Chinese HGH concerns

[calstate23]

Major companies producing hgh for the U.S. market will not be producing fakes. The guys making the fakes will copy them and sell the the black market, trying to pass them off as the genuine article. There was even a fake apple shop in china selling fake apple products and nobody knew for a long time! If they can produce hi tec stuff I'm sure a hgh pen isn't hard to reproduce.

Yes this ^^^....U.S. manufacturers can't make fakes man...They would be shut down faster then my granny's house in foreclosure....

That is why pharm grade products are the best....It's a little something called REGULATION. And here is the US regulation is huge whether it be producing meats and vegetables or medicine....There are strict guidelines they must follow when producing a product....

But ANYONE can copy a logo man, ANYONE can even make plastic molds of exact replicas if they wanted to...If people know how to do something they can....Drug dealers will make fake shit and sell as if it is the real deal

[marcus300]

I don't need any of the fakes I've used because it was obvious to me something was wrong. I've ran pharm grade and generics for over 15yrs so I know and don't need them testing . I cab easily go off results, sides and how I feel.

[EasyDoesIt]

Yes this ^^^....U.S. manufacturers can't make fakes man...They would be shut down faster then my granny's house in foreclosure....

That is why pharm grade products are the best....It's a little something called REGULATION. And here is the US regulation is huge whether it be producing meats and vegetables or medicine....There are strict guidelines they must follow when producing a product....

But ANYONE can copy a logo man, ANYONE can even make plastic molds of exact replicas if they wanted to...If people know how to do something they can....Drug dealers will make fake shit and sell as if it is the real deal

Yes i'm with you on that!!! Re-producing Logo's-authentication codes etc... I was thinking maybe the guys wanting to pull together and have products tested thought or knew something i didn't. Maybe that U.S. Companies or possibly companies in other countries that SELL to U.S. were doing something. I know some of the people on this forum are from Germany etc. and there is a company there that sells to pharmaceutical industry here in U.S. Where i'm at i wouldn't know what to test, IMO once you use Pharm-Grade, fake HGH IS SO FAR FROM REAL IN RESULTS, that if your taking counterfeit, you would know the difference. I have had my share of junk and great counterfeit labels, so risking Chinese is not even an option. I am 100% convinced generics and chinese that i could obtain is fake. But some on this board have had real Chinese from Russia and that is not available to me, so i just don't have a reason to test anything. I like to contribute what i can here on this forum, but i can only help spread the word about what has been discussed here on this great thread.

[EasyDoesIt]

I don't need any of the fakes I've used because it was obvious to me something was wrong. I've ran pharm grade and generics for over 15yrs so I know and don't need them testing . I cab easily go off results, sides and how I feel.

Yes i agree Marcus! I have not been using pharm as long as you, nor am i as knowledgeable, but when i started Pharm, the difference was night and day. All of these weird sides say something is wrong!!! Bottom line is: Better go back and have a talk with your source if it's Junk, wether that source is a Rep or a Manufacturer.

[swithuk]

Yes i'm with you on that!!! Re-producing Logo's-authentication codes etc... I was thinking maybe the guys wanting to pull together and have products tested thought or knew something i didn't. Maybe that U.S. Companies or possibly companies in other countries that SELL to U.S. were doing something. I know some of the people on this forum are from Germany etc. and there is a company there that sells to pharmaceutical industry here in U.S. Where i'm at i wouldn't know what to test, IMO once you use Pharm-Grade, fake HGH IS SO FAR FROM REAL IN RESULTS, that if your taking counterfeit, you would know the difference. I have had my share of junk and great counterfeit labels, so risking Chinese is not even an option. I am 100% convinced generics and chinese that i could obtain is fake. But some on this board have had real Chinese from Russia and that is not available to me, so i just don't have a reason to test anything. I like to contribute what i can here on this forum, but i can only help spread the word about what has been discussed here on this great thread.

yeah this is a great thread .......ive learnt a great deal from it ...............

[Indymuscleguy]

You can test to see if HGH is HCG by reconstituting your 'HGH' vial, purchase a pregnancy test, put 1iu over the 'strip' of the pregnancy tests device. Wait to see if it comes back - or +. If it's + then it's HCG. If it's negative...it's not HCG, but is it 'HGH'...anyones guess.

[calstate23]

You can test to see if HGH is HCG by reconstituting your 'HGH' vial, purchase a pregnancy test, put 1iu over the 'strip' of the pregnancy tests device. Wait to see if it comes back - or +. If it's + then it's HCG. If it's negative...it's not HCG, but is it 'HGH'...anyones guess.

Like Marcus said...I could care less about trying to test my product....You can tell just by pinning it

[Indymuscleguy]

Like Marcus said...I could care less about trying to test my product....You can tell just by pinning it

Correct me if I am wrong but it takes a good 90 days or more to experience sides or notice a size/bf% decrease. (Unless you are using more than 4iu/day) IMO, If I were concerned with a source, I'd buy the minimum, test it with a pregnancy test, then at least you've ruled out HCG . A pregnancy test is what, $15 vs. buying 3-6 months of what could be HCG. Just saying.

[calstate23]

Correct me if I am wrong but it takes a good 90 days or more to experience sides or notice a size/bf% decrease. (Unless you are using more than 4iu/day) IMO, If I were concerned with a source, I'd buy the minimum, test it with a pregnancy test, then at least you've ruled out HCG. A pregnancy test is what, $15 vs. buying 3-6 months of what could be HCG. Just saying.

For it to be full force and running and MAJOR physique changes....But much faster you can tell what you get yourself into....within a week see veins haven't seen before and eat like shit and feel fuller and leaner next day...

[marcus300]

It was 10yrs ago they used hcg , that's old school to what they use now. Complete waste of time if you ask me it went out with the ark

[Xtralarg]

Correct me if I am wrong but it takes a good 90 days or more to experience sides or notice a size/bf% decrease. (Unless you are using more than 4iu/day) IMO, If I were concerned with a source, I'd buy the minimum, test it with a pregnancy test, then at least you've ruled out HCG. A pregnancy test is what, $15 vs. buying 3-6 months of what could be HCG. Just saying.

Save your $15 you won't catch them out that easily these days.

[alex18]

Correct me if I am wrong but it takes a good 90 days or more to experience sides or notice a size/bf% decrease. (Unless you are using more than 4iu/day) IMO, If I were concerned with a source, I'd buy the minimum, test it with a pregnancy test, then at least you've ruled out HCG. A pregnancy test is what, $15 vs. buying 3-6 months of what could be HCG. Just saying.

I think most people with hgh experience are now fully aware of what's going on and chose their products carefully. I think it's the newbies that are being fooled into buying
crap and using it long term....If these newbies bought proper pharm grade stuff they would notice sides immediately at 2iu maybe even 1iu...

[Indymuscleguy]

I think most people with hgh experience are now fully aware of what's going on and chose their products carefully. I think it's the newbies that are being fooled into buying
crap and using it long term....If these newbies bought proper pharm grade stuff they would notice sides immediately at 2iu maybe even 1iu...

Gee it just seems from the advice and information I was given here regarding GH and results approximately 5 or 6 years ago, were very consistent...if you ran 4iu's or more per day 5 on/2 off one would not see results nor experience side effects until at least 3 months. I was considering my first cycle of GH at 2iu/day and was told to buy enough to last for a 6 month cycle as I wouldn't see results for a good 5-6 months. I concluded the cost/benefit wasn't for me based on that information. Has GH concentrations or it's chemical properties change from 5 or 6 years ago?

I'm not arguing with you guys, I'm just relaying the information on testing and dosing that I was given here a few years ago. I guess I was mis-informed.

[Sgt. Hartman]

^^^Thats all true as far as results go but guys who have a lot of experience running GH can tell from sides and how it feels within a very short time.

[MuscleInk]

It was 10yrs ago they used hcg, that's old school to what they use now. Complete waste of time if you ask me it went out with the ark

This was my understanding as well. The pregnancy test method would no longer be a reliable indicator of legitimacy. The only thing it would be useful for is determining if your HGH was actually HCG . It could still be counterfeit and not test positive on a pregnancy test.

[lovbyts]

Gee it just seems from the advice and information I was given here regarding GH and results approximately 5 or 6 years ago, were very consistent...if you ran 4iu's or more per day 5 on/2 off one would not see results nor experience side effects until at least 3 months. I was considering my first cycle of GH at 2iu/day and was told to buy enough to last for a 6 month cycle as I wouldn't see results for a good 5-6 months. I concluded the cost/benefit wasn't for me based on that information. Has GH concentrations or it's chemical properties change from 5 or 6 years ago?

I'm not arguing with you guys, I'm just relaying the information on testing and dosing that I was given here a few years ago. I guess I was mis-informed.

What you say is still valid to see good solid gains or results depending on your goals.

What else you are seeing/reading is it's 99% harder to find real HGH compared to 5 or 6 years ago.

[calstate23]

Gee it just seems from the advice and information I was given here regarding GH and results approximately 5 or 6 years ago, were very consistent...if you ran 4iu's or more per day 5 on/2 off one would not see results nor experience side effects until at least 3 months. I was considering my first cycle of GH at 2iu/day and was told to buy enough to last for a 6 month cycle as I wouldn't see results for a good 5-6 months. I concluded the cost/benefit wasn't for me based on that information. Has GH concentrations or it's chemical properties change from 5 or 6 years ago?

I'm not arguing with you guys, I'm just relaying the information on testing and dosing that I was given here a few years ago. I guess I was mis-informed.

Depends upon your physique a lot...how lean you are and how much gh you have run before....I can notice a diff within weeks like I said...Spider veins start poking, hungry eat like shit and just get leaner, skin gets thinner....

In fact not much sides at all, more sides to me = generics.....No sides, just results

[Angel of death]

Agreed, currently on genotropin and experiencing almost no negative side effects, but I did feel the carpal tunnel when I used around 9ius one day to be sure. when I was using rips I immediately got the most bloated I've ever been and found it hard to breathe...that shit just isn't hgh no matter what anyone wants to tell me.

And these were rips that I verified the code on THEIR website. A code than you can't even enter twice because once its been verified it says that when you try to enter it again. So no one can tell me they have rips any more real then that. Shit is straight garbage.

[Sheven]

Ok guys let me tell you one thing, Riptropin is the backdoor brand of Hygene Zhongshan (the original manufacturer of **********). There was one batch analyzed by RonnyT and revealed GH inside but as i know the seller of this project (which is also the "export" and "sales" manager in Hygene Zhongshan) they most likely started scamming people after people started to like it...

[marcus300]

Agreed, currently on genotropin and experiencing almost no negative side effects, but I did feel the carpal tunnel when I used around 9ius one day to be sure. when I was using rips I immediately got the most bloated I've ever been and found it hard to breathe...that shit just isn't hgh no matter what anyone wants to tell me.

And these were rips that I verified the code on THEIR website. A code than you can't even enter twice because once its been verified it says that when you try to enter it again. So no one can tell me they have rips any more real then that. Shit is straight garbage.

Sounds like you had a lucky escape. I've lost count of how many members who have pmed me with regarding rips and kigs giving them strange sides. Many don't realize until they try pharm grade and many also take the results from steriods as gains from their generics. At least you know and won't go don't that route again.

[Sheven]

Sounds like you had a lucky escape. I've lost count of how many members who have pmed me with regarding rips and kigs giving them strange sides. Many don't realize until they try pharm grade and many also take the results from steriods as gains from their generics. At least you know and won't go don't that route again.

Pharm grade = pharmaceutical grade product
Generic = pharmaceutical grade product, not patented (anymore).

so how can you say pharm grade is different from generic? omnitrope sandoz is generic, tevtropin TEVA is generic. lets at least have some sense of the discussion if we keep repeating it over and over again.

ansomone and ********** zhongshan are pharm grade too, and generic. they are both sold overseas and as i know ********** is registered in mexico. what about genheal that is registered in most CIS countries? its being sold by public tender in CIS countries. are this all shit products? are this all bribed FDA's?

radical people are the people far from the truth. truth is making somatropin pharma standard is not that complicated neither restricted to few big manufacturer like pfizer and lilly. it can be done with a average investment of 2mil$. afterwards, the cost for maintaining monthly the factory can come up to 20k$ just for the workers and utilities (small operation). there are medium chances for bad batches (amino exchange during the reaction that is causing bad reaction at injection spot, most common problem in production) or air trapped in the reactor causing the whole reaction to be compromised. except this two instances, the production goes easily most of the time. if you calculate the whole investment and the monthly bills and also the potential risks of losing a batch (which do occure) the cost of production cannot be the one currently demanded by the market. the market demands cheap cheap cheap. still 8 out of 10 people at least demand cheap gh. there are plenty of forums that have open sales and people are bumping some shit brands. once the market will demand quality, quality will arise. saying all is shit and lets all buy genotropin is pure stupid.

one important thing to be mentioned, mg is the weight of the hormone, IU is the bioactivity. 1iu = 1iu in any place of the world. be it pakistani hgh, american or chinese. when it comes to mg, yes is true 1mg is more potent (has more IU) than the chinese one and this comes from one of the initial reactions. but in the end the chinese can make this up with the mg ratio. us & eu agreed in their pharmacopoeias to say 1mg = ±3.3iu. chinese do calculate at 2.5iu currently. there are ways to check the bioavailability etc, but all this in some other posts.

[gixxerboy1]

Ok its not generics then. You are correct on the technical term. So ugl hgh.

[Sheven]

Ok its not generics then. You are correct on the technical term. So ugl hgh.

any ugl operation is prone to variation. doesn't mean it can't work at times.

[marcus300]

Pharm grade = pharmaceutical grade product
Generic = pharmaceutical grade product, not patented (anymore).

so how can you say pharm grade is different from generic? omnitrope sandoz is generic, tevtropin TEVA is generic. lets at least have some sense of the discussion if we keep repeating it over and over again.

ansomone and ********** zhongshan are pharm grade too, and generic. they are both sold overseas and as i know ********** is registered in mexico. what about genheal that is registered in most CIS countries? its being sold by public tender in CIS countries. are this all shit products? are this all bribed FDA's?

radical people are the people far from the truth. truth is making somatropin pharma standard is not that complicated neither restricted to few big manufacturer like pfizer and lilly. it can be done with a average investment of 2mil$. afterwards, the cost for maintaining monthly the factory can come up to 20k$ just for the workers and utilities (small operation). there are medium chances for bad batches (amino exchange during the reaction that is causing bad reaction at injection spot, most common problem in production) or air trapped in the reactor causing the whole reaction to be compromised. except this two instances, the production goes easily most of the time. if you calculate the whole investment and the monthly bills and also the potential risks of losing a batch (which do occure) the cost of production cannot be the one currently demanded by the market. the market demands cheap cheap cheap. still 8 out of 10 people at least demand cheap gh. there are plenty of forums that have open sales and people are bumping some shit brands. once the market will demand quality, quality will arise. saying all is shit and lets all buy genotropin is pure stupid.

one important thing to be mentioned, mg is the weight of the hormone, IU is the bioactivity. 1iu = 1iu in any place of the world. be it pakistani hgh, american or chinese. when it comes to mg, yes is true 1mg is more potent (has more IU) than the chinese one and this comes from one of the initial reactions. but in the end the chinese can make this up with the mg ratio. us & eu agreed in their pharmacopoeias to say 1mg = ±3.3iu. chinese do calculate at 2.5iu currently. there are ways to check the bioavailability etc, but all this in some other posts.

You know exactly what I mean and so does everyone else here. The shite coming out of China . You know what I mean because your sat in one of those labs in China so stop trying to be the one and only expert when we all know what your doing here. Wise up

[alex18]

You know exactly what I mean and so does everyone else here. The shite coming out of China . You know what I mean because your sat in one of those labs in China so stop trying to be the one and only expert when we all know what your doing here. Wise up

agreed..... a little too much knowledge + 'selling/marketing' going on here....

[Sheven]

You know exactly what I mean and so does everyone else here. The shite coming out of China . You know what I mean because your sat in one of those labs in China so stop trying to be the one and only expert when we all know what your doing here. Wise up

Wise up? Marcus300 i recall badly or was you that was soliciting me to source you HGH few months ago? Oh, and i didn't send you any email right? So what's that i'm doing here? I think you are the one who is doing something and i haven't called you out because i know what respect means, not the same for you it seems, i have been solicited many times (not just by you) to sell or offer advice where to buy gear and hgh, i never answered neither i helped anyone.

So before calling out people without any reason, better look in the mirror, fool.

[Sheven]

agreed..... a little too much knowledge + 'selling/marketing' going on here....

Who's selling anything? I'd say too many fools around and disrespectful guys, in fact not just that but huge hypocrites. Marcus is just jealous i didn't hook him up with a connection so he brings this shit up now, be a man don't a *****. If anyone reads my posts in this "Chinese HGH concerns" can easily see i'm totally impartial and i have criticism for most of the companies and brands (because i them know closely). I can write whatever i like because i'm feeling very free since i know i'm clean, couldn't say the same about some others but out of respect i'd better keep for myself.

[marcus300]

Wise up? Marcus300 i recall badly or was you that was soliciting me to source you HGH few months ago? Oh, and i didn't send you any email right? So what's that i'm doing here? I think you are the one who is doing something and i haven't called you out because i know what respect means, not the same for you it seems, i have been solicited many times (not just by you) to sell or offer advice where to buy gear and hgh, i never answered neither i helped anyone.

So before calling out people without any reason, better look in the mirror, fool.

I contacted you because I had pm's stating you was selling hgh, so I got in contact and opened you up so you would talk and tell me what you was doing, and guess what you did? and I still have the pm's so dont come with that one. I keep this board clean from scammers and trust me you have no idea what goes on. You have been put forward many times, thats why I opened you up. You was the fool who fell for it not me oh wise one! you told me all about you and what you do if you dont remember.

We know you are in China and even you stated dont trust anyone from China,

fancy posting a picture of this body you have built from hgh? seeing that you are here for bodybuilding,steroids and hgh advice lets see it?

I can't see what your problem is, I posted and quoted Angel of death about his rips then you come in shouting and screaming.....The whole Chinese hgh is a con you know it, I know and more or less all the members do so get back in your lab. All becaue your in China doesnt make you an expert listen to all these guys who are screaming about the rips, kigs and coloured tops. Just look at some of your older posts where you go on and on about how bad certain generics then you suddenly change your mind and come back with they not all that bad, you change your mind more times than my ex wife....I also dont need anyone for a source for hgh I have my own and its not that Chinese crap either.

When I post a reply I quote the person who I am posting to, so in future look at who I am speaking to, imbecile


You want to carry this on take it to PM, keep this thread clean from bullshite like this

[Angel of death]

Marcus is one of if not the most legit dude around here. And I've been scammed and ****ed with hundreds of times. He's a legitimate good person, and he looks out for people getting scammed. it pisses me off that anyone would even try to stir up some shit with him.

[EasyDoesIt]

I think it is a good idea to keep the thread clean as Marcus stated, just for purposes to keep the quality of the forum itself at a high standard. I do not know anyone on a personal level, but i can decipher what makes sense and what i have experienced.

[Edwin23q]

Guys, I think it's common knowledge that everything coming out of china is crap. I wouldn't trust them one bit. I know cause I've been on so called "Authentic" Chinese hgh and now I'm on the Pharma US grade hgh, and boy do you see the difference once you try both.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[marcus300]

Pease keep this thread clean from bullshite.

There are things what go on behind the scence what keep this board safe from scammers, members sourcing and certain brands being promoted for their own financial gain. On a persoanl note ive been involved in many of these cases and helped to keep this board safe for members to discuss without being sold fakes etc. I'm not saying anyone in this thread is selling fakes but at times thing are investigated to see if people have an agenda etc.

Please no more talk on this thread about what goes on behind the scences because its private and if anyone wants to carry this on please PM me and dont use this thread

Thanks

[Sheven]

Well i guess we both overreacted and i won't be immature to say that you started it by falsely calling me a source. i'm into the community best interest and i think arguing with details and proof is useful, i am the one who called out cheaters and shady people most of the chinese manufacturers and their export teams and also stated i don't trust anyone in china when it comes to this kind of products, unless i analyze it myself. i advised against members buying from some well known doggy sources like ankebio and i'll continue to call them out.

[marcus300]

There is enough information and experience from many members in this thread for future buyers to make their own mind up regarding the whole Chinese hgh market especially the underground market. I also find it hard to trust anything coming out most of the Chinese manufacturers and I will continure to give my advice on what I know to be fact, weather members take this advice is up to them but this thread has been a great help and a source of information for many members.

[EasyDoesIt]

There is enough information and experience from many members in this thread for future buyers to make their own mind up regarding the whole Chinese hgh market especially the underground market. I also find it hard to trust anything coming out most of the Chinese manufacturers and I will continure to give my advice on what I know to be fact, weather members take this advice is up to them but this thread has been a great help and a source of information for many members.

Yes there is more than enough repetitive information stating and re-stating the Chinese products QUALITY OR LACK OF. At some point seems like some people keep wanting to validate the Chinese products or look for a way to say they are good or maybe change later. To think that the Chinese mfgs are going to change there unscrupulous ways because of us is laughable. Yes an impact was made on ankibio regarding a few people here, but overall i dont think they are going stop doing what they do. Based on masses, 95% of the people using HGH never read these forums or do any research. If they feel that strong about having it, let them go get it. Were working off an internet forum here and it is experience and advice, I don't know the people here so if i contribute to the forum by sparing someone the mistake of dumping there cash into bad product and they still want to buy, it's there choice. I personally know many people using that junk and i have talked to them and it goes in one ear and out the other. I actually don't know anyone that reads up on products in general, including guys that are selling. I think in certain parts of the world, many people that workout and use gear are well read. Just my experience here in the U.S.

[Sheven]

Yes there is more than enough repetitive information stating and re-stating the Chinese products QUALITY OR LACK OF. At some point seems like some people keep wanting to validate the Chinese products or look for a way to say they are good or maybe change later. To think that the Chinese mfgs are going to change there unscrupulous ways because of us is laughable. Yes an impact was made on ankibio regarding a few people here, but overall i dont think they are going stop doing what they do. Based on masses, 95% of the people using HGH never read these forums or do any research. If they feel that strong about having it, let them go get it. Were working off an internet forum here and it is experience and advice, I don't know the people here so if i contribute to the forum by sparing someone the mistake of dumping there cash into bad product and they still want to buy, it's there choice. I personally know many people using that junk and i have talked to them and it goes in one ear and out the other. I actually don't know anyone that reads up on products in general, including guys that are selling. I think in certain parts of the world, many people that workout and use gear are well read. Just my experience here in the U.S.

truth is that most ugl manufacturers don't make the internet sales so the ones that are pushing the quality down is mostly the middleman and retailers. for the manufacturer is same if he makes 4iu or 8iu vial, in fact any manufacturer preffers making less vials and higher concentration rather than filling hundred thousands of vials with 2iu. the costs are much higher to do underdosed and they are mostly always payed according to what they really dose the stuff. it happens for the manufacturer to cheat the middleman but is rarely nowadays because they lose the market fast and who would they do that when the margins are very high ? do you think the colombians send to europe and us 5% cocaine? ofcourse not they sell the high purity one. analogy can be made.

at the end of the day, the real manufacturer prefers making good quality products because their margin is high anyway, and their market share loss is big if customers don't come back. when you're dealing with ankebio export department that is registered on every b2b website and their selling 1-2 kits to any bodybuilders, you can be 100% you're not dealing with the factory you're dealing with a bunch of people that manage sales, they have no stake in the companies profits or success so they rather cash in fast since life is volatile in emerging economies.

Later edit: why you think jintropin was good all those years before the US cracked them? they aren't a different type of chinese breed... they took the manufacturing seriously and didn't compromise on their brand, profits were huge anyway and those can be proven by their stock value and total public sales.

[human project]

truth is that most ugl manufacturers don't make the internet sales so the ones that are pushing the quality down is mostly the middleman and retailers. for the manufacturer is same if he makes 4iu or 8iu vial, in fact any manufacturer preffers making less vials and higher concentration rather than filling hundred thousands of vials with 2iu. the costs are much higher to do underdosed and they are mostly always payed according to what they really dose the stuff. it happens for the manufacturer to cheat the middleman but is rarely nowadays because they lose the market fast and who would they do that when the margins are very high ? do you think the colombians send to europe and us 5% cocaine? ofcourse not they sell the high purity one. analogy can be made.

at the end of the day, the real manufacturer prefers making good quality products because their margin is high anyway, and their market share loss is big if customers don't come back. when you're dealing with ankebio export department that is registered on every b2b website and their selling 1-2 kits to any bodybuilders, you can be 100% you're not dealing with the factory you're dealing with a bunch of people that manage sales, they have no stake in the companies profits or success so they rather cash in fast since life is volatile in emerging economies.

Later edit: why you think jintropin was good all those years before the US cracked them? they aren't a different type of chinese breed... they took the manufacturing seriously and didn't compromise on their brand, profits were huge anyway and those can be proven by their stock value and total public sales.

Will manufacturers sell to the general public???

[EasyDoesIt]

truth is that most ugl manufacturers don't make the internet sales so the ones that are pushing the quality down is mostly the middleman and retailers. for the manufacturer is same if he makes 4iu or 8iu vial, in fact any manufacturer preffers making less vials and higher concentration rather than filling hundred thousands of vials with 2iu. the costs are much higher to do underdosed and they are mostly always payed according to what they really dose the stuff. it happens for the manufacturer to cheat the middleman but is rarely nowadays because they lose the market fast and who would they do that when the margins are very high ? do you think the colombians send to europe and us 5% cocaine? ofcourse not they sell the high purity one. analogy can be made.

at the end of the day, the real manufacturer prefers making good quality products because their margin is high anyway, and their market share loss is big if customers don't come back. when you're dealing with ankebio export department that is registered on every b2b website and their selling 1-2 kits to any bodybuilders, you can be 100% you're not dealing with the factory you're dealing with a bunch of people that manage sales, they have no stake in the companies profits or success so they rather cash in fast since life is volatile in emerging economies.

Later edit: why you think jintropin was good all those years before the US cracked them? they aren't a different type of chinese breed... they took the manufacturing seriously and didn't compromise on their brand, profits were huge anyway and those can be proven by their stock value and total public sales.

But for example do you know for sure it was sales people selling the junk from Ankiebio? As i understand those sales were coming direct from Ankie. That's quite a problem and pretty loose control if it was sales personel, which is a internal control problem ankie would have. Also, there sales here in the U.S. which they have obviously been doing for some time are a different animal than there pharmaceutical sales as the buyers have no governing body to complain to and ankiebio knows that. If i'm wrong on that correct me, but from what i have read, that is what i see that happened.

[likelifting]

I don't need any of the fakes I've used because it was obvious to me something was wrong. I've ran pharm grade and generics for over 15yrs so I know and don't need them testing . I cab easily go off results, sides and how I feel.

I'm envious. Seriously envious. That seems to be the only test these days. And for us noobs, its almost impossible for us to know what we have.

I had vascularity. I felt great. I boiled 5iu and it went cloudy like I read it should and let it cool and it remained cloudy like I read it should.

The only reason I stopped pinning mine is becuase I was able to up my dose to 10ius in a about 3 weeks. That threw up a red flag to me. From my very limited experience, I shouldn't have been able to ramp up so quickly without sides. I had some wrist discomfort, but not bad.

Not talking to you specifically in this post. But that bolded sentence caught my eye. That is some valuable experience you have. Good for you, sir.

[marcus300]

Yes there is more than enough repetitive information stating and re-stating the Chinese products QUALITY OR LACK OF. At some point seems like some people keep wanting to validate the Chinese products or look for a way to say they are good or maybe change later. To think that the Chinese mfgs are going to change there unscrupulous ways because of us is laughable. Yes an impact was made on ankibio regarding a few people here, but overall i dont think they are going stop doing what they do. Based on masses, 95% of the people using HGH never read these forums or do any research. If they feel that strong about having it, let them go get it. Were working off an internet forum here and it is experience and advice, I don't know the people here so if i contribute to the forum by sparing someone the mistake of dumping there cash into bad product and they still want to buy, it's there choice. I personally know many people using that junk and i have talked to them and it goes in one ear and out the other. I actually don't know anyone that reads up on products in general, including guys that are selling. I think in certain parts of the world, many people that workout and use gear are well read. Just my experience here in the U.S.

I agree, there is enough information and experience from all over the world on this board regarding the quality of generics and even some pharm grade manufacturers. Once suspicion is there it can breed but results is where it counts and many who have used quality pharm grade hgh and generics for many years understands and knows how your body reacts and its as clear as black and white with these guys that the Chinese are not trustworthy and your playing roulette when you buy from them. Even with Ankibio you go direct and they started to sell underdosed,fakes and came out with all sorts rubbish with the reasons why, they even sent me and Ronnie some free hgh to keep us quiet on the boards, stop the rumours of them selling fakes and also stop the company getting emails asking about quality all because of this board and a guy who had a blood test from ProM what showed zero improvement in his numbers. Just goes to show you if they can what are the generic compaines doing when the only prize for these guys is money.



Ive been burnt from some serious sources and I also legit companies and they is only a certain amount of times you keep going back to get burnt. They are that far infront with knwoledge and scamming the underground market we have no idea what they are putting in their hgh to produce all these water retaining results, or estrogen rebound once you stop or other strange side effects what many think are great results. Facts are if you have used pharm grade for a good length of time at a good solid dose you know what real hgh does and how you react and for those guys they never go back to the Chinese market because they know.We can debate till the cows come home and most will carry on buying the generics and thats fine but no one will change my mind especially anyone sat in China or anyone else to that matter because Ive used enough hgh to know something is seriously wrong with many of Chinese hgh manufacturers especially the generic market.