift so once you hit failure in the lifting part of the exercise by yourself and adding forced with your partner the negatives will take you beyond and recruit further fibres like nothing I've experienced with any other training routine. Once this as been hit there is no need to do anything else because the damage has occurred and no more can be recruited only burn out and exhaustion. If we add the reps up you would be doing around 3-4 reps on the positive then 2 forced and then around 2 negative so in total your hitting around the 8 rep range. You have 3 strengths you have the positive, static and negative, the negative causes the most damage to the muscle and is the biggest cause of DOMS, you master negatives and you will see a huge improvement in muscle size and fullness.

Rest Pause
Again use a weight what you will be hitting true positive failure around the 3-4 reps range, put the weight down and rest for around 10-15 seconds which should give you around another 2 reps, then repeat and rest again and hit another 2+ reps again. Your completing a set of around 8 reps than you would normally use but your rest a couple of times within the set for around 10-15 second so you recover just enough to complete another 2 reps each time. This will recruit those tough type 2b muscle fibers and if you use your feeler sets correctly you can really cause some serious damage to your muscle and create an extreme amount of over load your body isn't use to. I like the 8 rep total mark but this isn't set in stone, you may prefer 10 reps in total or even 6 but just try and makes ure your in the 6-12 rep range and work from that to increase the intensity and overload.

Drop sets
This method needs a bit more thinking about but first lets explain what a drop set is. If we use DB curls for an example you would pick a weight again were you would be hitting around 3-4 reps at true positive failure and then get a set of lighter DB's and rep again for another couple of reps and then drop the weight again and curl another set of lighter bells for another 2-3 reps. You have to make sure you drop the weight enough to make sure you get around 2-3 reps out at failure but make sure you don't drop the weight to much, if your repping loads of reps out remember your trying to be hitting around the 8 rep range so when your doing your feeler sets its crucial to make the lighter db set just enough so you keep within the total rep range.

Halfs/quarters or partials
With partials you are doing a standard working set to which will involve you conducting a strict full range of motion to true positive failure, at this stage you would carry on doing half reps until its impossible to complete another half rep then do a quarter reps right down till you cant move the weight. A fine example would be DB side laterals were you would do strict reps till failure then carry on doing half reps so the DB's are only coming up half way then keep going till your hardly moving the weight from the side. There will be a bit of body assistance and sloppy form come into play towards the end but at this stage its fine just to get those deep muscle fibers working by going beyond failure. Extremely effective way to recruit those tough fibers we require with a constant tension approach.

Hit Supersets
Hit supersets entail you doing one exercise right after another with very little rest as in-between the two movements. With these types of supersets your still hitting the 6-12 rep range so your not doing anymore than 12 reps over two exercises, this is very important. Example you would go to true positive failure lets say on DB shoulder press and be at failure around the 5-6 rep then go straight into db side laterals for another 6 reps at the most which would be failure again. You have to make sure you use the right weight to hit the correct rep range so you don't go over the 12 rep ceiling otherwise you will trigger the muscle endurance and exhaustion and you wont tap into the tough fibers we require. Great examples is coupling compounds movements with isolation.


Combination
This protocol would consist of a combination of any of the above methods, you could use rest pause and on the second rest pause you may not be able to do anymore reps so you could go straight into a drop set to finish the working set of to failure and beyond. You could even use drop sets with partials on the last drop set to really increase the burn and intensity. The combination is endless, its how you feel to complete the workings set and what you need to do to make sure its a productive one. These are great for a back up plan if your working set starts to go wrong for any reason.

Rest
Using the above protocols is extremely tasking on your body and CNS so you need to make sure the training session are short but intense enough to stimulate growth. You also need to make sure you rest enough and have a good solid diet to suit your requirements. There is one thing for sure its impossible to train like this correctly for weeks on end, no matter how anabolic you are your going to need to pull back on the above movements and decrease the intensity and let the body fully repair and heal. This doesn't mean you have to stop training in this style just take a pullback training routine for a few weeks and lower the intensity and increase the rest days. Cortisol will fight against muscle growth so if you experience any over training symptoms its time to change things around to help your body repair and heal.


Feel sets
The feel sets are sets what you will do previous your working set, these sets are done so you can determine what weight you will be doing on your working set. Sometimes on my first feeler set it feels light and I'm very powerful so the next feeler set I will put some poundage on and see how that feels, again if that feels easy I know I can go heavier on my working set. I also take in consideration what I am going to be doing whether its forced and negs or rest pause or drops, I just judge a weight what I will be hitting failure around the 4th - 6th rep mark or less and then incorporate the beyond failure protocols. I also remember what I did last time I did that movement because in the back of my mind I know I have to overload my body. I am always pushing heavier weights or trying to increase the intensity.

Nutrition
Food is a major player when we are building muscle tissue or shredding bf. We need to eat enough energy releasing foods to fuel our workouts and also to promote muscle building. Nutrition is a very individual thing and nothing is set in stone no matter who tells you it is, its not. We are all different and have different levels of activity and we need to establish a baseline diet and work off this to suit your needs and goals. Make no mistake if you want to grow bigger thicker muscles than your going to have to eat big, train big and be consistent with everything you do. Once you establish your maintenance diet you can put a strategy together to add muscle and body weight or shred body fat. Learning how your body responds to different amounts of calories will be one most beneficial things you can do because this will open a plan to determine how you go about attacking and achieving your goals.

[Giggle]

Chest tonight went great -
Smith flat press ending in a 4 drop set
Incline flyes, top set with rest pause
Machine flyes to failure, followed by partials
pushups, 3 sets to failure
And lots of abs!
Great night - thanks guys for your help here

[almostgone]

Too many reps, unless it's a specific high rep day. Crank the weight up and keep it at 12 and under, including RP's and drops.

Thanks, Kelkel, I'll bump up the lbs! I had planned on using the high pulley for lats and ended up doing low cable rows. Never did get the feeling I was looking for...kept trying and ended up with the high reps

[Igifuno]

Chest tonight went great -
Smith flat press ending in a 4 drop set
Incline flyes, top set with rest pause
Machine flyes to failure, followed by partials
pushups, 3 sets to failure
And lots of abs!
Great night - thanks guys for your help here

I like how you switch up between the techniques, drop set to RP, to partials, etc. Very nice.

[AD]

nice long post up there Igi! was that your 10000th? well done!

[Igifuno]

nice long post up there Igi! was that your 10000th? well done!

thank you sir! 10k was in the nutrition section

[Cuz]

I feel as if im going to explode if eat any more rice lol dang this last meal is hard to get

[Hazard]

I feel as if im going to explode if eat any more rice lol dang this last meal is hard to get

Lmao me too. Made a meatloaf and a ton of rice

[Igifuno]

I feel as if im going to explode if eat any more rice lol dang this last meal is hard to get

Shove it down man.. sips of water between every bite. Don't gag.. lol.

[almostgone]

I prefer the narrow grip. Switch up at the gym but if I was buying one I would go with the close grip personally.

Thanks, Igi...much appreciated! I'll order one. Got called in early again and am working all weekend (was scheduled to be off). Guess I'll try to dig a little deeper so I don't stray too far.

[Cuz]

Shove it down man.. sips of water between every bite. Don't gag.. lol.

the only thing that makes me heave if im not careful is dry oats in water. always eat a cup in the morning and sometimes its like....well sickening to finish quickly. thanks for the encouragement brother

[Giggle]

Thanks Igi. I've learned a lot from you!

I like how you switch up between the techniques, drop set to RP, to partials, etc. Very nice.

[Igifuno]

Lmao me too. Made a meatloaf and a ton of rice

I made our famous ground turkey dish for dinner.. Tons of rice with it. Ugh.

[Hazard]

I made our famous ground turkey dish for dinner.. Tons of rice with it. Ugh.

Good quality meal right there

[Igifuno]

Good quality meal right there

Yup. Just finishing up last meal, mixed nuts, scoop of PB and protein shake.

[Java Man]

Hey Kel -
On that first exercise, what was it 8 reps of?
Unless "balls out heavy" is some new leg move lol!
Thanks!

Girls have difficulty with that one. Gyms don't have that equipment. Well, not for use by the public anyways...

[Java Man]

Legs/abs as well today.

Need opinions here.. I think I already know the answer but want confirmation.

Here's my issue: back pumps. Severe ones. They're definitely hindering my workouts, particularly on leg and back days. In addition to back pump, now I'm getting leg pumps (outside portion of the leg by the calfs) When I dropped GH a few weeks ago, I added tbol, and the pumps came with it.

They've been getting progressively worse and today may have been the most painful training session I've ever had. Took all of me to finish.

So, I need to drop the tbol I think. I can obviously give more output without the pain and I'm not getting the reps I could get with it so who needs it right?

Does everyone concur?

Can't keep up with this thread anymore! Lol.

If I'm taking anything that causes discomfort or hinders me in the gym, I drop it.

[marcus300]

This thread is moving fast will have to catch up and do some reading.........

Just been to the gym and totally killed my arms biceps and triceps, I executed them without remorse. I left with ringing in my ears which normally only happens on legs or delts but ive hurt those fukers this morning. They don't feel like mine kind of strange feeling and I love hurting myself

[Java Man]

This thread is moving fast will have to catch up and do some reading.........

Just been to the gym and totally killed my arms biceps and triceps, I executed them without remorse. I left with ringing in my ears which normally only happens on legs or delts but ive hurt those fukers this morning. They don't feel like mine kind of strange feeling and I love hurting myself

Sounds like you had a good day lol. There is a masochistic component to this training style for sure. I thrive on reaching new levels of pain tolerance. Knowing the difference between fatigue pain and true injury is important too of course but one must be accustomed to and maybe not enjoy per se but derive some kind of mental pleasure on some level from pushing themselves beyond current limits.

[Igifuno]

Can't keep up with this thread anymore! Lol. If I'm taking anything that causes discomfort or hinders me in the gym, I drop it.

Thx java. I dropped it as of yesterday.

[Igifuno]

This thread is moving fast will have to catch up and do some reading......... Just been to the gym and totally killed my arms biceps and triceps, I executed them without remorse. I left with ringing in my ears which normally only happens on legs or delts but ive hurt those fukers this morning. They don't feel like mine kind of strange feeling and I love hurting myself

You're a sick man marcus. I salute you!

[Java Man]

great workout man. the guys here will be able to assist you in HIT style training. personally I wouldnt make the.10 sec.rest a habit. you will learn aloy here anout drop.sets and.rest pauses. when.true failure comes you will need a little.more.than 10 secs lol.

Sometimes I need 10 MINUTES. lmao.

[Java Man]

nice long post up there Igi! was that your 10000th? well done!

^^^^ x2

[marcus300]

Sounds like you had a good day lol. There is a masochistic component to this training style for sure. I thrive on reaching new levels of pain tolerance. Knowing the difference between fatigue pain and true injury is important too of course but one must be accustomed to and maybe not enjoy per se but derive some kind of mental pleasure on some level from pushing themselves beyond current limits.

You're a sick man marcus. I salute you!

I do mean failure training not really hurting myself in an injury way that must be highlighted for sure. The pain is mentally and also tolerating the true positive failure which is very hard. Many will leave something in the tank for the drop set or rest pause or forced and negs, we shouldn't leave anything in the tank take your first working set (no matter what advanced protocol your going to do) to true positive failure and this takes a lot of hard work mentally and be able to withstand the torture your putting your body under. This is a MUST guys we should strive to take your working set to true positive failure so you cant do any rep no matter what your at the end of what is possible then from here you move forward into the zone of pure hell and those tough fibers will be activated

[Capebuffalo]

Got 2 days in this week. Time is not on my side. Made the decesion to jump into the deep end with the big boys. First Expo in Myrtle Beach end of next month. Most people plan a year out. We are doing it in a month. Displays demos marketing all having to be made before we get there. Work outs will be sporadic at best till February. I'll post when I get a minute or two. Keep kicking ass guys.

[Igifuno]

Got 2 days in this week. Time is not on my side. Made the decesion to jump into the deep end with the big boys. First Expo in Myrtle Beach end of next month. Most people plan a year out. We are doing it in a month. Displays demos marketing all having to be made before we get there. Work outs will be sporadic at best till February. I'll post when I get a minute or two. Keep kicking ass guys.

Life comes first cape. No risk no reward. We'll hold it down for you. Good luck with everything.

[AD]

Life comes first cape. No risk no reward. We'll hold it down for you. Good luck with everything.

I was going to say money comes first

[kelkel]

Hey Kel -
On that first exercise, what was it 8 reps of?
Unless "balls out heavy" is some new leg move lol!
Thanks!

Squats Giggle, sorry about that.

Do yours "no balls heavy" please.

[kelkel]

This thread is moving fast will have to catch up and do some reading.........

Just been to the gym and totally killed my arms biceps and triceps, I executed them without remorse. I left with ringing in my ears which normally only happens on legs or delts but ive hurt those fukers this morning. They don't feel like mine kind of strange feeling and I love hurting myself

I have back and shoulders in an hour or so and I can't wait. There are times I'll get done a set that went just perfect and I feel so good I'll just let out a yell. No one else is around so wtf. So much adrenalin is flowing that the yell just seems natural. Then it's back to pacing until it's time to attack my next set. It's such an internal drive to always do more weight or more reps and to continually up the intensity and eliminate all weaknesses. Probably why training partners were always hard to find back in my gym days. They were just so locked into "normal" intensity and styles of training that after a while go stagnant. It's why they look the same year after year. Fvck that.

Sorry for the short rant.

[Hazard]

I'm omw to the chiro. Had to reschedule yesterday. I hope he can fix this shit

[biggjd69]

Just got through eating a late breakfast consisting of turkey bacon , grits, and 8 eggs. Now it's on to legs and I know I will be bringing all this back up. Straight sets today

[Igifuno]

I have back and shoulders in an hour or so and I can't wait. There are times I'll get done a set that went just perfect and I feel so good I'll just let out a yell. No one else is around so wtf. So much adrenalin is flowing that the yell just seems natural. Then it's back to pacing until it's time to attack my next set. It's such an internal drive to always do more weight or more reps and to continually up the intensity and eliminate all weaknesses. Probably why training partners were always hard to find back in my gym days. They were just so locked into "normal" intensity and styles of training that after a while go stagnant. It's why they look the same year after year. Fvck that.

Sorry for the short rant.

Love the rants.. wish I could be a fly on the wall in the dungeon.. or better yet throw some weight around with you

I'm omw to the chiro. Had to reschedule yesterday. I hope he can fix this shit

Hope so too man.. fingers crossed for you

Just got through eating a late breakfast consisting of turkey bacon , grits, and 8 eggs. Now it's on to legs and I know I will be bringing all this back up. Straight sets today

better let it settle big lol.. I know you almost lost your cookies last time

[Cuz]

on my way to the gym getting in the zone!!!